Tyrion Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 I'll just put two different sides in this post for now- Christianity and Atheism/evolutionism. (Note, heavy pessimism) If you believe in God and Heaven, then what's the point to try to live on Earth? Modern Earth is a very strifeful place(and afterall, it has to be worst than paradise..i.e. Heaven), and there doesnt doesnt seem to be much point in striving to survive. I mean, all modern medicene does to us right now is prolong the time until we go to paradise, right? And any marks we leave on the world will surely be destroyed after End of Days, right? So why are murderers branded evil, when all that they're doing is getting us to heaven faster? If you dont believe in God, then what's the point to live? We'll die eventually, so this is just a pointless existence. Any offspring we might have will be wiped clean at a nuclear war, super nova of the sun, implosion of the sun, natural selection, ect. Both sides- give your reasons. Winner gets to meet thier maker sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wassup Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 I'd like to first point out that I'm an atheist. I was greatly moved by the film "The Shawshank Redemption", about a extremely intelligent man who was wrongly convicted of a crime and thrown into a prison he cannot have any hope of getting out of. He could have just commited suicide, but he never let go of the one hope that kept him from doing that: he was innocent. It all came to a choice for him (as quoted from the movie): "Get busy living, or get busy dying." I believe in what that emphasizes. I feel an urge to do something to improve the existence that I have, to leave a legacy. If it doesn't work out the way I planned it to be, it doesn't hurt to at least try. Sure, my physical body will cease to exist one day, but by striving to better my current life, I can hope that I will benefit myself in my life and that my life's legacy will continue to benefit others (my descendants) and the world forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elijah Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 THE OPINIONS BELOW, ARE MINE, YOU CAN TAKE THEM OR LEAVE THEM *Ahem* Originally posted by Tyrion If you believe in God and Heaven, then what's the point to try to live on Earth? Modern Earth is a very strifeful place(and afterall, it has to be worst than paradise..i.e. Heaven), and there doesnt doesnt seem to be much point in striving to survive. As Christians, we believe (as Christ told us) to, "go forth into all the nations and make disciples of many". Our goal as Christians, is not (as some believe) to change everyone, but to be the change we wish to see in the world... It’s been said, that the #1 cause of atheism in the world today, is Christianity... which obviously shows we are failing... My goal in life, is to share the love that I have found in Christ… I have seen some tough things in my short life, and I’ve been through some times and most people would not wish to go through… Christ is the only thing I have ever found, that can easy my pain, and give me joy. What is worth living for? I must ask, what is worth dieing for? I'm not sure who said it, but it, but it goes like so, "You have not found something worth living for, until you have found something worth dieing for." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homuncul Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 If you dont believe in God, then what's the point to live? We'll die eventually, so this is just a pointless existence. Any offspring we might have will be wiped clean at a nuclear war, super nova of the sun, implosion of the sun, natural selection, ect. Existential philosophy is not the last one to have been developed. There are numbers upon numbers of great works on that matter. And as you ask of opinions, I would post mine. It's quite simple, though I haven't decided yet Well, there are 2 aspects of it: biological and emotional. First is that information in our genes "wants" to have inheritence and therefore continue existing. Why it "wants"? I guess the answer is that it was the property that helped that info to dominate other information languages as there existed many at the dawn of life. Those that didn't have such a property could not sustain themselves for a long time and died or were consumed by others. We can't neglect this information, at least not now, so partly perhaps we are not in control of justifying our point for living. The pointless of existence (aka awareness of existence) or inevitability of death is what makes us different from animals. I'd say that our civilization is in that way forever bound to the everdignity with which we treat our dead, and with that firstly THE human civilization is difined. Our consciousness with it's emotions is what mostly effect our justification of the problem (which is objectively only in our head and nowhere else). Animals don't care about living or dying. We do. We 're afraid to not exist, which perhaps the most ridiculous matter to comprehend for what is existence to us but the ability to feel. Take that ability from us and we're nothing (Though "nothing" can be questioned here also to be existent or not). A man in perfect sensory isolation feels nothing, has no data to interpret, has no purpose for living. It doesn't mean though, like in Berkeley idealism, that he doesn't exist if not by the idea of god. At least I'm not agreed with it as with any idealism. I guess I'd be spet in to my face with "one can't disprove solipsism (or idealism)" again . Can't fight these things here so please don't torture me Understanding is much more different from knowing which could also have relevance here. We have this ability to understand, animals don't (mostly). In that context the everlasting "I think therefore I exist" has sense. But here we face the obvious problem of induction: if we're used to justify things, we must generalize here and so existence MUST also have such justification, such purpose, such meaning. But this is so untrue about generalizing in principle and this is not my philosophy and ultimately I'm not agreed with it. It's just too hard for many of us to face it. We MUST NOT neccesarily justify our existence or find ultimate meanings of it. It would be wonderful to know one and there's nothing more