Patch Thread

[Moleculor]

Originally posted by toolboi

My logitech iFeel mouse's third (middle) button doesn't work. I know Black & White and Tribes 2 got it to work, so I know it's possible. That, and the actual wheel doesn't work either.

 

Thats a "feature" in logitecs craptacular drivers. I asked tech support on this and they said that first you have to bind that button to shift or control, and then set the function in the game to one of those keys. I then noticed that binding to those keys causes the buttons to "stick" that is that pressing a button bound to shift will do the equivilent of holding shift until you tap the button again. I went back to tech support asking about this and they said "there is no way to keep the buttons from "sticking" ".

You heard it here, Logitec designed their windows drivers so that you couldnt bind keys in games.

 

Of course their mac drivers are some of the best Ive ever used...

 

If this is a problem with the Logitech drivers, then why did Black & White and Tribes 2 get them to work -just- fine? Which I -mentioned- in my post, and you even quoted? It's a bug in JK2 that should be fixed. Not a problem with Logitech.

[EekTheKat]

'k I just noticed this.....

 

but swings in MP are seemingly random if you stand still. If possible I would really like to see this changed to something simliar to the SP system.

 

I noticed this from being able to consistantly pull off certain moves from a standing swing in SP and can't pull the very same moves off with the same consistancy in MP.

 

Also to repeat - I'd like to see MP saber collisions simliar to SP saber collisions.

[Morkath]

the logitech mouse problem isnt a bug with jk2, its a bug from the q3 engine, one of the last pointreleases, the one that disabled the alt-tab'ing ability, always screws up some mice. It is easily rectified on your end, go to the logitech site and get the gamers patch.

[Moleculor]

Ok, yeah, I fixed the Logitech problem. Apparently Autoscroll is not decent. Just switching the middle button function to 'Middle Button' retains the windows functionality of it and makes it work in games. Weird. Why they even HAVE 'Autoscroll' as an option in the Mouse control panel is beyond me. Thanx.

 

Enhancements:

 

Agreed, the collisions should be like SP. So should the moves, and the swings. And most especially the saber locks.

 

In fact... make EVERYTHING like the SP game. MP shouldn't be any different.

 

Another vote for: Make the finishing move in duels move in slow motion, even when everything else is moving fine. This give the person time to recover and get out of the mindset of "This d*** n00b who's been sitting here lightninging me and my dueler the entire time we've been dueling can't hurt me" and back into "Ok, time to kill this f-ing n00b."

 

Either that, or prolong the invincibility and the can't hurt others thing for about two seconds after the duel is finished. As I stand there laughing at their still steaming corpse.

 

Bug:

 

Sniper shots are not blockable. This annoys me. Especially when I can toast a blue Reborn from a good distance away with a sniper rifle. *shudder*

[toolboi]

If this is a problem with the Logitech drivers, then why did Black & White and Tribes 2 get them to work -just- fine? Which I -mentioned- in my post, and you even quoted? It's a bug in JK2 that should be fixed. Not a problem with Logitech.

 

Go ahead, try to change the binding on them in B&W (dont know about T2). You cant. I talked to Logitech about this, and they confirmed it. These games work in such a way that they bind directly I suppose, but try it in UT or in Q3. I eventually changed to the default win2K drivers as they allowed more control (still not that much). However in JK2 (and most he new games) I can bind every button.

 

I also found a small bug, Im not sure if this happens ot all bots, but it happened with Tavion (the sith chick). If you play the jedi hanger with no force powers (thus no force jump) she starts standing at the back of the shuttle jumping up and down... kinda ruins the fun of the fight, its a small thing, should be fairly easy to fix. (not that I know jack ****).

[ajpiano]

Enhancement:

 

Server list indicates level of force mastery in a game.

 

also, has anyone else found that the game is much darker in window mode instead of fullscreen?

 

 

--adam

[Canis_Aureus]

*ENHANCEMENTS*

 

- I would also like to see an option for removing the shield chargers. Or setting the maximum shield level players can have (0 - 200). Basically make as many options to customize the server as you can think of

 

- Also I don't like that's it's almost impossible to see if you hit your opponent when his shields are out... I also agree that the SP saber fighting is better and that is the way MP should be too. Variety and control is important in an online game.

 

 

----

 

*OTHER COMMENTS*

 

- I think the grip force is just fine. Someone mentioned that it was too hard... well it's not actually, but of course the enemy can counter it... unless he's out of power, and that it a perfect time to use grip ... Don't make grip easier to use... it will be whored to death on levels where you can fall down, like lightning is on every level.

