[RUMOUR] Kotor MMO in Production.

[Jediphile]

The real problem is that KotOR is about the worst possible place in Star Wars you could put an MMORPG. Why? Because the entire history is fixed pretty tightly up to and including TSL, and after TSL there are scarcely any jedi left. That means ANY setting would either:

 

a. Completely violate Star Wars history as described in canonic history at the present time, or

 

b. Be very heavily restricted in the matter of characters that can be created (only so many jedi and NO Sith) as well as in the matter of what can be done plotwise, since the entire background is written down pretty firmly in the comic books and games already.

 

A Star Wars MMORGP is possible, sure, but the KotOR period is the worst of all periods to put it in because all major characters and historic events are already fixed.

[SilentScope001]

A KOTOR MMO could work right after KOTOR3. The True Sith are dead, and the Jedi Order prosper. But wait, there is a brand new Sith Order coming up, oh noes!

 

Still, better no KOTOR MMO. I'm still betting this is just a unjustified rumor.

[Samurai DD]

Although I agree in part with Jediphile, an MMO set in the KOTOR era wouldn't need to be subject to fixed events and characters. KOTOR itself rocked the events we thought happened at that time. But I think the best epoch for an SW MMO is Legacy. Now there you have freedom. Absolute freedom.

[NenDaiKi]

Wow... I am ashamed I even bothered to come here. I have been collecting information to support the argument that this game is happening knowing full well there is a huge audience. I am just... I don't know what at the fact that everyone here seems to be out of their mind.

 

Anyone who thinks SWG's continued existence is warranted is a fool. When SOE let the NGE happen the only reason for keeping the game alive went out the window as they betrayed every longtime player. Since then SOE has lost the license to any future SW related crap and for good reason.

 

I don't think I could fit enough answers to the stupid things I've read here into this post, but... KOTOR IS THE WORST TIMELINE FOR AN MMO? Are you serious? KOTOR is pure destiny. The entirety of the Mandalorian wars as told within the KOTOR universe is open, and in that timeline alone there were countless Jedi, good and bad. A KOTOR timeline addresses the two biggest problems of SWG. Jedi can be played realistically and the timeline actually allows progress. Even if there is eventually a point at which it has to end, it is a hell of a lot longer a period than the cramped space between Episode 4 and 5 which SWG was stuck in.

 

But all those facts seem kind of irrelevant because it seems everyone here is just bitter for no reason. Or, you actually think SWG is a good enough game that we don't need a new SW MMO. Here's the fact: It is in Lucas' best interests to wipe SWG from the face of the Earth and allow the visionaries to do it right this time. Only a properly done Star Wars MMO could ever fight off WoW, as it has name power and a setting that is in stark contrast to what people who play WoW want.

 

All the facts align for a secretly developed Bioware Austin MMO. They've been working on an MMO for a year with RICHARD VOGEL, that is HALF of the visionary team that made the genius style of play the original SWG offered. That talent coupled with Bioware's ability to make a hardcore story is a no brainer for an MMO that would utterly devastate every thing that came before.

 

As at least one person stated above, it is clearly an outside IP, and if you think for one minute Bioware is making an MMO of an outside IP that isn't Star Wars, well that's a form of stretching I can't even comprehend.

 

I just don't get it. So maybe none of you like MMOs... that would be fine. But there is a genuine hatred for the very idea of what if true is the single greatest thing to happen to MMOs in a long time. SWG was brought down by SOE, despite having massive potential. It was also brought down by its timeline setting, which at the time was the only choice. A KOTOR MMO is in every way the Luke Skywalker all jaded former SWG players have been waiting for, and if you are so adverse to the redemption of the Star Wars MMO maybe you should reconsider your priorities. You can't love KOTOR and be adverse to Bioware, who is never going to make a single player KOTOR again, creating a persistent world borne of the same genius that made the technical wonder of the original SWG and the storyline righteousness of KOTOR.

 

If you don't want to play a KOTOR MMO, fine. But I will not stand for people trying to destroy the dreams of others when it has absolutely nothing to do with them.

[SilentScope001]

Well, who's going to run the KOTOR MMO?

 

If Sony, you're stuck in the same boat. Sorry.

 

If Bioware...prehaps. And, since there will be mutliple servers, we can easily call everything that happens in the KOTOR MMO "uncanon". However, we got the problem of Jedi.

 

Make Jedi too common, and it will be just as broken as SWG now. Make Jedi too rare, or take out Jedi all together...and, it's no longer Star Wars.