to it. Meaning itself is only a human concept. Reality has no human emotions to care whether life has a meaning (that of course if everyone would agree that biblical god has no word here). Creating a meaning is a mechanism we use to structurize our understanding of reality, to strip it from uniformity, to establish relations in this deadly boring flow of data, to make it alive to us (meaningful). Other than that meaning that a my mind create there is no other meaning. That's my conviction and nothing more. And so we live to have a purpose some might conclude. Some live for children and for god, some live for money and fun, some live for understanding (don't get me wrong, there are major and minor purposes). I live both for money and fun, understanding and god. Heiian samurai were perhaps the greatest warriors in history, from childhood they were accumulated a calm acceptance of death dictated by neverending wars. Such spirit can only be born in extreme conditions, and I think in a way we lost those things today, we lost the ability to fight, we lost our strength both mental and physical, as the nature predictated us to have: survival of the fittest. Frank Herbert's Dune: "And the price we paid was the price men always paid for achieving a paradise in this life - we went soft, we lost our edge" I would like to say that I myself have accumulated this calm acceptance of death, but I didn't, though I strive to it. Consider this one more in the list of purposes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 the purpose of feeling the need to stay alive? The answer is very simple, Curiousity. The thought of what if something I would have loved to see happens after I die I could miss something great because I lived to short (probably not really short but just to short to see the events after our death) People want to experience so many great things before they die, take for example my mom. My mother wishes to travel the world before she dies, probably won't happen entirely but it's still a hope, she is curious as to the happenings of the world. People want to live longer to feed their curiousity, whether they realize it or not. The meaning of life? To live and leave a mark on someone or something, to make an impression, to write a message in eternity, to become immortal through someone else eg: Elvis. He died, he's still in the mind of many people, he is truely immortal and he has fullfilled the meaning of life. To leave a mark on one person, or on many. Why do I not wish to die right now even though I would like to leave this hellish place? Because I'm curious as hell and I don't want to miss something great. "all our lifes events are gather up to just one tiny drop of water in the bucket. No matter how much we learn it's never going to fill the bucket, the bucket is just too big." True words of a stoner, and a visionary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manoman81 Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 Point of life.... OK, I was brought up Christian. But, hopefully my point will have some meaning for both people that believe in a higher power, being, etc and atheist: Go outside. Look around. Look at the trees and the animals. Go to a big city. Look at the tall buildings. Go to an ancient area (i.e. Rome, Latin America, the Roman ruins throughout Europe). Despite all of the wars, destruction, and sickness, there are many things in our world to see and enjoy. Whether humans and other living beings were put here for a purpose or we all just crawled out of the water, there is much to enjoy while we are here. That is the point of living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MennoniteHobbit Posted January 25, 2004 Share Posted January 25, 2004 Originally posted by Tyrion I'll just put two different sides in this post for now- Christianity and Atheism/evolutionism. (Note, heavy pessimism) If you believe in God and Heaven, then what's the point to try to live on Earth? Modern Earth is a very strifeful place(and afterall, it has to be worst than paradise..i.e. Heaven), and there doesnt doesnt seem to be much point in striving to survive. I mean, all modern medicene does to us right now is prolong the time until we go to paradise, right? And any marks we leave on the world will surely be destroyed after End of Days, right? So why are murderers branded evil, when all that they're doing is getting us to heaven faster? If you dont believe in God, then what's the point to live? We'll die eventually, so this is just a pointless existence. Any offspring we might have will be wiped clean at a nuclear war, super nova of the sun, implosion of the sun, natural selection, ect. Both sides- give your reasons. Winner gets to meet thier maker sooner. Well, all I can say is that if u believe in God and Heaven, the whole point of livin on Earth is to prepare for Heaven. How else would I know? ** Please try to quote less than you post / post more than you quote. --- SkinWalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 But as long as people continue to convince themselves that there is something else, they'll keep living their lives like they have a second chance later. As long as they believe. That's a true waste of life. Not to mention countless hours of "devotion" to the various religions that people make time for. If people would just accept the fact that, in all likelihood, when you are dead, you cease to be aware, the world will be a more liveable place. Because we'll all be living life like its the only one we have and respect for others will rise. Go to a funeral today, and someone will be overheard to say, "well, at least he's in a better place." Bull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrion Posted January 26, 2004 Author Share Posted January 26, 2004 Originally posted by SkinWalker If people would just accept the fact that, in all likelihood, when you are dead, you cease to be aware, the world will be a more liveable place. Ah, but it isnt likely we'll cease to be aware. None of us know what the afterworld is, so we have no idea wether it's nothing, heaven, hell, or St. Orleans. That is why I am an anagontist. (And Skin, depending on how pessimistic your views are, an afterlife of nothing might be better than this life. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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