 

- Someone suggested a player sontrolled parry system. I disagree. The way JO handles parry is perfect. If you have tried Rune where the player has to parry himself - you know that such a feature means only one thing... hack and slash chaos monkeys. No it is fine as it is. If someone just slashes blindly at you, stand still and keep your sword where his is... perhaps move a bit so he doesn't get behind you. If he continue this behaviour he will eventually fry himself on your saber. He will have learnt an important lesson, will be more exciting to duel in the future and will make the game more enjoyable for everyone.

[Moleculor]

Enhancement/Bug

 

When you do the patch, can you make the patcher make empty directories for things such as demos and everything else that needs it's own directory? They're missing unless you create them, and to create them you have to know exactly what to create. Having the patcher create them will make it easier for people to know what goes where.

[EekTheKat]

Originally posted by Canis_Aureus

 

- Someone suggested a player sontrolled parry system. I disagree. The way JO handles parry is perfect. If you have tried Rune where the player has to parry himself - you know that such a feature means only one thing... hack and slash chaos monkeys. No it is fine as it is. If someone just slashes blindly at you, stand still and keep your sword where his is... perhaps move a bit so he doesn't get behind you. If he continue this behaviour he will eventually fry himself on your saber. He will have learnt an important lesson, will be more exciting to duel in the future and will make the game more enjoyable for everyone. [/b]

 

No one is advocating that the current computer neutral stance auto-blocking system be removed.

 

People (myself included) just wanted more out of MP saber game after the incredibly fun fights with Tavion and the reborn on the SP game.

 

If swords go through one another it takes away from the counter system that exists in the SP game, which is basically if you swing at someone with a light swing while they take a heavy swing at you, there's a chance that your swing will be parried/riposted away by the force of his swing. Desann in the SP game does this quite often if you swing at him with a light swing.

 

Most people agree that the SP system is perfect, and what most people have been asking for on this board is for many of the same physics/behaviors in the SP system to carry over to the MP system.

 

I haven't had this much fun with a saber swordfighting game since the days of Bushido Blade on the PS1......I'd just like to see more of the depth that exists in the SP game brought over to the MP arena

[UgonDieFoo]

It seems that many people, including myself, are unhappy with many of the force powers and the balance between light and dark jedi, especially in multiplayer. I just want to give my 2 cents on how some of the issues could be remedied.

 

First, are the “unfair” powers on each side of the force.

 

-Force Drain

Definitely the most complained about dark power at the moment for many valid reasons. The biggest problem with it is that it drains an enemy’s force energy too quickly. It needs balancing, but not by reducing its range, removing its healing properties or anything like that. Such alterations would not do anything to address force drain’s real problem.

 

Instead, it should only drain any single opponent’s energy at the same rate as it does the caster’s for all levels.

 

If this change were made, drain would become like force heal, just for the dark side. It would no longer dominate in 1 on 1 duels because it wouldn't allow anybody to have any unfair advantage in force energy over their opponent. If the ratio of the drainer’s energy loss and the subject’s loss were 1:1, then it would no longer be possible for someone to repeatedly leave their opponent forceless using drain and then follow up with grip or lightning attacks. This is the only reasonable change that could be made without significantly altering drain or making it just plain crappy.

 

-Force Heal

Another complained about power, especially in 1 on 1 duels. It isn’t really all that unfair except perhaps at level 3, where it gives 50 health points at the cost of only 25% of your total force energy.

 

If force heal were to be changed, it should be something like:

 

Level 1: gives 12 health points

Level 2: gives 24 health points

Level 3: gives 36 health points

 

Something like this would be appropriate. That way, it would be changed enough to make a difference, but not enough to make it worthless.

 

Aside from these changes, I think it is necessary to improve some of the light side powers, especially protection and absorb. Many more people play as dark jedi rather than light jedi, and with good reason.

Dark jedi powers are designed for killing, which is fun, and light powers are designed for defense, which isn’t so glamorous. Also, the light side powers really are not adequate for defending against dark attacks. I think most people would agree with this. Below are some changes that I think would help equalize the balance of power.

 

-Force Absorb

This force power itself is pretty good. However, its biggest weakness is that it drains force too quickly, and it doesn’t absorb enough energy, even at the highest level. I think that there are two possible solutions that could make it more worthwhile. The first, and most obvious, would be to increase the amount of energy it absorbs. Right now, absorb really isn’t all that helpful unless an attacker is foolish enough to continually spray lighting or grip you while you have absorb active. Adjusting this could help.

