These are the Kinds of People the US is fighting around the world

[JediMaster12]

They want to murder every Jew on this PLANET.

And the Islamic extremists think we too should be destroyed since democracy is considered the devil's own invention.

 

I'm starting to see a pattern here, you must really hate Israel.

And if you hate Israel then it's a good bet you probably hate Jews too.

No he is reading your statements and based upon the flow of your argument, he made an assumption. Now with the second statement you are assuming he dislikes Israel. Reading his post, I got no such vibe from that. Perhaps that because your argument is full of passion, it obscures the words he was saying.

 

The Israelis are Jews, you know that don't you?

I beg to differ. Israel has a large population of Jews but not all of them are Jews. About 2% are Christians or so. Israel is a nationality, Jew is a religious conotation. One political and one religious. Believe me there is a big difference.

 

I'm not arguing or trying to start a flame war with you, I'm just trying to figure where you are coming from with that, "we must kill the Israeli government" statement.

If you read the entire statement, he was saying by YOUR reasoning, meaning he was referring to your previous statements.

 

You, know JediMaster12 we use propaganda too.

Of course we do. After all we have to convince the American people that our way is the only way to go. Never mind the fact that we come from different cultures

 

So, if they don't want a peaceful resolution only a genocide, then that organization must be wipe out, they are to dangerous to be left alive.

And by doing that, we create martyrs which will keep the cycle going. Execution of criminals like Saddaam while justifiable make room for the fact that anyone can use his death as an excuse to further wage terrorist acts or war on groups they dislike. People have done terrible things yes but we can't ignore the fact that actions do speak louder than words. If we went with a plan like yours, we would end up infuriating Islamic populations and even our allies if we look at the humanitarian side of things. With murder, there is no good way to look at it. Murder is murder even with the best intentions.

[Windu Chi]

And the Islamic extremists think we too should be destroyed since democracy is considered the devil's own invention.

Yes I know!

Also where that come from, that democracy is the devil's own invention?

The devil according to the Christian religion is evil, and want to rule souls, I highly doubt he will want a democracy in hell.

 

 

No he is reading your statements and based upon the flow of your argument, he made an assumption. Now with the second statement you are assuming he dislikes Israel. Reading his post, I got no such vibe from that. Perhaps that because your argument is full of passion, it obscures the words he was saying.

Well, I said I was not sure, but people who talk about destroying the Israel seem to show a hidden hate toward Jews.

 

I beg to differ. Israel has a large population of Jews but not all of them are Jews. About 2% are Christians or so. Israel is a nationality, Jew is a religious conotation. One political and one religious. Believe me there is a big difference.

What is 2%?

And I'm not talking about no religion here.

The majority of Israelis are Jews.

 

 

If you read the entire statement, he was saying by YOUR reasoning, meaning he was referring to your previous statements.

So, talk to Hamas, I think that was already tried.

They don't want to recognize Israel's existence, like I said before the Israelis aren't going to just give up there country, that is nonsense.

So, because they don't want to give up their country, Hamas want to wipe every Jew out in Israel.

Until they abandon their country.

 

And if you don't believe that then I can't explain it more clearly then that.

 

 

Of course we do. After all we have to convince the American people that our way is the only way to go. Never mind the fact that we come from different cultures

Yes many of our ancestors come from across the world.

Yes our way the best and other ways aren't is a very tiring statement, I have said our government should stop saying we are superior to every other human culture on this planet.

 

 

And by doing that, we create martyrs which will keep the cycle going.

The cycle is already ongoing, Hamas are terrorist who die for nothing as

martyrs.

 

Execution of criminals like Saddaam while justifiable make room for the fact that anyone can use his death as an excuse to further wage terrorist acts or war on groups they dislike.

Hmm, by your reasoning we should have kept Hitler alive, if he had been caught alive.

To prevent the rise of neo-Nazis.

 

 

 

People have done terrible things yes but we can't ignore the fact that actions do speak louder than words. If we went with a plan like yours, we would end up infuriating Islamic populations and even our allies if we look at the humanitarian side of things. With murder, there is no good way to look at it. Murder is murder even with the best intentions.

