2 notes about 1.04 patch

[CapitalB]

byebye nasty post.... SPY

[GrEEk_OuTcAsT]

Well I don't think that 1.02 was that good as you guys say. Maybe you had fun with it as you played it first time but all versions have their sucky points till now. At least in 1.04 the Duels are somewhat balanced. I don't give a F for other gametypes because they are not for a Jedi Knight II game. People want to balance CTF but if you do it you unbalance FFA and Duel so F@k them. No Force Duels withOUT jump/kick are pretty balanced and fun now with sabertracefirst to ON. All stances have their uses and Light/Dark seem balanced. And also the Force Duels are pretty balanced because the winner again is the one that uses the saber better.

 

So I don't care what you say but I have fun with Duels.

 

The only problem that sometimes exist is the kick. Kick should do NO damage but would knock the enemy away or even down. Not that it is overpowered but just seems to see jedis kick people on the face like that. It looks stupid.

[FatalStrike]

Originally posted by GrEEk_OuTcAsT

Well I don't think that 1.02 was that good as you guys say.

 

The only problem that sometimes exist is the kick. Kick should do NO damage but would knock the enemy away or even down. Not that it is overpowered but just seems to see jedis kick people on the face like that. It looks stupid.

 

Here we go people! The movement to nerf another move begins.

 

One question, how long did you play 1.02? 1 or 2 days?

[IronJedi Kaga]

Originally posted by FatalStrike

 

Here we go people! The movement to nerf another move begins.

 

One question, how long did you play 1.02? 1 or 2 days?

 

I played 1.02 from 2 days before the official rlease date (EB got it early) until 1.03. Likewise I've played 1.03 up until Sunday.

 

With that said 1.04 is the most balanced of all releases.

[FatalStrike]

Originally posted by IronJedi Kaga

 

I played 1.02 from 2 days before the official rlease date (EB got it early) until 1.03. Likewise I've played 1.03 up until Sunday.

 

With that said 1.04 is the most balanced of all releases.

 

hmm..

 

Balanced? You know I have heard people on both sides of the force arguing that the other is too strong, now they are both weak. Yet the gripes continue.

 

Balanced? I have heard medium lovers say heavy was too good in 1.02. So now everything is blocked at ridiculous angles and Heavy requires you to slow down to crawl speed to swing it. Yet I still hear the same things. Heavy is too strong.

 

See you agree with the absurd removal of everything that is percieved by you and others like you in the name of balance only to find that you cannot reach perfect balance thru this method.

 

Some of us learn to counter these imbalances. All it takes is practice and you know what, everything in this game can be countered. You see the only way to balance the game is to play against someone you are evenly matched with.

 

If your opponent crushes you, its not the DFA's fault, or the backstab's fault, its YOUR FAULT.

 

Those who learn to win are not heard by Raven. Only those that can't beat us and blame it on this ridiculous notion of "balance" and "something being too strong" that write and e-mail to Raven everytime they lose. They are the ones that have a say in patches. Because we don't complain!

 

So in a way, these patches are designed by the worst players not by the best. Nice!

 

By the way this is not a flame, I am simply challenging the mind set that we must remove and weaken in order to balance.

[Jonas Braver]

Alright - im new here. I love star wars - its a great universe, and most (not all) of the games and RPG manuals for it have been good. In fact, JK2 is the very best game i have ever seen for the computers. However, i do have several questions

1 - why does multiplayer lightsaber combat suck? blocks are worse, and several of the special moves don't seem to work.

2 - Whats with the 'kick' thing? I have never seen this kick attack, or even knew it existed. How is it done.

3 - balanced? The Dark Side character can still have alot of advantages over light, but thats not what i mean. Force Speed is absopultely shat in multiplayer.

 

I never tried 1.02, because my internet connection was rubbish then. 1.03 made very little difference to my experience. 1.04 seems better, mildly, but there are balance issues to discuss. The dark side should be stronger, because they are (i aint a sith player, for note - i like a challenge on my games). I just want to be able to perform some of the more stylish moves, and enjoy learning from the best on the net. I wouldn't mind some lessons of playing the game better. So, anyone here got an answer, or do i wait for real pros ... not babies arguing over little comments and minor modifications which make the game challenging? (not an insult, just an observation)

[FatalStrike]

Originally posted by Jonas Braver

Alright -

1 - why does multiplayer lightsaber combat suck?

