TheDestroyer99 Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 What if... You made Team Heal named to Force Valor and that recovers HP DP FP and Mishap, and then the Dark Side gets Force Resurrect. It be a cool imitation to Darth Plagueis in which you can bring back the dead to life. I'd get pissed off if some noob went around resurecting my body in the middle of a fight... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZerooftheFour Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 I'd get pissed off if some noob went around resurecting my body in the middle of a fight... I know what you mean, I play 2142 and it sucks to have 2 seconds left till respawn and this noob resurrects you right in front of a tank only for you to die again... So maybe there can be an Accept and Decline button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unbeholden Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 Wiki up the Potentium heresy. I'm reluctant to bring up the NJO stuff because the writers have left a very bad taste in my mouth on how they handle the NJO characters, but there's a reason why Luke brought back the orthodox Dark/Light distinctions of the Force and got rid of the Potentium philosophy. Caedus being a big reason. Palpatine also used this idea to lure Anakin in Ep III. Besides, you're talking about the exception and not the norm. We want to simulate the norm in gameplay, not the exception - one reason why Sever Force would be a crap power in a game, as an example. Or multiple people who're as uber as to be in-game equivalents of Legacy era Luke Skywalker (even someone with 500 skill points to use won't even come close to a Luke). hmm interesting. So Light and Dark isn't inherently good or evil, depends on the individual. Everybody has their own Light and Dark potential. Only those that have more Dark side potential are the ones that use their dark side for evil purposes. Using the Dark side of the force isn't evil, if the intention isn't evil. So its possible to use the Dark side of the force for good intentions. Interesting. I think the Potentium philosophy makes the most sense, in that the force isn't split into good and evil. But people are. Light side can be used for evil intentions just like the dark side. I have been enlightened, thank you Master Tanqexe. I will meditate on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanqexe Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 Uhhhh, you completely missed my point. The Potentium heresy is heresy for a reason. Channeling the Dark Side ultimately corrupts you. It's incompatible with the Light Side. Palpatine used the Potentium heresy to attempt to lure Anakin in Ep III (the scene where Anakin tells Palpatine that Obi-Wan's engaged Grievous). Vergere, a fallen Jedi who came under instruction of Palpatine, used the Potentium heresy to lure Jacen, who ultimately fell to the Dark Side, believing he could master both sides. Yoda hunted down Potentium heretics at some point because of the danger of the Potentium theory in luring people to the Dark Side. Looking further back, there were the examples of Ulic Qel-Droma, Kreia, and even Revan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 22, 2008 Author Share Posted June 22, 2008 Hey, Screw you, Kreia and Revan were damn awesome. Love, Maxstate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZerooftheFour Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 THIS... IS... STAR WARS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unbeholden Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Uhhhh, you completely missed my point. The Potentium heresy is heresy for a reason. Channeling the Dark Side ultimately corrupts you. It's incompatible with the Light Side. Palpatine used the Potentium heresy to attempt to lure Anakin in Ep III (the scene where Anakin tells Palpatine that Obi-Wan's engaged Grievous). Vergere, a fallen Jedi who came under instruction of Palpatine, used the Potentium heresy to lure Jacen, who ultimately fell to the Dark Side, believing he could master both sides. Yoda hunted down Potentium heretics at some point because of the danger of the Potentium theory in luring people to the Dark Side. Looking further back, there were the examples of Ulic Qel-Droma, Kreia, and even Revan. Darth Traya is evidence that contradicts what you said. Not to mention there where other Potentium members that never became sith, Heresy is a good thing, "If you are to truly understand, then you will need the contrast, not adherence to a single ideal." Sure Palpatine uses this, but he used this philosophy to try to turn anakin for evil intentions. Where as the philosophy itself isn't evil. face it jedi are flawed. Jedi Masters refused to believe in the Potentium view because it would mean the Jedi weren't needed to fight evil, for evil would not exist. the council believed that it was the duty of the Jedi to use the Force to protect others, not study its absolute limits. Lets not forget Darth Revan, Sure he was a Sith and used evil methods but his intentions where good, this supported the Potentium philosophy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZerooftheFour Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 I want Force Fart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanqexe Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Cripes...we really need our own forums where we can talk about stuff not relevant to OJP. Hey, Screw you, Kreia and Revan were damn awesome. Love, Maxstate Hey, Yes they are. Except for the thought of Kreia in lingerie. Loves you too Maxy <3 Darth Traya is evidence that contradicts