Look, if people who want to commit genocide, they must be wipe out completely, I don't know about you but I was very enrage for what happen in the Holocaust, so you should understand where I'm coming from.

 

I'm a African American and some would say why do I care about what happen to the Jews in WW II, but the Holocaust

was unacceptable evil and I just can't stand for genocide of any kind.

 

So, if don't get where I'm coming from then too bad.

[JediMaster12]

I'm a African American and some would say why do I care about what happen to the Jews in WW II, but the Holocaust was unacceptable evil and I just can't stand for genocide of any kind.

And why is the Holocaust so quick upon your mind? Did you know that there was an Armenian genocide during WWI? Did you know that there was a genocide during Somalia in 1992? Yes the Holocaust is important to remember because we as intelligent beings try to do things right the second time around.

 

Hmm, by your reasoning we should have kept Hitler alive, if he had been caught alive. To prevent the rise of neo-Nazis.

By what I was saying that people who did and do have a profound influence on the rest of the world if they were to die, their death would be the hook anyone needs to further their own aims. Who really cares if a gang member kills another? That's not going to spark a world movement against a group. It may be an enrangement and retaliation cycle on a local level but going globaly, I don't think so. People who are notable figures in the global community have that affect.

 

Also where that come from, that democracy is the devil's own invention?

The devil according to the Christian religion is evil, and want to rule souls, I highly doubt he will want a democracy in hell.

If you get a chance, read the Koran. Also it based upon the interpretations the imams give to the youths. On that note, within the Koran, Jesus is mentioned 186 times and always referred to as a prophet. However there is one passage that I remember if not word for word. It states somewhere along the line that Islam should be taught to the heathens and those who resist should be destroyed. I may have it wrong but that is the basic gist of it.

 

They don't want to recognize Israel's existence, like I said before the Israelis aren't going to just give up there country, that is nonsense.

So, because they don't want to give up their country, Hamas want to wipe every Jew out in Israel.

Until they abandon their country.

Blaming the Jews has been going on since Biblical times. As much as I am loath to beat this horse some more, the Germans blamed the Jews for their problems before WWII because they were in a deep depression brought on by the fact that France and Britain wanted Germany to bleed in raparations. The people controlling the money as bankers were none otherthan the Jews.

 

What is 2%?

And I'm not talking about no religion here.

The majority of Israelis are Jews.

On another note, Jewish people are a religious group by technicality. Ethnicity refers to culture which are the shared and learned behaviors learned through the socialization process. However Jews believe that they are the chosen people of God, and for those who know their Bible, I won't explain anymore. Religion is a function within a culture but not a culture of itself. Whe we hear terms like Hasidic Jews, that is referring to sects or the degree of orthodoxy.

[Windu Chi]

And why is the Holocaust so quick upon your mind? Did you know that there was an Armenian genocide during WWI?

Yes I have recently came aware of Armenian genocide.

Did you know that there was a genocide during Somalia in 1992?

I don't know about what you are talking about, but I have heard of Rwanda.

I'm not aware of no genocide in Somalia.

 

Yes the Holocaust is important to remember because we as intelligent beings try to do things right the second time around.

Yes, don't let evil have free reign a second time around.

 

 

 

 

By what I was saying that people who did and do have a profound influence on the rest of the world if they were to die, their death would be the hook anyone needs to further their own aims. Who really cares if a gang member kills another?

 

That's not going to spark a world movement against a group. It may be an enrangement and retaliation cycle on a local level but going globaly, I don't think so. People who are notable figures in the global community have that affect.

You right, no one cares if a gang member kills another.

You can't make everyone on this planet care for everybody.

 

If you get a chance, read the Koran. Also it based upon the interpretations the imams give to the youths. On that note, within the Koran, Jesus is mentioned 186 times and always referred to as a prophet. However there is one passage that I remember if not word for word. It states somewhere along the line that Islam should be taught to the heathens and those who resist should be destroyed. I may have it wrong but that is the basic gist of it.

I'm not very interested in reading religious text, JediMaster12, I see religion as being responsible for a lot of wars our society have rage over the 100s of years, that have delayed us from focusing on galactic exploration.

