DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 please die or something Wall-Gliding is a BUG, not an exploit, it has very little actual benefit in a game, except occasionally saving your ass from a fall. It also makes the game more fun, something which Raven have a lot to learn about, anyone who objects to bugs that make a game mofr enjoyable just has the wrong attitude. Also note that many of those clips are from waaaay back when JK2 had only just been released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 Know what an exploit is...right? Abusing a bug for an advantage. SO...it's an exploit Check out Nutri's movie for some real gunner shots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryudom Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 exploit or not, its still cool as heck, and was very enjoyable to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 yes Nutri has real gunner shots, but do you have any idea how long those shots take to get? I've played him numerious times and its very rare for anyone, even him, to get a shot suitable for a video. Oh, and as far as i'm aware Dsbr-Buffeh has beaten Nutritious in every meeting. The Dsbr video shows how a gunner wins a fight, not how a gunner gets some pretty air-shots. The majority of kills will always be on the ground, so that's where the skill should be focused. Incidently, I design my maps with wall-gliding in mind, and I know other members of the CTF community do as well. As a result, any use of wall-gliding in my maps is NOT an exploit. Have a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lathain Valtiel Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 Wow, I hate to say this, but what crawled up your butt and died Det? This ain't like you to a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 posted at 5:42am Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moradivh Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 In Nutri's defense, I've seen him make those pretty shots all the time when he's playing for fun, almost every time I've seen him play. He was overflowing with em' while making his video. I'm not saying flying sniper hits are practical in competitive CTF, well not often, but he does them all the time in FFA, etc., when he's on the ball. It's great to watch, great to die from even. So funny. And it's not like all his vid kills are mid-air only. Both DSBR and Pistolero have a little of both. But you can't claim flying shots like that are useless in a "real fight," or that skills "should" be focused in any one area. I liked the DSBR video fine. It shows off more CTF moves, while Pistolero is about cool ways to kill with small arms. Both vids took a huge amount of skill and effort to finish and they're both great. I've never seen Buffeh play, Idunno who's better. But anyone who claims that Nutritious or DSBR has the "less skilled video" is just biased. That goes for Detritic and RP. I'm sure Nutri's vids aren't about saying he's better than everyone else. He's not trying to outdo anyone. They're just for fun, and maybe to share with the masses the JO moves that're possible at that level of play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 I never suggested Nutritious' videos weren't skillfull, I was acting in Dsbr's defence about remarks that their's wasn't. Air-Shots aren't an art, they are something that just comes instinctively at times. The fact is, anything that can be done in a game, is practical at times. The mistake comes when people deliberately set out to play in a "cool" way, Dsbr has repeatedly demonstrated that the best result comes from simply doing the most appropriate thing, hence the nature of the video. What I objected to was the comparison between Nutritious and Dsbr when the videos are attempting to demonstrate very different things. On a side note: Currently i'm a bit annoyed with myself because I play really poorly unless i've got some calm music playing. At other times i've got more mid-air sniper shots in a row than on Pistelero. Inconsistancy is far more irritating than just being rubbish I think I fell into the trap of trying to do "cool" shots, so my playing skills suffered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 Dude, I NEVER said it wasn't using skill. Stop putting words into others people's mouth or I'll report you for attempting to spread lies to bring down other posters. I never said anything bad about Nutri's, I just mentioned I don't see why people brag about exploiting (in dsbr movie). They had some decent shots in that one, but I was talking about wall climbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 Fine, go ahead and report me. I try to build bridges and somehow make it worse. I give up on this community. It does nothing but bring out the worst in people. But it might help your case if you read carefully what I (and other people) write in future, I don't see how I somehow put words in you mouth since from my perspective you are defending Nutritious, not putting him down. Some of the shots were good, but common. They did good making the movie clip, but the in-game stuff just just normal, stuff I see everyday. This is what you said about Dsbr, this is what I was