Why I'd Rather Play Bots Than People...

[N3h3bkau]

Originally posted by KaiaSowapit

Nehebkau, again the point of this thread is not (was not) to debate "honor codes" - I am criticizing lousy attitudes and the tendency of players to abuse chat in game. I'll defend your right to keep/enforce "honor codes" on your server just as fiercely as I'd fight to keep that malarky off of mine (no disrespect intended).

 

Nor would I want to force you to uphold by beliefs of how a server should be run. Your money at work your rules. The only reason the honor code came up was because I was tieing it into rules. The only reason rules came up was because in some post prior to mine it was brough up how the person liked to run in and kill all with no regard, to me that sounded like they liked to disregard the rules of the server and I hate people that blatantly break the rules to have their type of "fun".

 

I don't know thats just me, I could be wrong.

[KaiaSowapit]

...like you have fought this guy for 2 minutes and suddenly, he turns his saber off and yells: "Saber down! You can't hurt me!"

This would piss me off bigtime.

 

Yes, it DOES happen and it IS annoying. I've seen all kinds of abuses of this nature, including chuckle-heads who will pop-up their chat windows in a moment's notice to avoid retribution after just attacking you. In my experience it's rampant in this community and if you haven't stumbled upon it yet, consider yourself quite fortunate.

 

The only reason rules came up was because in some post prior to mine it was brough up how the person liked to run in and kill all with no regard...

 

Yes, that's precisely how some of us interpret "Rules: Defeat your enemies to score points!"

 

1) Could work if you would stop trying for easy points and attacking people that are not hurting anyone by taking up a slot on the server.

 

Actually, if the server is at capacity you quite possibly ARE hurting some unlucky sod who'd rather be playing than idling and selfishly taking up space. And even if the server isn't full, you're tying up precious bandwidth (regardless of your ping) which believe it or not, can have a negative impact on other players.

 

2) Not everything has to be FFA this is why the "k" button was put in so that you could challenge players 1 vs 1.

 

True, but that's also why Raven included game types known as "duel" and "Power Duel." On my server, the CVAR "g_privateDuel" is set to "0" making the "k" button useless. And yes, that's the way I like it.

 

While I'm at it, let me reveal another option included in the game, it's the CVAR "g_saberRestrictForce." When activated (which it always is on my server), it restricts offensive Force powers (Grip, Lightning, Mind Trick, Push, etc.) to players who have LOWERED their sabers. That's right - you MUST lower your saber to use lightning. Therefore, if you lower your saber on my server, I'm going to assume you're about to do something nasty... so yeah, don't be surprised if I go out of my way to clobber you.

 

Cheap shots are never ok.

 

That's so relative, arbitrary and subjective it doesn't merit further discussion.

 

I'll close with one more comment, and urge all future posts to remain on topic...

 

It's called STAR WARS, not STAR TREK for a reason. Think about it.

[Luc Solar]

Argh. Not again. You don't know what you're talking about and you sure haven't read the posts you're replying to.

Please read the threads about this issue first and then reply.

 

Who said community? I was speaking of a single server not the whole world. Who's to say what rules are stupid? (refer to previous quote)

 

We are speking of the whole community. The attitude of players in general. And I can tell you what rules are stupid and what aren't. If you don't agree with my arguments, please tell me why and we'll see who wins. My argument against yours. That's how debating works. And once it is established that Rule X is in fact BAD, then Rule X should not be enforced anymore. Unless you want to be a prick, that is.

 

In other words - you can say: "sure, that rule sucks but I want to be a prick and enforce it anyways". But if you lose the debate, you can't insist on being the 'good guy' who enforces a good rule. It does not work that way. Keep your Honour Code but admit you're being an ass to the JA community.

 

This is up to the admin and players (If voting is allowed) This is not up to you, if multiple people vote in your favor then so much the better.

 

Isn't that just lovely. People can vote anyone off for any reason they want to. Could this feature be abused in any way? Perhaps by immature teenagers who want everyone to show them respect? Have you ever even played this game, because you don't seem to have the slightest clue about the "reality" online.

 

Again, it does work if you don't "flip out" everytime you see another player and feel the need to backstab, sneak up, or just plain strike the person while his saber is down.

 

Please read the thread FIRST. Then post. This "flipping out" you're talking about is actually the only thing you're SUPPOSED to do in a FFA game. You call that flipping out? Take a look at the screen when you log on to a server. What does it say about the rules of the game?

