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Realistic saber duels


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The thing is that the movement of both the character and the sabre are controlled by one thing, the mouse, with a change in position(left, right, forward, backward, up, down) with the key-pad.

 

We've only got two hands!

You could get some quite advanced fighting if both people were standing still in front of each other(using some specially designed engine)

 

And btw, does KOTOR use the Q3 engine?

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Originally posted by Remirol Nacnud

And btw, does KOTOR use the Q3 engine?

KOTOR is the other end of the spectrum when it comes to saber combat. It is based entirely on programmed rules and the moves are scripted. All the player does is give commands for the character to execute. They have not control over where to swing and so on.

 

And thus it is more or less irrelavent to how JA does combat :)

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Originally posted by Prime

KOTOR is the other end of the spectrum when it comes to saber combat. It is based entirely on programmed rules and the moves are scripted. All the player does is give commands for the character to execute. They have not control over where to swing and so on.

 

And thus it is more or less irrelavent to how JA does combat :)

hhhhmmmmm, that's....uh......interesting.

And there's no demo, so I can't tell if I'll actually like that style.

hhhhhmmm, for that to be ANY good, there'd better be a lot of scripted moves.....

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they could try some sort of target locking. Like in the Zelda games for Nintendo n64. That would realy make it kinda easy to make those saberduels to seem very realistic. It worked very well i matrix, reloaded. Buffy the vampire slayer for xbox. So it can be done mutch better, no doubt. So that is a realy good challenge for you modding experts out there.

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Originally posted by mtropolis

they could try some sort of target locking. Like in the Zelda games for Nintendo n64. That would realy make it kinda easy to make those saberduels to seem very realistic. It worked very well i matrix, reloaded. Buffy the vampire slayer for xbox. So it can be done mutch better, no doubt. So that is a realy good challenge for you modding experts out there.

I'm planning on implimenting that for MotF.
Originally posted by mtropolis

So the project one guy mentioned, open jedi something. It sounded great. Lookin forward to try that out :D

MotF is the saber combat modification mod. OJP (Open Jedi Project) is the development platform mod I'm also working on. Some of the cooler parts of MotF will be in OJP but they probably won't be turned on by default.

 

I hope that makes sense. :)

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Originally posted by razorace

I'm planning on implimenting that for MotF.MotF is the saber combat modification mod. OJP (Open Jedi Project) is the development platform mod I'm also working on. Some of the cooler parts of MotF will be in OJP but they probably won't be turned on by default.

 

I hope that makes sense. :)

 

Im realy looking forward to try that out! Both of them. I did try the motf for JA actually. Way better than the original setup. I realy loved the dodge function. Since a jedi realy should be able to sence a shot from behind. That was some good work. Keep it up!!!

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What I think we need is the ability to choose when you block and when you attack. The problem with Jedi Knight is defense is automatic and poor because of it. The player should be making a consious choose to go offensive or defensive. The only problem with MOTF is it still depends of purely automatic defenses(like dodging). Sometimes this is bad because you could be in the middle of an attack and your character could go into a full dodge. Although blocking saber blades or blasters will never be fully controlled by the player(not with mouse and keyboard anyways) we should at least have control over weather you attacking or defending.

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If I'm not mistaken, KOTOR uses a modified Baldur's Gate 2 engine...

 

I'm looking forward to trying the PC version when it comes out. Hopefully they'll optimize the interface and take advantage of the superior power of modern PC's and not just do a straight console port.

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originally posted by Kurgan:

I'm looking forward to trying the PC version when it comes out. Hopefully they'll optimize the interface and take advantage of the superior power of modern PC's and not just do a straight console port.

 

I read in a preview of KOTOR that they're going to add more movies, items and locations in the PC version. I think the graphics may have been improved as well.

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If I'm not mistaken, KOTOR uses a modified Baldur's Gate 2 engine...

 

I think it's the Neverwinter Nights Engine. Baldurs Gate 2 used the (improved) engine of Baldurs Gate 1 and was still in 2D. Either Way, fights will probably be managed by the computer, leaving you nothing but the choices of a fighting style and some special moves.

