children and the hungry demand "rights"

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs/2008/gashc3941.doc.htm

 

Specifically:

 

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ANNEX III

 

Vote on Right to Food

 

The draft resolution on the right to food (document A/C.3/63/L.42/Rev.1) was approved by a recorded vote of 180 in favour to 1 against, with no abstentions, as follows:

 

In favour: Afghanistan, Albania, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Antigua and Barbuda, Argentina, Armenia, Australia, Austria, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belarus, Belgium, Belize, Benin, Bhutan, Bolivia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Botswana, Brazil, Brunei Darussalam, Bulgaria, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Canada, Cape Verde, Chad, Chile, China, Colombia, Comoros, Congo, Costa Rica, Côte d’Ivoire, Croatia, Cuba, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Democratic People’s Republic of Korea, Denmark, Djibouti, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Egypt, El Salvador, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Estonia, Ethiopia, Fiji, Finland, France, Gabon, Gambia, Georgia, Germany, Ghana, Greece, Grenada, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Guyana, Haiti, Honduras, Hungary, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Jamaica, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Lao People’s Democratic Republic, Latvia, Lebanon, Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Madagascar, Malawi, Malaysia, Maldives, Mali, Malta, Mauritania, Mauritius, Mexico, Micronesia (Federated States of), Monaco, Mongolia, Montenegro, Morocco, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Nauru, Nepal, Netherlands, New Zealand, Nicaragua, Niger, Nigeria, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Panama, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Republic of Korea, Republic of Moldova, Romania, Russian Federation, Rwanda, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, Samoa, San Marino, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Serbia, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovakia, Slovenia, Solomon Islands, South Africa, Spain, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Suriname, Swaziland, Sweden, Switzerland, Syria, Tajikistan, Thailand, the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, Timor-Leste, Togo, Tonga, Trinidad and Tobago, Tunisia, Turkey, Turkmenistan, Uganda, Ukraine, United Arab Emirates, United Kingdom, United Republic of Tanzania, Uruguay, Uzbekistan, Vanuatu, Venezuela, Viet Nam, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe.

 

Against: United States.

 

Abstain: None.

 

Absent: Central African Republic, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Guatemala, Kiribati, Marshall Islands, Palau, Saint Kitts and Nevis, Sao Tome and Principe, Seychelles, Somalia, Tuvalu.

ANNEX VIII

 

Vote on Rights of the Child

 

The draft resolution on the rights of the child (document A/C.3/63/L.16/Rev.1) was approved by a recorded vote of 180 in favour to 1 against, with no abstentions, as follows:

 

In favour: Afghanistan, Albania, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Antigua and Barbuda, Argentina, Armenia, Australia, Austria, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belarus, Belgium, Belize, Benin, Bhutan, Bolivia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Botswana, Brazil, Brunei Darussalam, Bulgaria, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Canada, Cape Verde, Chad, Chile, China, Colombia, Comoros, Congo, Costa Rica, Croatia, Cuba, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Democratic People’s Republic of Korea, Denmark, Djibouti, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Egypt, El Salvador, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Estonia, Ethiopia, Fiji, Finland, France, Gabon, Gambia, Georgia, Germany, Ghana, Greece, Grenada, Guatemala, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Guyana, Haiti, Honduras, Hungary, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Jamaica, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Lao People’s Democratic Republic, Latvia, Lebanon, Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Madagascar, Malawi, Malaysia, Maldives, Mali, Malta, Marshall Islands, Mauritania, Mauritius, Mexico, Micronesia (Federated States of), Monaco, Mongolia, Montenegro, Morocco, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Nauru, Nepal, Netherlands, New Zealand, Nicaragua, Niger, Nigeria, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Palau, Panama, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Republic of Korea, Republic of Moldova, Romania, Russian Federation, Rwanda, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, Samoa, San Marino, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Serbia, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovakia, Slovenia, Solomon Islands, South Africa, Spain, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Suriname, Swaziland, Sweden, Switzerland, Syria, Tajikistan, Thailand, the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, Timor-Leste, Togo, Tonga, Trinidad and Tobago, Tunisia, Turkey, Turkmenistan, Uganda, Ukraine, United Arab Emirates, United Kingdom, United Republic of Tanzania, Uruguay, Uzbekistan, Venezuela, Viet Nam, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe.

