FOX News

[TK-8252]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News_Channel_controversies

 

That's an interesting article. Worth the long read.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News_Channel_controversies#False_reporting

 

You can just do a YouTube search for any clip from Faux News, Bill O'Reilly, or Sean Hannity, and get all kinds of ****.

 

I'll throw in a Jon Stewart clip for good measure:

 

http://youtube.com/watch?v=P8PivH5u96c

[Dagobahn Eagle]

Didn't Fox news Propaganda Sender go to court and win the right to lie?

Yesh.

 

I'm still waiting Mr. Eagle, I'm still waiting for proof that FoxNews lied.

For the third time, it's in the report (search this thread for "scholarly report"). It's not my fault that you don't read it.

[Good Sir Knight]

You made a statement in here that was really the crux of your argument. I'm simply asking for you to back it up thats all.

 

All I heard was your opinion..come on now... this is a place for discussion, not to hand out course work.

 

Educate me on the Faux Mr Eagle, educate me.

[SkinWalker]

This report provides the breakdown of misperceptions among viewers of the major news networks. In it, Fox was cited as having the most viewers with misperceptions while NPR had the fewest. NBC, CBS, CNN etc. all fell variously in the middle.

 

This doesn't directly indicate, of course, that the misperceptions are the result of lies and deceptions. It could as easily be indicative of the overall lack of intelligence, cognitive abilities or the credulous nature of the viewers themselves (or any combination thereof).

[sockerbit89]

Oh for christ sake. Why does everything have to be black or white for you GSK? FOX has to be found liying or innocent til the opposite proved is that it?

 

Well while FOX may not directly lie to viewers they simply put small censurs on things they don't like. It can't be called lying when they only show one side of a matter but it is still far from fair news. A propaganda station such as in north korea doesn't always need to directly lie. Yay-sayers can also be gained by leaving out or sharpening up news to the gouverments favor.

[Dagobahn Eagle]

It's certainly lying to say WMDs were found in Iraq, for one thing. And just to get one thing straight: Degraded sarin is not a WMD.

[TK-8252]

Not to mention that Bill O'Reilly (okay so they don't claim his is a "news" show) has been caught in numerous lies. Such as his defense of U.S. war crimes that took place during WWII that actually were Nazi war crimes (O'Reilly defends Nazi war criminals! Yay!) Or his fake War on Christmas and such...

[Good Sir Knight]

It could as easily be indicative of the overall lack of intelligence, cognitive abilities or the credulous nature of the viewers themselves (or any combination thereof).

 

Oh of course SkinWalker, without even meeting/conversing with the thousands of Fox viewers you're willing to judge that they're either:

 

A. Ignorant

 

or

 

B. Corrupt

 

 

That is so openminded of you. I love this tactic by the left. When backed into a corner they'll state one of two things.

 

1. Dissent is the highest form of Democracy

 

2. The other guys are just ignorant.

 

 

This is the type of attitude that makes Democrats lose elections. This is the type of attitude I want to see more of. The more outrageous and egotistical the left gets the better.

 

 

Oh and so I'm taking it that FoxNews hasn't flagrantly lied? I still haven't seen one iota of proof. Still waiting....

 

 

It's certainly lying to say WMDs were found in Iraq, for one thing. And just to get one thing straight: Degraded sarin is not a WMD.

 

That's your definition, here's Princeton's.

 

 

A weapon that kills or injures civilian as well as military personnel (nuclear and chemical and biological weapons)

wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

 

 

Again you didn't even watch that segment, furthermore you've probably never even watched FoxNews you've just read someone's opinion.

 

I watched this segment and they were careful to note exactly what was found and what wasn't.

 

 

Oh for christ sake. Why does everything have to be black or white for you GSK? FOX has to be found liying or innocent til the opposite proved is that it?

 

Until I can actually understand what you're trying to put across, I won't be able to address you. Please restate your question.

[Good Sir Knight]

What of Rather's demise at CBS?