Not a bad concept for a RPG but nothing one could compare to a FPS like JA.

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Originally posted by JediLiberator

What I think we need is the ability to choose when you block and when you attack. The problem with Jedi Knight is defense is automatic and poor because of it.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I strongly disagree. If defense in multiplayer wasn't automatic, players with the lowest ping would dominate the game. IMHO, bandwidth already plays far too significant a role in online gaming, frequently more so than skill. I'm afraid what you're suggesting would radically unbalance the playing field even further. Though in theory I understand where you are coming from, in practice we need automatic defense, simply because of server latency.

 

As for "realistic" saber duels... I'm not entirely thrilled with the current system (and have thoughts on how it could potentially be improved), however for reasons such as Tsaya mentioned, it's incredibly unlikely we'll ever see something as authentic as the movies. There's only so much you can do with a mouse and keyboard. Adding more animations might make for nicer eye candy, but at the end of the day, someone still won't be satisfied.

 

Ultimate "realism" means Luke never dies and no one ever respawns. That doesn't sound like much of a game to me.

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Originally posted by Master William

We couldn't get any more obvious! We're talking about the sabers hitting, not THAT kind of stuff. :rolleyes::p

Sabers could be hitting all the time, but if it's only for a fraction of a second and your ping sucks, you'd never know about it. Unless you're playing locally, on a LAN or Single Player, animation will always be a bit "twitchy" - that's the nature of online gaming.

 

Try to appreciate you're asking a lot from current technology. At least three computers (yours, the server and your opponent) have to detect, calculate and share data via the internet about some fairly sophisticated collision detection (not to mention everything else going on in the game world)... and all in damn-near REAL TIME.

 

Even if you ARE playing locally, if your hardware isn't up to snuff and you drop some frames you STILL might not see the eye candy you're hoping for.

 

Reread Tsaya's comments. He makes some very valid points. I too am disappointed that dueling is as chaotic as it is, but to some degree we just have to live with it.

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Originally posted by IG-64

i play sp and duals seem a little wild for me. if they just spent a little time on programming a locking system so the sabers would connect it would be greatly appreciated

If you want to see sabers connect more easily, you could always slow down the saber animations. There is a cvar to do it...
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just to clarify my point about defense and attack ill say this. Im not saying you should control which way the saber moves to block a strike or a shot from a blaster. Basically Im saying have the second button on the mouse be the one you hold down when you want to block. Granted you may still end up needing some authomatic defense for blaster fire, but the problem I see is blocking enemy sabers is impossible. The way the game works forces you to go purely offensive with the saber, which isn't how swordplay works. And on another note, if the next game in JK series is sp and has a realistic way of letting you wield the lightsaber I'd be just fine with that.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have been working very hard on getting a realistic saber server up. I currently admin the darkmatter public server and have set the server up with the following options:

Force=on jedi knight no lighning or mind trick

Wepaons= limited I got rid of spamming weapons and am considering getting rid of weapons alltogether

melee attacks are on and let you do throws etc. tricky to master though.

 

here are some sever settings

g_saberLockFactor 20

g_saberlocking 1

g_debugmelee 1

g_saberdamagescale 2

 

please stop by and offer feedback. any suggestions would be appreciated

server info http://www.planethaven.net/jediacademy

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Bah Humbug ! The more realistic anything becomes, the more boring it can potentially get ! I like the lightning speed of JA.

 

The moves in the films are choreographed, like Nick Gillard(fight co-ord)explains in one of the webdocs for TPM, "each move is a check" and that is the only possible move you could do to counter the opponents move. If you stuck to this rigidly when making a game, you'd end up with something turn-based for gods sake !!

 

But if all you need is more saberlocks to make you feel "real" then console it in man !

 

MTFBWYA

 

**dont forget to have realsiticcombat on, and dismember probabilities at max. (that makes things hard enough as it is!)

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