 

Against: United States.

 

Abstain: None.

 

Absent: Central African Republic, Côte d’Ivoire, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Kiribati, Saint Kitts and Nevis, Saint Lucia, Sao Tome and Principe, Seychelles, Somalia, Tuvalu, Vanuatu.

 

How will they learn to not be 5 and not be hungry if we coddle them like this?

 

 

So... thoughts?

[Tommycat]

Seems as though you are mischaracterising WHY the US voted against.

 

Speaking in explanation of vote, the representative of the United States said that, while agreeing with the sentiment expressed in the resolution, his delegation could not support the text as drafted. The United States felt that the attainment of the “right to adequate food” or the “right to be free from hunger” was a goal that should be realized progressively. The current resolution contained numerous objectionable provisions, including inaccurate textual descriptions of underlying rights. The United States was the largest food donor in the world of international humanitarian food aid and it would continue to work towards providing food security to all. In the future, he expressed hope that the co-sponsors would work to address his delegation’s concerns, so the United States could join other countries in adopting the draft.

Hmmm seems to me that there were some things within the text that the US objected to. Far from being against the hungry, as we are the largest provider of food.

 

Speaking in explanation of vote, the representative of the United States welcomed the commitment of the United Nations and the Third Committee on issues relating to the rights of the child. The United States was equally committed to the issue and had worked to ensure that the protection of the rights of children was fully integrated into its foreign policy. However, she also expressed disappointment over the failure to make a number of minor changes that would have allowed the United States to support the draft. In particular, she referred to preambular paragraph 2, which stated that the Convention on the Rights of the Child “must constitute” the standard, and in operative paragraph 2, which might have been improved by urging States to “consider” becoming States parties to the Convention, as each State had a sovereign right to make such decisions on their own. Finally, operative paragraph 31, which recognized the contribution of the International Criminal Court in ending impunity for the most serious crimes against children, was not necessarily supported by fact, as it had not yet tried a single case in that regard.

Basically we didn't like the text because parts of it trumped individual States sovereign rights, some of the text was funky, and giving credit to the ICC for things it had not done.

 

Sometimes I wonder why we bother providing as much aid to other countries as we do. No matter how much we do, we still get characterized as being against things we are supporters of.

[vanir]

Well it all stands to reason. The United States is one planet, and everybody else another.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Seems as though you are mischaracterising WHY the US voted against.

 

 

Hmmm seems to me that there were some things within the text that the US objected to. Far from being against the hungry, as we are the largest provider of food.

 

 

Basically we didn't like the text because parts of it trumped individual States sovereign rights, some of the text was funky, and giving credit to the ICC for things it had not done.

 

Sometimes I wonder why we bother providing as much aid to other countries as we do. No matter how much we do, we still get characterized as being against things we are supporters of.

 

 

I see meaningless wordplay and bull**** excuses. Nothing more.

 

As to your last point, I'm guessing it has something to do with much of U.S. foreign policy being an impedance to humanitarian efforts.

[Tommycat]

I see meaningless wordplay and bull**** excuses. Nothing more.

 

As to your last point, I'm guessing it has something to do with much of U.S. foreign policy being an impedance to humanitarian efforts.

 

Most law is just wordplay. If we're going to be held to it, it has to be acceptable to us legally.

 

Yeah, what percentage of food does your country provide? WE provided 49% of food aid. EU COMBINED was less than 1/2 what we did. But somehow YOU call US against the hungry.

[vanir]

About ten years ago the US initiated a monetary fund to support the fight against poverty in Africa. The requirement details were that it was a loan to be repaid, and that the monies loaned would be spent with specific US industries at inflated prices. And that until the loan was repaid local policy was to procreate a US friendly economic-domestic policy.

 

Imperialism in as many wordplays. This act resulted in demonstrations around the globe, particularly among environmentalist and holistic political groups. You give, you don't demand. It's called charity, it begins at home and it doesn't involve political or any other agendas. But then that wouldn't be capitalism now, would it?

 

See, when people that are determinedly religious stand against you, you don't say, let's wipe out fundamentalist extremists. You say, what am I doing wrong?