 

Another problem with absorb is that anyone can tell when you are using it. Dark jedi can take advantage of this by just waiting until your force runs out, and then attacking you with lightning, grip or drain. However, there is a simple solution to this. It should be changed so that you only glow blue if you have absorb active AND if someone attempts to use dark powers on you, instead of always glowing blue. This would make it a much less easy task for a dark jedi to overwhelm a light jedi who has absorb, without making absorb too powerful.

 

-Force Protection

Again, this is a good force power, but it drains energy too quickly to be effective. Even at the highest level, protection wears off too easily especially if you are under attack. What’s worse is that this leaves you defenseless because you’ve used up all your force. One of two things should be done to improve it. Either the rate that it drains energy should be lowered significantly, or it should not continuously drain energy at all (like force sight or speed).

 

-Mind Trick

Commonly agreed to be the most useless of the light side powers because it’s so easily negated by force sight. What’s worse is that it is also the most expensive when it comes to force allocation points. It’s hard to say what could be done to improve the power itself, but at least it shouldn’t be the most expensive one available. It should be either the cheapest or second cheapest, and protection and absorb should be the most costly (provided they are improved to some degree).

 

-Dark Rage

A dark power not powerful enough? Not exactly. In fact, it’s quite powerful, but it just kills your life completely. Most people don’t touch it for this reason. Dark Rage drains you of up to 80 health points no matter what level it’s at. That means that at level one, you go from 100 health down to 20 in just 10 seconds. What good are enhanced damage, speed, and damage reduction benefits if you aren’t alive long enough to take advantage of them? No good at all. This could use some tinkering. Example:

 

Level 1: duration 10 seconds; drains you of up to 50 health; deactivates if your health reaches 1; same bonuses and after-effects

Level 2: duration 20 seconds; drains you of up to 60 health; deactivates if your health reaches 1; same bonuses and after-effects

Level 3: duration 30 seconds; drains you of up to 70 health; deactivates if your health reaches 1; same bonuses and after-effects

 

I think this would be pretty fair. The longer it lasts, the more health it costs you. And it doesn’t leave you on the brink of death, unless you’ve taken reasonable damage.

 

Well, I gave a lot more than two cents here. I hope my suggestions are considered and I encourage any and all responses in agreement or disagreement with what I’ve said, especially those backed with good reasons, as I have attempted to provide.

[TheLonelyBard]

I'd like to see an option for a slower paced duel type of gameplay, maybe a slider for speed. This would make a more technical lightsaber duel. Dodging and blocking attacks would be more precise and the feeling would be rewarding.

[Robinhood]

I keep having this thought of being able to have more control over the movement of the light-saber. instead of just clicking the mouse and the light-saber doing a predefined slashing i would like to be able to hold the mouse button down and be able to keep the sabre out stretched, then only the arms would move and i could move the blade around with direct mouse control. To slash i would just quickly swipe the mouse across the desk. Having full control would really enhance the game (for me anyway) then i could have some really really controlable 1 on 1 battles. But it might be a bit to much trouble to implament.

[Landorin]

Enhancements:

 

1) Include some more MP levels, if possible of known locations. I still miss levels from JK 1 such as Bespin (where Luke and Vader fight and Luke loses his arm, later on he jumps off that little bridge).

Also, I guess I'm not the only one especially missing the carbonite freezing chamber MP level (first seen in JK 1)

Yes, I know you probably did not make JK 1, but just to give you a comparison.

 

2) Include some more skins from (famous) characters such as Darth Vader, ice (?) trooper, AT-AT and AT-ST driver as it was done in JK 1, and maybe also some cute Leia Organa. ;D

 

3) !!!Most important!!!: fix/upgrade the netcode or whatever, the latency is unusually high. Other games (also shooters) work with much less latency than JK 2.

And no, I don't use a modem, I use an ADSL connection and I'm not hosting too many people (besides I also experience higher latency when joining any server than in other games).

Maybe there is not very much to fix or improve but a little bit would already do (and should be done if possible, I think).

 

4) The in-game-browser should set an icon to each server listed that requires a password. It is always a pain trying out every server and finally finding a server that is not password protected.

 

5) Server welcome message or message of the day might be a nice thing to have.

 

6) Not everybody knows about a /rate command. You should add some more connection types a player can choose when hosting or joining a server. 56k modem, ISDN, and cable won't really do. How about adding some more such as 128 kbit DSL and a few more up to 768 kbit DSL (since if all clients had the best setting for their connection the game would be much less lagged online)?

 

7) In some JK 1 levels there were obstacles laying around that you could throw on your enemy with force pull and do damage, maybe you could include something like that if that's possible?