[zaykodroid]

repeating again, The Problem was NOT Jedi at SWG, the Problem WAS TIMELINE

 

KOTOR Timeline includes many Jedi and Sith, Galaxy full of them 3900-4000 Years Ago from A New Hope, so Jedi will not be problem.

[Ambrose]

But I will not stand for people trying to destroy the dreams of others when it has absolutely nothing to do with them.

 

Firstly, I'd like to remind you that it's just a frickin' game! lol, I certainly hope you have greater dreams in this life than seeing a successful Star Wars MMO

 

In any case, it has EVERYTHING to do with us. Our fear is that this KotOR MMO will take the place of the KotOR 3 SP game that we've all been looking forward to since TSL ended. The production of a KotOR MMO will affect us just as much as you, except it will have a far more negative effect on those of us who enjoy SP KotOR.

[Samurai DD]

repeating again, The Problem was NOT Jedi at SWG, the Problem WAS TIMELINE

 

KOTOR Timeline includes many Jedi and Sith, Galaxy full of them 3900-4000 Years Ago from A New Hope, so Jedi will not be problem.

 

But still, it's like what happened to SWG. If you make Jedi/Sith a starting class, you won't see anything else unless the other classes are equally powered. Makes no sense. Sony's original system also made no sense. Probability? Please. Better resort to something like COH/V, you unlock the classes once you hit the level cap. And of course, you have to start again with them. But here what would be important is the fact of making like an almost separate game for the people that have reached the cap and can be Jedi/Sith for overpowered reasons. Even like that it would be far from flawless. And, on the other side, if they take force sensitive characters out of the player's hands, it would be... well, not stupid, but unreasonable and riot making.

 

Have you noticed how big of a problem a thing like this is? It's like SW wasn't made for being a MMOG. Ever.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm the first person that would want one. Except Galaxies. DAMN YOU SONY!!!

[i_shot_the_jedi]

It seems that the heroes of Star Wars are always Jedi and never mere mortals like us. This is because Star Wars is a fantasy universe; and in fantasy the vast majority of people are always bound to prefer the more outlandish beings who wield greater power than anyone else, especially if that power allows you to throw things around with a flick of your hand or wave around a sword which can cut through concrete.

 

The likeliness of the majority not wanting to be force-sensitve is slim. Thanks to Boba Fett bounty hunters are 'cool' and rather popular, but nevertheless people who prefer them to Jedi or Sith are a minority, and minorities never win. Which is the reason why the Liberal Democrats over in the UK haven't come into power for almost a century - but I'm rambling...

 

Without the Force, Star Wars would just be another generic sci-fi fantasy: the Star Wars franchise revolves around and only continues to exist because of Jedi, period.

 

Got that?

 

Now, let's go on. LucasArts originally succeed with Galaxies because becoming a Jedi was the ultimate prize; only the best of the best could attain a Knightship. Obviously the drive was to BE one of those elite, and so many people happily grinded their way through Krayt Dragons til their face turned blue just to attain the possibility that they may be the chosen. So put simply, Galaxies was a competition to become a Jedi, and that's why it crashed and burned when Jedi were made into a base class (though there were other factors too, I agree). Even when it was going strong, Star Wars as a whole suffered.

 

I hope that those who truly love the story of Star Wars would never join such a grind-fest of canon-defying bantha turd as a KotOR MMORPG, because you can bet that it will be a Jedi-infested hellhole of spam no matter what. Such a venture will be doomed from the beginning.

[Jediphile]

Wow... I am ashamed I even bothered to come here. I have been collecting information to support the argument that this game is happening knowing full well there is a huge audience. I am just... I don't know what at the fact that everyone here seems to be out of their mind.

 

Anyone who thinks SWG's continued existence is warranted is a fool. When SOE let the NGE happen the only reason for keeping the game alive went out the window as they betrayed every longtime player. Since then SOE has lost the license to any future SW related crap and for good reason.

 

To quote, well, you: "But I will not stand for people trying to destroy the dreams of others when it has absolutely nothing to do with them."

 

I don't think I could fit enough answers to the stupid things I've read here into this post, but... KOTOR IS THE WORST TIMELINE FOR AN MMO? Are you serious? KOTOR is pure destiny. The entirety of the Mandalorian wars as told within the KOTOR universe is open, and in that timeline alone there were countless Jedi, good and bad. A KOTOR timeline addresses the two biggest problems of SWG. Jedi can be played realistically and the timeline actually allows progress. Even if there is eventually a point at which it has to end, it is a hell of a lot longer a period than the cramped space between Episode 4 and 5 which SWG was stuck in.

