Revan Or The Exile? Who's Stronger In The Force?

[lukeiamyourdad]

This is like comparing Vader and Luke, something I don't and wouldn't do.

 

Why?

They're both different, even if in the end Luke defeated Vader. Different abilities and different personalities.

 

One thing is sure, if the Star Wars movie serie is the story of Anakin Skywalker, the KOTOR Trilogy(maybe) is the story of Revan. At the beginning(PT), Anakin is the most powerful Jedi. At the beginning(KOTOR I), Revan is the most powerful Jedi. In the end, Luke manages to defeat Vader.

In the end, the Exile...oh wait we don't know...

 

Nevertheless, I don't think any one of them is stronger then the other.

[Nevhision]

Firstly its important to ignore the level system/new force powers and classes etc.

 

I'm just going with my gut and going to say Revan. The exile just doesn't have that impact on the galaxy that Revan seemed to have. Revan just has that depth from fallen jedi and redemtion. I'm sure by Kotor 3 time, he'll be pretty much the jedi with the most wisdom and knowledge of how the galaxy works.

[Feagildin]

I think that Revan was definitely stronger in the force, sure, maybe the Exile could beat him with sabers only, but I say only maybe. Heck, Revan survived that blast from a star cruiser. Let's see Exile do that.

 

Ok, so the Exile can feed off of others, but so could Nihilus. Who had problems defeating him?

 

I say Revan hands down, no hesitation.

[Drazin]

Ok, so the Exile can feed off of others, but so could Nihilus. Who had problems defeating him?

 

Uh... You beat him as the Exile. Kinda doesnt help make your point there bro

Revan had a Star Forge to make his Armies powerful, Exile just bonds with people to make them do what he wants. Technically, I guess Exile could destroy the force completely, which would either instantly kill Revan and all Jedi, or take away all of Revan's force powers.

 

To really Argue who is stronger in the force is quite difficult. To me, Revan was just an exceptional Jedi. Learned alot of stuff and mastered its use quite easily. Exile was a mediocre Jedi that created force bonds with ease, without evening knowing it sometimes. I wouldn't say the Exile was a Master at force usage, but through his unique talents he can manipulate other force users own power to his advantage. The stronger the Force wielder, the more powerful Exile becomes. To pit any Force user against him would be like trying to put out a fire with Gasoline.

 

So, I would say that Revan was stronger in the force, where as Exile gains power from other force users. I think in a no holds barred fight, Exile would win. Only because the stronger the enemy, the stronger he gets. But he doesnt have the individual power or ability to wield the force that Revan has.

 

Make sense?

[Lord_Supra]

Technically, I guess Exile could destroy the force completely, which would either instantly kill Revan and all Jedi, or take away all of Revan's force powers.

 

Thats the whole point!

 

I know, I know, Revan is better general, better tactician, but the question is: Who is stornger in the Force? Wheter is Revan or he Exile, Revan CANNOT kill the Force, Exile can.

 

Both Revan and Exile (last known force users in the ENTIRE galaxy) use the Force... but Exile has the power to kill it, an don't die in the process... he can destroy it or manipulate it as he see fit, and not being harmed, Revan NEEDS IT, as a Jedi, he is very dependant on it.

 

P.D.: And although my Exile is a DS girl powerful and fearless... I certainly prefer Revan to her, because his story is more "understandable" and maybe more "personal".

[Boba Rhett]

I still like my Yin Yang take on it.

[Feagildin]

Originally posted by Drazin

Uh... You beat him as the Exile. Kinda doesnt help make your point there bro

 

Uhhh, that was my point. Nihilus was easy to defeat, despite his power, so why would Revan have trouble defeating the Exile?

 

Though I will say that my opinion is biased, I didn't really like Exile, but I thought Revan was awesome. But I'm confident that I would still go with Revan for this one even if I wasn't biased. We really have no idea how much Revan learned in his journeys, while at the same time, we have no idea how many powers Exile lost when

Kreia perished.

That means that while we have to consider Revan's power unimited as far as our knowledge goes, we have to consider the Exile's power severely limited. (Again, only from our incomplete knowledge of pre-KOTOR and post-TSL events.)

[jack dell]

Show a little logic Feagildin. You are saying that Nihilus was easy to defeat by the exile, who happened to share the same talents as Nihilus. The fact that the exile did it does not prove that he was easy to defeat, and your point is lost there entirely. We don't know how other jedi interact with the exiles and nihilus powers, but more probably than not it hinders them severely.