 

Learn some self control and attack people that are ready to fight, not just grab some easy points by attacking defense less players.

 

What on earth are you doing on a FFA server if you're not ready to fight? Are you saying that I must ask permission to make sure the opponent is willing to be shot at the moment? How long am I supposed to wait before attacking if he sais "sure, shoot me" so that it won't be a dishonourable type-kill? Or should I bow first? It's satrurday today... wasn't that double-bow day in teh Code Of honourz? So 2 bows is sufficient? Should I bow before and/or after I asked for permission to attack? Is there any freaking way I could PLAY the game without getting whined upon and kicked in this absurd mine field of silly made-up rules?

 

You people keep talking about "easy points" and "defensless players". It makes me sick. I don't care what the hell you're doing on the server. If you are in my way, I won't put my chat box up to ask if it's okay if I play a little just so that you can throw a thermal det in my face. If you log on to a FFA why don't you play? If seeing you're Jedi die is so horrible that you simply have to insult and kick people off the server....how about NOT PUTTING YOUR SABER DOWN or using spectator mode or better yet: not log on to the server at all!?

 

 

1) Could work if you would stop trying for easy points and attacking people that are not hurting anyone by taking up a slot on the server.

 

Easy points is not the issue. If you had read ANYTHING people have been posting you'd know that. They're not hurting anyone? Yes they are. They're kicking me off the server because my PLAYING THE GAME messes up their chatting session. Can you not see how absurd that is?

 

2) Not everything has to be FFA this is why the "k" button was put in so that you could challenge players 1 vs 1.

 

Not everything has to be FFA? How about if you could actually FFA in say... 1 out of 20 FFA servers? Is that too much to ask? Of course it is. All FFA servers should be chatrooms were noble jedi talk about noble stuff and insult & ban "lamers".

 

You can duel in a FFA, sure. WHY DON'T YOU USE IT THEN? Why do you insist on ruining the game for everyone else by walking around saber down whining? Oh and how about going to a duel

server or spec mode if you don't feel like "playing"?

 

3) Not everyone wants to invade the earth (Seeing how we have not explored the galaxy yet) most people join a server and everyone is playing "Honour code" style so they do the same, then some person comes in and go FFA and attacks them while they are watching a fight. Cheap shots are never ok.

 

No. Not everyone. Just most of them. Idiots forcing their Code upon me. Do you think anyone is complaining about the courteous guy who never whines and always obeys server rules?

 

And now you're giving me the "cheap shot/easy kill"-thing again. Please get a clue.

 

I used that term because some like it others don't how about we come up with a term that everyone can agree on?

 

How about "immature egoistic delirious jerk who seeks to ruin the fun of others and thinks that he really is a honourable skilled Jedi Master"

 

[/rant]

[Master William]

I like just relaxing and playing around in the maps...

I do duel and kill people.

 

As for you people who want to turn this into Ut2003 - stop it, you're ruining something most players are enjoying.

 

the honorists are like 80% of the community or something, they're bigger.

 

I think the ''don't spam a force/move'' rule sucks though. It's so unfair...

 

I'm fine with the others... I remember when I used to meditate on the bespin pad and other places in JK2 maps...

 

I loved those custom maps.

 

Luc Solar - you may start your quotes and flaming.

[Master William]

But Luc... You're kind of right...

In Counter-Strike people don't care if you're typing, they kill you.

Same in UT games - Quake games - etc.

 

I don't see why JA should be a special case.

I do love the honor stuff, I like relaxing more than running around in a FFA fight with 9 people in the same spot spamming katas and other leet tricks.

 

But I can understand why you think so, Luc...

 

Now let me slash you in game... Please?

[Luc Solar]

I don't really understand what you mean by referring to UT2003. Nobody is trying to turn JA into anything else than what it is...well, except for all the honour code people.

 

I'm all out of quotes and flames.

 

[mr. T voice]I pity the fool who still doesn't understand what I've been trying to say[/mr. T voice]

 

Everyone has the right to play a game they bought. Don't be a part of the plaque that ruined JO. Ditch the silly rules that exist only in your head and just play the damn game...who knows, it might actually be FUN.

 

EDIT: Feel free to slash me anytime, Master William.

[KaiaSowapit]

As for you people who want to turn this into Ut2003 - stop it, you're ruining something most players are enjoying.

 

I'll make you a deal: I won't try to turn Academy into Ut2003 if you don't try to turn it into mIRC.

 

the honorists are like 80% of the community or something, they're bigger.