 

I doubt any of you were really concerned about the integrity there... gee I wonder why?

[TK-8252]

GSK, I already posted you the wikipedia page that shows at least two direct lies by Faux News:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News_Channel_controversies#False_reporting

 

Did you not see it? One was fake quotes that made John Kerry look bad, and another was about a non-existant chemical weapons facility "found" in 2003.

 

It those aren't lies... I don't know what are.

 

 

Rather was a fraud and everybody knows that. I don't think anyone's going to dispute that. It seems though that a lot of Americans turn to Faux News for their (mis)information, listen to Bill O'Reilly and think "OMG, Christmas is under attack, we gotta vote Republican to save Jesus from the evil atheist conspiracy!"

 

Faux News is worse than any Soviet propaganda station - most people can't see through its bias, because they themselves are neocons and want to believe this stuff. They want to believe that Christians are a persecuted minority that must fight back. They want to believe that al-Qaeda is on the run. They want to believe that the government isn't corrupt and full of liars. They want to believe that WMD's were found in Iraq.

[Dagobahn Eagle]

I watched this segment and they were careful to note exactly what was found and what wasn't.

Namely: "Huge chemical weapons factory found in Iraq... Reports: 30 Iraqis surrender at chem weapons plant... coal. troops holding Iraqi in charge of chem. weapons.". That's the news banner they ran.

 

Oh of course SkinWalker, without even meeting/conversing with the thousands of Fox viewers you're willing to judge that they're either [ignorant or corrupt]

Either that, or made that way by FOX News. And Skin isn't the one saying it - his independent, objective report is.

 

FOX News-viewers have a far, far higher level of misconceptions than viewers of other channels. There are only two explanation for that - that they are ignorant already, or that FOX News is mis-leading.

 

That is so openminded of you.

Says the guy who obviously has not bothered to read the article.

 

This is the type of attitude that makes Democrats lose elections.

What's funny is that it's also true. Supporters of torture, the invasion of Iraq, and other dubious acts of Dubya all have some sort of mis-conception about what they're discussing. Debate torture with a supporter of it, and he'll rant on about how torture can be controlled, how mental abuse is not torture, and so on (take the test). According to a series of focus groups done by ACLU, most torture-supporters got their view-point from - guess - the TV series 24. Wow, what a great source of information on torture.

 

And I bet you 99% of neo-cons haven't even touched the Downing Street Memo.

 

Finally, if I take Wikipedia's statistic regarding how 40% of conservatives watch FOX News, and couple it with PIPA's report on how 80% of FOX News' viewers have one or more serious mis-conceptions about the Iraqi war, that adds up to a bit.

 

I doubt any of you were really concerned about the integrity there... gee I wonder why?

Maybe because CBS-viewers don't have nearly as many mis-conceptions about things as FOX News' viewers?

 

A weapon that kills or injures civilian as well as military personnel (nuclear and chemical and biological weapons)

But does degraded sarin do that? Skin, you know this one;).

[toms]

I doubt any of you were really concerned about the integrity there... gee I wonder why?

 

Well, i missed most of that incident, not being in the us, so tell me if i'm wring here.. but didn't they admit they were wrong and apologise?

 

Maybe Foz has admitted it was wrong and apologised too. Anyone?

 

Of course anyone can make mistakes.. its whether you admit to them and learn from them.. or keep repeating them thats important.

[SkinWalker]

Oh of course SkinWalker, without even meeting/conversing with the thousands of Fox viewers you're willing to judge that they're either:

 

A. Ignorant

 

or

 

B. Corrupt

 

If you look back at what I actually wrote you would see I used neither the word "ignorant" nor "corrupt." Indeed, I didn't even say that was what I believed of Fox viewers. I said it could as easily represent the options I listed as it could out-right lies and deception on the part of Fox News. You really should pay closer attention and assume less when it comes to what others write, it'll go further in your favor.