 

Speculations aside, also not true is the your statement about power limitations. It is in fact exactly the reverse of what you say. Revan may be powerful, but his limitation is the fact that he only has a limited potential, like all jedi do. He cannot bond infinitely with the force, and thus cannot become indefinately powerful. The exile can, in fact, as long as there are people in the galaxy, he can still draw strength from them, and as long as other jedi live he can also draw a lot more force from them. Even ordinary people have some force sensitivity, a "whisper" as qui-gon calls it. The exile's power is unlimited, revans power isn't. Sure he may be mediocre as a normal jedi, no force bonding aside... perhaps... but he can certainly crush Revan with his unique talents.

 

As things currently stand, it has been made extremely clear that the exile is more powerful than Revan, not accepting that is just because you like Revan more as a character. It still does not rule out the possibility that in the third installment Revan "learns" force bonding or another unique ability altogether that might give him an edge, but as things stand NOW, the exile is just more powerful. Maybe not as smart, maybe not as resourceful and as charismatic... but he is more powerful.

[KungFuFerret]

Ironically, Revan would have been nothing more then a general had Kavar led the Jedi against the Mandalorians. And without the Star Forge, the Jedi Civil war would have been very short indeed.

 

As for Kreia, who's to say she didn't manipulate Revan into doing all this to begin with?

 

She at least understands where true power lies. Revan did not.

 

True power lies in the ability to wield it, yet no one ever knowing you have it, or knowing that you are a threat. Or letting someone else like Revan stand out in everyone's view so HE can be the target for what you do behind the scenes. =)

 

 

 

 

ALL of KOTOR 2 was by Kreia's design. She was aboard the Sith ship attacking the Ebon Hawk, which started this whole mess.

 

So, the real question is, if Revan was so powerful, why didn't he confront Kreia? Or did he, and did he lose?

 

All we know is that he went back to Malachor V, and that somehow Kreia learned of and was able to pursue the Ebon Hawk, paving the way for the beginning of KOTOR 2. T3's directive was, if something should happen to Revan, to go find help.

 

 

[lukeiamyourdad]

Originally posted by KungFuFerret

 

So, the real question is, if Revan was so powerful, why didn't he confront Kreia? Or did he, and did he lose?

 

 

 

What if he didn't have to? What if Kreia was working on behalf of Revan? What if the whole thing is truly Revan's work?

 

[Gall_4185]

My take on has been that Kreia left(or fled) Revan because she couldn't manipulate him anywhere near as much as she desired to. Revan has always struck me as being too proud and intelligent to be truly controlled by anything other than his own path.

[Feagildin]

Originally posted by jack dell

Show a little logic Feagildin. You are saying that Nihilus was easy to defeat by the exile, who happened to share the same talents as Nihilus. The fact that the exile did it does not prove that he was easy to defeat, and your point is lost there entirely. We don't know how other jedi interact with the exiles and nihilus powers, but more probably than not it hinders them severely.

 

Now how can you put logic into it? It's StarWars, so it's fantasy, not reality. Anything can happen. Don't forget that I'm also only sharing my opinion, not saying anyone is wrong.

[Aristotélēsticus]

I see that Kreia doesn't manipulating just The Exile, she has manipulating us all as we all believe her ambition of bringing death to the force, I mean look, the force is everywhere, its like a god or something that the omni-creator has created and give it the will to manage his kingdom so if u took it from a philosophic/religion way its impossible, and if u wanted to leave this things behind and see it from a logic way (although I think that mind-religion-philosophy are truly has the same and not the opposite ideas) I don’t think that the force that has the strongest will in the universe I don’t think that she will allow her death to happened and if The Exile has the ability to kill the force he could not do that for the force will get him killed before he does that at the hand of her instruments which maybe and strongly Revan himself, which lead us to an end to the expectations that some of us said about killing the force and in the result killing Revan.

 

Maybe some of u will never be convinced in the logic presentation I've wrote above and I understand u coz I really love The Exile and I've found K2 more interesting than K1 coz it's more complex and has a lot of action and make u feel like u r in a movie (even if Obsidian didn’t presented perfectly and logically especially when u found ur self running from planet to another without even knowing why) in addition that u can fully embrace The Exile and find ur place in the SW universe as long as he has no certain name or gender so u can make him looks like u in everything unlike Revan who may has the same options in the beginning of the game but in the end he still Revan and not Norrath Kun (or any name u give to ur pc in K1). So I'll assume that u r right and The Exile kill the force so what happened then? When all life dies, how could The Exile live if the life as a concept has died? so how could anyone live? U may say that The Exile is the death of the force so if the life gone the death also will die coz there will be no reason for him to stay, its like day and night if one of the had gone the other cannot survive without the second coz the two depend on each other Thus the two sides must live in harmony

unbalanced forever or try to make some kind of balance which (in my opinion) wont last for a long time.