 

What's the statistic on how many are thirteen year old boys obsessed with DragonBall Z?

 

Here's a proposal for "honor code" enthusiasts:

[*]ALWAYS play the "Light Side"

[*]NEVER use a red saber

[*]NEVER attack another "Light Sider"

[*]DON'T lower your guard around Sith/Dark Jedi

[*]NEVER lose your temper (i.e.: whine)

[*]Eat all your vegetables [/list=1]

Okay, the last one is optional, but in all seriousness the first five ARE authentic to the spirit of the movies and the role of being an "honorable" Jedi. I challenge anyone to argue with me on that.

 

Meanwhile, I'll continue to "role play" a Sith. If you don't like the way I play, GOOD... it means I'm in character!

[Master William]

Um, I kill anyone, and I don't whine, because it's just bad to do it.

 

''omg whinar stfu lol''

 

that's the kind of response I will get if I whine - which I did in my JK2 days.

 

But I understand you... Why should JA be a special case, when in all games you kill people who type or whatever.

 

I attack light/sith, no difference to me between them...

I also tend to change force sides, and therefore the color and look of my character.

 

I do have a ''dark side suit''

 

I hate Dragonball Z - (anime hater ) and I am turning 14 tomorrow.

 

Do any of you want to play? I'm bored.

[weiderudare]

Well, the honour code thing shows that JA users actually wants to do something else than just: "Stab, run, heal, grip, stab...."

I can see why certain players hate this code but why not do this the simple way: People who don't want the honour code play on their servers and vice versa.

If there really 80% of the users that like this code, why can't they as a majority play the game the way the want?

It seems that most of the codehaters are those people coming from Ut, Cs and other games that are pretty much: "Fire, run, reload, fire......"

Codehaters have fun killing people all the time.

Codelovers want to have a more easy way to the game, and maybe find some internetbuddies and walk from the computer thinking:"Wow, its really fun how nice these people are"

[Kurgan]

The problem isn't that the honor code "exists" (ie: that so many people "believe in" it), but rather that they think it is (or should be) universal.

 

 

These are the folks who join a server and then whine when their honor code is not followed and (if they can) vote kick people who violate their code.

 

In short, they harass people who don't adhere to their particular version of the 'code.'

 

That's what we so many of us object to. If they stayed in their own servers and clearly posted their rules on said servers it would be NO BIG DEAL. People can play how they want on their servers.

 

Its when they join public servers and shove it down other's throats that it goes too far.

 

 

And let's debate this WITHOUT flames, thanks. I have to keep reminding people, they get so angry over this (which can be understandable). Just realize there's no reason to level personal attacks against people on these forums. None. If you want to do that, do it someplace else.

[KaiaSowapit]

Well, the honour code thing shows that JA users actually wants to do something else than just: "Stab, run, heal, grip, stab...."

 

Not to sound like an ass, but that's precisely why LucasArts offers games such as "Star Wars Galaxies" and "Knights of the Old Republic." Like it or not, Academy is based on the Quake engine and by this very nature, inherently similar to other first-person shooters.

 

I can see why certain players hate this code but why not do this the simple way: People who don't want the honour code play on their servers and vice versa.

 

In an ideal world, you're absolutely right. Unfortunately as Kurgan pointed out, this isn't an ideal world. People migrate from server to server with little to no regard for what is acceptable behavior. Furthermore, the most brazen act as if it's their god-given right. Newsflash: the money you spent on Academy (assuming you didn't simply pirate it) guarantees you nothing more than a single-player experience - playing online is a bonus and a privilege. That's the underlying message of this thread, whether we agree on "honor codes" or not.

 

It seems that most of the codehaters are those people coming from Ut, Cs and other games that are pretty much: "Fire, run, reload, fire......"

 

I assure you, at least for me personally, that is NOT the case.

 

Codelovers want to have a more easy way to the game, and maybe find some internetbuddies and walk from the computer thinking:"Wow, its really fun how nice these people are"

 

Again, you're welcome to that opinion, though from my experience it's quite inaccurate. Take for example my buddy Lathain (MMXP); he'll spend a good majority of the time in-game clobbering me and anyone else in his path. Afterwards we'll discuss it (in AIM mind you) and have a good laugh. It's all good fun and still quite social. On the other hand, from my experience with "codelovers" and the various "clans" obsessed with it, I've found the majority of them to be fairly petty, egocentric and insecure people, preoccupied with establishing a distinct peking order of "respect" and "authority." I'm not trying to bad mouth them all... just share what I've witnessed for myself.