 

 

 

On another note, Jewish people are a religious group by technicality. Ethnicity refers to culture which are the shared and learned behaviors learned through the socialization process. However Jews believe that they are the chosen people of God, and for those who know their Bible, I won't explain anymore. Religion is a function within a culture but not a culture of itself. Whe we hear terms like Hasidic Jews, that is referring to sects or the degree of orthodoxy.

Yes, a lot of people believe they are the chosen people of God, you probably don't

know but I hate God so much.

So, when people refer to that thing, lose my control over my emotions. But I will try to be cool here, since people will think that I'm a bad person if I react in a negative way.

Back to your comment.

Now, I'm tire of hearing people who always say they are the chosen ones, as the representatives of any supreme being.

People need to stop being God or any other God paper boy/girl and focus on

exploring the universe and really find out what is out there, before making assumptions on here say, I do believe in God but I don't believe the Christian God is the only one there is.

Become knowledgable of the universe, before assuming they are the chosen ones, by not truly knowing, they should try to find out where we actually come from and we can't find that answer by remaining here, still here waging human civil wars to take control over insignificant territory, when we have infinite territory out there in the universe awaiting us.

 

It's about time our society put our petty differences aside and look toward the stars for inspiration.

The mystery, the adventure and the knowledge awaits us, if we stop focusing on ensuring the extinction of our species in this galaxy by these endless human civil wars, we continue to have on this planet.

 

But I have wasted my time writing all of that, no one but only a few of us is really interested in interstellar travel, right NOW damn the torpedoes of difficulty, in my opinion this should be our focus, not war.

 

But human civil wars continue to occur, JediMaster12.

[JediMaster12]

windu6: The genocide I refer to in Somalia is the 200,000+ dead from the starvation that Mohammed Fared Adid invoked upon his own people to keep control of his territory.

As to that religious outburst, I was not trying to argue that nonsense. I was pointing out the technicalities regarding the difference between the ethnic and religious boundaries within a culture is. I don't know what your problem is with God in general and I don't know why you think the Christian God and the Jewish one are different when they are one and the same but I wonder how it is you trudge through each day.

 

True that what the Hamas are showing is nothing more than propaganda to encourage the youth that becoming a suicide bomber is a good thing but there is only so much we can do. Like anything local, in a global perspective there are rules regarding certain things. As to why it is allowed to be shown on TV, that could be because the makers paid for it and the studio does have the descretion to show it. Call me the coward but I still believe that there is always room for one more round of diplomacy.

[Windu Chi]

windu6: The genocide I refer to in Somalia is the 200,000+ dead from the starvation that Mohammed Fared Adid invoked upon his own people to keep control of his territory.

Thanks for informing me about that, I will have to look up on that.

As to that religious outburst, I was not trying to argue that nonsense. I was pointing out the technicalities regarding the difference between the ethnic and religious boundaries within a culture is.

Yes, those ethnic and religious boundaries, must be sever, so we can stop that nonsense.

 

I don't know what your problem is with God in general and I don't know why you think the Christian God and the Jewish one are different when they are one and the same

Yes, I know that thing is the same god to both groups, I guess I forgot to tell you, I was once a stuck up; believing I was on the high moral ground Christian, before I was betrayed by that thing.

I use to read that book, when I was ignorant.

But I'm not going to go anymore into that.

 

I wonder how it is you trudge through each day.

Well, if you really want to know, I say F God and move on to the next day, after the next and so on until it wipe's me out of existence or I become consume with my own rage that I have every now and then.

 

 

 

 

True that what the Hamas are showing is nothing more than propaganda to encourage the youth that becoming a suicide bomber is a good thing but there is only so much we can do. Like anything local, in a global perspective there are rules regarding certain things. As to why it is allowed to be shown on TV, that could be because the makers paid for it and the studio does have the descretion to show it. Call me the coward but I still believe that there is always room for one more round of diplomacy.

 

I'm not calling you are coward because you want to find a peaceful resolution.

Trying to find peace is wise, but it is very difficult to achieve, that's why the human civil wars continue and continue....

[mur'phon]

You are naive if you believe they want to talk, they don't want to talk they want to kill.

 

I seem to remeber them trying to coopertate with fatah, and trying to stop palestinians killing each other. I also seem to remember them trying to talk to the israeli government.

 

What news you have been watching?