 

That is so openminded of you. I love this tactic by the left. When backed into a corner they'll state one of two things.

 

I'm a conservative.

[Good Sir Knight]

Namely: "Huge chemical weapons factory found in Iraq... Reports: 30 Iraqis surrender at chem weapons plant... coal. troops holding Iraqi in charge of chem. weapons.". That's the news banner they ran.

 

Either that, or made that way by FOX News. And Skin isn't the one saying it - his independent, objective report is.

 

Oh sure it's independent. I go to their site and surprise surprise it's all about how America is evil.

 

Gimme a break.

 

Oh and I'm sure that FoxNews corrected it's story if it was originally untrue, prove that they didn't.

 

Somewhere other than wikipedia please.

 

 

FOX News-viewers have a far, far higher level of misconceptions than viewers of other channels. There are only two explanation for that - that they are ignorant already, or that FOX News is mis-leading.

 

Yeah base your opinion of thousands of people on one flimsy little poll. Yawn.

 

 

Oh and Dagobahn, even IF detainees are being torchered. I couldn't care less.

 

They're not from a standing army and they fight like cowards.

 

If it were Norwegian/French/German/Saudi Arabian SOLDIERS then I would be opposed to it.

 

Let them rot I say, they have no rights.

 

 

It could as easily be indicative of the overall lack of intelligence, cognitive abilities or the credulous nature of the viewers themselves (or any combination thereof).

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V

Indeed, I didn't even say that was what I believed of Fox viewers.

 

Contradiction?

 

 

 

I'm a conservative.

 

 

I honestly chuckled, don't make me dig up that PM you sent me describing how you're neither conservative or liberal.

 

 

Faux News is worse than any Soviet propaganda station

 

Listen to yourself, I was told by a Russian exchange student in highschool that we really didn't land on the moon.

 

 

I'm sorry I wasn't able to touch on everyone's points today, I've been out of pocket. It's also a little hard when I'm the only right winger in here.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Listen to yourself, I was told by a Russian exchange student in highschool that we really didn't land on the moon.

We did land on the moon.

 

Thank you jmac for proving my point better than I possibly could! Please reevaluate the point you were responding to, here it is again.

 

 

 

Do you see that? I do see a difference between pacifists and liberals and that was my point!

 

A pacifist is against all types of violence, a liberal simply roots for another team.

 

That's why I can respect a pacifist's point of view and not a liberals. Thank you so much for that contribution jmac, thank you.

 

 

 

 

Prove it.

I never said you didn't draw a distinction between the two, I was merely pointing out that a liberal isn't necessarily a pacifist. As for proving that Fox doesn't broadcast news, the fact that 90% of the crap they've been broadcasting lately has been **** like "...more rockets exploded in northern Israel today...," proves my point. **** exploding in a war isn't news, and Bill O'Reilly getting pissed at Democrats isn't news either.

[Good Sir Knight]

That was my point jmac, he was saying that FoxNews was worse than Soviet propaganda so I sited an example of a brain washed Russian teenager.

 

This is the second time you've done this. You're like a child that walks in the room during a movie and asks what the plot is.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

That was my point jmac, he was saying that FoxNews was worse than Soviet propaganda so I sited an example of a brain washed Russian teenager.

 

This is the second time you've done this. You're like a child that walks in the room during a movie and asks what the plot is.

I love that movie. But I posted that because I wan't aware the Soviets spread propaganda about the U.S. not landing on the moon.

[Good Sir Knight]

I was merely pointing out that a liberal isn't necessarily a pacifist.

 

Yes you did but what I was really talking about was the distinction between the two and why I can respect one viewpoint and not another.

 

I love that movie. But I posted that because I wan't aware the Soviets spread propaganda about the U.S. not landing on the moon.

 

I'm glad you got the joke

 

It is a great movie.

[TK-8252]

Before I address your post GSK, I have to point out that you got some of the quotes wrong. Most of the quotes are from SkinWalker but you put them with Dagobahn...