[weiderudare]

Well, as I see it, there will never come to an agreement between codelovers and codehaters..

I for one, can't even find a server! Where are all the servers? There are like 20 of them!

And how do you bow? By tapping C? Or what?

[KaiaSowapit]

Well, as I see it, there will never come to an agreement between codelovers and codehaters..

 

Maybe, maybe not... at the very least we can agree to disagree.

 

I'd be satisfied if we all simply agreed to respect each other's "house rules" when joining servers, but that's probably expecting too much.

 

I for one, can't even find a server! Where are all the servers? There are like 20 of them!

 

Darn annoying, ain't it? I don't know what the story is on this one... from what I've overheard it's a result of Raven having a fit over all the bootleg (illegal) copies of Jedi Academy floating around. All I can say is mine is legit yet still I can't see more than a dozen servers online at any one time. It fries my noodle too.

 

Till somebody comes to their senses, one alternative is to use "All Seeing Eye" software to browse for available servers.

 

And how do you bow? By tapping C? Or what?

 

There's actually a built-in emote for this in Academy... look at your setup menu to find it. Mind you it only works in Duel/PowerDuel... why I have no clue, though far be it for me to complain Raven didn't add more emotes to FFA.

 

In lieu of using the new bow emote, you can probably get away with the old standard of simply crouching and/or looking down to nod your head.

 

Just keep in mind that if you do it on my server... you're giving me an advantage I most likely won't pass up.

[Astrotoy7]

Yeah, running into online idiots can sour your take on the whole game, ruining the experience. When on your own, bots are cool, if you can get a few friends together and have a Lan game(as I often do) that is even more fun, and there is never any fighting or flaming any of that other BS....it's FUN ! Which was the original aim of the game, right ?!

 

MTFWBYA

[weiderudare]

LOL...

I also have a legit copy....Stupid everybody

I think that to stop people from using the saberdown thing, you could do that on Team servers, whenever someone gives up a fight(puts his saberdown) hes captured and will have to walk to the opposite teams "base"

I think this would make people think twice before putting their defense down.......

[Galadrielle]

I haven't read all the replies, but I think it boils down to this:

 

The person that hosts the server has the right to create any "rules" they want for people who wish to play on that server. If you want to play on that server, and you do not follow the rules, it follows you will be dealt with in any number of ways (hopefully a mature way, but that's a seperate topic).

 

If, however, you get on a server that has no rules, and out of habit expect certain common rules to be adhered to, you're in for a rude awakening. It's only fair that with no rules present, it's up to each individual if they want to agree to another individual's rules.

 

Personally I think if you join a FFA, you should be expected to fight at all times. I don't join a FFA to avoid certain players just because they're not in the mood to fight when our paths cross. You have plenty of time to change your profile when you're dead. Don't spawn next time you die so you can change such settings. But of course if a server has such a rule, I don't join it. Some people, however, will join it and blatantly ignore such rules. Therein lies the difference (and the problem) between some people.

[fatBastard()]

First there are a few statements I feel the need to comment on:

 

Originally posted by: Spider AL

I suppose some sad people play games to escape from life, because their life is sad. Therefore, they create all these silly, and quite frankly, dishonourable "codes of honour" that help them compensate for the fact that they're not really Jedi, even when they're pretending to be in a game. Ergh. Crush them all, that's what I say.

 

Nothing is lame, the only rule is "win". Get used to it.

Wow, talk about a bleak perspective on life. Please promise me you'll never try to play soccer or football or even baseball with your kids or they'll end up in the hospital due to your obsessive focus on winning rather than having fun

 

Originally posted by: CortoCG

Wait a minute. What damn rules are we talking about? I mean, if the game allows me to kill all my enemies by simply hitting the same button all the time, I will keep hitting that button unil no one else is left alive.

 

You can call me lame, noob, sucker, and bla bla bla, for I won't care. If THAT button was meant to kill players and killing players is the primary goal in the game, then I'd call LAME, NOOB, SUCKER, CHEAP (and everything in between) those players who don't use THAT freaking button.

So if I told you that by performing a certain action you could instantly wipe out every other player in the game ... you would do it without a second thought, right? Just like the ridiculous bunny-jumping (pardon me: strafe jumping to be correct ... I think) exploit in Quake based games? Or the shooting through virtually ANY material in Counter Strike or whatever bug, exploit, inconsistency, you name it, can be found in basically every game engine (ALL programs contain errors ... it is only a question of how many and how critical they are).