 

Back to The Exile's gift, we all know that The Exile can "persuade wounded soldiers to fight to the death" and Revan cannot (maybe, we don’t know) but we know that Revan persuaded all the soldiers and some of the jedi(including The Exile) to fight with him in the mandalorians war, no matter the reasons was but he could do it by his charisma and his outstanding leadership and without needing some force tricks in doing this, while The Exile use the force to lead people and this doesn’t make him a leader coz people follow him because of his gift not because his attributes, thus we have a conclusion that unlike The Exile who need the force to be leader, Revan is a natural born leader, and I think that EmperorJello was right when he compared The Exile to Mara Jade, I mean The Exile is strong in the force but he grow stronger when someone is around like Revan and Kreia, in addition that we saw him cut the bound between Visass and Nihilus and this means that this bonds can be cut off if some one strong enough in the force try to do it, on the other hand : The Exile has a bond between him and Kreia but we discovered that Kreia was the one who control and manipulate him not the opposite and if Kreia could do this then Revan could do it either so The Exile may not win if he create such bond between him and Revan.

 

adey12 said:" With Revan V Exile I believe that the Exile would win since Light always beats the Dark in the end."

The end of the game is optional so u can't assume that since Lucasfilm has stated that the true, historically "canonical" ending of K1 is the light side choice.(source:en.wikipedia.org).

 

A last word to say: after I played K2 I liked The Exile maybe as much as I liked Revan but I saw in Revan a powerful jedi master and a great leader, while The Exile is more like a dream of a man who could destroy all the existence and stay alive which is far beyond reality.

[Feagildin]

Nice, Korfredonn. I think I'm inclined to agree.

 

One statement I would like to make, however, is as follows: Can we trust anything Kreia says throughout the course of the game? She was a Sith Lord, after all. Like Yoda says in TCW, those who give themleves to the dark side are agents of deciet, fear, anger, hate, etc., mainly the deceit stuff. Just a random item to think about.

[TheOutrider]

Are you all high, Revan of course!

 

I mean, its always saying he is strong in the force. He converted thousands of Jedi to the Sith within a week. I mean the Exile is strong but Revan can kick his @$$.

[Voran]

Revan seems to have the Jacen Solo thing going on, where he's realized there isn't a lightside/darkside duality to the force, but something more encompassing. In such a way, he seems to have a greater understanding of the force than the Exile does, though depending on your end dialogue with Kreia, the Exile appears to be learning that Revan has learned there is more than just light/dark force. Also, Revan seems much more willing to make hard, even cutthroat decisions. The Exile did make a big one and squashed a buncha planets together, but then he kinda wussed out. Revan remained (according to the TSL lore) focused on his goal, regardless of cost, until he got sideswiped by Malak and had his memories screwed with. And when he got them back, he focused back on his original goal.

[jblue789]

I say that they are equal in power. Revan is just wiser in his uses. And as someone has said, they are like the Yin and Yang of the force. The life and power (Revan) of the force, and the death and destruction of the force (Exile). And as another has said, they balance each other out. Also...

In the Korriban "test" of TSL, it shows the Exile's past, (Malak and the soldiers) present, (Kreia VS party members), and future (Exile VS Revan). But look at Revan in the end, in the corner, is you, fully Dark Side. Or whatever. Which would set up a stepping stone for KOTOR III. Exile meets Revan, but they're both totally absorbed by the Sith energies of there, and you, the third one, goes there, meets them, and saves them from the Dark Side, bringing them to grayness.

If the Exile and Revan create two opposite and parallel sides, as do the Dark and Light sides of the force, I say, that if there's a third PC in KOTOR III, s/he'll be the Balance of the Force. The balance between dark and light, life and death.

 

EDIT: Also, according to wikipedia.org, the Light Side, male Revan AND Exile are the canonical sides.

[nas77]

Originally posted by jblue789

In the Korriban "test" of TSL, it shows the Exile's past, (Malak and the soldiers) present, (Kreia VS party members), and future (Exile VS Revan). But look at Revan in the end, in the corner, is you, fully Dark Side. Or whatever. Which would set up a stepping stone for KOTOR III. Exile meets Revan, but they're both totally absorbed by the Sith energies of there, and you, the third one, goes there, meets them, and saves them from the Dark Side, bringing them to grayness.