defending. I even tried to elaborate my meaning to try and get rid of the unintentional apparant jab at Nutritious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin_Medjai Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 basicly Im going to have to go with moradiv on this one... They both showed great skill in diff forms of combat but you CANNOT tell me that the mistake is in trying to do something cool IE staged moves in videos cause I know a few secrets about something and I could reveal it if necessary. Just move on both the videos were very great and entertaining which is what they were made for entertainment or well sorta dsbr claimed theres more of bragging rights which seemed kind of arrogant to me but I let it slide cause according to the vid it seems they have earned them. Lets try and make more movies instead of griping aboot whos is better I am currently making my own movie except its more like the SW movies all scripted and choreographed and crap.....if any of ya wants to help hit me up on msn messenger lordsod521@hotmail.com or you can go to our site http://www.roleplayersinc.com but its not all the way finished yet just got to finish the interface and upload it our forums are at http://www.roleplayersinc.com/phpBB2 so you can hang out there while we finish up the site. As far as them mid-ai sniper and pistol shots go I can do those all the Time and when I play in FFAs I seem to get "good enough for a video" shots all the time I wish I could just have it recording all the time I could easily throw a movie together in a day or two if it was. Cant we all just get along and enjoy ours and others work and not make it into a competiition? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 People still play FFA? I haven't seen a populated FFA server in months. All the FFA games i've played have been on private/locked servers. My point still stands, if you are trying to just do something cool, you are far more likely to screw up. Better that you just get better at everything, then cools shots will just happen. [Edit: Oops, forgot to say the following] The key words in Moradivh's post were "playing for fun". Due to the extremely frustrating "pull-whorism" associated with publc CTF servers, its been a while since i've been able to enjoy a game, and hence I haven't been able to relax into a game. Now with FFA servers its slightly different, pull-whorism is less beneficial, so its easier to enjoy a game. I've noticed my skills are significantly higher in FFA as opposed to CTF. But I offer the following advice for anyone who actually cares about my point: Find a nice song, set it on repeat and play a game and just enjoy the music, try not to concentrate on the game too much. Ignore all the frustrations, such as pull-whores. Do all this and from my experience you will get some amazing shots. Now you've just got to figure out how to duplicate this mindset on demand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 Det.... you should actually READ someone's post before you comment on it. I WASN'T TALKING TO YOU man...some people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 2, 2003 Share Posted February 2, 2003 ermm your post came after mine, with a gap of at least enough time to have seen my post. Plus we'd had a conflict of opinion, what exactly was I supposed to think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lllKyNeSlll Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 ahaha, that mid-air stun shot was hoodwinker getting killed. HE told you not to tell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lllKyNeSlll Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 Det is right. Every one good knows that its good to land a shot with splash on the ground or wall. The only trick shots that are commonly done is to shoot a rocket at someone's feet, knock them into the air, and hit them against a wall. Besides that, mid-air's aren't really useful. Most of the special frag vids make the players seem better than they really are, since midairs aren't practical unless ur chasing somenoe with flag who jumps and you can't possibly follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 Well, it's a bit obvious I wasn't talking to you. Look at your thread, was I? No Now, look at this "But anyone who claims that Nutritious or DSBR has the "less skilled video" is just biased. That goes for Detritic and RP." Now, since you NOW read the above replies, who do you think I was talking to? Skill is nearly...non existent in a game with such random factors in it. I wasn't saying any of them weren't skilled. I was saying, it does take more "skill" meaning effort, in nutri's video than dsbrs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moradivh Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 You were talking to me? Hahahah, now I'm as confused as Detritic. Unless you're replying within about 10 minutes of a post, you may wanna specify who you're talking to. It's not that obvious. Anyways, I hear ya Det. I play best in a trance, let my instincts take over. If I get all stressed about my opponent's cheeze, or doing some sexy move, then I'm usually painting a target on my head. And I know such selfish thoughts