ET Warrior Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 Originally posted by ep2 Anakin i'll bet none of you had family in washington when all this happened did you No, i had family in New York. i can tell you know when they mentioned the pentagon bein hit i had an adrenaline rush like a mother ****er, cuz my family was in danger, and that gives me the right to say go to war with them sons of bitches, cuz they need to be taken down one or two levels, Now stop, think of the fear, anger, and pain you were feeling when you heard that. The people in Afghanistan have been feeling that pain for their whole lives at the hands of israeli soldiers, who got their weapons and support from the US. Not to mention the US bombs their country all the time. You think that you have the right to get mad and fight back but they dont? And they don't have a military capable of doing anything, so what do they do? Strap bombs to themselves and lash out, or hijack planes and ram buildings..It's not right, but it's what happens when people are pushed too far. More war will only make things worse. Sure, we'll scare the afghani's for awhile, but they'll just come back madder and meaner. And that's it, i'm done with the off topic terrorist business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 The thing about American politicians is that a lot of them aren't exactly the brightest and the best... they're just the people who had enough money to win. And with a subject like this--that depends so much on having public opinion behind it--why would the supporters for war in Washington tell less than the most damning evidence they could find? Did they want to surprise Saddam with an attack? There was never going to be any surprise... they were saying, "We want war with Iraq" for months before this vote. No, they were putting forth their best arguments--arguments which I'd heard before (on these boards, no less). A lot of this "evidence" has been refuted by some very reliable sources in the news media... if you want the links, they're all posted on the war thread that I linked to in my first post. And despite how popular this war seems, a unilateral attack never got more than 35% of the population behind it, and even support for a multilateral attack is now waning. Ari Fleischer actually said that the administration was just throwing out accusations until one of them stuck. So far, nothing has stuck. Basically, in one form or another, every argument for war has come out and been debunked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 I can't think of any real reason why we SHOULD go to war with Iraq........they aren't provoking us, so what do we gain by attacking them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 ep2 Anakin, I am truly sorry that you had to go through that... But, you've just made one of my points. Would you want some poor Iraqi to go through the same thing you did? And if they did, then is it so hard to believe that they would want revenge on America? You said: if they don't want a war then they can leave that country, if they don't, oh well, they'll get somethin real soon, and i hope to be part of it So is it so hard for you to believe that one of them would say the exact same thing? War leads to a cycle of violence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 And ZDawg, I asked you who would Jesus bomb and you said: A Good question, but because I’m not the son of God, I can't answer that. What is the point of being a follower of Christ, as you say you are, if you don't try to follow the example of Christ? Being a Christian is more than going to church, sitting in the front row, holding up your hands and belting out your prayers and hymns as loud as you can. Didn't Jesus say, "Blessed are the merciful, for they shall be shown mercy... blessed are the peacemakers for they will be called children of God..." (Mt 5:7, Mt 5:9)? I think you should read Matthew 6:38-39, "You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.' But I say to you, offer no resistance to one who is evil. When someone strikes you on your right cheek, turn the other one to him as well." Now who do you say Jesus would bomb? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 Well, if anyone is curious about Al-Qaedas motives... http://www.bad-seed.org/notes/archives/00000145.shtml (this is an excerpt from the manual) Basically, they're angry at anybody who they think is "against" the "islamic nation." This is definitley not exclusive to US, but to most Arab leaders as well. We're the strongest, though, so peope notice more when we get hit. and, the training manual for them. (edited, so terrorists cant actually use it to train...) http://www.usdoj.gov/ag/trainingmanual.htm You see? Islamic fundementalists have been angry at non-Islamic people since 1924. You think it takes a lot for that anger to jump to the USA? Not really. I'm sure Israel didnt help, either, but as far as I can tell, the only country that has a legitimate problem with Israel is Palestine. Back on topic now, I think every last measure should be taken to make sure Hussein has no nuclear/bio/chem weapons. I mean, attacking should be the LAST option on the list. War sucks, and everything should be done to avoid it. However... Hussein cant be trusted with weapons of that magnitude. He hasnt shown himself to be responsible enough. If we let a sociopath like him develop long (or even short) range nukes or perfect a strain of ebola or bubonic plague, we, as a world, are asking for trouble. If he has nothing to hide, then he'll give the inspectors unrestricted access (unlike last time). If he tries to block them from certain palaces and bunkers, we know what he's hiding... and we have to go in swinging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elijah Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 Originally posted by ET Warrior Now stop, think of the fear, anger, and pain you were feeling when you heard that. The people in Afghanistan have been feeling that pain for their whole lives at the hands of israeli soldiers, who got their weapons and support from the US. Not to mention the US bombs their country all the time. You think that you have the right to get mad and fight back but they dont? And they don't have a military capable of doing anything, so what do they do? Strap bombs to themselves and lash out, or hijack planes and ram buildings..It's not right, but it's what happens when