 

Bug(s):

When a player with high latency (as it seems) joins, the pings for all clients raise to 999 ms, after a min or two all clients get kicked, it definately has to do with some special kind of client joining (because after I kicked that client out myself, the pings went down to "normal" again and the game continued).

 

Sincerely

Landorin

[Scarlet Widow]

Enhancement:

 

It would be nice if the "target" character box (in the upper right corner) in multiplayer was optional, the screen is so cluttered already with the status meters...in fact it would be nice if those were optional too. i like having everything off the screen, otherwise it kind of kills immersion.

 

Force energy drains much to easily and rises much to slow in multiplayer, i usually end up using all my energy from simpily jumping. If it could rise and drain at the exact same rate as in single player, i would be very happy.

 

If dynamic lighting could be coded into the engine that would be really, really great. Dynamic lighting is like a *must* for a StarWars game...it looks really odd when you're in a completly dark room and you shoot a gun or have your lightsaber drawn and theres no light emiting from it. i'm very surpirsed that Quake never had dynamic lighting coded into it....its practicly a nessesity...it can't be that difficult to accomplish, can it...?

 

Currently there arn't specific footsteps for specific surfaces, it dosen't feel right at all when i walk over metal or dirt and it sounds like stone or something...dirt and metal are the main ones that it needs really...its probably too late to fix that though, huh....

 

Bug:

 

When the lightsaber is equiped but disarmed and then switch to another weapon, it makes the sound of the blade disarming when it was disarmed in the first place.

[Bax]

BUG/ENHANCEMENT? I noticed when joining a server the client still loads stuff(weapons, etc) that are disabled server side. Isn't that a waste of memory?

[FWB]

Originally posted by UgonDieFoo

-Force Heal

Another complained about power, especially in 1 on 1 duels. It isn’t really all that unfair except perhaps at level 3, where it gives 50 health points at the cost of only 25% of your total force energy.

 

This makes up for the strong Dark side forces, such as lightening.

 

Another problem with absorb is that anyone can tell when you are using it. Dark jedi can take advantage of this by just waiting until your force runs out, and then attacking you with lightning, grip or drain. However, there is a simple solution to this. It should be changed so that you only glow blue if you have absorb active AND if someone attempts to use dark powers on you, instead of always glowing blue.

 

I agree with this one but I would get rid of the aura completely. Either that or decrease its cost.

 

-Mind Trick

Commonly agreed to be the most useless of the light side powers because it’s so easily negated by force sight.

 

I'd disagree. Unless you are playing on a Jedi Master server, you'll find that most players don't select Force Sight, they focus on other skill instead (I actually don't like Jedi Master servers and prefer games where your limited in what you can allocate). In addition, the Dark Jedi can't counter it. I think mind trick is perfect the way it is.

[Canis_Aureus]

EekTheKat I agree with you. The way saber fighting is handled in SP is perfect... I would like to see that in MP too.

 

- Mind Trick is underestimated. It is so useful for sneaking up behind an enemy and giving him a heavy slash in the back. Of course then you become visible... but he will be at a disadvantage after that heavi slash to the back. Besides I think it's a great power. When I play I never take force lightning... it's just boring IMO (the most powerful though). I like forces that add some jedi style to my play. My preferred power settings are Jedi Guardian/Knight. At these settings very few people will have the force sight.

 

- I wrote earlier that the the server should be able to enable/disable individual powers. I would like to see that the server could configure the maximum rank for each force. Lightning 1 is quite ok... not expensive and not too powerful... but at 3 it is just way too unbalanced.

 

- The only proble I have with heal is that you can move while healing. Fix that and it will be perfect.

[Terribly_Mauled]

Enhancement (Mission Pack)

 

This is me adding my two cents to the debate, and u guys at Raven need a break for sure after all the hard work you've done! But anyway, heres what I'd love to see a mission pack if it ever sees the light of day:

 

- New Saber fighting styles.

The ones in the game are great, but how about a bit of variety?

 

1. Lightsaber/blaster combo - Kyle has his saber in his right hand, and a blaster in his left. This is purely a saber defense mode - no saber fighting is possible in this stance, but you can use the saber to deflect weapons fire back, while also using your own blaster to fire. (Also, this stance would reflect Kyle's conflicted halves... both his favoured weapons at once huh? )

 

2. Duel Lightsaber combo - after defeating a saber wielding opponent, Kyle can pick up their saber and use it along with his own, one in each hand. FOr issues of balance, this stance is more offensive in its nature than defensive, and ideal for use against multiple saber wielding opponents. However, you are weaker defensively, and more prone to a quick death! It would incorporate a lot of spins to make greater use of both lightsabers, and when you use lightsaber throw only Kyle's personal saber returns, while the acquired one does not.