 

Of course in some countries that just doesn't get the illusion of a majority vote, for some ungodly reason. I should think many more will continue to question polling dictum in the US in the coming future, as each begins to find it harder and harder to actually identify these majority voters anywhere within their own neighbourhoods, anywhere.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Most law is just wordplay. If we're going to be held to it, it has to be acceptable to us legally.

 

Yeah, what percentage of food does your country provide? WE provided 49% of food aid. EU COMBINED was less than 1/2 what we did. But somehow YOU call US against the hungry.

49%. You are us and us are you MIND TRIP

 

that's actually part of the reason i even brought this up, i have to rely on the u.s.' reputation when i travel and i don't want my passport being turned into a reason to be hated and ridiculed thanks.

[Adavardes]

This whole thread is an epic facepalm, to be completely honest. It's ridiculous. Not only do we start a war against all the UN's cautions against it, ignoring international policy and turning ourselves into THE most ignorant, moronic country on the planet, we turn around and hold back global progress by being the only one to vote against two huge steps toward better human rights, and progressive measures to staving off world hunger. We could have just signed off on it and stopped being international *******s, but NOOOOO.

 

And the fact that this is even a point of argument on whether or not America's decision was just is absurd. It should be fairly obvious that this is exactly why other countries dispise us. And yes, it does matter, because believe it or not, America isn't master of the world!

 

@ Tommycat:

 

I don't care how you paint it, what happened there was wrong. America is not a country to be loved unquestioningly, it is most definately up on the chopping block not only for being one of the countries with the lowest quality of education, sanitation, health, and understanding of global policy, but also for being the country that is all of these things, and holds everyone back, because we think we have a god-given right to bully anyone around that doesn't think and act just as we do, and think that because we have more military power, we are somehow superior, when really, we are not.

 

AMERICA MAKES ME SO MAD!

[Tommycat]

The problem is that even when we do something right, we don't get the credit for it. Instead people just go "Yeah, well what about X" and don't even give acknowledgement to the good. Lets face it, people will hate us regardless. Maybe things will change with the new administration, but I doubt it. Maybe instead of just accepting when someone says that we're opposed to feeding the hungry instead of telling people Yeah that was bad of us to oppose those two annexes(which I have not seen the text of, so I cannot say whether it was poorly worded), you could simply point out that we do provide 49% of the food aid.

 

About our education: Though this is getting off topic, we have consistently had the highest completion rates. We turn out almost twice as many scientists and engineers than we have jobs for. It really depends on what criteria they are using to judge the education.

IThe most recent figures show just 76 percent of 25- to 34-year-olds with uppersecondary education in the UK as of 2006, which is 11 percentage points lower than the corresponding figure for the US despite continuing problems with dropout rates in the US, particularly US cities.4

 

I would also like links to proof of your other claims please. I'm not saying you are a liar by any means, I would just like to see the info for myself.

[Web Rider]

A "feel good" measure and nothing more, nothing less.

 

How to we(the world) ensure everyone has an "equal food standard"? Do we give everyone a cheesburger? Do people get to choose whatever they want so long as it is above a certain caloric value? How do you DO that? Not everyone even needs the same amount of food, some people need more, some people simply want more. You can't possibly expect anything realistic to come out of saying "everyone deserves the right to eat food."

 

As for children, this falls into my "when people say 'THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!' our brains turn off" point of view. The EU is not helping themselves by micromanaging it's nations. The UN will not help by doing the same. Yes, everyone who cares KNOWS children have rights, life, liberty, ect...but they are also children, and require parents to some degree, and we know when they're harmed that it's BAD. Really, what is this going to do other than make an unenforceable law that doesn't DO anything other than state the obvious?

 

And, look at some of the nations that supported it, Afghanistan, Belarus, Egypt, Israel, Kenya, Saudi Arabia, Zimbabwe, are we joking here? Half the nations that support this have a horrible human rights record, saying "oh, they're good" for doing this is like patting the dog for learning how to shake but still letting him poop on the carpet.

[Rev7]

A "feel good" measure and nothing more, nothing less.