 

I do not mean to pick on you specifically CortoCG, but your opinion (if I interpreted it correctly that is) is one I've encoutered so many times before. "If it is in the game then why not use it?" Erm ... because it ruins the game?

 

This was not originally a thread about exploits or bugs, so I'll try not to turn it into one, but I'll stake my good name and reputation (What do you mean: "What reputation?" ) on the claim that basically every single exploiter/grief player has used the same argument: "It's in the game, so use it" or "If I can do it, you can just learn to do it yourself" or "If you don't like it, you can just go somewhere else.".

 

Now, I think both sides of the debat in this thread are right ... and both sides are wrong:

 

Yes, it IS stupid and unbecoming to start spewing foulness if you get killed (be it by a cheap shot or not).

Yes, it IS a waste of server space to log onto a server only to chat away about the when and the how a date with Jennifer Lopez (I'll rather shoot myself than stoop to calling her J-Lo) is to take place.

Yes, it IS abusing/exploiting the "rules" to enter chat mode or turn off your saber only to avoid getting wacked.

 

BUT ...

 

Orginally posted by: KaiaSowapit

On my server, the CVAR "g_privateDuel" is set to "0" making the "k" button useless. And yes, that's the way I like it.

 

While I'm at it, let me reveal another option included in the game, it's the CVAR "g_saberRestrictForce." When activated (which it always is on my server), it restricts offensive Force powers (Grip, Lightning, Mind Trick, Push, etc.) to players who have LOWERED their sabers. That's right - you MUST lower your saber to use lightning. Therefore, if you lower your saber on my server, I'm going to assume you're about to do something nasty... so yeah, don't be surprised if I go out of my way to clobber you.

Let me start off by apologizing for "misquoting" you KaiaSowapit. You are not the one complaining about the "honor code", but your comment is just what I need to make a point .

 

Anyway, does anyone know the CVAR for stopping people shooting other people while they are chatting? Or when their saber is off? No? Well, it is easy to "enforce" your own rules when they can be set by server commands, like exluding certain force powers/weapons or removing the option to challenge others to a duel, etc, but it's not quite so easy when you're trying to promote an certain way of behavior or "conduct" if you like, hence the whole concept of an honor code.

 

If I'm in the mood for a good game of fast paced, gun blazing, multiplayer action, then what are my alternatives? I can play Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Enemy Territores, CounterStrike, Medal of Honor, BattleField 1942, Unreal Tournament 2003, Quake3 ... in fact there are dozens of games to choose from. Now, if I'm in the mood for some great, non-balistic, close encounter multiplayer action with tons of cool moves and a strong element of outsmarting your opponent (rather than who has the quickest reflexes), I can just go play ... what? As far as I know my choices consist of JA and JO (and to a certain degree Rune, but it had a lot less moves). This is the one fact that most of the "codehaters" (as weiderudare so nicely put it) fail to realize: There are so many other games where one can blast away as one pleases, but only JA/JO where one can combat the enemies with a blade (be it of steel or light). The reference to KotOR is invalid since it is a singleplayer game and so is the reference to SW Galaxies since it utilizes the typical MMORPG "gameplay" where you observe the action instead of taking part in it.

 

I am of course making a huge assumption by siding "codehaters" with gun wielders and "codelovers" with saberists, but more often than not, this assumption seems to be correct.

 

I don't mind admitting that I prefer to use a light saber when I play JO/JA, be it in singleplayer or multiplayer mode, and I also don't mind admitting that I usually just use absorb in order to neutralize an opponents force power use so I can focus on swinging the saber. If I want to play around with guns I go play ET or BF1942, but to me, and apparently to a lot of other people too, the embodiment of the Star Wars universe is the light saber. I've already stated that this does not entitle me to run around acting like a spoiled brat and whine all the time ... but it would also be nice if both sides would speak the acronym FFA out loud: Free For All. Not just "FREE to do as you please no matter what the other players say or who you piss off". Not just "this and this rule applies to ALL of you too".

 

FREE FOR ALL. Is it really so hard to refrain from ruining an otherwise great game for other people by being/acting like an ass?

[Luc Solar]

This was my sig a while back:

 

Luc's code of honour: Don't be an ass.

 

That's all it takes, really >> Don't be an ass. But "unfortunately" we do have 5-14 year-olds playing this game. We got Star Wars nerds and people with an IQ below 80. We got dumb, insecure egoistic jerks playing the game.