about individual glory can totally ruin good teamplay. RP: before you go reporting me, you may wanna review quotes like: "it does take more 'skill' meaning effort, in nutri's video than dsbrs." I mean, duh, isn't that EXACTLY what I said your claim was? How am I putting words into your mouth? Here's one thing that threw me: skill and effort. They're not the same. Not even in JO, where the gameplay is somewhat limited by pull-whoring and kick-spamming and whatever equivalent that's in your gametype. But.... somebody can have all the experience in the world and still not do as well as someone with natural talent. So basically, when you say "skill" I assume you mean SKILL, not effort. Sorry for the misunderstanding. Anyways, some background for my opposition: I don't play BaseJK CTF. I don't know sophisticated team tactics. I don't wall-glide with speed/rage. I don't rocket people into walls so that they're sitting ducks. I don't do mid-air sniping. And I don't make demos with special observer code to do slow-mo's and spectator rotations and all that crazy **** in the Quake3 Engine. And I find all this VERY impressive when I see them from DSBR/Starcraft/Nutri/etc. Between the Pistolero and DSBR vids, I don't know which took more "effort," but I'm pretty damn sure they were both REALLY time consuming. It looks like the DSBR one was a long while in the making. It's 10 freaking minutes long for God's sake. And anyone who thinks Pistolero was a piece of cake should just look at the notes Nutri included with the zip file -- all his own demo's, all compiled, listed, converted, cut and edited by himself. For the most part, I STILL think that anyone who claims that one took more work than the other, or that one is somehow more valid when it comes to "skill," is just being overdefensive and biased. RP, don't get me wrong: Nutri and I are MSN buddies. I advised him a little on his latest vid. I even suggested/sent him the Pistolero song by Juno Reactor, so if any of you think that music's really ghey, you can blame me. They're my MP3s. I'm not trying to get into a flame war. I like Nutri alot, he's got mucho skill (enough to beat one of DSBR's strongest teams recently with his own clan, if I recall correctly). And it bugs me to see his talents downplayed on these forums, after he puts all this work into a "just for fun" video. I think people need to chill and stop clamoring for jealous rivalry between the video authors. Stop being so edgy, it's pathetic. Better to keep that in the game, not let it defile some really amusing vids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aoshi Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 dont bother arguing with rp. he's one of those saber rpg n00bs that argued with the entire twl community in the /kill thread. he was the one that thought that /kill was a bug that needed to be removed and he kept asking raven to patch it out. he's also probably one of those idiots that kept asking raven to make new patches to get rid of the backstab in .03 and the 'unfair force powers' and dfa in 02. in short he's the type of person that ruins games cause he sucks and cant do what other people do. so his logic is to ask to have things removed because he doesnt have the common sense to adapt. i swear some of you people really need to grow up. you keep posting about 'honor' and 'exploits' when all you're really saying is "i cant beat this person or learn this move and i'm too lazy to even try so why dont i ask the developers to remove that technique and thus force the rest of the community down to my level." just so you know there is no such thing as 'honor' in a world of anonymity and if you cant realize this then well i feel really sorry for you because you are constantly going to be worried about something so idiotic and mundane the internet. OH NO I JUST POSTED SOMETHING THAT MIGHT HURT SOMEONE ELSE'S FEELINGS I HAVE NO HONOR I'M GONNA GO CRY NOW AND BEG THE GOD OF INTERNET CHAT TO FORGIVE ME!! ok now that that has been said. det is right. there are no such things as cheats or exploits. the reason is because there are always 2 sides of the argument but which side can prove his opinion is actually true? one side will say that xbug was intentionally left in the game so it is not an exploit and it is part of the system. the other will say that the gamedevs left it in on accident so use of xbug is an exploit and it should be banned. now which side is correct? the answer is neither because someone claiming that they can read someone else's mind over the internet is just plain stupid. however the person who is arguing that xbug was intentionally left in the game at least has some solid proof i.e. that the 'bug' IS IN THE GAME. whereas the person that says that the bug is unintentional has no proof whatsoever and is simply making an assumption based on a biased opinion. therefore the person who is arguing for the use of the 'bugs' or 'exploits' is MORE RIGHT but not completely right because he at least has some sort of evidence to support his claims. so by this argument wallgliding, strafejumping, and /kill are not exploits or bugs, and since they are part of the system they will continue to be used. some people take this