QFE

[vanir]

Right, wrt comments like the following, it's time to grow up:

 

The problem is that even when we do something right, we don't get the credit for it.

 

Mate, this is pure and whole childishness. Doing good is the minimum acceptable standard of human behaviour. It's normal. It's not supposed to stand out. Get it?

 

Now going and as good as making an argument of, "pander to me or I'll go do bad," just makes you public enemy number 1 from the very start. It makes you an arrogant, dangerous child who needs to be controlled. And here's the down and dirty, nobody will. It's not democratic to do so.

 

So you just go do what you want, and we'll go do good like it's normal behaviour. Then at the end you can whinge about how nobody likes you and it's not fair, whilst we're the ones with all the honest friends we can trust with our backs turned.

 

 

I mean come on. As far as people liking you goes, what you choose is what you get. Not happy? What on Earth did you choose, feller? Same goes for nations. Argue the finer points, go right ahead. That was precisely what we wanted to see. Now we know. We know. We know you.

 

Cheers

[Web Rider]

Mate, this is pure and whole childishness. Doing good is the minimum acceptable standard of human behaviour. It's normal. It's not supposed to stand out. Get it?

No, it's not normal. Normal is acting in self interest. I do what is best for me because I'm designed to survive. I do not do what is good for you at the expense of me because that is death.

 

Now going and as good as making an argument of, "pander to me or I'll go do bad," just makes you public enemy number 1 from the very start. It makes you an arrogant, dangerous child who needs to be controlled. And here's the down and dirty, nobody will. It's not democratic to do so.

Oh yeah, because calling somebody an arrogant dangerous child who needs to be controlled really doesn't make you sound like an arrogant dangerous child who needs to be controlled.

 

So you just go do what you want, and we'll go do good like it's normal behaviour. Then at the end you can whinge about how nobody likes you and it's not fair, whilst we're the ones with all the honest friends we can trust with our backs turned.

Mature, trusting friends who will decide what's best for you, what clothes to wear, how much food to eat, if you die in some land you can't spell.

 

 

I mean come on. As far as people liking you goes, what you choose is what you get. Not happy? What on Earth did you choose, feller? Same goes for nations. Argue the finer points, go right ahead. That was precisely what we wanted to see. Now we know. We know. We know you.

Jeeze, no wonder Americans don't like Europeans, you've just written 3 paragraphs in support of why the US should take it's toys home and play isolationist.

 

America helps, a lot, the world generally gives them gripe for not helping MORE. Then they praise how much they're helping, which is considerably less, and what's that called? A DOUBLE STANDARD. Hey, I don't want the world to sing praise for me, I just want a simple thank you. If you can't cough up so much as "hey, that really helped" I don't see why buying your love by helping poor nations is going to make you any better friends than if I do nothing.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

America helps, a lot, the world generally gives them gripe for not helping MORE. Then they praise how much they're helping, which is considerably less, and what's that called? A DOUBLE STANDARD. Hey, I don't want the world to sing praise for me, I just want a simple thank you. If you can't cough up so much as "hey, that really helped" I don't see why buying your love by helping poor nations is going to make you any better friends than if I do nothing.

i dont have any sources for this, but i'm pretty sure other countries gripe because we cause a lot of situations that require humanitarian aid

[Web Rider]

i dont have any sources for this, but i'm pretty sure other countries gripe because we cause a lot of situations that require humanitarian aid

 

And that was exactly Tommycat's point. We help even where we screw up. not always, but often. And people, instread of saying "oh, dang you, you screwed it up, but good on you for helping." just say "you idiot, you screwed it up!" and ignore any help we give anywhere. And it's annoying. A little thanks is not hard, and yeah, we do mess things up, just like a laundry list of other nations do.

 

But what do we want? high praise? Good trade deals? no. A little thanks would be nice, just say "too bad you messed it up, but thanks for helping fix it."

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

And that was exactly Tommycat's point. We help even where we screw up. not always, but often. And people, instread of saying "oh, dang you, you screwed it up, but good on you for helping." just say "you idiot, you screwed it up!" and ignore any help we give anywhere. And it's annoying. A little thanks is not hard, and yeah, we do mess things up, just like a laundry list of other nations do.

