WarteX Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 I havent read all the replys in this post yet. But I think you should have in mind that the sabers shouldnt counter eachother to much. We dont want sabre switching spam instead of stance switching, do we? I agree with you Rockstar, single saber should be the strongest as it's easier to hit harder if your using two hands (IRL). I dont mean it should take more damage, but it should break your opponents defense alot easier than double saber or duel saber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cheat Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 will you be able to control each saber individually when u have two sabers? i think if would provide better gameplay and make it more difficult to master Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gosub Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 I think the main problem with sabers is defending, because there is no certain way you can defend a saber blow, this makes some people spam specials, in a effort to take as many HP as they can if raven can somehow fix that, i think saber combat will be much more skilled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toms Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 Originally posted by Rockstar yes that would be very cool when using guns, however with a lightsaber its only really one hit anyway which will determine the fight, may it be a slash or stab to the torso which is fatal. a decapitation.. need i say lol, or a stab to a limb (which would be SOOO painful:( ) which would probably cause the jedi to fall down in agony (as we saw with obi1 in EP2). or at worsed a dismembered limb, which would not only get the person out of the battle but cause them to immediately into shock. except that doen't happen. At the moment a red "powerfull" blow cuts straight through someone and they die. Then a blue "light" blow cuts straight through someone and they are fine..... visually it appears that the effect should be the same, but it isn't. So, assuming that they aren't going to change the blue-red stances or institue one hit kills they need to do something to visually differentiate between the "powerful" blows and the "light" ones. The only way i can see to do this is to stop lighter blows clipping all the way through the target. I think the main problem with sabers is defending, because there is no certain way you can defend a saber blow, this makes some people spam specials, in a effort to take as many HP as they can if raven can somehow fix that, i think saber combat will be much more skilled. yeah.... i think we are all trying to band aid something that can't be fixed... but it is worth a try... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solbe M'ko Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Well, the collision detection system that is supposed to be implemented in JA might be able to solve that problem. It could be made so that light hits bounce off after they strike, like when Luke hit Vader in the shoulder. If some kind of "smart" saber system were implemented, it would be a huge boost to the game, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blademaster_109 Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Originally posted by Luc Solar The quotations marks are just for you Spider Al We'll have 3 different saber combinations: Single saber, two bladed saber and two sabers. With every saber style we got 3 "substyles" >> fast, medium and strong. (blue/yellow/red -sort of thing) The big question is: how should all this be balanced? Here's how I think the sabers should be from a realistic POW (By "good" attack I mean that it gets past defences. By "weak" I mean doing less damage/hit) Double bladed saber Good but weak offense. Good defence against sabers, but poor defense against blasters. (It should be quite difficult to block shots that come straight towards you) Two Sabers *Excellent but weak attack. Poor defence against a saber. (try blocking a powerful blow with only one hand) * Excellent defence against blasters. (Blocking a blaster shot does not require much physical force) Single saber * Medium but powerful offense. Medium defence against sabers. * Medium defence against blaster shots. (to be continued) good idea, except the saber staff should be able to use only one side, so it can gain a medium in blaster blocking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockstar Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 umm blade master that would be CRAP!! that would just be unfair. the saber staff they are putting in is actually a genuine saber staff i think. Darth Maul's was infact 2 lightsabers joined together. there was another dark jedi ages before him who had a genuine light staff and i think that is what lucas arts are incorperating if you want single side so badly just go a single bladed saber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solbe M'ko Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 From the looks of it, you actually have 2 sabers joined together in JA. That sith master's name was Exar Kun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Originally posted by Blademaster_109 good idea, except the saber staff should be able to use only one side, so it can gain a medium in blaster blocking I doubt they will do this, simply because of gameplay reasons. If you have a double-bladed lightsaber that can also be used as a single blade, this will be inherently more powerful that the regular single blade. Raven has stated that the lightstaff that can be split into two singles (like in the video) will no longer be included in JA. They felt that this would make it so that no one would pick the two single blades. I suspect they will use this same reasoning regarding the lightstaff with one blade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solbe M'ko Posted June 25, 2003 Share Posted June 25, 2003 That's some good news! Whew! I think that the lightsabers should have an increased effectiveness against guns in MP. It seems to me that if I put my defense up to level 3, I can still deflect only a small minority of the shots coming at me. Plus, the guns do a good deal more damage in a shorter amount of time than the sabers. This should be remedied, in my opinion, so that the sabers are more intimidating in team based games. Anyway, the most important