game way too seriously. they need to calm down and realize that this is simply a game and not a way of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin_Medjai Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 It seems the community is split into two seperate entities because saying that the people in TWL are the most l337 players in JKO is a biased opinion most of what Ive seen and heard about the TWL community is CTF and all those wall floats,and strafe jumping/speed stuff. But on the other hand calling someone a saber RPG n00b is uncalled for as those "saber RPGs' may not attend to your liking but I run an RPG club for JKO and we like to roleplay in JKO,but when it comes down to it and its WoW time for my Clan I kick arse in NF Sabe which im sure many of those TWLers would lose to the extreme good NF sabers Clans/players. there are many diff gametypes in JKO to say that one person is the most leet is fictatious as there is no way he can be the best in CTF, FF gunz,NF guns,CTF,Jedi Master,Hydroball,duel,captue the holocrons and many more its impossible. And JKO was built wrong anyways JK was so much better JKO is a multiplayer game where you can be a jedi with a gun and that my friends is Wrong according to the Star Wars realm which George Lucas built and go ahead and clown the SW realm cause you are simply wasting your time discussing a SW game that YOU play to totally contradict yourselves I dare ya to flame! JKO is a Game tho as previously said so however you play that game is good as long as you get your 49.99 worth then lucasarts achieved their goal....and the word n00b is so misused these days without newbs none of you l337 peeps would exist who else would you get kills off of? All said and done you have ruined this thread about a simple task to post a cool JKO vid you made everyone get all mad and turned it into a mass argueing fest. Go to your room all of You! and No TV for a week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 Actually there is one exploit, which gives players an insanely unfair advantage, most of the good players are aware of it. However you have to be aware of its existance to actually notice it being used, its kinda hard to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin_Medjai Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 yawspeed? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aoshi Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 well i've never minded the 'saber rpg n00bs' at all as long as they dont try to tell me how to play my own game. i could care less about backstab and all that other stuff, but when they go and complain about something that pertains to the game I play and they dont (i mean who the hell suicides in a saber only ffa or a duel or who would wallglide, strafejump, ect??) then i get annoyed. i just say to let people play their game and you play yours. i never complained about people backstabbing me because .... IT NEVER HAPPENED. even in .03 it hardly ever happened and when it did i didnt really care. i just got pissed cause i let myself be killed in such an idiotic way. so the people that complain about 'exploits' like wallgliding dont even play a gametype where wallglide would be relevant. they just whine and complain about something that doesnt even matter to them. i could also understand if the 'exploits' even somewhat pertained to them but they dont. i mean if someone /kills in a ffa then who cares? they just lost a point. perhaps it denied you of yours but just get over it and accuse him of being a lamer. then when he's typing a response, kill him and there you go you got your 1 point back. people just need to quit complaining and adapt to things because everytime they've complained they've perhaps made themselves happy but made hundreds of others pissed... selfish bastards =) oh and about the videos. i liked nut's better. more original and had really nice timing. dsbr's was just like a trick jump vid and a shots vid combined into 1. dont get me wrong i'm not criticizing it i'm just saying i liked nut's and star's better. oh just on a side note. twl isnt just ctf. it's tdm ff, tdm sabers, duel nf, and duel ff. virtually all of the best players compete there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin_Medjai Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 where is the thread for stars? never seen that one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aoshi Posted February 3, 2003 Share Posted February 3, 2003 Originally posted by DeTRiTiC-iQ Actually there is one exploit, which gives players an insanely unfair advantage, most of the good players are aware of it. However you have to be aware of its existance to actually notice it being used, its kinda hard to see. well that exploit is just for n00bs that cant aim in the first place and need to use that trick to actually hit anything. i dont really mind it because i can outrun those things anyways even when i'm not using speed and they travel far too slow to hit me when i'm capping. ronin just go search on own-age.com in the jk2 movies section. it's called "demolitionist" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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