 

That still leaves about more than 3000 other years to set a new Star Wars MMORPG in, where there could be a countless jedi and sith and which does not dictate plot to the game. For example, nothing much seems to happen in the time from, say, 3900 to 3000 BBY, which is from 100 to 1000 years after KotOR - http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline#The_Old_Republic_era

 

And let's clear something up - there are NOT "countless jedi" in the KotOR era!

 

Atris: "We're still rebuilding our ranks from the last war. We can't afford this kind of adventurims, even if we were supporting it!"

 

(Source: Knights of the Old Republic, comic book issue 9, page 8. And yes, this is just BEFORE the Mandalorian Wars break out in full)

 

At the same time there are hardly any sith, which end up being a contributing factor to Revan splitting the order.

 

As a basis for a good MMORPG you need to have people playing against each other, which to Star Wars translates into both jedi and sith IMHO. In a pre-KotOR game you can have no sith because it's established that there haven't been any since the fall of Exar Kun. Besides, the Mandalorian Wars are currently being chronicled in the KotOR comic book, meaning we do have a canon chain of events going on there. I doubt LA is going to do anything that conflicts with that. After all, if you're right, Bioware's project has been on its way for about a year, while the comic book has also been going for a little longer than that. If the MMORGP in question were taking place in the timeline detailed in the comic, then I'm fairly certain LA would have stopped it by now.

That's why KotOR is the worst time period. Jump ahead 200+ years or so, however, and you can do pretty much whatever you please.

 

But all those facts seem kind of irrelevant because it seems everyone here is just bitter for no reason. Or, you actually think SWG is a good enough game that we don't need a new SW MMO. Here's the fact: It is in Lucas' best interests to wipe SWG from the face of the Earth and allow the visionaries to do it right this time. Only a properly done Star Wars MMO could ever fight off WoW, as it has name power and a setting that is in stark contrast to what people who play WoW want.

 

Personally I don't care if there is a new Star Wars MMORPG or not. I didn't play SWG and I probably won't play the next one either. MMORGPs tend to, in my experience, be about monsterslashing and dungeoncrawling during highly generic quests, all of which are fairly unattractive to me. I like playing with my friends, but since MMORPGs usually have poor or virtually non-existent plot (and, incidentally, since my friends hardly ever have time to play), I'm not going to bother. Besides, I refuse to pay to be allowed to play a game that I've already paid for.

 

I do care about the next KotOR game, however, and I don't want to see a very immersive single-player experience be sacrificed on the holy alter of MMORPG. Is it going to kill you if it's set 200 or 500 years later? I doubt it...

 

And taking on WoW has nothing to do with whether it's a Star Wars game or not. Look at EVE Online. It's not as big as WoW, but it's been growing steadily for years and continues to. WoW will have been dethroned in three or four years. EVE Online will not, because it has no competition. Star Wars is totally different to both. It might pull people away from WoW if it's any good, but it will never be a direct competitor because WoW is Tolkienesque fantasy (of which we have more than enough...), while Star Wars is, well, Star Wars.

 

All the facts align for a secretly developed Bioware Austin MMO. They've been working on an MMO for a year with RICHARD VOGEL, that is HALF of the visionary team that made the genius style of play the original SWG offered. That talent coupled with Bioware's ability to make a hardcore story is a no brainer for an MMO that would utterly devastate every thing that came before.

 

As at least one person stated above, it is clearly an outside IP, and if you think for one minute Bioware is making an MMO of an outside IP that isn't Star Wars, well that's a form of stretching I can't even comprehend.

 

Given how Bioware appears to have a strained relationship with Lucasarts (like most devs that have worked with LA at some point), I find it more likely that Bioware would work with someone else actually. Of course, that's just rumor and speculation, yet given that the business if rife with rumors about LA being difficult to play with for devs, I doesn't seem unlikely to me.

 

I just don't get it. So maybe none of you like MMOs... that would be fine. But there is a genuine hatred for the very idea of what if true is the single greatest thing to happen to MMOs in a long time. SWG was brought down by SOE, despite having massive potential. It was also brought down by its timeline setting, which at the time was the only choice. A KOTOR MMO is in every way the Luke Skywalker all jaded former SWG players have been waiting for, and if you are so adverse to the redemption of the Star Wars MMO maybe you should reconsider your priorities. You can't love KOTOR and be adverse to Bioware, who is never going to make a single player KOTOR again, creating a persistent world borne of the same genius that made the technical wonder of the original SWG and the storyline righteousness of KOTOR.

 

We can't?

 

Watch us...