 

Oh and I'm sure that FoxNews corrected it's story if it was originally untrue, prove that they didn't.

 

Somewhere other than wikipedia please.

 

It seems that you've forgotten who has the burden of proof. If you want to disprove that Faux News has straight-out lied, then you need to find where they pulled the story where they did lie. If they did pull the story (specifically about a WMD facility that they wanted to say was found in 2003), which as far as I know they did not, that would make them sloppy journalists at best. Because someone watching Faux News one day will see the story, then not be watching Faux News the day they apologized for the false story, they'll still think that WMD were found in Iraq.

 

Yeah base your opinion of thousands of people on one flimsy little poll. Yawn.

 

How else are you supposed to measure it? Go interview each of the thousands of viewers?? The poll seems pretty damning to me.

 

Oh and Dagobahn, even IF detainees are being torchered. I couldn't care less.

 

You don't care that innocent people would be being tortured?

 

They're not from a standing army and they fight like cowards.

 

How do you know they're fighters? Don't you believe in innocent until proven guilty? Due process of law?

 

Let them rot I say, they have no rights.

 

Yes... because someone is from Afghanistan, they don't have basic human rights that even Saddam Hussein is getting: due process.

 

Listen to yourself, I was told by a Russian exchange student in highschool that we really didn't land on the moon.

 

And you can easily pass them off as a brainwashed Russian who has been programmed by the Soviet propaganda machine.

 

But have an American say "yeah there were WMD's in Iraq" and it's not that simple. Were they watching Faux News? Do they believe what Bush has said (up until recently when he's saying how there weren't WMD)? Or do they just think that Saddam was a bastard so he MUST have WMD?

 

I'm sorry I wasn't able to touch on everyone's points today, I've been out of pocket. It's also a little hard when I'm the only right winger in here.

 

I'm more conservative than you that's for sure. There's nothing conservative about the big government nonsense that you support.

 

It's amazing how you feel it is your duty to defend a biased, Republican propaganda station just because you say you're a right-winger. Why? Should liberals defend Dan Rather because he supports their politics? No. No matter what your political leanings are, you should criticize both left-wing and right-wing bias in news.

[Dagobahn Eagle]

Oh and Dagobahn, even IF detainees are being torchered. I couldn't care less.

 

They're not from a standing army and they fight like cowards.

 

If it were Norwegian/French/German/Saudi Arabian SOLDIERS then I would be opposed to it.

 

Let them rot I say, they have no rights.

Take that to the Road to Guantanamo thread. Check the sources I posted there, and then address them. All the points above have been replied to, and hence you should address the replies instead of restating over and over what you've already said. I left a reply to your "cowards" argument there, too.

 

Oh, and it's "tortured", not "torchered".

 

Yeah base your opinion of thousands of people on one flimsy little poll. Yawn.

"One Flimsy little poll"? According to PIPA, it was a series of seven. Oh, and why can't I anyway? You base your argument on one single Russian teenager.

 

Oh, sure it's independent. I go to their site and surprise surprise it's all about how America is evil.

Name one example, please. I see some things about the US, namely:

"Americans Support Full Due-Process Rights for Terrorism Suspects",

"Majorities Oppose Rendition of Suspects to Countries that Practice Torture", and

"Most Believe Abu-Ghraib-type Abuses Still Occurring"

 

..but nothing about the US being evil. I guess the closest thing to get to that is how many believe the Abu Grahib torture is still going on, but that's the suspicion of the people polled, not of PIPA itself.

[SkinWalker]

It could as easily be indicative of the overall lack of intelligence, cognitive abilities or the credulous nature of the viewers themselves (or any combination thereof).

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V

Indeed, I didn't even say that was what I believed of Fox viewers.

 

Contradiction?