 

 

Because everything fun has been removed in the name of balance!

[Snake13]

quiet I'd turn ghoul2 on and I think it would be perfect

[ryudom]

1 - why does multiplayer lightsaber combat suck? blocks are worse, and several of the special moves don't seem to work.

2 - Whats with the 'kick' thing? I have never seen this kick attack, or even knew it existed. How is it done.

3 - balanced? The Dark Side character can still have alot of advantages over light, but thats not what i mean. Force Speed is absopultely shat in multiplayer.

 

1. blocks are worse because of internet and it needs to send and receive info, i think. still its not that bad.

special moves work better then before, don't know what your talking about

 

2. to kick you double jump at some1, or strafe kick them

 

3. force is balanced, darkies just have to be smart now. speed isn't bad, on level 3 anyway. don't know what level you tried.

[RpTheHotrod]

They left us hanging saying they probably wouldn't make another patch. THEY NEED ONE MORE.

 

For crying out loud, bring back saber damage! It's stupid to set it by default as 10 damage per hit.....but you can set it high if the admin has any idea how. It should be 1.02/03 damage and set it LOW of the admin wants too. Face it, more people want saber realism.

 

Pull...THAT was the problem, not backslash/stab. Also, backslash/stab should be set where when you pull it off, it does the move every time...not if someone is behind you or not. That would prevent the backslash/stab spammers...because they would be left WIDE open every second they spam it.

[ryudom]

they would have to change the move combination then, because i know i hit forwards while moving backwards quit a bit

[ryudom]

they would have to change the move combination then, because i know i hit forwards while moving backwards quit a bit

[Spider AL]

The game is well balanced now. Drain is nerfed, yes, but so is heal. Grip is nerfed, yes, but so is pull. The arsenals of the two sides are balanced once again, and that's all I care about.

 

Combat is infinitely changeable now. And since a huge number of variables can be decided upon by server admins (more blocking, but more damage etc. These are all good things.) 1.04 is truly a good patch, and any problems people have with it can be remedied in-console. IMO 1.03 was a debacle. 1.04 is a fine official patch.

[Chewie Bakker]

Well with all these patches... here's my side.

 

Jedi Outcast came out - I liked it.

Patch 1.03 came out - I downloaded it, listened to the griping about it, tried it for myself, and liked it. Especially the invisible Absorb.

Patch 1.04 came out - Just downloaded it, I still have the 1.03exe still on my machine, and I'm gonna try it out. If I like it, I'll keep it, and if I don't, I'll go back to 1.03.

 

Then, as soon as I've got enough patches and mods and toolkits I'll burn them all to a nice CD, take the cover from the JK2 CD box and put it in a double CD box, then put the patches CD with the original CD. An archive fit for a... well... me.

 

My point is, play the one you prefer. If you like 1.02, then don't play 1.03 or 1.04.

[idlemind]

I find it awesome (sarcasm) how vtec goes out of his way to say he is not complaining like five times, and offers what can only be construed by any sane person as constructive criticism, and he STILL GETS JUMPED!

 

For the most part I agree with what Vtec has to say. I played 1.02 since the first week, and played a lot. I still play 1.04 and enjoy the game, but not nearly as much as 1.02. Here's why. I'm trying to offer this as constructive cricism. Please read my post carefully before replying, it will help ease forum tension. Everything I have to say relates to Saber No Force FFA. That's mostly what I play. I have nothing to add to a discussion of force powers or guns.

 

In 1.02 it was possible to move in when someone was exposed, and strike fast and fatally with a wicked yellow combo, or a well timed red before the other person could recover from their initial mistake. End result: The more skilled player won with little damage to himself.

