The Lopper Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 Thanks to all those who whined so loud about backstabbing and ass-fighting and got the brilliant minds at Raven to ruin the game with the 1.04 patch. Sure ass-fighting sucks, but the backstab wass the only thing that made the saber a competative weapon in free-for-alls. Now that the saber is so underpowered as to be useless as an offensive weapon, gun-whoring rules the day and free-for-alls are lots less fun. Just another example of the old adage Be careful what you wish for - you might get it. your friend, The Lopper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeraphimII Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 Woot! 1st post! Anyway...Running around backwards, spamming attacks, then spinning like a top is a competative? Its downright retarded. Try Heavy stance in ffas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-[MotU]-Lyger|=- Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 Originally posted by The Lopper Thanks to all those who whined so loud about backstabbing and ass-fighting and got the brilliant minds at Raven to ruin the game with the 1.04 patch. Sure ass-fighting sucks, but the backstab wass the only thing that made the saber a competative weapon in free-for-alls. Now that the saber is so underpowered as to be useless as an offensive weapon, gun-whoring rules the day and free-for-alls are lots less fun. Just another example of the old adage Be careful what you wish for - you might get it. your friend, The Lopper you got a point there Lopper, but i thought it was lame that thats all people would do, all id do is yell at em and tell them that they have no skill. and when they'd be typing to talk back. id run up and backslash them:D hahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Solar Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 Funny. It's like...if you complaing about 1.04, it tells everyone that you were one of those ridiculous assfighters spamming backstab/sweep 24/4 and "ruining" the game for everyone. No really, I'm serious, that's what it means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 I'd disagree that the backstab was nerfed too much, it's still quite useable for what it was intended....an attack of style and oppertunity. If anything, it's the guns that need a good nerfing. Rocket launchers should be slow to fire, low on ammo, and force you to stand still to fire. The heavy repeater's secondary is ONLY designed as a jedi killer, it needs to be removed or changed. All the weapons SHOULD be secondary to the jedi powers and light saber. Now, if you added a score adjust to make the weaker weapons score more points (like Mechwarrior 4's absolute atrition) then both gun and saber fighters could play without it being unfair. Razor Ace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Solar Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 I dunno... The rocket launcher is pretty easy to "counter" (pull/push) and ammo is scarce. But the truth is that in a FFA you won't get very high up the scoreboard wihtout guns. The saber is a last-resort kind of weapon. A flechette alt-fire-spamming player with absorb is a pain in the butt. Luckily we have saber only servers and servers with the "big guns" disabled. Anyways, I do agree...if you want Quake, go play Quake. Sabers should be lethal. (saber damage scale x 2-3) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mInk3nine Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 well, i can tell you one thing...us no force 1v1 duelers love 1.04 ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demise_SOK Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 If you don't like the recent overpowering of guns then just play on saber-only servers. I have been ticked at Raven since they first patched the game. You got three options- get used to it, stop playing OR play on the many 1.02 or 1.03 servers that are still available. It's that simple. EDIT- One more thing for the no force-dueler pansies whos endless whining since launch have brought about all these stupid patches- you get the gas face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryudom Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 i think the patch is excellant. in duels its almost perfect (nothings ever perfect) and in FFA its good too EXEPT, i find CTF and FFA's funner when the saberdamage is cranked a bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 How have the guns been "recently" overpowered? The guns haven't been alter much by the patches at all. All Raven has really done is nerf a lot of the special moves and fix bugs. I don't think it's unreasonable to be force sensitive saber users be more powerful than gun users. In the movies, noone ever had any of these super anti-jedi guns that spawn around the map. You should be able to use guns if you want, but you need to accept a tactical disadvantage against the saberers. I think a good nerf with a score adjuster for gun users is in order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grey_fox_001 Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 BUMP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homosexual Ewok Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Originally posted by Luc Solar Funny. It's like...if you complaing about 1.04, it tells everyone that you were one of those ridiculous assfighters spamming backstab/sweep 24/4 and "ruining" the game for everyone. No really, I'm serious, that's what it means. Funny, it seems the only people who are going "Yippee I love v1.04!" are the players who have the mental and physical reflexes of a slug. "Raven Software, thank you for making patch after patch to keep me alive!" "First you gave me v1.03 because I couldn't figure out how to strafe or roll under a DFA and now v1.04 because binding Absorb and Protect to two separate keys and having to activate them was just downright gay!" "Please do something about these kick whores in v1.05. Some ghey lamer killed me with 5, yes 5 kicks!" "Kicks should do .9999999 % damage. Having to strafe just ruins