what you said. Not to mention there where other Potentium members that never became sith, Darth Traya was slowly corrupted by the Potentium philosophy and shunned by the Order. Note that in the end of the game she was revealed to be a Sith, used highly questionable manipulations of other characters throughout the entire story, and furthermore wanted to destroy the Force, an idea that is inherently very tainted with the influence of the Dark side. The lure of DS is very subversive, and some people don't even realize that they've fallen until they're in deep - like Jacen from NJO and Atris from KotOR 2. The Light/Dark distinction was taught for thousands of years during the Old Republic era because of the dangers of skirting the Dark Side - with good reason. It makes you much, much more vulnerable to corruption. Luke was almost corrupted during Dark Empire in the mistaken belief that he could defeat the Dark side from within without being corrupted, until Leia saved him. Besides, the distinction of abstract, almost entity-like Light/Dark sides of the Force has the George Lucas Stamp of Approval. You can't argue with that, really. Plus, in your efforts to convey the information from Wookieepedia, you neglected the very crucial statement here: The Power of the Jedi Sourcebook states that the Potentium is a corrupt, misguided philosophy, and is the first canonical source to outright state this. Official word against yours. Anyway, the point that you are completely missing, which is why this is in any way at all relevant to OJP, is that it is very, very rare that someone can master both Light AND Dark side powers without some kind of price. Light side Force users channel the Force by meditation, harmony, and positive emotions - for the purpose of defense, never to attack/kill - Yoda's words in Episode V. Dark side Force users channel the Force as a concentrated, focused release of extreme emotion (usually negative) as the catalyst. These are completely different methodologies of wielding the Force. Mastery of one while attempting mastery of another comes at some cost, something that's well reflected in how Light/Dark Force powers were given bonuses and penalties depending on your alignment in KotOR. Think about it - you're a Jedi and asked to tap into your Rage (a temptation of the Dark Side), and then immediately you have to heal yourself (let's consider that a Light Side power). So one moment you're reeling from allowing yourself to tap into all these negative emotions, and then the next moment you're supposed to be all Zen-like? Or is it easier to imagine that you're already in a peaceful meditative state to tap into Light Force powers, such that you can readily call upon other Light Force powers without extra strain? That is what we should simulate with the Light/Dark Force power dichotomy. Tapping into both sides must come at some cost. If you want to discuss gameplay mechanics or talk about Star Wars canon, please don't plagiarize Wookieepedia and pass it off as if you wrote all that. We've talked about this before, and I really hope you ween off the bad habit before it gets you in some kind of academic trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lathain Valtiel Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Do NOT take what happened in KOTOR 2 to have any inkling of any sort of truth in regards to the overall machinations of the Force in Star Wars. Doing so is pretty much immediate grounds for dismissal of your theory. Its story was heavily clouded by the biases of its writer, Chris Avellone. He's into gray areas, so to speak. He doesn't like how Star Wars normally operates, so he screwed with it. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 That's why I like it. KOTOR reminds me a lot more of the old trilogy, it has the same "epic" feel to it. So, any other Force powers you guys want? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unbeholden Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Light side Force users channel the Force by meditation, harmony, and positive emotions - for the purpose of defense, never to attack/kill - Yoda's words in Episode V. Dark side Force users channel the Force as a concentrated, focused release of extreme emotion (usually negative) as the catalyst. These are completely different methodologies of wielding the Force. Mastery of one while attempting mastery of another comes at some cost, something that's well reflected in how Light/Dark Force powers were given bonuses and penalties depending on your alignment in KotOR. Think about it - you're a Jedi and asked to tap into your Rage (a temptation of the Dark Side), and then immediately you have to heal yourself (let's consider that a Light Side power). So one moment you're reeling from allowing yourself to tap into all these negative emotions, and then the next moment you're supposed to be all Zen-like? Or is it easier to imagine that you're already in a peaceful meditative state to tap into Light Force powers, such that you can readily call upon other Light Force powers without extra strain? That is what we should simulate with the Light/Dark Force power dichotomy. Tapping into both sides must come at some cost. If you want to discuss gameplay mechanics or talk about Star Wars canon, please don't plagiarize Wookieepedia and pass it off as if you wrote all that. We've talked about this before, and I really hope you ween off the bad habit before it gets you in some kind of academic trouble. I agree, I was quoting Wookieepedia, any dumb ass can see that. Darth Traya was slowly corrupted by the Potentium philosophy and shunned by the Order. Note that in