 

nrk, tv2(both norwegian) + reading diferent newspapers, what have you been watching?

 

You are sadly mistaken !

 

Strangely enough, I think you are mistaken

 

They want to murder every Jew on this PLANET

 

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think they are just saying it to fire up their folowers

 

I'm not sure about your feelings toward Israel

 

I feel that occupying a country because the west felt sorry for the jews was a big mistake.

 

But as I was saying, Hamas want to kill Jews every where on Earth.

 

I think they say that to get suport from the huge amount of palestinians who hate Israel, and think of Israel and the jews as the same thing

 

I don't know where you get the idea, that they only want to destroy Israel

 

From the fact that they have repeatedly said that they want the israeli occupation to stop. As far as I know, Hamas is not known to kill jews not in palestine/israel.

 

You need to do some more research.

 

Aparently, so do you

 

What the hell are you talking about, I'm talking about wiping Hamas out.

 

Whoops, my bad, I thought you wanted to wipe out hamas for what they have done, serves me right for posting when exhausted

 

I'm starting to see a pattern here, you must really hate Israel

 

I hate what it has done, which I'm sure I'm not alone in doing.

 

And if you hate Israel then it's a good bet you probably hate Jews too.

 

No, I don't. By that reasoning, anyone hating Turkey atomatically hates moslems.

 

And if you hate Israel then it's a good bet you probably hate Jews too.

 

I don't hate jews, please stop asuming that.

[Windu Chi]

I also seem to remember them trying to talk to the israeli government.

What?

Can you post a news article saying that?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Strangely enough' date=' I think you are mistaken [/quote']

I guess we are just going to have to wait any see which one of us is right.

 

 

Maybe I'm wrong' date=' but I think they are just saying it to fire up their folowers[/quote']

Well, time will tell.

 

 

 

I feel that occupying a country because the west felt sorry for the jews was a big mistake.

What do you mean felt sorry, they was almost wipe out in the Holocaust as a group, so what, too bad for their millions of deaths they had with all the families that was destroyed in that massacre.

So, what tough luck?

I think they say that to get suport from the huge amount of palestinians who hate Israel' date=' and think of Israel and the jews as the same thing[/quote']

You trust Hamas too much, mur'phon.

Israel and the Jews are the same thing they aren't seperate.

 

From the fact that they have repeatedly said that they want the israeli occupation to stop

.

Thats not going to happen, Israel won't ever give up that land, until a time when our society get's off it's lazy ass and explore the Milky Way galaxy.

 

As far as I know' date=' Hamas is not known to kill jews not in palestine/israel.[/quote']

What in the hell is you talking about, they are terrorist, where do think all the suicide bombings come from.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Whoops, my bad, I thought you wanted to wipe out hamas for what they have done, serves me right for posting when exhausted

I only want to wipe them out if they ever plan a genocide, but as you believe they probably can be talked to.

But I won't get my hopes up, mur'phon.

 

 

I hate what it has done' date=' which I'm sure I'm not alone in doing.[/quote']

No, you are not alone, you definitely can be sure of that, mur'phon.

 

 

 

No, I don't. By that reasoning, anyone hating Turkey atomatically hates moslems.

I don't hate jews, please stop asuming that.

Well, then I must apologize in my assertion, my anger toward the Holocaust can cloud my judgement from time to time.

[mur'phon]

What?

Can you post a news article saying that?

 

I'll do it when i have more time to search.

 

What do you mean felt sorry, they was almost wipe out in the Holocaust as a group, so what, too bad for their millions of deaths they had with all the families that was destroyed in that massacre.

So, what tough luck?

 

I mean that giving a turning a moslem country into a jewish one, was probably not the brightest idea in history. If they wanted to give them a country, why not chose a part of one of their own? Like a state in the US, or something.

 

Israel and the Jews are the same thing they aren't seperate.

 

As Jedimaster12 pointed out, they are seperate.

 

they are terrorist

 

Hamas is a lot more than that, they are the democratically elected ruling party in palestine. They do charity work like providing food, healthcare and education (admitedly a flawed one, but some is better than none).

Their fight against Israel using any means they can, which makes them terrorists to some, freedom fighters to others, and something in betwen to someone.