 

What I'm asking is: quit bitching and play the game. If no-one whines, everything is just fine. Whining is the enemy. If you have a silly code of honour, go ahead and live by it but don't whine when other's don't. It's that simple.

 

Don't be an ass. Don't whine.

[GoJiTa]

So if I told you that by performing a certain action you could instantly wipe out every other player in the game ... you would do it without a second thought, right? Just like the ridiculous bunny-jumping (pardon me: strafe jumping to be correct ... I think) exploit in Quake based games? Or the shooting through virtually ANY material in Counter Strike or whatever bug, exploit, inconsistency, you name it, can be found in basically every game engine (ALL programs contain errors ... it is only a question of how many and how critical they are).

Strafe jumping was intentionally programmed into both the quake 2 and quake 3 engine, it was initially a 'bug' in quake 1 but it was so popular with fans of the game that ID software decided to keep it in. Calling it an exploit or rediculous just makes you totally ignorant, god knows why you display hostility towards this perfectly legitimate technique, I dread to think what else is an 'exploit' in your book.

 

 

Luc Solar has the perfect player attitude with this quote:

 

What I'm asking is: quit bitching and play the game. If no-one whines, everything is just fine. Whining is the enemy. If you have a silly code of honour, go ahead and live by it but don't whine when other's don't. It's that simple.

This game so badly needs more people who think this way.

[KaiaSowapit]

Anyway, does anyone know the CVAR for stopping people shooting other people while they are chatting?

 

I don't know of a CVAR, but I can think of a few commands: team spectator, disconnect, and quit. In all seriousness, I'm not defending the "nobility" of whacking someone with their chat window up, but let's not confuse this game with a chat utility/application. If your ego just can't stand the thought of someone taking advantage of you whilst your guard is down, then those are your most viable options.

 

I think it's ironic (and hypocritical) that those whom condemn others as "lamers" for being so obsessed with winning points rather than just having "fun" are also the most distressed and outspoken about losing points to these so-called "lamers." Honestly folks, you can't have it both ways.

 

Now, if I'm in the mood for some great, non-balistic, close encounter multiplayer action with tons of cool moves and a strong element of outsmarting your opponent (rather than who has the quickest reflexes), I can just go play ... what?

 

Let's see... chess? How bout poker? Off the top of my head, those are what come to mind if you want to eliminate reflexes from the equation. Not to sound pompous, but as someone old enough to have seen Star Wars on opening night in '77, I'm fairly confident reflexes have as much to do with the average teenager whoopin' me in Academy as being "outsmarted."

 

I am of course making a huge assumption by siding "codehaters" with gun wielders and "codelovers" with saberists, but more often than not, this assumption seems to be correct.

 

Yes you are making a huge assumption. But nevertheless, you are aware there are quite a few "saber-only" even "saber-only, no Force" servers available for you to play on, aren't you? And if one-on-one action is more your bag, there's also plenty of "Duel" servers to choose from. Where's the problem?

 

And yes the acronym is "Free For All." And the only predetermined, Raven-approved (and thusly Lucas-approved) rule I'm aware of is "Defeat your enemies to score points!" There's no mention of "Defeat your enemies, but bow first..." or "Defeat your enemies unless they've disabled their saber or have their chat window up..."

 

But I digress. Really our opinions about "honor codes" are not relevant to the spirit of this thread.

 

You'd like people to speak the acronym FFA out loud. I'd like more people to say to themselves "it's just a game."

 

Allow me cite another example:

 

One day I'm on my server, and some "fellow" is handily beating everyone else by at least a margin of six to one (no exaggeration, literally). That said, every time someone was lucky enough to clock him one (which was infrequent), he'd exclaim "BULL****!!!" (again, no exaggeration, literally).

 

After about ninety minutes of this and at least three matches in his favor, I had the nerve to say, "golly, for someone winning you sure have a lousy attitude." His deluge of "comebacks" aren't fit to repeat in this forum, but I'm sure if you use your imagination you can guess at what they were.

 

Fittingly, his distraction in coming up with new ways of insulting my lineage, sexual adequacy and political affiliation gave someone else the opportunity to win that particular match (no it wasn't me, but that's beside the point). This led to a whole new batch of vulgarities and ultimately I had to kick him off the server.

 

An extreme example, but this is EXACTLY the kind of pinhead that makes the game unbearable at times.

