Promod is..

[Mex]

Rubbish, absolotely rubbish in my opinion..

 

It makes it less realistic than the game was! Here is why

 

When lazarous pushed me, I went flying down a pit!

 

Then when I tried pushing him down, it didnt work, and I even pushed till my force ran out, and yes, I did have lvl 3 push and pull.

 

Force Protect : It doesent help in any way, when laz used it, he didnt get a scratch on him, then when I used it, I get killed in one little medium style slash!!!!

 

Lightsabre styles : Yellow style kills in one hit, Red does not for some reason..

 

Lazarous : He always kills me in one hit, but when I hit him he doesent get touched..

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

I can beat Lazarous, but the second he sticks up force protect there's nothing I can do. 3 secondary shots from the level 4 flechette (both balls hitting each time) didn't take him out when he had protection up.

 

I agree about the saber damage as well, I had 100/100 health shields and it only took one medium stance swing to kill me.

 

As much as lazarous may be good at *promod*, I can't help thinking he was lacking in basejk FFA. He chat-kills as much as possible, and yes most of the times I had the chat-icon up I was actually testing to see if he would kill me. He also relies heavily on pull/push which for me are the main factors which ruin basejk.

[ksk h2o]

sounds to me like you got shooled and were quite angry about it. what you mentioned are not a problem for anyone I know that plays promod. you just need to know how the game works.

 

[Lathain Valtiel]

You're right ksk h2o, me, Lazarous, and some other guys were flat out taking his ass to next week in NS Streets.

 

He had the Bryar out, I swing with medium and cut him in half right then and there. He kept bitching and moaning each time Laz killed him. I once took Laz down while he had Protect on, but it was close.

 

In Death Star I was only 5 kills away fdrom him when the game ended, but I was killing gunners left and right.

 

As for yellow.. You had the bryar out kid. Damage for lightsabers is increased whe you are not using a lightsaber. THAT is why red didn't kill you straight out later, you had a lightsaber. And red CAN kill in one hit, even with a lightsaber on the opponent, if you time it right and hit just right. Your bitchings are meaningless.

 

I contest the claim Lazarous abuses Push and Pull. In straight up saber fights Laz barely used it on me. I'd say once for every six times he killed me with a saber.

 

Det, the ONLY reason you die in one strike is because quite frankly you have no DEFENSE against a lightsaber with a gun out, plain and simple.

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

NS Streets? I only played that map once with Promod and you weren't there... I was also talking to someone during that map. Geez, if you're gonna try and dispute my claims, don't lie about it.

[Lathain Valtiel]

Oh no, I was referring to Flanders Det, for most of that post.

[Mex]

Infact I never used the byarr once, and Laz is a lamer, I had my saber in, and was talking, and he just came up, clash bang, I am dead, what a n00b.

[Lathain Valtiel]

You never SHOT the bryar. You had it in your hand, and I killed you before you could switch. Thus the one hit kill.

 

As fr the chatkill.. Laz only did it to me once out of the 50 times I pulled that box up.

[Mex]

I dont even use the byarr, it takes me half a second to switch to the saber. So I use that all the time.

[Lathain Valtiel]

Tht's the POINT man, you were chatting with th bryar in your hand, you turned it off, then you turned and WHAM, sliced in half before you switched.

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

ah right, sorry about the misunderstanding. I was about to break out the screenshot archive and all

[Lathain Valtiel]

It's alright, crap happens.

[Moradivh]

Heheheheh. This thread is most amusing.

 

I've never played a gunner online for more than 5 minutes, but I know I've survived single medium swings from bots as a gunner (though it hurt ALOT), and I've spectated gunners while they've survived medium swings.

 

But still, maybe I'm totally insane. I'll test the "I got 200/100 and still died" claims. Sabers are supposed to do 150% damage to gunners, but it's possible that a perfect spot-on swing will hit more than once.

 

Saber VS guns seems almost perfectly balanced as is, but I hate the thought that maybe shields mean NOTHING, and almost everything in the game is a one-hit kill. Maybe everything under the sun should be nerfed, whadda y'all think?

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

The only saber strikes i've survived in promod are ones where i'm just clipped and manage to jetpack out the way before the full strike finishes.

 

Why exactly should gunners receive more damage than saberists? Saberists have their blocks and parrys to keep saber damage down.

[Doctor Shaft]

this complaint about the saber being powerful is meaningless. Lazarous has done just as quick damage being a gunner as he has a saberist.

 

Here's what happened to me when I put lazarous' stradegy against him.

 

force protect: useless? well it worked agaisnt you didn't it. perfect on lazarous. well, when i used it against him, he was smart and simply drained my force powers dry, and then just finished me off.

 

If the person has protect, keeping distance and waiting for his power to drain while you take potshots is the prescribed method.

 

Saberists take tremendous damage from guns. A single charged bryar shot is all it takes. a stormtrooper rifle wreaks havoc on saberists. the repeater is great, the flechette destroys in small areas, and the rocket launcher, it's devestating. and they are all effective at BOTH long and short range. and you're complaining?!

 

If the saberist got that close and hit, you deserved to die. Please explain to me how a balanced game would work if i had a sword, but had to get close to you, aim JUST right, and then do that FIVE TIMES, or even just THREE?!? That's near impossible. Anyone with basic skills will probably get outmaneuvered the first time, but then merely move out of the way and smash the saberist. That's ridiculous. In fact, that's what basejk is. The saber is the combat knife of jk, it's only good for limited situations. block or close range finish. IF a person gets close, and gets the precise slash, yeah, you deserve to die, not get a second chance. Heck, even in promod, if my first saber hit doesn't do the job, the gunner will usually win. and because the swings are so awkward when you're using them to chase someone, it's a pain in the ass if i have to get the guy several times.