 

Well, then I must apologize in my assertion, my anger toward the Holocaust can cloud my judgement from time to time.

 

No problem, we all make such mistakes from time to time

[lukeiamyourdad]

What?

Can you post a news article saying that?

 

It happens, but since they keep a hard line, negotiations almost never give something positive.

 

 

 

 

 

What do you mean felt sorry, they was almost wipe out in the Holocaust as a group, so what, too bad for their millions of deaths they had with all the families that was destroyed in that massacre.

So, what tough luck?

 

So, what did the world community do for Rwanda? Or the Cambodians?

 

There's no justification for the creation of a country in the middle of another one. From the beginning it was a bad idea.

 

 

Israel and the Jews are the same thing they aren't seperate.

 

I didn't know Israeli citizenship was given to every Jew on Earth...

 

.

 

Thats not going to happen, Israel won't ever give up that land, until a time when our society get's off it's lazy ass and explore the Milky Way galaxy.

 

No one wants to give up their "promised" land.

 

 

What in the hell is you talking about, they are terrorist, where do think all the suicide bombings come from.

 

So, have you heard about that Hamas bombing in Queens? They hit a synagogue I heard...

 

 

I only want to wipe them out if they ever plan a genocide, but as you believe they probably can be talked to.

But I won't get my hopes up, mur'phon.

 

You can't wipe out an ideology. Nor can you make it totally disappear through dialogue.

[Windu Chi]

So, what did the world community do for Rwanda? Or the Cambodians?

They did nothing and I'm very p--- off about that, the U.N. uselessness is very apparent, lukeiamyourdad.

And Rwanda which is obvious, is racism, that was the main reason no one did a damn thing to prevent that genocide.

 

There's no justification for the creation of a country in the middle of another one. From the beginning it was a bad idea.

Well, you must realize until we explore this galaxy, we are going to have to share this planet and deal with the limited territory, lukeiamyourdad.

 

 

 

 

I didn't know Israeli citizenship was given to every Jew on Earth...

Well, they can't give citizenship to every Jew on Earth since the land is so limited, lukeiamyourdad.

 

 

 

 

 

No one wants to give up their "promised" land.

Promised by who, God?

That thing is the main reason, the Middle East War continue, because of religious influence.

 

 

 

 

So, have you heard about that Hamas bombing in Queens? They hit a synagogue I heard...

No I have not, lukeiamyourdad.

Can you post a link to a article that speak of that.

 

 

 

You can't wipe out an ideology. Nor can you make it totally disappear through dialogue.

Yes I know, but it is wise to try, lukeiamyourdad.

[lukeiamyourdad]

They did nothing and I'm very p--- off about that, the U.N. uselessness is very apparent, lukeiamyourdad.

And Rwanda which is obvious, is racism, that was the main reason no one did a damn thing to prevent that genocide.

 

Exactly. Why give a special treat in the form of a country to the Jews?

 

I'm not trying to minimize the suffering they went through in history, but there's no reason to favor them over Africans.

 

Well, you must realize until we explore this galaxy, we are going to have to share this planet and deal with the limited territory, lukeiamyourdad.

 

Do some research. Other places were taken into consideration when choosing a piece of land for Israel. The problem is that Palestine still remains the promised land and a holy place for the Jews. It is natural that they desperately want that place.

 

 

 

Well, they can't give citizenship to every Jew on Earth since the land is so limited, lukeiamyourdad.

 

So Israelis =/ Jews right?

 

 

 

 

Promised by who, God?

That thing is the main reason, the Middle East War continue, because of religious influence.

 

So what? It's a factor and you cannot discount it.

 

 

 

 

No I have not, lukeiamyourdad.

Can you post a link to a article that speak of that.

 

Hopefully, you're sarcastic...

 

 

 

Yes I know, but it is wise to try, lukeiamyourdad.

 

So it is wise for the Islamic terrorists to try to change the current western ideology?

[Windu Chi]

Exactly. Why give a special treat in the form of a country to the Jews?

Well, since a lot of people on this planet dispise the Jews, they gave Israel to them to possibly prevent another genocide back then.

 

 

I'm not trying to minimize the suffering they went through in history, but there's no reason to favor them over Africans.