 

If you don't want to play a KOTOR MMO, fine. But I will not stand for people trying to destroy the dreams of others when it has absolutely nothing to do with them.

 

Just because people does not share your "dreams" does not mean that their opinion, or their choice to voice it, is by its very definition meant to be a personal insult to you or others who share your opinion.

 

As much as you love this idea and want it to happen, there are others who are just as justified in hating it and not wanting it to happen. And they have every right to say so too.

[The Source]

Personally I don't care if there is a new Star Wars MMORPG or not. I didn't play SWG and I probably won't play the next one either. MMORGPs tend to, in my experience, be about monsterslashing and dungeoncrawling during highly generic quests, all of which are fairly unattractive to me. I like playing with my friends, but since MMORPGs usually have poor or virtually non-existent plot (and, incidentally, since my friends hardly ever have time to play), I'm not going to bother. Besides, I refuse to pay to be allowed to play a game that I've already paid for.

 

...I don't want to see a very immersive single-player experience be sacrificed on the holy alter of MMORPG....

Bingo. I absolutely agree with you on these statements. I never thought I would agree with you on anything. Why the hell should I dish out more cash to play a game that I allready have purchased. Why the hell would I want to pay twice for the game. If I am allready dishing out $50 - $60 to purchase the CD/DVD, why do I need to pay a yearly fee to play online. At the end of your gamming cycle, you just spent around/over $100 to play a game for a year.

[Jae Onasi]

Moderator mode: All right folks, I'm feelin' the heat rather than the lurv. It's OK if you love the idea of a Kotor MMO, it's OK if you hate the idea of a Kotor MMO, but don't snipe at each other because someone doesn't agree with you.

 

Back in 'Just plain Jae' mode.....

I'd like to see it SP, but that's because the first 2 have been that way and they're my favorite games. I can't play online enough to justify the cost of the monthly fees--I work and have a family, and they need my time more than a game does. I need a game I can set aside when real needs supersede game-playing desire.

[HerbieZ]

Im only going to say no because i love Kotor as it is. The problem with Mmo's is that you have too many players whom systematically attack every minor inconsistancy/fault/item/stats with the game that they ruin the general experience for you. Many a time in Galaxies have i seen people who complain from the minute they log on til the second they log off yet still play the game and treat it as though they are forced to play it. I'd hate to see the beautiful content of kotor ruined by such a bunch of literal moronic zombies.

[lukeiamyourdad]

But this is the case for every game. The only difference between an MMO and an SP game is that you don't hear any of that in some sort of general chat room. If you went on official forums and such, of any MP game, you'd have whiners, of varying degrees.

[HerbieZ]

You ever been into a multiplayer game where the players hated it so much that they stayed in for hours on end. Then go back on it the next day and say the exact same stuff and repeat the same cycle day after day after day. Game hate and Mmo hate are two different things.

[Ambrose]

People take multi-player games more seriously than SP games. Too seriously. Some people got more mad over NGE-era SWG than they would have if their car got stolen (real life car that is... ).

 

I think the competitive edge which multiplayer adds can spoil a good game like KotOR. Let's face it... KotOR is NOT a "competitive" game. Combat isn't even that fun, if you think about it. It's an RP game. That's why we all love it (really, there's not much else to love, which really speaks volume about the RP's quality).

[SykoRevan]

In most online multiplayer games, you either get the people who take great personal offense when they are beaten in a multiplayer game (i.e.: OMG WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU?!?! WHY DID YOU SHOOT ME?!?! I HATE YOU! I WANT YOU AND YOUR FAMILY TO BURN!!!), or you get the guy who constantly loves to taunt you on the off-chance they beat you, usually with internet slang, which I sometimes relate to baby-talk (i.e.: O YEA WUT NOW I PWN U! I AM 1337 U R PWNED!) I laugh thinking about what it would be like for someone to talk like that in a possible KotOR MMO. That's why I like SP games over online games, even though I do like playing Battlefront online sometimes. Something about online playing and the fact you can pretty much say what you want to other people without retribution brings out the "pwner" in some people, and the road-raging maniac with intent to kill in others. That's why I'm glad KotOR is a SP game

[John Galt]

I actually think this is a pretty good idea, using an era with certain well-established traits and some characters, a well-defined general visual appearance, and a (series of) large overarching conflicts that would make good material for patches and/or expansions. However, most of the galaxy at the time of KotOR is not actually fleshed out anywhere, giving the makers of a potential MMO(read:Bioware) LOTS of leeway in terms of artistic/developmental creativity.

