Toa Tahu Posted July 19, 2003 Share Posted July 19, 2003 Hey guys!I've got an idea!What if the saber damage in JA made into the follows: Do you study physics?Anyone who does should know P for Power=Fd/t or Force * distance / time Therefore,force and distance,will be decided on the strength of the player model(for instance,reelo has better strength but slower speed) and time also.Therefore,it should all be balanced out. Blue stance will have weak force and distance but time is low,so the denominator is low,making it bigger.The opposite applies for red stance.Any suggestions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txa1265 Posted July 22, 2003 Share Posted July 22, 2003 Although it might not be explained in the same terms, that is basically what they have already done - blue is fast, short distance, weakest attack. Red is slow, long distance, strongest attack. Yellow is balance. I'm sure they used some type of algorithm to calc it out, but then needed to tweak it for the reality of gaming. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted July 22, 2003 Share Posted July 22, 2003 I don't think you need to be as complicated as all that to get effective lightsaber damage. Also, a system like that would have a big problem with lag. Suppose you take a swing, and due to lag the distance gets messed up. Then, even with light stance, you might get a fatal blow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txa1265 Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 Originally posted by Prime I don't think you need to be as complicated as all that to get effective lightsaber damage. Also, a system like that would have a big problem with lag. Suppose you take a swing, and due to lag the distance gets messed up. Then, even with light stance, you might get a fatal blow. ... or miss ... I was thinking [sP], where this are more determistic, but you are very much correct, especialy for [MP]. I think the whole think is the continued optimization of location determination, hit detection and damage allocation. I know they have done a lot with the first (they said it in an early interview), and I'm sure they've beeen tweaking the others. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emon Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 Blue actually makes a good deal of sense. Perhaps damage could be upped, but you have to remember that it's mostly flicks of the wrist or one handed swings, those don't do much damage. Red is almost perfect. Only thing is that it should be a slow windup then fast release. I once played an MP game that had a server side mod that did this. Or maybe it was client side and it was really small and just autodownloaded, I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reprehence Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 Red is almost perfect. Only thing is that it should be a slow windup then fast release. I agree - I wish red has faster in the swing - logically it should be since it cuts the deepest....but a game is a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txa1265 Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 Originally posted by Reprehence I agree - I wish red has faster in the swing - logically it should be since it cuts the deepest....but a game is a game. Agreed - and I think its' a balance thing as much as anything else. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boinga1 Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 I don't think normal physics really apply to lightsabers. I mean, Force=mass*acceleration, no? But a saber has no mass other than the hilt. Really, I thing they should all do roughly equal damage- red can knock aside defences, but blue can get in before red winds up and slash the enemy. However, if blue does like 20 damage, then there's no point, since the oncoming red slash will be fatal. I mean- it's a lightsaber. It kills on contact (basically). The difference in the saber styles should be in their ability to be blocked, rather than their damage. BUT they should all be blockable *cough cough The unblockable JO red stance cough cough*. Did this post make any sense? It probably didn't, did it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reprehence Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 If a lightsaber were a club your fisiks might be a complete picture. However your forgetting the sharpness or the heat of the blade. Generally blue stance has been connected with what Dooku did to Obi in the Ep II - i.e. quick slashes that don't cut through. Of course - the whole point really is that it's a game - so you end up with differences to make the game more interesting. You end up with the same scaling in the old space-sims (remember when people played space-sims?) - e.g. fast interceptors with little firepower and slow, plodding bombers with massive capital-ship-busting torpedoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaowei Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 this is a personal opinion Currently Red against Blue = entertaining. One has to time strikes and position to catch a quick opponent in the damage arc, the other has to hop in, do damage, hop out, but only on the Red's windup since, Blue strikes are easily blocked. Red against Red ~ entertaining. My gripe is with how people can change directions during a strike, it absolutely breaks the suspension of disbelief for me. But it kind of works in this game because of another thing - slow slashes. There should be slow windup, fast slash. Those two "minuses" work together quite ok in JO, though it looks more like a running backwards match, not sword combat. Blue against Blue = currently NOT entertaining. The strikes are too fast to intercept one another on windup. Both can block each other's strikes with ease, since the saber is positioned really defensively. People end up doing simultaneous damage all the time, it is a mad chicken fighting contest. The solution, borrowed from fighting games. Make fast style have less combo moves (~3), but combo moves should have almost no windup in between. After a combo, there should be a cooldown though. This is where one can intercept. If not intercepted, 4-5 blocked hits drain the blocking ability of the defender, and the last attack knocks away the defending saber, allowing a free hit or two. This should affect blocking of all styles. I think the existing damage model is allright. I would like to see the following changes though: -the player has to commit to a direction during the strike, so windup indicates your intention to the enemy -the player shouldn't be able to shift movement or aim direction during the actual strike -red strikes should have slow (faster than current) windup, short slash time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toa Tahu Posted July 25, 2003 Author Share Posted July 25, 2003 no,I said the mass of the model of the guy wielding the saber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 Originally posted by Emon Red is almost perfect. Only thing is that it should be a slow windup then fast release. I will throw my voice to the chorus of praise for this idea It certainly would be much more realistic... Originally posted by Reprehence However your forgetting the sharpness or the heat of the blade. As a Canon Nazi, it is my duty to inform you that lightsaber blades emit no heat Originally posted by Toa Tahu no,I said the mass of the model of the guy wielding the saber. This doesn't make any sense. The mass of the wielder only plays a small part of the force they can apply. Big != strong. Why should a flabby bastard like Reelo be able to hit harder than Kyle or Desann? The force that can be applied by the muscles is what matters here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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