people are pushed too far. More war will only make things worse. Sure, we'll scare the afghani's for awhile, but they'll just come back madder and meaner. The Afgas where trowing a party when the Twin Towers Fell, They dont care about any of us dying. The Afgan bible (cant remember the name) Tells them to keep they'er sword sharp and redy to kill any christian they may find. Now who do you say Jesus would bomb? Did Isreal not go to war? Did God not tell them to kill not only the men, but the women and children because they where evil? Did solomon not hack the king into pieces before the children of Isreal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breton Posted November 23, 2002 Share Posted November 23, 2002 Originally posted by ZDawg The Afgas where trowing a party when the Twin Towers Fell, They dont care about any of us dying. The pictures of the people partying were fake, they were taken during an islamic festival earlier in the year, and used around the 9/11 events. CNN propaganda. The Afgan bible (cant remember the name) Tells them to keep they'er sword sharp and redy to kill any christian they may find. If you are talking about the Coran, the islamic bible, you are very misinformed. Did Isreal not go to war? Did God not tell them to kill not only the men, but the women and children because they where evil? Did solomon not hack the king into pieces before the children of Isreal? Well now, that's one of the reasons I am an atheist. In the old testament, God was often really terrible and mean, unlike in the new testament. Since you are christian, do you really mean that what they did was right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Originally posted by ZDawg The Afgas where trowing a party when the Twin Towers Fell, They dont care about any of us dying. And before 9/11 did YOU care about them dying? Did you even KNOW that they were dying from american bombing raids? Do you even care NOW that they are dying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elijah Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Since you are christian, do you really mean that what they did was right? If God said it was Right, it was right. Did you even KNOW that they were dying from american bombing raids? Oh? America was Bombing the afgans with no motive? really? please, do tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breton Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Originally posted by ZDawg If God said it was Right, it was right. No wonder there are still religious wars in this world:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Did Isreal not go to war? Did God not tell them to kill not only the men, but the women and children because they where evil? Did solomon not hack the king into pieces before the children of Isreal? That's all Old Testament. Jesus preached a gospel of peace and love and brotherhood and it is our duty as His disciples to follow His example! "Do not repay anyone evil for evil; be concerned for what is noble in the sight of all. If possible, on your part, live at peace with all. Beloved, do not look for revenge but leave room for wrath; for it is written, 'Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord.'" Romans 12:17-19. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkum Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 let me make a point. No religion in the world tells people to go kill other people except maybe satanism. but satanism is messed up, so that one doesn't count. Al-Qaeda has nothing to do with Saddam. In fact, Saddam hates Osama and vice versa. Simple, they both have big egos. Saddam wants to take over the mid-East and Osama is some new age wanna-be Hitler. Should we attack Iraq? Doesn't really bother me. In the GUlf War, Iraq had 1.1 million troops, the 3rd largest army in the world. Now they only have 360,000 troops, a HUGE decrease. The weapons they have are outdated by at least 10 years and they have less of them. We basically destroyed them in the GUlf War, so if we go now, it'd be the same. WE'd win because they have less troops, weapons, and their weapons are outdated. One difference in a possible war than the GUlf War is that we're trying to remove Saddam from power this time, so the mission is a bit tougher. Last time, we were just there to liberate Kuwait. And back to that religion thing. Hitler was killing numerous amounts of people. IT was a mass-genocide! was he truly a Christian? I don't think so! was he truly living out christianity? Hell No! Same with Osama. IS he really Muslim? NO, he's just an insane fanatic. is he truly living out Islam? NO, the Qu'ran says to only take up arms only when you have no choice and you have to defend yourself. Nobody attacked him, he's just brainwashing people around him to kill, just like Hitler did. Hitler brainwashed kids as little as 10 years old in his Nazi rallies to join his youth army only to grow up to fight his meaningless battles. You need to see the real story, not this bull**** that the media puts out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elijah Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Originally posted by Arkum No religion in the world tells people to go kill other people except maybe satanism. but satanism is messed up, so that one doesn't count. Sorry but you are incorrect. Many religions tell people to kill they're enemies. That's all Old Testament. Jesus preached a gospel of peace and love and brotherhood and it is our duty as His disciples to follow His example! Yea... I Guess your right, I'm letting a bit much of my human side show... I (personaly) think we should destroy Al-Qaedas and Osama Bin Laden... But as you said, thats not what Jesus would do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrion Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Originally posted by ZDawg thats not what Jesus would do. Proboly. But wouldnt that only let them do more acts? Besides, Jesus did peaceful stuff and look where it got him, on a cross;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elijah Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Originally posted by Tyrion Besides, Jesus did peaceful stuff and look where it got him, on a cross;) He Died on that cross so sinfull people like my Self and you wouldnt have to burn in Hell. watch your words Tyrion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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