 

Bottom line: saberist not too strong. gunners not too weak.

 

Lazarous, since he's been destroying people lately, has had the same effectiveness without the saber and his force powers. He switched to guns and STILL destroyed all people. And these chat killing claims are ridiculous. Yes, he killed you and your friend a few times with the chat box on. You better find a spot where you are 1.) out of the battle 2.)in some deep dark corner 3.) stop chatting so much. 4.) if you die in chat... OH WELL.... we all gotta lose sometime. If you're being chased by him, guess what, turning on chat box does not equal "time-out". You have to fight. chat when you're dead or something, or type faster, that's all i can say.

 

If someone chased me around and purposely chat killed me, guess what? I... wouldn't.... care. Yeah, I like to win just as much as the next guy, but i know when it's a good time to chat and when it isn't. If someone is on the hunt, I look around and make sure that everything is safe to talk. otherwise.... the game is still, and always will be... on.

[ArtifeX]

Sabers should do more damage to gunners because when trying to stay true to the fiction, gunners wouldn't be trained to minimize the damage to themselves from an incoming saber. Ask anyone who has trained with martial weapons like a sword: there's a difference in hitting someone who's familiar with your weapon.

 

Even if you totally ignore the fiction, the Golan level 4 does 150 points of damage. That kills any jedi with one hit unless they've picked up three +25 shield packs, plus it makes that kill at range. I think that's very even.

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

Artifex, the lightsaber is different to martial weapons. with a martial weapon you can shift your weight to deflect an attack away from the body and other such moves. A lightsaber blade has no mass, and cuts through just about anything, shifting your weight would have no effect. If a lightsaber hits you there is nothing you can do.

 

Doctor Shaft, my entire second and third games against Lazarous consisted of me positioning myself in certain ways to test if he would chat-kill me. He didn't need the kills because without anyone bothering to put up a real fight there was no way he was going to lose. He took EVERY SINGLE chance to chat-kill me and the other players. I don't know which Lazarous you played, but the one I faced lacked certain gaming etiquette.

[zerowingzero]

You guys are funny, laz is beatable... you just have to know when and where.

 

First about the push/pull, it's CSC dependant, so pusing in the general area isnt as effective as aiming dead on.

 

Protect is very usefull now, provided you arent using up all your force jumping and pulling while it's on.

 

Also, pusing while the opponent is swinging their saber is a lot more powerfull than when they are standing idle.

 

s for chat killing, who cares, it's not like he actually needs the kills, and plus, if you want to be evil get a golan, open the chat console, and when laz comes by turn it off and shoot.

 

It's all legal in a ffa...

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

I know Laz is beatable, that's not the issue at hand. I like a good challenge in a game but there are certain methods people use which just take the fun out of the challenge.

[Emon]

I would imagine that the reason the red stance does less damage is because it moves SLOWER...

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

shh Emon, logic has no place in videogames

[Syfo-Dyas]

Here is my take.

 

Having NOT been there, I can't comment on who lacks tact, or who is just being a whiner.

 

I DO think that there is MUCH to be said for being in 'Spectator Mode'. You can learn alot about what it's like from your opponent's point of view.

 

Unfortunately there is no good way to tell where your opponent is healthwise. It may seem like you are attacking and getting good hits against them, and they just aren't phased by it at all. But in reality they've got maybe 2 health points left! It's frustrating I can understand that.

 

It would be nice if your opponent 'looked' injured, or acted injured, so you would know you've hurt them. Might be a cool thing to look into implementing into the game someday if it's possible. As for now, the only way to know is through 'Spectator mode'.

 

 

 

Also, this is a game of split-second victories. Things happen so fast that sometimes it's hard to tell how you died, how you killed, or how your opponent managed to escape your checkmate.

 

As I've said before, I think the game really moves too fast. I don't know if it's possible for a server to set the Timescale for the client machines. If it is possible, I wish that JUST ONE server would run Timescale 0.6 or 7. I've even settle for 0.8. Honestly, the game is more fun at those speeds. As it is, it's like watching a movie in fast forward. Maybe it appeals to ADD/ Mountain Dew / X-treme crowd...

 

 

 

Lastly, on the issue of balance: I don't know for sure if JO is balanced now with ProMod 3. What I DO know was that it wasn't even close to being balanced before ProMod. The CSC alone makes a HUGE difference for JO in a way that adding or subtracting damage points from weapons never could.

 

I know JO is a lot more fun and far more challenging with ProMod. I still get my ass kicked, but at least I have FUN getting my ass kicked now.

 

But what about balance? Well, if the game was UN-balanced before, in favor of certain weapons or attacks, and people capitalized on those things to win games, wouldn't those same people find it harder to win those games if the game became balanced? If ProMod 3 does indeed balance -or nearly balance- JO, it makes sense to think that some people are going to hate it just because they lost the natural advantage.

 

That is ALWAYS going to be a point of debate, because those who lose are more likely to say it was unfair. But those who win are more likely to say they don't see anything wrong. So what I'm saying is that if you are IN for the debate you better be in it for the long haul 'cause this won't be settled anytime soon...

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

JK2 is pretty balanced if you think in terms of the saber being another weapon in your arsenal, Gunners who master the saber will nearly always come out on top of those who just master the gun.

 

On the other hand, there are those who think in terms of Guns vs Sabers, which isn't balanced, this is what Promod deals with.

 

So you've got 2 very different perspectives that drastically affect your outlook of basejk, personally I think in terms of saber vs bryar vs e11 vs repeater etc, but i'm aware that there are those that don't.

 

This is why I feel there will NEVER be a mod that doesn't completely rewrite JK2 gameplay that can satisfy both parties.