 

- Some large creatures to battle.

One thing I sorely missed for Jedi Outcast. There were no large beasties to best. Surely a Rancor (or two!) could be worked in there somehow? A Mission on Dathomir maybe?

 

-Let us meet Han Solo!

(please?)

 

-More multiplayer models

Its been said I know, but some more characters from all facets of the Star Wars universe would be great! Phantom Menace, Attack of Clones, Expanded universe - BRING EM ON!

 

But first, take a break! lol

[Chato]

and if ther was a second taunt for mp , one in which u can see ure character turning off his sabre and make things with it , like t jedi in SP do, or throwing it verticaly and spinning (u know what i mean ?) that would be cool

 

Excuse me if it was recommended before i didn't read all hte posts (lack of time)

 

bye

[Zodiac]

Originally posted by Morkath

the logitech mouse problem isnt a bug with jk2, its a bug from the q3 engine, one of the last pointreleases, the one that disabled the alt-tab'ing ability, always screws up some mice. It is easily rectified on your end, go to the logitech site and get the gamers patch.

 

there is no gamers patch at the logitech site.

[Demolisher]

Make camera options like distance, stiffness, and commands like looking around. I am really dissapointed that Raven didn't keep a lot of the customizablility that Heretic II had with 3rd person. I was hoping the game would be so I could make it feel like the way I played Heretic II. Also make it so you can see who is on a server and whether or not it's "for low pings only" or passworded.

 

And what is with having to press shift and ` to bring down the console??! For the last 6 years it's been just pressing ` for every Quake 1,2,3 engined game

[Moleculor]

BUG

 

For some odd reason, Heal isn't working on a couple of servers. Even if I'm standing there with my saber off and in a corner holding still, I still don't heal at all. Not even using the force_heal command in console.

 

Enhancement

 

Provide us with 'weapon 0' in MP games? Especially in the saber only ones.

[Scum]

BUGS

 

-In SP on some levels I have noticed that the texture flickers where two textures join. Supposedly this is fixed with 32-bit mode but this is not true (I have a GF2 Ultra). Specifically on Nar Shadaa (?) on the large flat platform the texture flickers on the wall opposite the hangar where Lando's ship is (the level where you must pump fuel into his ship).

 

-In SP on the mining level there is another way to get on top of the mining vehicles. As a vehicle leaves the room with the red flashing light, it is possible to run in and stand on the open doorway that leaves this room. Standing here leaves you safe from the damage from the room, although the player will suffer a small amount of damage from the doors as they try to close. Then all the player has to do is jump onto the vehicle as it leaves. I used this method to begin with as I was totally stuck and did not know what to do. It seemed strange at the time but I now realise the 'correct' way of getting on the vehicle.

 

-In MP when following the viewpoint of a character and they go into a saber lock, when trying to go back to free-look mode the camera screws up and moves away at an odd angle.

 

ENHANCEMENTS

 

-In SP, it can be incredibly difficult to kill an enemy with the E11 on alt-fire. Despite being at relatively close range. The laser bolts just seem to dodge around them. Also the hits don't seem to register at point-blank range.

 

-Lighting up walls and character with laser shots and other weapons would be nice

 

-Bot AI is questionable. They always use the same technique in saber battles: attack, run backwards for a bit, then run in. Is there no way to vary this? Sometimes they run backwards for ages.

 

-After someone wins a MP match their name should appear in a different colour or something for a better indication that the match is over and that person has won.

 

-As always, more maps and skins. We need more arena type maps for saber battles and the like. That circular platform on the Bespin Streets level is great, for example.

 

-More control over Force power options, and the ability to customise your character before entering a match.

 

-A whole new multiplayer game type for Light v Dark where specific skins and force abilities come into play. Objectives must be met a la UT Assault. This can be either implemented by you Raven guys or later in a mod by some Star Wars enthusiasts. See Penny Arcade and their comments for a more detailed rant And no, Storm Troopers and that guy with a white briefcase should not be allowed to wield a lightsaber

[Moleculor]

BUG

 

Lightsabers seem to go through people without hurting them in MP. Especially if the swing is a forward+strafe and they're behind you, or some other combination of directions that don't match up. (Like backwards when they're forwards... it doesn't matter if the saber goes through them, it's as if the damage only counts for the direction you're 'trying' to do it in).

[GrandMoffSmokin]

Originally posted by Zodiac

 

there is no gamers patch at the logitech site.

 

Yes, there is: http://www.logitech.com/cf/support/mousefiles_w98.cfm#3