Of course it's not, thats why I'm p--- off about any genocide, like the one going on in Darfur, nothing being done there because as usual the useless U.N. and that racist Bush.

 

 

 

Do some research. Other places were taken into consideration when choosing a piece of land for Israel. The problem is that Palestine still remains the promised land and a holy place for the Jews. It is natural that they desperately want that place.

No one else want Jews in there land not even Americans, the hate for them is great on this planet, lukeiamyourdad.

If the U.S. did want Jews there, Israel or whatever they would call it will be there.

 

 

 

 

 

So Israelis =/ Jews right?

Ok !

As I was saying, the surface area of Earth for colonization is runing out, they can't have every Jew on the planet there, because of the simiple geometry of the land, it's way too small for that, unless people want to live 5 feet apart I assume; well I will have to do some calculations to be sure.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So what? It's a factor and you cannot discount it.

Well if we continue to rely on that factor, then any group can find some religious evidence to say any land is theirs because their religion say so.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hopefully, you're sarcastic...

No, I'm not being sarcastic, I'm really asking you to post a link.

 

 

 

 

 

 

So it is wise for the Islamic terrorists to try to change the current western ideology?

You got to come up with these difficult questions.

Hell no, it's not going to happen, they are wasting their time.

They won't obtain their Muslim Empire that they thirst for, lukeiamyourdad.

[JediMaster12]

The problem is that Palestine still remains the promised land and a holy place for the Jews. It is natural that they desperately want that place.

Well if you refer to the Bible, Jerusalem is one of the main cities that is considered important to the Israelites. I believe part of the assertion that the Jews should have a homeland is based upon this context.

 

Well if we continue to rely on that factor, then any group can find some religious evidence to say any land is theirs because their religion say so.

You also have to look at historic context meaning who had it first way back in the time of the pharoahs. Honest truth, that land was highly dominated by nomadic herders of goats and sheep. The Middle East environments range from the desert to savannah, similar to the sub-Sahara Africa part. the main means of food source came from hunting-gathering and herding. So if we go on thatm then technically the land should belong to the nomadic tribes.

 

So Israelis =/ Jews right?

No. Israel is a political state. Jew is a person who practices Judaism. Israel was created as a Jewish homeland following WWII. The population of Israel is predominately Jewish but there is a small percentage of Christians and other groups living within her borders.

[Windu Chi]

 

You also have to look at historic context meaning who had it first way back in the time of the pharoahs. Honest truth, that land was highly dominated by nomadic herders of goats and sheep. The Middle East environments range from the desert to savannah, similar to the sub-Sahara Africa part. the main means of food source came from hunting-gathering and herding. So if we go on thatm then technically the land should belong to the nomadic tribes.

Yes, like technically America belongs to the Native Indians.

[GarfieldJL]

It's really pathetic how people go out of their way to blame Israel or the United States because some lunatics can't actually sit down and talk and instead have to resort to blowing themselves up, or using their own children as human bombs...

[Totenkopf]

Yes, like technically America belongs to the Native Indians.

 

 

Well, if one believes that the first humans came out of Africa, it would be fair to say that either a)Africans were the first imperialists or that b) Africans should own the world. That is, if one wanted to be technical about it....

 

Seriously though, I don't believe that the mess we see in Africa today is simply b/c the world is racist. First, many of the problems are currently caused by indigenous people. Second, if Rwanda were the source of oil that places in the middle east are, there would be a much greater degree of attention paid to what goes on there. Simply put, mounting military/police style expedtions to "right" the wrongs of the world is prohibitively expensive and you're unlikely to see any individual country (or even coalition) want to expend their resources on what is essentially an economic dead end. One of the big arguments for getting out of Iraq, for instance, is that it's an ongoing civil war. If noninvolvement in civil wars is the reason for staying out of certain areas of the world........well, Africa is a continent wracked with them.

 

The problem with diplomacy is that it requires that both sides need to agree to some kind of compromise. If either/both sides wanted such compromises, there wouldn't be a conflict in the first place. At some point, the "resonable" party is going to have to realize that the other is negotiating in bad faith and will need to take measures to defend themselves or defeat their opponent. Some parties are simply too intractable and must be recognized as such, less self preservation go out the window. That is the problem presented today by radical islam. It's their way or the highway and it's global, not merely regional.