thing is that all 3 saber types have some distinction, and that the distinction makes sense and is balanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obi-Wan X Posted June 27, 2003 Share Posted June 27, 2003 Only using one side of the lightstaff? Now I don't want to be rude, but that would just be dumb. Not only for balancing reasons, but also, who wants to use a lightstaff wit only one side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Solar Posted June 28, 2003 Author Share Posted June 28, 2003 2 seconds after JA is released, I bet we'll have a mod that gives you a double bladed saber that can be split into two sabers or used as a single saber with all the benefits of each fighting style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockstar Posted June 28, 2003 Share Posted June 28, 2003 i think your right solar ..... im not looking foward to that, tho i think its inebitable. i don't know why people would want a double bladed saber that can use one side. i don't mean to be critical, but if you want one side then use the single blade also, as a response to: I think that the lightsabers should have an increased effectiveness against guns in MP. It seems to me that if I put my defense up to level 3, I can still deflect only a small minority of the shots coming at me. Plus, the guns do a good deal more damage in a shorter amount of time than the sabers. This should be remedied, in my opinion, so that the sabers are more intimidating in team based games. i don't see the problem man. i think that the lightsaber IS already better enough than the guns. i wouldn't want a game where the guns are just useless, as the lightsaber is the norm anyways... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agen Posted June 28, 2003 Share Posted June 28, 2003 I really don't want to see a single type of saber being used and the rest left behind, i'd much rather see everything equal, or the single saber being used just a bit more. If that was to be the case then the double saber and staff should be used as much as each other which makes them both less likely but more dangerous because your average joe dosen't know so much about them (unless you play the game alot in which case, it pays off and you deserve to be better against them). Also, if the staff was just the 2 sabers put together that would cause serious balance issues. Since i've heard that it's not actually going to be like that, then i think it would be 'ok' in sp but a definate no no for mp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockstar Posted June 30, 2003 Share Posted June 30, 2003 yeah i wanna see pretty even saber usage, but i also would like to see the single blade being used slightly more if any. im really glad to hear the rumours that the new saber styles will be at the expense of force powers. i think this is really good and we will actually see some single bladed sabers. 2 things determine why someone chooses something: efficiency and appeal. to most people the duel and double will appeal more. but making the single blade more efficient i think will be great at trying to even it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted June 30, 2003 Share Posted June 30, 2003 Originally posted by Solbe M'ko I think that the lightsabers should have an increased effectiveness against guns in MP. It seems to me that if I put my defense up to level 3, I can still deflect only a small minority of the shots coming at me. If your saber defense is at level 3, you can block every blaster shot that comes at you. They can't make it more effective than it already is. Obviously, you aren't going to be able to block explosives... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemios Posted July 1, 2003 Share Posted July 1, 2003 I think that a style for each "saber" would be enough, but probably at least single saber will keep the original 3 stances. I would balance the styles this way: Single saber: - Defence ratio: 1.0 - Offence ratio: 1.33 - Speed ratio: 1.0 Dual sabers: - Defence ratio: 1.0 - Offence ratio: 1.0 - Speed ratio: 1.33 Double bladed saber: - Defence ratio: 1.33 - Offence ratio: 1.0 - Speed ratio: 1.0 So every saber would have pros and cons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 IIRC, in an interview posted at jk2files.com, it was stated that in fact the lightstaff and two lightsaber styles are stances in themselves. So all the stances are: blue yellow red two single lightsabers lightstaff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reprehence Posted July 2, 2003 Share Posted July 2, 2003 No one has really talked about range of attack. To me that is a distinct component of the saber balancing that has been ignored so far. I've always found it playes a big part in duels - if I can hit you but you can't hit me, guess who wins. Slower attacks have greater range, but hit harder, so I've successfully stayed out of blue range with red and timed the hit for a win. With blue it's about sneaking in under red's big swing for a quick slash. It looks like duel sabers will be fast and have a long range - perhaps similar to Tavion's style. I wonder how that'll play into the mix. I also hope they will introduce a forward thrusting stab. The back stab was okay - but I just think it would be cool to be able to impale some guy in front of you. Then slowly draw the saber from his lifeless body as he slumps to the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockstar Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 yeah maybe not a bad idea however, when you stab you stick your saber out and your defense is at its lowest possible point. a jedi could forsee it and push the stab to the side and have his choice in which way he would like to leave a nice bloody slash mark accross your torso im not against it, but i do think that if it does fail you should be as good as dead. and also it shouldn't as damn ridiculas as the lunge which can't be blocked at close range up close. if it does do this then it should be very risky with low chance of success Nemios, i liked your layout. i think its good the alternate saber styles only have one stance, it will give more reason to go the good ol single blade. i think its very realistic how the lightstaff can't be thrown (how the hell could you catch it on return? lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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