C'jais Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 Originally posted by Mandolorian54 dude this isn't the fiftys man. we don' t tell people that they brought it apon themselves when bad stuff happens to them. bullying usually starts when kids are young, and you know kids, almost no disernment, they don't realize they are hurting other kids feelings. And at that age kids who get bullyed really can't defend themselves. then they grow up to be pathetic nerdy wimps. It's a normal cycle of life it's not that hard to grasp. I find joy in the fact that we can finally agree on something, man Bullies lack empathy, or maybe just sympathy. Whatever it is they lack, they're too disgusting to behold. Our society is running dry of good morals when bullies can bully as they see fit, and getting told it's wrong. Or get punished. Bullying does not improve self-esteem, or hardens you in any way. It's no effort to overwhelm a lone person by numbers alone. It doesn't "harden" a person to get 7 people to beat him up. It doesn't harden you if I shoot you with a 9mm in your kneecaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munik Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 I don't think bullying is all about physical violence. If someone kicks your ass on a consistent basis, and you do nothing, or can't do anything, about it, you are someones bitch. In which case any intervention by an adult or friends will only put off the inevitable. Now, I think bullying is the use of physical threats, intimidation, and mental abuse. In the sense that I see this thread discussing, being children bullies in school. Yes, if some child is constantly harassed, I could understand intervention by a teacher. But mostly I think that a child should be left to handle it on their own. Not everyone is gonna grow up to be a well adjusted, affluent, succesful, popular person. Some people will grow up never being able to adjust or adapt to situations. Who are you to think that you need to right every wrong, to avenge every injustice? I would advise and instruct my child on how to handle a situation with a bully, but only in extreme cases do I think I would intervene. Teaching self sufficiency would be more of a priority then protecting them from the negative side of reality. I see people bullying people at work quite often. I don't do anything then, either. If someone asked for my help, I would, but to this date no one has ever asked. Do children ever ask for help in the case of a bully? None that I can remember from my childhood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowTemplar Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 Originally posted by munik But mostly I think that a child should be left to handle it on their own. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. The problem is that the child can't handle it. If it could then the bullies wouldn't target it. And please, anyone who has posted anything along these lines: 'Bullies have low self esteem, so you should feel sorry for the bully too', has obviously never seen the effects of bullying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 Agreed, Munik (time to go play the lotto). Constant intervention on a teacher or parents part will do nothing but further alienate the abused student. Empowering said student should be the main goal. When the bully sees that this is not a student to mess with anymore, they usually go somewhere else. (note: this may or may not be the case with older kids. I work with grades 7 and under. Older kids may simply hold a grudge and work harder to make life miserable for the kid who stood up) Sadly enough, this is often accomplished through physical violence, as it's the only thing that is going to get through to the bullying types. Trust me, I've sat them down and talked to them about the effects bullying can have, and how they're really, really hurting someone here. They tell me what they think I want to hear and leave, then do it again. I've seen kids try to talk to their bullys, asking them why they do what they do. They only receive more teasing. Usually, the only time a bully learns his or her lesson is with a good left hook to the chin. Although I'll break up the fight, a big part of me is cheering on the kid who finally stood up for himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoguePhotonic Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 Originally posted by ET Warrior Right, make the kids defend themselves, it's good for the smallest kid in class to get the crap beat out of him so much when he's young that he has a ruined self-image and strong feeling of worthlessness. Heck, let's just let it continue all through school and maybe he'll end up feeling so horrible that he'll commit suicide! [/immense sarcasm] I was actually never really bullied, but i still think that it's not up to the kids to handle bullying. I mean people should not fear anyone for any reason...even if it is the smallest kid in the class he should run over and start swingin at the bully....if he gets his ass kicked well...least he put up a fight... The idea is to change the kids state of mind all together.... So much fear in our world....and for what?.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 Supposing he did get his ass kicked. Over and over and over. Do you think he would continue to run up and attack this bully? Even monkeys can learn not to hit the button that gives you the electric shock... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoguePhotonic Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 Well when that happens you move to the next level and pick up a non lethal but still very good weapon:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 Non-lethal weapon such as.....? A Baseball bat? Methinks that if a young kid were weilding a baseball bat against a bully and managed to knock him down, it's quite possible that the kid would be very unrational with said bat, and all the years of torment would come flooding out and bully would end up broken and bleeding, maybe even dead. I don't think that kids should just tuck their heads down and recieve the torment from bullies, but many times there is nothing they can do against it. They will always be smaller and therefore will always be bullied unless someone else steps in to stop it. So much fear in our world....and for what?.... So much fear is a direct result of the so much violence in the world. If all violence were answered with violence, humanity would make no progress, we would alway be fighting each other.....even more than we are right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psydan Posted February 15, 2003 Share Posted February 15, 2003 *cough* Turn the other cheek *cough* Matthew 5 *cough* But seriously what do we have all of those "monitors" and various other school staff out for? Aren't they the ones the little kids are suposed to tell if there is a bully? Oh, yeah, the majority doesn't want to get in trouble, so there is a negative implication to reporting bullying, "tattling" seems to always be an effective deterent from informing a teacher. I personally have seen two examples of bullying at my school this year, that turned into fights, and thankfully both times someone slipped passed a staff member and anonomously reported that they might want to go check out what's going on, and one kid was suspended, and another expelled. But, seriously, why be afraid of bullies? There is always a way out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoguePhotonic Posted February 15, 2003 Share Posted February 15, 2003 I can't stand that in our world...the whole break up fights....used to be two people could go out and handle their business like men...now nope can't do ****.... I can see the future....the day legal age of becoming an adult is pushed up to like 25... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted February 15, 2003 Share Posted February 15, 2003 How old are you? Do you even know anything about the world? No, no, I'm not gonna continue, I'll say something I'll regret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoguePhotonic Posted February 15, 2003 Share Posted February 15, 2003 18...and I know to much about our world...that's the problem....knowing to much is a bad thing.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[KOC]Qui-Zan Posted February 15, 2003 Author Share Posted February 15, 2003 Originally posted by RoguePhotonic I mean people should not fear anyone for any reason...even if it is the smallest kid in the class he should run over and start swingin at the bully....if he gets his ass kicked well...least he put up a fight... The idea is to change the kids state of mind all together.... So much fear in our world....and for what?.... I'd really hate to meet you And for those of you who think bullies just need to be comforted, this is my story: When i was about 12 i used to go on the bus to and back from school, once in the morning and once in the evening, these journeys lasted about 40mins. Now i got on at one of the last stops and always had to sit next to this guy named craig because it was the only seat left. After about 3 days he started pushing me of the seat, onto the floor and i had to go stand up. Then he became friends with another kid on my bus (can't remember name) and the used to sit behind me and flick my ears, slap me round the face, hit me and throw their bags at me. I told my mum once and she complained to the school, but nothing was done. one day i was sat on the inside on the seat, next to craig when the other guy got on. There were no seats left so he had to sit on the end of our bench seat thing. They dicided they didn't want me to sit there so they treatened to put yogurt in my face if i didn't move. I said "NO" and they then covered my face in yogurt as i tried to stop them, but couldn't. Then they BOTH pushed me against the side of the bus and i couln't breathe (i'm asmatic [sp?]) and they did this until i started crying (it really hurt that much) Now you tell me RoguePhotonic about why people should be bullied? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowTemplar Posted February 16, 2003 Share Posted February 16, 2003 Originally posted by [KOC]Qui-Zan Now you tell me RoguePhotonic about why people should be bullied? Yeah, I'd like to hear that too. To me it sounds like social darwinism, which I do not support. But seriously what do we have all of those "monitors" and various other school staff out for? Yeah, I've been asking myself that same question for the last 10½ yrs. Oh, and ditch that bible stuff. Like someone said once: "I very much support this "turn the other cheek" stuff, but I only have two cheeks". I ran out of cheeks a long time ago, and those I have left I save for those whom I find worthy of them. Bullies don't fit in that cathegory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted February 16, 2003 Share Posted February 16, 2003 Originally posted by RoguePhotonic I can't stand that in our world...the whole break up fights....used to be two people could go out and handle their business like men...now nope can't do ****.... Yes, violence is the answer to our problems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munik Posted February 16, 2003 Share Posted February 16, 2003 Qui-Zan, that is an unfortunate situation. So, how was it resolved? Did you do something, or did someone intervene? How would someone be able to intervene and help you in that situation? I too had one incident when I was younger with a group of bullies. Me being a few grades lower then them, they picked on me. Then one day I did something about it. All I needed was the balls to do it, and in fact afterwards my