[SilentScope001]

Or prehaps Radical Islam may see Westerners as being unable to negogiate and compromise, and they are the reasonable ones. Or maybe both are unreasonable idiots. Who knows?

 

There are always two sides to one coin...

[Totenkopf]

Well, given their stated aims (ie submission or die), doesn't look much like room for compromise in anyones' book. Mind you, we are talking about the radical ones that wish to establish (however unrealistically in the views of others) a global caliphate. Doesn't much sound like a group of people interested in negotiating anything but their opponents subjugation.

[mur'phon]

It's really pathetic how people go out of their way to blame Israel

 

Why would anyone blame Israel for anything?

The have just occupied Palestine, killed an insane amount of civilians in "revenge" attacks, bombed the remains of Palestine, killed/kidnapped many of its politicians, cuting the power causing people to die in hospitals, walling in huge chunks of what remains of Palestine, shooting "terrorists" who where using weapons of mass anoyance (known as rocks), preventing trade to the remains of Palestine, preventing palestinians from fishing, occupying its neinghbours terretories, blowing parts of Lebanon to bits, refusing to negotiate with Palestines elected goverment and a few other things that I can show you if you would like.

 

Or am i going out of my way to blame them?

[GarfieldJL]

Actually Israel has taken ridiculous precautions to avoid collatoral damage. The problem is that a lot of these groups deliberately use innocents as human shields (particularly children). Due to how these terrorist groups operate, the blame for civilian deaths is mostly on their heads not the Israelis, whom do prosecute people for deliberately targeting civilians.

[mur'phon]

Actually Israel has taken ridiculous precautions to avoid collateral damage

 

Could you please link me to some of theese?

 

the blame for civilian deaths is mostly on their heads not the Israelis

 

When the Israelies know that they are likely to kill a lot more civilians than rebels in a strike, and proceds to do it anyway, don't Israel need to take the largest part of the blame? After all, they don't need to bomb/bombard an area to kill of rebels. They could use ground forces which would cause a lot less dead civilians. I know they would loose a lot more soldiers this way, but it's unlikely that the extra dead soldiers would outnumber the civilians saved. A life is a life, wether Israeli or Palestinian.

 

 

 

whom do prosecute people for deliberately targeting civilians.

 

What about the demolition of refuge camps? as far as I know the people ordering and comitting these acts still walk free.

[GarfieldJL]

Okay, so you're saying Israel shouldn't fight back because the terrorists are using children as human shields.

 

Also if you'd look to the recent Israel/Lebanon Conflict, you'd realize that most media outlets aren't at all trustworthy when it comes to things concerning Israel. Running around stating that doctored photos are the gospel truth.

[lukeiamyourdad]

Running around stating that doctored photos are the gospel truth.

 

So you were there right? You know what's the truth?

 

 

 

This is a guerrilla vs. a standard army. You'd think people would learn from Vietnam.

 

This is a description of the Vietnamese communist Viet Cong:

 

-Linen shirt

-Linen pants

-Sandals

-Pointy hat

 

This is the description of a regular Vietnamese peasant:

 

-Linen shirt

-Linen pants

-Sandals

-Pointy hat

 

Which one do you shoot? Who's plotting to ambush your squad?

 

That's the sad reality of guerrilla warfare. Civilians as human shields. The problem is that you must try to minimize the civilian casualties or else you lose the propaganda war.

[JediMaster12]

LIAYD: The example you gave is a sad truth. I have read the criticism on Mai Lai and the fate of the those that were charged. Of course that could be seen as wanton killing, something that we like to thing we are better than.

 

Seriously though, I don't believe that the mess we see in Africa today is simply b/c the world is racist. First, many of the problems are currently caused by indigenous people.

This is true since we are dealing with old tribal hatreds that still run deep. It's the same thing you find regarding tribes anywhere else in the world. The Native Amer here in the States fought each other and conducted raids and the like. It escalated I think when the European settlers arrived in the name of imperialism. They divided Africa without regard for territories established by the native peoples. Then they encouraged them to kill each other but also they wanted them as labor. Interesting thing in my opinion.