 

In 1.04 this is more difficult since strikes do less damage, swings are slower, and your saber has a tendency to get blocked even when your opponent should be exposed. The end result being in many instances you get hurt as much as your opponent when you attack and he is just randomly swinging back at you to defend himself. This levels the playing field making the difference between the more skilled and the less skilled shrink.

 

Example: ever try to attack a blue headless chicken with yellow stance in close quarter?

 

So what this means is that spamming special moves (ie DFA and jump yellow) becomes an advantageous strategy because instead of just trading blows with your opponent, you stand a much greater chance of killing him before he can swing back.

 

I hate to spam specials. I find it boring and lacking in skill. I would much rather be able to win with regular strokes in a variety of stances, and throw in specials on the rare occasions when they are appropriate. That's just how I like to play, and as a result I enjoyed 1.02 over 1.04.

 

/dons flame retardent suit

[ryudom]

idlemind, i know what your saying, but i have to disagree. you can still take out a headless light stance swinging chicken with medium, without using specials. probably the timing is differant and the openings are differant then before. the medium stance range is greater then the light's, so you just have to stay stlightly out of range, and then do some horizontal sweeps maybe. vertical hits are harder to get in i find, put do more damage

[V-tecc]

Originally posted by idlemind

I find it awesome (sarcasm) how vtec goes out of his way to say he is not complaining like five times, and offers what can only be construed by any sane person as constructive criticism, and he STILL GETS JUMPED!

 

For the most part I agree with what Vtec has to say. I played 1.02 since the first week, and played a lot. I still play 1.04 and enjoy the game, but not nearly as much as 1.02. Here's why. I'm trying to offer this as constructive cricism. Please read my post carefully before replying, it will help ease forum tension. Everything I have to say relates to Saber No Force FFA. That's mostly what I play. I have nothing to add to a discussion of force powers or guns.

 

In 1.02 it was possible to move in when someone was exposed, and strike fast and fatally with a wicked yellow combo, or a well timed red before the other person could recover from their initial mistake. End result: The more skilled player won with little damage to himself.

 

In 1.04 this is more difficult since strikes do less damage, swings are slower, and your saber has a tendency to get blocked even when your opponent should be exposed. The end result being in many instances you get hurt as much as your opponent when you attack and he is just randomly swinging back at you to defend himself. This levels the playing field making the difference between the more skilled and the less skilled shrink.

 

Example: ever try to attack a blue headless chicken with yellow stance in close quarter?

 

So what this means is that spamming special moves (ie DFA and jump yellow) becomes an advantageous strategy because instead of just trading blows with your opponent, you stand a much greater chance of killing him before he can swing back.

 

I hate to spam specials. I find it boring and lacking in skill. I would much rather be able to win with regular strokes in a variety of stances, and throw in specials on the rare occasions when they are appropriate. That's just how I like to play, and as a result I enjoyed 1.02 over 1.04.

 

/dons flame retardent suit

 

First off, thanks for understanding me.

Secondly I just want to say that I also agree with you for the most part. In my time playing 1.04 I didn't find winning a hard thing to do I just did one of following:

 

1. Kicked a lot

2. Spamed yellow special

3. Played on saber-only (boring)

 

But I never enjoyed myself so I have gone back to 1.02 again, because for me the enigma was very clear:

 

If I want to have fun = I have to do what???

 

...indeed... go back to 1.02.

 

So until 1.05, you will find me with ASE on *1.02* or here augmenting in a civilized manor about the corruption of a great game...

[idlemind]

Originally posted by ryudom

idlemind, i know what your saying, but i have to disagree. you can still take out a headless light stance swinging chicken with medium, without using specials. probably the timing is differant and the openings are differant then before. the medium stance range is greater then the light's, so you just have to stay stlightly out of range, and then do some horizontal sweeps maybe. vertical hits are harder to get in i find, put do more damage

 

I'm willing to believe there is a way to defeat blue headless chickens. It can be done with yellow given sufficient space, but in tight quarters it is difficult to find the space to utilize your superior distance. There is probably a strategy that can work in close quarters. I need more time to find it though. For now I just end up rolling as much as possible until he loses track of me and I have some room to work. This works maybe 50% of the time. What do you use in close quarters?