the game and takes no skill" The game is great; it’s the “community” of whiny, inexperienced babies that need “fixing”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homosexual Ewok Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Originally posted by Demise_SOK One more thing for the no force-dueler pansies whos endless whining since launch have brought about all these stupid patches- you get the gas face. Actually, there is truth in that. "I'm too much of a moron or too slow to react to high damage moves, take em out Raven!" "I'm too much of a moron or too slow to react to Force powers, take em out Raven!" If the "community" gets it's way in v1.09 it will be just two guys, a saber, no special moves, no Force powers, no swings that do more than 4-5 hp damage, no kicks, and we can finally have "pure duels of skilled honor"...that last 90 minutes a piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 You know, calling everyone who disagrees with you a "player(s) who have the mental and physical reflexes of a slug" isn't a way to win an arguement. Personal attacks get you no where. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demise_SOK Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Razorrace- I am not claiming that guns have recently been changed or overpowered (although the added ammo with imp repeater could be called a big boost for guns). I am saying that the saber has repeatedly been NERFED. Damage? Cut. Autoblocking? Cheesed.It used to be a good saberist could defeat a gunner all the time, now give the gunner force jump and absorb and the saberist is dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homosexual Ewok Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Originally posted by razorace You know, calling everyone who disagrees with you a "player(s) who have the mental and physical reflexes of a slug" isn't a way to win an arguement. Personal attacks get you no where. Who says I called anyone in this post anything? That comment was not directed at the person I quoted, it was a shot at the players who are too slow and too stupid to fix the flaws in their play styles and looked to "Mother Raven" to make them "better" players via nerf-patches. If anyone has a problem with my dislike of people who complain and beg for patches because they can't avoid what other players do, fell free to look me up, beat me and "put me in my place". I somehow doubt that people who were unable to dodge a few simple moves have the ability to do that though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mInk3nine Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 One more thing for the no force-dueler pansies whos endless whining since launch have brought about all these stupid patches- you get the gas face. If the "community" gets it's way in v1.09 it will be just two guys, a saber, no special moves, no Force powers, no swings that do more than 4-5 hp damage, no kicks, and we can finally have "pure duels of skilled honor"...that last 90 minutes a piece. There are seven gameplay modes that ships with this game. Theres a reason why people play no force...cause they don't like force. simple enough? For those of us who hate being pushed/pulled/gripped off a ledge to fall to our deaths, that is our option, to play no force. Personally, and i'm sure i speak on behalf of 98.9% of the people visiting these forums, if this game didn't have sabers, we'd be playing something else. it wouldn't even be called jedi knight even but thats not the point. The point is, *I* would take a "90 minute" no force saber duel over a 2 second lightning spammed/1 blue slash death. EDIT- BTW, there seems to be a big bug in this thread. this post should be at the BOTTOM, after grayfox's post. i don't know how the hell i got bumped up 4 posts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rut-wa jodar Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Originally posted by The Lopper Thanks to all those who whined so loud about backstabbing and ass-fighting and got the brilliant minds at Raven to ruin the game with the 1.04 patch. Sure ass-fighting sucks, but the backstab wass the only thing that made the saber a competative weapon in free-for-alls. Now that the saber is so underpowered as to be useless as an offensive weapon, gun-whoring rules the day and free-for-alls are lots less fun. Just another example of the old adage Be careful what you wish for - you might get it. your friend, The Lopper I sympathise with you but you are lowering yourself to the 1.03 whiners level. I suggest you persevere with 1.04 it`s really not that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 So, you're doing personal attacks on a large scale then? I'm not sure how fighting you would put "put you in your place". I imagine it would only increase the personal attacks. Sides, some people around here are interested in actual discussion, not HUGE 1.04 patch flames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caster Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Frankly I can't understand Ewok's problem. The patches fixed bugs in the moves that were unforseen, unintended and (especially) unexpected. I'm very happy that Raven got rid of the DFA bug where if you clipped the saber with your toe after the swing was completed you'd still get 100+ damage. I'm also happy that Raven removed the ability to pivot during backstabs and backswings. I don't know how any being with only two legs can spin around that many times hitting that many people dealing that much damage. The outcome? Realistic, believable, and enjoyable saber fights. It's not just who can pull off the special move of each stance and spin around really fast hoping their saber will knick some one's elbow. It's now foot work, timing, the ability to forsee how your opponent will act, knowing when to swing and when to defend, knowing where to swing, knowing how every swing leaves a defense open that can be attacked. When I play, I don't just think "do this and kill him". I think "Horizontal heavy stance swing, wait till it passes and move in with a light stance forward slash" or "Light stance slashing left and right, I've got to get some distance so I can safely attack with a forward heavy stance slash that'll break through his defense" or maybe "Downward diagonal swing, he might move into a slow horizontal slash spin and I can attack him when his back is turned". The game plays beautifully like the movies now. Or at least as close as it gets when all we have to work with is a keyboard and a mouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Well put, Caster. But I believe it's possible to make it even better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canis_Aureus Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 hmmm whiners might be quite annoying... but when people start whining about how whiners have ruined the game by forcing raven to make a lame patch... well I'm just puzzled. 