[fatBastard()]

Originally posted by: vert1go

Strafe jumping was intentionally programmed into both the quake 2 and quake 3 engine, it was initially a 'bug' in quake 1 but it was so popular with fans of the game that ID software decided to keep it in. Calling it an exploit or rediculous just makes you totally ignorant, god knows why you display hostility towards this perfectly legitimate technique, I dread to think what else is an 'exploit' in your book.

And this attitude doesn't fall into the: "It's in the game, so use it" category?

 

If I pick up a pile of dog droppings, put it on a plate, serve it at a dinner party as being chocolate pudding and the guests like it, does that mean that the dog droppings has magically been transformed into chocolate pudding? No my friend, not by a long shot. Just because Id chose to let the bug remain in the engine, it is still a bug.

 

Do you honestly believe it is intentional that you can strafe jump faster than a regularly player can run with force speed on level 3 in a saber only CTY (Capture the Ysalami) match in JO? (i.e. you can't catch the strafe jumper in any way). How about the multitude of different ways that have been tried to stop the bunny jumping problem in CS ... they did that just for the hell of it?

 

And now ...

 

Originally posted by: KaiaSowapit

Let's see... chess? How bout poker? Off the top of my head, those are what come to mind if you want to eliminate reflexes from the equation.

Touché. Well, that serves me right for using one of your quotes out of context:rolleyes: What I MEANT to say (and I suspect you know this already) was of course: "Now, if I'm in the mood for some great, non-balistic, close encounter MELEE multiplayer action with tons of cool moves and a strong element of outsmarting your opponent (rather than who has the quickest reflexes), I can just go play ... what?"

 

Originally posted by: KaiaSowapit

And if one-on-one action is more your bag, there's also plenty of "Duel" servers to choose from. Where's the problem?

The problem is that I actually want to PLAY the game, not sit around watching other people play from anything between 5-30 minutes before I get the chance to fight for 30 seconds (or a few minutes if I win a couple of rounds) and then go back to watching all over again. Though only a single duel challenge can take place at a time in FFA (and none on your server ), there is a chance that other equally minded players want to "duel", even if a challenge has not been made. This is not saying that I would like for everyone to just wait their turn to duel (if you're willing to wait then I agree that you should go to a duel server) and if that is what the others are doing then I'll rather get my ass served to me while trying to defeat a grip spammer or a "ForceQuake" player (that one time in 5 or 10 that I actually get him is a lot more sweet than the other 4-9 times are sour )

 

Originally posted by: KaiaSowapit

... you are aware there are quite a few "saber-only" even "saber-only, no Force" servers available for you to play on, aren't you?

Yes well, I have to admit that (probably) due to the weird master server thingy I can find less than a handful of servers were the ping is even halfway decent, so right now my choices are rather limited. In theory you are correct of course

 

Regarding your example about the complete and utter ass, well I couldn't agree with you more. There is no defense/reason for behavior like that. It doesn't matter whether you are abusing the "honor code" conduct to avoid getting your heinie roasted or you're abusing the option to chat by spewing unpleasantries all over the place or whatever else you can think of that will stop other people from having fun (and that includes accusing others of cheating/exploiting simply because they are better than you).

[KaiaSowapit]

Touché. Well, that serves me right for using one of your quotes out of context What I MEANT to say (and I suspect you know this already) was of course: "Now, if I'm in the mood for some great, non-balistic, close encounter MELEE multiplayer action with tons of cool moves and a strong element of outsmarting your opponent (rather than who has the quickest reflexes), I can just go play ... what?"

 

To the best of my knowledge... nothing. Even with "honor codes" JK2 & Academy ain't it. But should you stumble onto something, let me know 'cause it sounds fun!

 

The problem is that I actually want to PLAY the game, not sit around watching other people...

 

That precisely sums up how I feel about "honor codes." I wanna get in and start playing, rather than sit and wait around for some nitwit to decide he/she is finally ready to start fighting. At least on a Duel server, you know when your turn is up, the gloves are off.

 

Nothing is more frustrating than joining my own server to find a couple of nincompoops trying to bully/brainwash everyone else into believing that attacking someone with their saber down is a big no-no (some even attempt to turn the server into a big, stupid clan-recruitment site). And it's even more annoying when they turn around and try to accuse me of being a "n00b/lamer" for saying those rules don't apply here.

 

Some are even so ignorant they have the nerve to "remind" me that because it's a "public" server, I don't have the right to tell them how to behave. Frankly, I don't know where these idiots got the impression public server = public service.