 

I simply find it frustrating because all he has to do is hold attack and charge me, no thought or skill involved, and gets a 1:1 kill ratio.

[FatalStrike]

Originally posted by cjais

 

 

Well, imagine that everyone started out with the BFG in quake, do you then think that they'd use anything else? When certain supermoves are too good, they get balanced - It's a patchers job really. That they then can balance things out by weakening the good moves or strengthening the weak moves, is a choice for them to make. But I think that they made useless choice, since no one wanted even more tedious, drawn-out fights in CTF for instance.

I'd say that when everything is equal, and your creativity is rewarded in fights, then the gaming enviroment is skilled, but this is not the case, yet.

 

 

OK you are comparing apples to oranges and fail to make a point. If the BFG left you open to an easy kill everytime you used it I would see your point.

 

The orignal DFA woul leave people open enough in 1.02. The nerfed version leaves you too open and is frankly a stupid move.

 

A patchers job is to restore balance, just as you said. BUT this would have been more easily accomplished simply by makeing the DFA require 1/3 of you force to use it. This would limit the number of DFA you could use and weaken you greatly for over using them. Thus you would have balance.

 

 

Originally posted by cjais

About the blocking, you are true in that the blocking takes no skill to use, but it takes skill to get past, and that is where the low saberdamage kicks in and makes it unrewarding to use normal saberslashes.

 

There should be no skill required to kill an unskilled fool. If a weak nerd trys to fist fight you it takes NO skill to kick his pale ass up and down the street. Thus is the game there should be no defensive blocks awarded to anyone that are not earned by some action of the player.

 

Basically the blocking is a tool for the weak. It helps them by doing some of the work for them.

[Deetox187]

Hey idlemind what settings do you guys use on your {RH} servers? is it just default? i was on one of them last night and the blocking sucks, if you want it more like 1.02 you should turn g_sabertracesaberfirst to 0 and maybe up the damage a bit.

 

Just a suggestion, i used to really enjoy playing you guys in 1.02 but i will only play 1.04 if i like the settings hehe.

[Deetox187]

Yeah i can understand that for sure, too bad all the clans don't adopt a new standard of settings for competition. I guess i should finally just swallow my pride and force myself to play default. I skipped 1.03 entirely and i've been waiting and waiting for more tweaked 1.04 servers to show up but it just isn't happening.

 

EDIT: LOL this thread is screwed up or something, posts are not where they should be.

[idlemind]

Originally posted by Deetox187

Hey idlemind what settings do you guys use on your {RH} servers? is it just default? i was on one of them last night and the blocking sucks, if you want it more like 1.02 you should turn g_sabertracesaberfirst to 0 and maybe up the damage a bit.

 

Just a suggestion, i used to really enjoy playing you guys in 1.02 but i will only play 1.04 if i like the settings hehe.

 

I think I remember you from 1.02. That was a whole different world though.

 

We use default settings. We are loathe to change them because you'll be completely messed up when you play in ladders/competitions. Having said that I think that the blocking on our servers sucks too, but I blame that on Raven and their bizarre ideal for saber combat. I'll throw around the idea of setting up a Saber NF FFA server with tweeked blocking, but I can't honestly say that I'll play on it that much. At the back of my mind I'll know that I'm developing useless skills that won't do jack for me in standardized competition.

[V-tecc]

Hehe... how the hell did I become the thread starter?? :=)

Or am I the only one that can see this?

[FatalStrike]

Originally posted by V-tecc

Hehe... how the hell did I become the thread starter?? :=)

Or am I the only one that can see this?

 

No I see it too! This forum is havin problems!

[V-tecc]

Hey Fatal!

 

About the match, could we test the server you guys have before we go at it for real? :=)

 

So that we can test the ping, we are all the way in Sweden you know.

 

And another thing, the time difference: its 17:30 here right now, on weekdays I'm home from work first 18:30, so if you guys can it would be great some time after that...

 

 

Oh... got a tad off-topic here... .but so what.. its my thread!