confidence was higher then before. I alone averted those thugs, and from my action they ceased to harass me. And I feel I'm a better man today because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted February 16, 2003 Share Posted February 16, 2003 When i was in kindergarted in got picked on, and my parents told me that i should stand up for myself. So one day i knocked the bully down and sat on him. (I was actually pretty chunky back them.....i'm now very scrawny....go figure) But after that he never picked on me......but i dont think that changed my life that much...........I was actually pretty upset about the whole thing, because i had to go stand by the wall for recess......very sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted February 16, 2003 Share Posted February 16, 2003 I was actually pretty upset about the whole thing, because i had to go stand by the wall for recess......very sad. Now that will ruin a kid for life! You poor, poor boy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Solar Posted February 16, 2003 Share Posted February 16, 2003 I'd just like to say one thing about this whole "stand up for yourself"-stuff. As a rule the bully is twice the size of the bullee (Bullee? Is that a word?? ) The bully has 10 guys backing him up, the bullee has no-one. Who the hell stands up to that? If you can stand up for yourself then usually you won't be the one who gets bullied (for Real, that is). I've been 175cm and 65kg (=not a big guy) for the last 10 years and I've never been bullied. Why? >> Because everyone knew that I'd practised martial arts before I went to school. I did something "special" one time when I was ~8 years old and that's it; no bullying, ever. My point is: You think the bully wants "a fair fight"? You think he/they look for someone who is equal to them physically and mentally? You think they want to risk their "Tough-Guy"-rep by challenging someone who has the slightest chance of beating them in any way? Well, do you...PUNK? Hahahaha... ahem..sorry. Couldn't resist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted February 16, 2003 Share Posted February 16, 2003 You think the bully wants "a fair fight"? You think he/they look for someone who is equal to them physically and mentally? You think they want to risk their "Tough-Guy"-rep by challenging someone who has the slightest chance of beating them in any way? But the bully often doesnt want to risk even the chance of being defeated. So he wont threaten someone who he perceives as a threat. Clocking the bully shows him that you're not going to lie down and take it anymore, and since the bully had a little bit come back at him, he's not likely to pick on that kid anymore... But I agree it's not that simple. You might hit the bully, but then his ten friends might hold you down and he pummels you. Who wants to mess with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psydan Posted February 17, 2003 Share Posted February 17, 2003 Originally posted by ShadowTemplar Oh, and ditch that bible stuff. Like someone said once: "I very much support this "turn the other cheek" stuff, but I only have two cheeks". I ran out of cheeks a long time ago, and those I have left I save for those whom I find worthy of them. Bullies don't fit in that cathegory. Well, If you read that passage (Matt. 5) through, it says: 44. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; 45. That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. And Romans 12:19 says: 19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. So, yah....I kinda disagree that you have to fight back, but if you don't follow the Bible, I guess you could argue otherwise... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunClown Posted February 17, 2003 Share Posted February 17, 2003 Usually, the only time a bully learns his or her lesson is with a good left hook to the chin. I did that once literally. One morning in grade 7 a guy came up to me and slapped me on the face hard. Since he knew I was a pacifist and I wouldn't do anything back he slapped me again and laughed at me saying I wouldn't do anything back to him. This went on with him slapping me around seven times and finally out of the blue I grabbed him kneed him in the chest then gave him an uppercut with my left hand in the chin. Just like the quote above. He was knocked to the ground and his face was all red. I must say it felt good for a few seconds. I can still remember the sound my fist made on contact. It was like dropping a block of steel on another block of stell like a thumping sound. Definitely different to the sound on the movies lol. He didn't bother me again after that. Does that make me a bad Christian??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted February 17, 2003 Share Posted February 17, 2003 Originally posted by FunClown Does that make me a bad Christian??? I dont think so. To simply sand there and allow yourself to be abused like that is wrong. You must be willing to fight back when necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoguePhotonic Posted February 18, 2003 Share Posted February 18, 2003 I never said anyone should be bullied...only that they should do something themself without help from anyone else.... In the end it will make you a better person if you handle it yourself.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted February 19, 2003 Share Posted February 19, 2003 Originally posted by RoguePhotonic I never said anyone should be bullied...only that they should do something themself without help from anyone else.... In the end it will make you a better person if you handle it yourself.... Only if you manage to do it without getting the crap beat out of you.....getting beat up kinda makes you feel bad....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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