 

But what do we want? high praise? Good trade deals? no. A little thanks would be nice, just say "too bad you messed it up, but thanks for helping fix it."

uhh why should we be praised for kinda sorta cleaning up our own messes?

[Web Rider]

uhh why should we be praised for kinda sorta cleaning up our own messes?

 

We shouldnt, which, if you read my post instead of assuming I wrote "bawwwww world hates america!!!" you'd have seen all I wanted was a "thanks".

 

Friends thank their friends for cleaning up after a party even when they made the mess. It's called "common courtesy". If the US is going to be given flak for messing things up, and then STILL given flak when they clean it up, WHY do we have any incentive to clean it up if nothing has changed and everyone still treats us in the same poor manner?

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

We shouldnt, which, if you read my post instead of assuming I wrote "bawwwww world hates america!!!" you'd have seen all I wanted was a "thanks".

 

Friends thank their friends for cleaning up after a party even when they made the mess. It's called "common courtesy". If the US is going to be given flak for messing things up, and then STILL given flak when they clean it up, WHY do we have any incentive to clean it up if nothing has changed and everyone still treats us in the same poor manner?

cleaning up a mess after a party isn't really comparable to killing a country or region because of the sheer scale and the fact that we can't bring people back to life or go out to the store and buy new ones.

 

back on topic though, opposing these measures is deserving of criticism.

[Tommycat]

Right, wrt comments like the following, it's time to grow up:

 

 

 

Mate, this is pure and whole childishness. Doing good is the minimum acceptable standard of human behaviour. It's normal. It's not supposed to stand out. Get it?

 

Now going and as good as making an argument of, "pander to me or I'll go do bad," just makes you public enemy number 1 from the very start. It makes you an arrogant, dangerous child who needs to be controlled. And here's the down and dirty, nobody will. It's not democratic to do so.

 

So you just go do what you want, and we'll go do good like it's normal behaviour. Then at the end you can whinge about how nobody likes you and it's not fair, whilst we're the ones with all the honest friends we can trust with our backs turned.

 

 

I mean come on. As far as people liking you goes, what you choose is what you get. Not happy? What on Earth did you choose, feller? Same goes for nations. Argue the finer points, go right ahead. That was precisely what we wanted to see. Now we know. We know. We know you.

 

Cheers

 

MALE BOVINE FECAL MATTER!

 

I'm not asking for high praise. Just acknowledgement of the good we do. You want to talk about maturity? Lets talk maturity. We do good despite the fact that other countries hate us. THAT is maturity. We don't do it for praise. But it would be nice to at least get a "thank you" once in a while from the global community.

 

Maybe it's a sign of how I was raised that I was taught that when someone helps, you say thanks.

 

Oh and our own messes aren't the only ones we help clean up. Sure they get more press, because it is fashionable to bash the US.

[Web Rider]

back on topic though, opposing these measures is deserving of criticism.

 

Why? The measures do nothing, and half the nations that signed on are guilty of breaking these measures on a daily basis. Isn't it THEY who should be criticized for being hypocritial, instead of the US for simply objecting to a rule they pretty much already follow or find invasive to their nation?

 

This law doesn't mean jack. Nations that already follow standards that are as close as humanly possible to it will follow it, nations that have no way of implementing it will still not implment it, and nations with no intention of following it will continue with that intention. Not to mention that there's no way the UN can possibly organize a task force to go to every person in every nation and check if they're having these standards applied to them.

 

Why should anyone be criticized for not signing on to something that doesn't even have any effect?

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Why? The measures do nothing, and half the nations that signed on are guilty of breaking these measures on a daily basis. Isn't it THEY who should be criticized for being hypocritial, instead of the US for simply objecting to a rule they pretty much already follow or find invasive to their nation?

 

This law doesn't mean jack. Nations that already follow standards that are as close as humanly possible to it will follow it, nations that have no way of implementing it will still not implment it, and nations with no intention of following it will continue with that intention. Not to mention that there's no way the UN can possibly organize a task force to go to every person in every nation and check if they're having these standards applied to them.