 

I don't see how. I pointed out several hypotheses. I didn't say these were the only hypotheses. I never claimed to believe one more than the other. It seems you have some comprehension difficulties here. At first I thought I was being ambiguous in my comments, but I read over them and they appear clear and concise. Read back over them and tell me, specifically, where I contradicted myself.

 

But let me ask you, if the hypotheses I presented don't explain the level of misperception that is evident in Fox News viewers, what does? If it isn't lies, deception, intelligence, cognitive abilities or the credulous nature of the viewers, what is it?

 

 

I'm a conservative.

 

 

I honestly chuckled, don't make me dig up that PM you sent me describing how you're neither conservative or liberal.

 

I definitely *do not* fit the mold of false dichotomy that political fanatics create for "conservative versus liberal." I have opinions that are extremely conservative and others that are quite liberal. In my opinion, anyone that toes a party line is unable to think for themselves and arrive at their own conclusions and opinions.

[Dagobahn Eagle]

I recommend the Outfoxed clips on Youtube. A sample: The sample.

 

Another lie:

We hope you'll depend on us for the truth' date=' 'cause we're gonna report the situation in Iraq without (...) political prejudice.[/quote']

 

Yet another lie:

.

[Good Sir Knight]

I don't see how. I pointed out several hypotheses. I didn't say these were the only hypotheses. I never claimed to believe one more than the other. It seems you have some comprehension difficulties here. At first I thought I was being ambiguous in my comments, but I read over them and they appear clear and concise. Read back over them and tell me, specifically, where I contradicted myself.

 

But let me ask you, if the hypotheses I presented don't explain the level of misperception that is evident in Fox News viewers, what does? If it isn't lies, deception, intelligence, cognitive abilities or the credulous nature of the viewers, what is it?

 

So what? You explained your opinion like any politician, it gives you plausible deniability while still puting your point across.

 

You still made your point, don't be shy SkinWalker... you know that's how you feel so just say it for once.

 

No one is going to judge you here...well...except for me.

 

 

I definitely *do not* fit the mold of false dichotomy that political fanatics create for "conservative versus liberal." I have opinions that are extremely conservative and others that are quite liberal. In my opinion, anyone that toes a party line is unable to think for themselves and arrive at their own conclusions and opinions.

 

Then why'd you say that you're a conservative? I think you're starting to sound alot like that guy John Kerry.

 

You are on the left wing my friend, that is for sure.

 

I'm very right wing but that doesn't mean that I support the drug war... so please don't assume that I'm a Republican either.

 

 

I'm more conservative than you that's for sure. There's nothing conservative about the big government nonsense that you support

 

Oh my goodness this is great. I live in a blue state in a very blue city. The right wingers here are very moderate.

 

TK my friend, you are not a conservative.

 

Though perhaps you are. I'm well aware that many liberals can become so left wing that they're conservative in their own little way.

 

 

Oh, and why can't I anyway?

 

I never said you couldn't, I'm just laughing because you base your entire opinion (of thousands of people) on one little poll.

 

Big woop, I can waste my time showing you polls that are in favor of my pov and I'd get no where with you.

 

Why? Because they're silly little polls that aren't really transparent.

 

I left a reply to your "cowards" argument there, too.

 

Oh my cowards argument, boo hoo. Mr. Eagle, I do hope that your friends in Gitmo are being tortured with Brian Adams and ACDC.

 

I bet they scream to drown out the sound, not loud enough though.

[TK-8252]

TK my friend, you are not a conservative.

 

Correct, I'm not a "conservative." If I fit into any political ideology I'm a libertarian... which is considered a right-wing ideology. I despise big government in every form it comes in... but the people at Faux News cheer on the GOP and its big government neoconservative agenda at every turn.

[Good Sir Knight]

Libertarian? Then surely you would support the 2nd amendment and the legalization of drugs/prostitution?

 

Two things I can agree with, the drugs part in principle.

 

Watching FoxNews, every pundit has shown disgust with Bush's immigration policy (and I agree). So they don't agree on everything, sorry.