 

BTW, remind me to politely turn down the pudding if I'm ever invited to one of your dinner parties.

[GoJiTa]

Do you honestly believe it is intentional that you can strafe jump faster than a regularly player can run with force speed on level 3 in a saber only CTY (Capture the Ysalami) match in JO? (i.e. you can't catch the strafe jumper in any way). How about the multitude of different ways that have been tried to stop the bunny jumping problem in CS ... they did that just for the hell of it?

This game was made using the quake 3 arena engine.. strafe jumping was intentionally programmed into the quake 3 engine by ID software, the creators of the engine. If Raven did not want people to strafe jump, then guess what... they would of programmed it out, just like Medal of Honor, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Enemy Territory, just to name a few examples where the developers removed the ability to strafe jump, all games based on the quake 3 engine, just like jk2/jka.

 

Did Raven remove the ability to strafe jump in multiplayer? No they didn't, although they CERTAINLY could have because if you didn't notice.. in Jedi Academy Singe Player, you cannot strafe jump. (However you can still circle jump to an extent )

 

As for your example of someone with no force out strafe-jumping someone running with force speed, well.. yeah, is that so surprising? Running without jumping results in a fixed speed, that speed can never be exceeded. Strafe jumping has no speed limit, each jump results in acceleration, so of course someone strafe jumping will eventually accelerate to being faster than someone just running at a constant speed. But if the person with force speed started strafe jumping (which unless they are newbie they will) they will effortlessly catch the forceless strafe jumper.

 

So yes, it is most obviously intentional, because if it was not intended then strafe jumping would have been coded out. This is obvious when you look at it from an objective stance, rather than the way you come across which is: You hate strafe jumping and therefore cannot accept it's presence in the game so therefore it must be a bug/exploit or some such nonsense.

 

It's in the game, it was left there intentionally, deal with it or don't play.

[g//anarki]

Originally posted by vert1go

This game was made using the quake 3 arena engine.. strafe jumping was intentionally programmed into the quake 3 engine by ID software, the creators of the engine. If Raven did not want people to strafe jump, then guess what... they would of programmed it out, just like Medal of Honor, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Enemy Territory, just to name a few examples where the developers removed the ability to strafe jump, all games based on the quake 3 engine, just like jk2/jka.

 

Did Raven remove the ability to strafe jump in multiplayer? No they didn't, although they CERTAINLY could have because if you didn't notice.. in Jedi Academy Singe Player, you cannot strafe jump. (However you can still circle jump to an extent )

 

As for your example of someone with no force out strafe-jumping someone running with force speed, well.. yeah, is that so surprising? Running without jumping results in a fixed speed, that speed can never be exceeded. Strafe jumping has no speed limit, each jump results in acceleration, so of course someone strafe jumping will eventually accelerate to being faster than someone just running at a constant speed. But if the person with force speed started strafe jumping (which unless they are newbie they will) they will effortlessly catch the forceless strafe jumper.

 

So yes, it is most obviously intentional, because if it was not intended then strafe jumping would have been coded out. This is obvious when you look at it from an objective stance, rather than the way you come across which is: You hate strafe jumping and therefore cannot accept it's presence in the game so therefore it must be a bug/exploit or some such nonsense.

 

It's in the game, it was left there intentionally, deal with it or don't play.

 

Actually, I believe there are ways to strafe-jump in ET and RtCW (I can confirm that you can in ET, and probably RtCW since ET was based off of RtCW). But MoH had it coded out. So yes, it was intended to be in the game.

 

JA in fact made it easier to strafe-jump as opposed to JO.

[GoJiTa]

Originally posted by g//plaZma

Actually, I believe there are ways to strafe-jump in ET and RtCW (I can confirm that you can in ET, and probably RtCW since ET was based off of RtCW). But MoH had it coded out. So yes, it was intended to be in the game.

 

JA in fact made it easier to strafe-jump as opposed to JO.

Yeah I know what you mean, in rtcw/et you can use strafe jumping on slanted surfaces and also perform connected circle-jumps to travel faster than normal, also you can *sort of* use overbounce'esque jumps hehe, but not to quake3's extent, and it normally ends up giving fall damage and stopping you instantly. I was more referring really to the original quake style of strafe jumping, which as you know is much different.

 

Also I agree about the easier strafe jumping in jka, it still feels incredibly floaty though, kind of wish they would adopt a similar jumping feel to the way quake3's is.

 

 

(edited)