yuuzhan vong

[mivoci1]

Well it's better than slimy vong it remainds me on Alien vs Predator.

[Astrotoy7]

If you are refering to what I think you are refering to (LOTF series), I kind of disagree. Apart from a few passing mentions to events and characters in the NJO, all of the motivations/philosphies/etc. he has are referenced back to his post-NJO 5 year Star Trek mission and the film eras....

 

Primeski.....allow me to kind of disagree too !

 

Let me put it this way. In the NJO alone...Going through 21 books with Jacen in most of it, you see how much he changes by the end of it...he really does. Those familiar with Jacen beforehand from the JJK/YJK series will find it even more interesting.

 

It is done so gradually it is really compelling to read and seems a plausible, if not natural progression of his character(as compared to Anakin's transformation) At the start of the NJO Jacen was refusing to be involved in *anything* - and even had hang ups about carrying his lightsaber. Then there was the incident with the YV warmaster......then Traitor. These were key incidents, but there's *alot* of stuff about his development woven into NJO(and done quite deliberately) If you're happy to have it summarised in a few lines for you in wookiepedia/CUSWE it simply can not be the same experience if you travelled along with this kid every step of the way...

 

Jacen's NJO experiences are so, so, soooo much more than "his experiences with Vergere" ONLY someone who has not read the series can say that, seriously !! (it is simply a misinformed generalisation)

 

That '5 year' mission would not have occured without what happens to Jacen's character in NJO. I damn hope theyre going to go back and cover that properly !!

 

As for Del Rey 'undoing' the NJO's 'explanation of the the force' ... this is poppycock. It was never presented as the definitive answer back then. Luke, in his incidental meetings with Vergere, always would argue with her about this. It's merely a perspective Vergere gave to Jacen. I dont think Jacen ever adopted it 100% but it definitely has made some impact on him - especially enough to feel confident to question and challenge his peers/Masters. This can be likened to Sidious' interaction with Anakin....he too talked about all aspects of the force, and that ignoring the dark side is closing oneself off to a entire set of different powers and discoveries. This is really the essence of what Vergere said, and said it before ROTS....it was really interesting to hear echoes of it in Palpatine's words in the films, and to me made NJO even more relevant

 

Clarifying the 'Light vs Dark' outlook, as LOTF seems to be doing, would not be half as interesting had the discussion about the nature of the force not occurred in the NJO. It simply would have been more of the same !! Interesting that some obviously uninformed fans are so short sighted they cannot see this, but instead think of it in ridiculous terms like "OMG the NJO is being erased..." Rubbish

 

Luckily we have the smartest EU cookies here, not even the staunchest NJO hater has ranted on about this as if it's a fact GL told them about

 

Finally, anyone who "knows what happenned in Traitor" because they read a synopsis somewhere needs to be knackered! Traitor is a thing of beauty. It is simply as *must read* for anyone who is a fan of Jacen and LOTF. You live insides Jacen's head for a whole book!

 

Stover > you all

 

mtfbwya

[mivoci1]

I mean Remnant with New Republic after a long years of struggle and suddenly alliance it doesen't feel right Star Destroyers with Calamari Cruisers on my opinion I stick with the era when Empire ruled the galaxy and then Luke Skywalker ruined every thing.

[Prime]

Primeski.....allow me to kind of disagree too !

Allow me to retort!

 

Let me put it this way. In the NJO alone...Going through 21 books with Jacen in most of it, you see how much he changes by the end of it...he really does. Those familiar with Jacen beforehand from the JJK/YJK series will find it even more interesting.

 

It is done so gradually it is really compelling to read and seems a plausible, if not natural progression of his character(as compared to Anakin's transformation) At the start of the NJO Jacen was refusing to be involved in *anything* - and even had hang ups about carrying his lightsaber. Then there was the incident with the YV warmaster......then Traitor. These were key incidents, but there's *alot* of stuff about his development woven into NJO(and done quite deliberately)

I'm not arguing that he didn't go through changes or that he wasn't drastically effected. I'm saying that so far the two LotF novels barely mention the events in it, and that is mainly to point out (retcon?) that Vergere was actually a Sith. When these novels discuss his motivations for decisions he makes, they refer back to the five years and these novels themselves. You may be right an much extends from the NJO, but it doesn't seem to be presented that way currently.

 

Jacen's NJO experiences are so, so, soooo much more than "his experiences with Vergere" ONLY someone who has not read the series can say that, seriously !! (it is simply a misinformed generalisation)

OK. But in LotF the few references to Jacen's experiences in the NJO are mainly related to Vergere, mostly showing the Sith connection. So if these other experiences were huge, ok, but they aren't captured in LotF. It basically comes down to Luminya saying, "remember all those discussions about the Force? Vergere was trying to convert you to the Sith."

 

I damn hope theyre going to go back and cover that properly !!

I doubt it, only because the novel side of the EU seems to loathe going backwards in the timeline. Thus the need for the foolish extended lifespans to keep the big three around.

 

As for Del Rey 'undoing' the NJO's 'explanation of the the force' ... this is poppycock. It was never presented as the definitive answer back then. Luke, in his incidental meetings with Vergere, always would argue with her about this. It's merely a perspective Vergere gave to Jacen. I dont think Jacen ever adopted it 100% but it definitely has made some impact on him - especially enough to feel confident to question and challenge his peers/Masters.

My understanding, and correct me if I am wrong, is that at the end of the NJO it was sort of left as an open question as to which was the correct interpretation. As of LotF, there doesn't seem to be any doubt that there is a dark side, just whether it is bad to use it or not (at least in Jacen's mind).

 

This can be likened to Sidious' interaction with Anakin....he too talked about all aspects of the force, and that ignoring the dark side is closing oneself off to a entire set of different powers and discoveries. This is really the essence of what Vergere said, and said it before ROTS....it was really interesting to hear echoes of it in Palpatine's words in the films, and to me made NJO even more relevant

And thus the need to "retcon" Vergere to be a Sith.

 

Clarifying the 'Light vs Dark' outlook, as LOTF seems to be doing, would not be half as interesting had the discussion about the nature of the force not occurred in the NJO. It simply would have been more of the same !!

But again, LotF seems to present it as though this is how it always was, at least to a reader that doesn't know about the NJO. It just uses the original concept as it always was. NJO may have discussed it to death, but at this points things are right back where they started.

 

Interesting that some obviously uninformed fans are so short sighted they cannot see this, but instead think of it in ridiculous terms like "OMG the NJO is being erased..." Rubbish

Erased is probably too strong a word, but at least marginalized. If events therein were so important, and I'm not saying they aren't, you would think they would play a much larger role in LotF. Instead, it is the 5 years and Luminya that form to the largest extent the "input" into Jacen's thought processes.

 

I assume it was done this way since the authors would have to write the stories on the assumption that readers hadn't read the NJO.

 

Finally, anyone who "knows what happenned in Traitor" because they read a synopsis somewhere needs to be knackered! Traitor is a thing of beauty. It is simply as *must read* for anyone who is a fan of Jacen and LOTF.

I like the direction the character is going, but I certainly don't like the character. He is just too irrational and selective, and I find I get annoyed at the foolish thought processes and justifications he comes up with. Just selfish overall.

 

You live insides Jacen's head for a whole book!

Not my idea of a good time!

[Samnmax221]

Now the NJO just taught me to dislike Jacen even more. I found the Tahiri story-arc much more interesting and introspective then anything else that happened.