 

Besides, given the plot-driven nature of KotOR and TSL, the player never really sees "the big picture" of the rest of the galaxy, just the part that Revan or the Exile is directly involved with. This allows an MMO to be created that "frames" the events of the two games without adversely affecting canon too badly.

 

Besides, if the MMO is successful, Lucasarts and Bioware will EVENTUALLY need KotOR III to provide more storyline for future patches/expansions.

 

Just my two cents.

[Ztalker]

Yeah, okay...an MMO can bring the SW universe alive if done well, like SASdelta said.

 

The only problem is: You can't create an MMO and do this, imo. You will always have people running around with Pink Jedi robes, shouting: "WTS lightzaber"

 

I simply don't think the roleplay-lovers (like almost everyone in here) can live with that...inconsistant effect of an MMO.

 

But anyways; a new point of interest:

When the LucasArts brand name is on the box, the game becomes canon. Just look HK-47 up in Wookiepedia. It'l say he died at the hands of some 'anonymous spacers.'

And...the most horrifying thing; look up Obi-Wan. It tells an epic tale, and how he says goodbye to Luke Skywalker in a dream. After that story;

"Obi-Wan also appeared to some anonymous spacers at Mustafar."

Those two things broke my canon-heart, all because of SW: Galaxies.

 

And a possible new MMO will do the same

[lukeiamyourdad]

You ever been into a multiplayer game where the players hated it so much that they stayed in for hours on end. Then go back on it the next day and say the exact same stuff and repeat the same cycle day after day after day. Game hate and Mmo hate are two different things.

 

 

No, it's the same. They pretend to hate it, they whine about every damn detail. It's a strange love/hate relationship, but I've seen it with plenty of MP games.

 

The "zomg you've killed the game [insert developer]! You unbalanced [insert element X]! I'm going to stop playing your game!" is present everywhere. I saw it in StarCraft, BF1942, BF:V, Battlefront and MMOs.

[Talwin]

Some people are taking it rather personally on whether or not KOTOR MMORPG shoud or should not even be made. Here's the reality check: no amount of rambling here is going to sway that decision one way or another.

 

Personally, I think a MMORPG set in KOTOR time-frame has incredible potential.

 

First, it's the setting:

 

We know there are "true Sith" out there somewhere in the Unknown regions, where Revan has gone at the end of KOTOR and this is where Exile has followed him.

 

We know Jedi Order is to be rebuilt and Visas Mar playss a significant role in it.

 

We know a lot of other characters from both KOTOR I and II are around.

 

In short, there's a ton of possibilities as far as storylines go. And none of them would have to be crammed into a short span of a few years as SWG was.

 

As far as a MMO aspect of the game goes, I think people assume that having others play together with them would somehow lessen their feel of being the "hero" of the game. It's all in the implementation. Hold on... let me emphasize this: IT'S ALL IN THE IMPLEMENTATION.

 

Would you have felt any less of the accomplishment or any less excitement if 2 of your party members were controlled by other sentient players when you confronted Sherruk, Darth Bandon, or Saul Karath? If properly done, everyone could feel just as involved by doing different tasks in the group. It also opens such exciting opportunities as group combat ala Geonosis Arena.

 

People should not get too hung up on the failure that was SWG. Sadly, SWG was a mistake from get-go on many levels. It was doomed to fail because of where they placed it in Star Wars timeline and it was doomed to fail because they picked SoE to make it.

 

The thing that impressed me most about original KOTOR was the exceptional attention to detail unlike any other game I had played to that date and gameplay staying incredibly true to the spirit of Star Wars lore. I have never heard of Bioware before that time but it appears all of their titles are done with the same care. If anyone could make it into an excellent game, I would expect it to be Bioware.

[JediWookShaco]

it would be nice to have a kotor mmorpg after a kotor 3 comes in i dont want to see k3 replaced by the online game

[EricJLeach]

Well first off I play swg, I have played the KOTOR games and I love it. I mean they did a aweosme job with KOTOR. But for the people that still play swg like me we are stuck with SOE, granted they are doing better then when the NGE first was rolled out.

 

I bet LA would gladly dump SOE for Bioware (i think they made KOTOR) sorry dont remember exactly.

 

Anyway /discuss

[JediWookShaco]

hahaha i hated the nge i had to quit if KOTOR MMROPG came out id be there buying it ill try anything as long as it isnt ownd by SOE

[EricJLeach]

Same here, but swg is getting better a form of CH/BE is back. Its called Beast Master. But if you dont know about swgemu.com go there. Its swg pre-cu. Its in development.

 

Edit:

I personaly would love to have K3 dumped and turned into a MMO, it would be way better, plus they would make TONS more money