HEX editing character models for new textures

[Darkkender]

I've noticed alot of the new textures and items released need to make changes to the 2da files. I'm curious if alot of these can be adjusted in ther mdl file via hex. If so I was thinking that some of us who can edit hex might be able to help make changes to the models.

[Darth_ToMeR]

I didn't understand what you want to do.

Can you explain?

[cchargin]

Hi all,

 

so I was thinking that some of us who can edit hex might be able to help make changes to the models.

 

That gives me an Idea!

 

For the next version of MDLOps I will add a feature that will let you rename the textures in a binary model without hex editing. I will credit you for the idea darkkender!

 

Are there any other hex editing like operations that MDLOps should support?

[Darkkender]

For the next version of MDLOps I will add a feature that will let you rename the textures in a binary model without hex editing. I will credit you for the idea darkkender!

 

That sounds great cchargin. That feature alone would be very handy and it would reduce the number of programs needed to mod kotor.

 

I didn't understand what you want to do.

 

Darth Tomer what I was refering were the mods that create new player model textures examples would be the ones that are apllied to juhani and bastilla in svosh's different robe mods also in which chainz has reworked. Those require making changes to the appearance.2da to apply your new model type to replace the old model already listed in the 2da file.

 

Now as some of us are brave enough and do play with hex editing models anyways. I was wondering if we can change the mdl file for the original character models to include the new clothing textures as variant clothes like we would do with the lightsaber models, and still retain the original model name.

 

If so I would think it would be great if any of us were to step forward as brave souls that others might enlist our assistance this might reduce the number of mods needing to modify the 2da files and improve compatibility of mods without side editing when we download.

[ChAiNz.2da]

Originally posted by darkkender

If so I would think it would be great if any of us were to step forward as brave souls that others might enlist our assistance this might reduce the number of mods needing to modify the 2da files and improve compatibility of mods without side editing when we download.

 

Great idea Darkkender! Not to mention cutting down on writing the 'readme' instructions on how to edit the .2da files. Of all the modding projects that I've done so far....writing the readme was what I didn't look forward to...

 

Must be that thing about "guys and instructions / directions" bleh

[T7nowhere]

If you edit a model with a new texture It has to have a row in appearence.2da. Models like the the PC body models have a base texture applyed to it and when in appearance you have a model and tex columns, the tex column has the texture name minus the numeric and then you bring in the uti which can specify texture varient for a model type.

 

When I make mods I do always try to reduce the 2da's required to alow the mod to run but in many cases there is just no other way of doing than editing a 2da. If you wanted we all could make mods that don't use any 2da's but that would severly limit the number type and quality of the mods.

 

One thing that would be very usefull is a tool that could automatically edit 2da's, and ut* files based on perameters set by the modder.We do have KISS tool but lets face that thing is not easy to use and for many mods its just plain overkill. self extracting installers are nice and all but do we need one for a lightsaber mod when all that is required at most is a simple upcrystal.2da and maybe baseitems.2da.

 

OK i think i strayed a bit there. To keep it simple if there was a way to edit armors, npc and all that ,without editing appearance.2da I would have done it long ago along with several others.

 

But hey, atleast we don't have to create a new baseitem for every new item

 

edit: heh, beat ya to it Redhawke

[RedHawke]

Originally posted by darkkender

Now as some of us are brave enough and do play with hex editing models anyways. I was wondering if we can change the mdl file for the original character models to include the new clothing textures as variant clothes like we would do with the lightsaber models, and still retain the original model name.

Sadly I don't believe this can be done... let me elaborate;

 

The clothing and underwear models are about the only things that are somewhat unique on NPC's (Only), so say like in my Canderous Dark Jedi Mod I wanted to change just Canderous Revan robes slot (J) to use my custom Bandon model... you have to do an appearance.2da edit to accomplish this, because Canderous, as well as Carth, uses the standard PMBJL Revan robe body model, just like all the other Solder PC's, if I were to include a PMBJL.mdl and .mdx instead, to avoid editing appearance.2da, I would end up overwriting Canderous and Carth as well as all the male soldier PC's as well with the new dark robe model... not the intended result.

 

Also lightsaber models do not work like the clothing models do, clothing models must have a refrence in the Model A-J cells appearance.2da for them to show up in game at all.

Originally posted by darkkender

If so I would think it would be great if any of us were to step forward as brave souls that others might enlist our assistance this might reduce the number of mods needing to modify the 2da files and improve compatibility of mods without side editing when we download.

Sadly, we are stuck with how it is, as there are too many shared models in the appearance.2da for this to be possible or practical.

 

Not trying to rain on your parade darkkender, but I don't see how it is possible.

 

Originally posted by cchargin

For the next version of MDLOps I will add a feature that will let you rename the textures in a binary model without hex editing.

That sounds sweet cchargin!

[Darkkender]

Thank you T7 and Redhawke I actually was not aware of all that knowledge and it makes a profound amount of sense to me after reading your posts.

 

I have to admit I totally agree with you T7 we need a .2da inserting and extracting tool. Like KMM where we keep all the commonly edited 2DA files in overide and just use a insert extract tool however the problem would then be in the gff files and when they reference certain lines in the 2da files. if this proposed utility made changes to both gff files and 2da's it would be excellent.

[SConrad]

Originally posted by T7nowhere

One thing that would be very usefull is a tool that could automatically edit 2da's, and ut* files based on perameters set by the modder.We do have KISS tool but lets face that thing is not easy to use and for many mods its just plain overkill. self extracting installers are nice and all but do we need one for a lightsaber mod when all that is required at most is a simple upcrystal.2da and maybe baseitems.2da.

Appending a .2da with KISS is remarkably simple once you get the knack of it, and in the end, it's a lot faster to do it that way than manually edit it with kotor tool. If you have several .2da's, you'll save a lot of time.

[RedHawke]

Originally posted by SConrad

Appending a .2da with KISS is remarkably simple once you get the knack of it, and in the end, it's a lot faster to do it that way than manually edit it with kotor tool. If you have several .2da's, you'll save a lot of time.

No offence SConrad, but I really don't agree...

 

KISS is far too complicated for normal users to use... scripting, the likes of which are used in KISS, is far too difficult for most people... it is hard enough to learn the NWN/KOTOR scripting language just to mod, but to then to ask people to learn another just to install the mod is overkill.

 

If it were easier to use, better documented, and it's makers more willing to join the KOTOR and KOTOR II Modding community, I'm sure more would be using it.

 

BTW what I mean by easier is: To write a GUI for the user to use, and the user just enters the data for the mod that needs to be changed then KISS writes the scripts that it uses in the background... scripting, of any kind, is by far the most difficult hurdle for some to overcome, and this fact alone makes the KISS tool unusable by most.

 

Again, I mean no offence...

[SConrad]

Originally posted by RedHawke

No offence SConrad, but I really don't agree...

 

KISS is far too complicated for normal users to use... scripting, the likes of which are used in KISS, is far too difficult for most people... it is hard enough to learn the NWN/KOTOR scripting language just to mod, but to then to ask people to learn another just to install the mod is overkill.

 

If it were easier to use, better documented, and it's makers more willing to join the KOTOR and KOTOR II Modding community, I'm sure more would be using it.

 

BTW what I mean by easier is: To write a GUI for the user to use, and the user just enters the data for the mod that needs to be changed then KISS writes the scripts that it uses in the background... scripting, of any kind, is by far the most difficult hurdle for some to overcome, and this fact alone makes the KISS tool unusable by most.

 

Again, I mean no offence...

As I've said somewhere, a GUI is being considered, so we'll see.