1.04 is great. Backstab works fine, and red DFA works perfectly... I always play saber only so don't know about guns and I don't care... If I want guns I play OFP or Tribes2... Jedi Knight is about sabers for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grey_fox_001 Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 It's good to see someone that recognises the fact that the moves are now REALISTIC which is what makes the game fun now. I have never been one to complain about assfighting, the solution to that was simple: Just wait for them to get close enough then DFA them. Easy. And I never complained about DFA in 1.02 cause, like ewok says in his sig, you can strafe around it. Now what I think you missed Ewok is that you cant just say "USE ABSORB!!!!" as alot of people are'nt light side and to tell them to turn would mean imbalance on a massive scale. For me, personaly, I LOVE 1.04. I think it has finally made the game complete by stopping certain moves from being swung in circles unrealisticaly and slowing running speeds while traveling backwards. This last change enables the use of the rarely used attacks from the ground upwards making great duels as, with these, you can hit the other persons sabre around the other direction and attack while they are left open and things like that. Now, give me your reasons for not liking the new patch people, and I will give you a solution (not ones like go back to 1.03/02 either but PROPER fixes) so you can play the game the way you like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homosexual Ewok Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 You guys are missing the whole point. "Realistic" to you is slow and boring to me. Playing v1.04 w/o the saber scale stuff is kind of like having a fistfight with a guy who has Down syndrome. Winning is not the problem, actually, it has become much easier now because my opponents have no lethal moves to kill me with. I have been slaughtering the same people who could actually beat me in v1.03. I should be happy right? Winning or "owning" is everything right? Not for me. I like having my abilities pushed to the limit because I know at any moment my opponent can kill me. This to me is exciting, because it not only tests my knowledge of the game, but how fast I am able to implement it on the fly. NF or FF duels are a matter of personal taste, but I'll be damned if I let anyone spout off with this "NF duels are the only skilled duels" or "Force powers are cheap" crap. No matter what game type, FF, NF, CTF whatever, if you know the mechanics of that game style inside and out, nothing, yes nothing, is cheap or unstoppable. The problem with you people is you *think you know what you are doing but you don't. Therefore you cry and complain about "Spamming cheap moves". Yesterday I played a 2 round 10 match duel with a guy and beat him 20 times in a row using nothing but lightning. Now you can cry all you want about how lame that is but if this guy would have simply used absorb (yes, ironically he WAS a Light side player) that attack would of gone right out the window, so to speak. Why I bring this up is after every single death I had to listen to "Lame, gay, newbie (love that one)" flames from this moron. Could I have beaten him another way? Of course, but I did the same damn thing over and over just to see if this twit who was calling me a newbie would ever shut his mouth and start paying attention. Yes, I actually told him to "Just use absorb". I would have never dared to try an attack like this on an experienced player, it would have been suicide. Why? Because it was predictable and easy to counter. But the point to that fight and these "flames" is the same. People don't know the game and the moves/counters as well as they think they do; yet they are so damn self absorbed and arrogant they refuse to learn. But why bother to learn? It is much easier to cry and label others as cheap and pray for a patch. It has worked twice now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homosexual Ewok Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 Originally posted by mInk3nine The point is, *I* would take a "90 minute" no force saber duel over a 2 second lightning spammed/1 blue slash death. Like I said, NF or FF is a matter of personal choice, but MY point is if you knew what you were doing in those FF duels, it would not end in a 2 second death. The only people who die from "Spammed" moves are the people who are unskilled. I am sorry but this is true. "Spam" anything you want at me, anything, guns, lightning, DFA's, kicks, pulls, backstabs, whatever. You may get me once, but only once. Now I'm not saying I'm impossible to kill. What I am saying is if you do the same damn thing over and over I am not going to die from it. To kill a good player you have to surprise him because he knows how to defend himself. I took the time to learn the game. I took the time to learn the counters and defenses, more to the point. Next time someone is "cheap" in your mind, before you complain, stop and ask yourself "is there any way I could have prevented that?” There ^^^ is the key to making yourself a better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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