 

Why should anyone be criticized for not signing on to something that doesn't even have any effect?

by that logic we should just forget about any u.n. measure and pretty much any other international law regarding the behavior of nations. the fact remains however, that u.n resolutions do matter, and just because they aren't being enforced as strictly as they should be, doesn't mean they should be forgotten about.

 

as for being deserving of criticism, i'd like to see a reason why people shouldn't have a right to not starve to death and why children shouldn't have the right to not be slaves.

[Web Rider]

by that logic we should just forget about any u.n. measure and pretty much any other international law regarding the behavior of nations. the fact remains however, that u.n resolutions do matter, and just because they aren't being enforced as strictly as they should be, doesn't mean they should be forgotten about.

Shouldn't laws that CAN be enforced be what we focus on? UN resolutions matter to those who already care. Nations that don't care, they have no effect. And it isn't a matter of the enforcement not being as 'strict" as it should, it's a matter of the enforcement being IMPOSSIBLE.

 

as for being deserving of criticism, i'd like to see a reason why people shouldn't have a right to not starve to death and why children shouldn't have the right to not be slaves.

As I already said, everyone who cares already knows that people have a right not to die of starvation and children have the right to be free.

 

But that's not the point. We, the nations the care, already know this. Those nations that might care, but can't control their country, can't do anything about it. The nations that don't care, STILL don't care. Why do we need to pass a law that affirms what We are already doing, and has no effect on They who can't/don't want to do anything about it?

 

Aren't there better things that everyone can do?

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Shouldn't laws that CAN be enforced be what we focus on? UN resolutions matter to those who already care. Nations that don't care, they have no effect. And it isn't a matter of the enforcement not being as 'strict" as it should, it's a matter of the enforcement being IMPOSSIBLE.

absolute enforcement would be impossible, as it is with any law, that doesn't mean we should just say **** it and move on.

[vanir]

MALE BOVINE FECAL MATTER!

 

I'm not asking for high praise. Just acknowledgement of the good we do. You want to talk about maturity? Lets talk maturity. We do good despite the fact that other countries hate us. THAT is maturity. We don't do it for praise. But it would be nice to at least get a "thank you" once in a while from the global community.

 

Maybe it's a sign of how I was raised that I was taught that when someone helps, you say thanks.

 

Oh and our own messes aren't the only ones we help clean up. Sure they get more press, because it is fashionable to bash the US.

 

Actually maturity is to do what you do without expecting thanks. Self respect is the thanks you get. Once you've got self respect, you'll find others thanking you for that.

 

The problem again, about a puppy dog looking for a pat on the head is that it also needs a good whack when it bites instead.

A combination of events throughout the 20th century served notice on humankind, it cannot be allowed for childish or corrupt governments to rule industrially developed nations even for a single term anymore. That would include, in fact most especially within the United States.

 

But governments will not grow up, they cannot. The onus of responsibility is upon populations, us, you and me. By the time you get past your early teens you absolutely must become politically developed, moreso than your government, in order for the planet to survive with some semblence of democratic well being.

 

This would include giving without receiving. Efforts without return. That is what turns the world. What else are you going to do? Create slave classes or just artificially control population growth?

 

No thanks. Just be good. You're the only one who loses otherwise. Perhaps we should be thankful for corrupt politicians for having exampled it so illustratively for our entire species, that their national reputation pays for each and every choice made and in turn the population is innately responsible. Certainly, apparently simplistic, "religious extremists" the world over seem to have gleaned this piece of enlightenment.

 

You do good not for any other reason other than threat. It is a very bad thing for you if you do not. And it has nothing to do with anybody else.

 

 

-Note that I did forget to add in my previous post that this was not a personal attack of any kind but an examination of the subject material. I sometimes do that due to distractions and apolegise, Tommycat. My rant is not directed at you but generally and includes myself as much as anyone.

[Web Rider]

The problem again, about a puppy dog looking for a pat on the head is that it also needs a good whack when it bites instead.

A combination of events throughout the 20th century served notice on humankind, it cannot be allowed for childish or corrupt governments to rule industrially developed nations even for a single term anymore. That would include, in fact most especially within the United States.

A lot of corrupt governments have made that argument to support overthrowing governments they don't like. Don't walk around saying "I've got the big stick and you'll behave now." And then condemn others for doing the same.