 

I never thought of it that way... very interesting and I hope it's true. With all the bugs running around in this game I assumed the Exile in the corner was just another one!!

[Lord_Supra]

Nice argument, and yeah... that makes a lot of sense about a "hypotetical" confrontation of you, Revan and Exile...

 

And I think I was the "Ying-Yang" guy...

 

Exile is stronger, Revan is cooler...[

 

In the Korriban "test" of TSL, it shows the Exile's past, (Malak and the soldiers) present, (Kreia VS party members), and future (Exile VS Revan). But look at Revan in the end, in the corner, is you, fully Dark Side. Or whatever. Which would set up a stepping stone for KOTOR III. Exile meets Revan, but they're both totally absorbed by the Sith energies of there, and you, the third one, goes there, meets them, and saves them from the Dark Side, bringing them to grayness.

[Malkavier]

 

What people seem to be mistaken about, is when they imply that the Exile left the Force willingly. He did not. He was found guilty by the Jedi Council of crimes against the Jedi and the Republic, and he was severed from the Force and exiled (hence the name Exile) as punishment for those crimes. At least in the PC version.

 

 

Just a bit of clarification there.

 

As for Exile vs Revan. Revan ONLY if he/she was still Sith. A Light Sider Revan would be too cautious to use Dark Side powers again in anger, knowing that they lead to corruption... Not only that, but the Exile would just sit there and mirror Revan's Force attacks with the same ability and strength demonstrated by Revan... And as to Revan's apparent strength, couldn't the Exile just use it to sever Revan's connection to the Force, as was done to him/her?

 

In a saber battle, Revan would lose hands down, as the Exile is known for his supreme combat skills, and is I believe from what I've seen so far in both games, more knowledgable in saber/combat forms than Revan (Jedi Guardian/Weapon Master type). Also interesting to point out that the Exile was a master of the dual-bladed saber, which in the SW universe is a very rare choice for Jedi, and is extremely difficult to master.

 

Then again, strength in the Force is not the end-all of things, as was demonstrated when Vader was defeated by Luke. (Vader's Midichlorian count was the highest EVER in the SW universe, even the later characters like Han and Leia's children didn't even compare, and his mastery of the Force was incredible).

 

What is interesting though is how powerful Luke became AFTER he mastered the Dark Side. Maybe this is how Revan is as well? He has mastered both sides so now he is extremely powerful?

[Derc]

Originally posted by Malkavier

Also interesting to point out that the Exile was a master of the dual-bladed saber, which in the SW universe is a very rare choice for Jedi, and is extremely difficult to master.

When was that ever pointed out?

 

What is interesting though is how powerful Luke became AFTER he mastered the Dark Side. Maybe this is how Revan is as well? He has mastered both sides so now he is extremely powerful?

You summed it up best. For story purposes, Revan should be stronger than the Exile. This is Revan's show, after all.

[Malkavier]

 

Well, it was kind of inferred depending upon your saber choice questions earlier in the game. When you have the council sequence displayed by TM-34, it displays the Exile flourishing his saber (I've seen it as a single or dual depending upon the choice made earlier) and thrusting it into the "statue" in the middle of the circle before leaving. And since Jedi Knights are masters of their chosen weapon (the Lightsaber in particular) you may draw the conclusion that he can be master of the saberstaff.

 

 

That's what I was pointing out with that, it's just a simple game mechanics thing and not so much a canonical thing.

[nas77]

^^ Then I gues the answer to the question: "who's stronger, Revan or the Exile?" is dependant upon how each and every player plays their games. There is no right answer - some would say Revan was a Jedi Guardian who mastered a dual saber and the Exile was a Consular with no STR and DEX and so had no clue with lightsabers. There's too much freedom given in the games (not that this is a bad thing) for anyone to answer this question and what you choose for stats, feats, etc. is not always going to match up with what the narrative suggests.

 

But as for a 'canonical' answer... well I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

[Lord Stalin]

Exile>Revan period. Anyone that doesn't agree is a Revan fanboy, and doesn't want to face the truth. And for the person that said this story is unbelievable............. how believable is it for a guy to come back to his old self after a complete mindwash? How real is it to wield a lightsaber or the force................ all fantasy, none of this stuff is real.

[lukeiamyourdad]

I would lay off the insults. Calling people fanboys isn't a good idea.

 

People should quit it. nas said it all in his post. Only a few of us realize that's not a question that can be answered.