the end of the game she was revealed to be a Sith, used highly questionable manipulations of other characters throughout the entire story, and furthermore wanted to destroy the Force, an idea that is inherently very tainted with the influence of the Dark side. The lure of DS is very subversive, and some people don't even realize that they've fallen until they're in deep - like Jacen from NJO and Atris from KotOR 2. Very morally wrong in many ways to manipulate everyone for her own will. But she wanted to destroy the force, because she hated the fact that it controlled us all. That we had to fight this never ending battle between light and dark for the rest of eternity. She hated anyone who had connection to the force, the only reason why she used for force was to understand it in order to destroy it, killing force users wasn't enough. She had to kill the force, but how can you kill a entity of unlimited power and a will that guides all? She found a way to create "echoes" in the force, she first discovered this injury in the force with in the exile. Her hatred of the Force is fueled by anger but, if she did not kill it, even more lives would be lost in the future. Thus this supports the Potentium Philosophy, in that she used the dark side of the force but her intentions where good. NOT evil. So basically she believed the ends justify the means. I whole heartedly agree with this, so I share the same views as Traya... and im not tainted by the dark side or am I? So I think the force doesn't turn us into something where not, it actually gives us our deepest darkest desires to life, where it be evil or good depends on the individual. Even if it isn't supported by most i stand by this philosophy simply because i don't like star wars the way it is. So I guess we can't argue about this anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 Shut up already and give me some Force power suggestions. Tell you what, next power to be suggested will be recreated and I'll post screenshots of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDie Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Force atomic bomb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 Here it is as a rocket explosion: http://www.mediafire.com/?4yodnovr3sc Use this to replace enhancedstuff/effects/rocket/explosion.efx. It's too detailed/long for a screenshot, but I guess this'll do. Edit: could create it to be even more detailed if you want, but I sincerely doubt this'll be a force power Edit 2: Uploaded new nuke with some more flashy particles. Needs more body now. Edit 3: For particle effects, you'll need http://www.mediafire.com/?xpyjp2jelg6 in enhancedstuff/effects/explosions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZerooftheFour Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Gimme Force Fart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 24, 2008 Author Share Posted June 24, 2008 Come on guys let's keep it serious. The offer isn't going to stand eternally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kahn D'halaine Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Telekinesis, as I described before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 24, 2008 Author Share Posted June 24, 2008 That's easy, we'll just need a "wave" model for JKA's refraction shader to wrap around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unbeholden Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Yes, also make it so that Force telekineses can be used when you using force grip. But make it limited, you can't throw a person right and then left. When using grip if you throw them right then they will fly in that direction and knock into something. So you can't keep them gripped and knocking them left and right and left and right cause thats retarded... Yer so make limitations, if thats possible so the force ability isn't that powerful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDestroyer99 Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 And if there is force telekinesis, pulling air particles together and making them tightly packed into a reflective solid (using the force) means you must add force deflect or I'll pwn the one who decides not to put it in into the next millennium. @Zero I don't need force fart. My farts are already bad enough! Every time I sit down on the toilet a nuclear mushroom cloud goes into the upper atmosphere forcing the astronauts to make course corrections or face exposure to nuclear fart radiation. . I bet if I bottled it up and sold it to the government as a chemical weapon I'd be rich because of its effectiveness. Yea, its that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 24, 2008 Author Share Posted June 24, 2008 ^lol Alright, let's steer this into a direction. What do you guys think of these ideas for point garnering: -single points- +hard to earn +everything costs the same amount :ussr: +things locked down until you open them up via other skills -money- +bigger amounts (i.e 1500 credits for an e-11 and training, ammo) +easier to earn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unbeholden Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 ^lol Alright, let's steer this into a direction. What do you guys think of these ideas for point garnering: -single points- +hard to earn +everything costs the same amount :ussr: +things locked down until you open them up via other skills Nice -money- +bigger amounts (i.e 1500 credits for an e-11 and training, ammo) +easier to earn hmm, this concept doesn't really fit with the game. Though its a excellent concept in KOTOR. But thats a long single player game RPG. while this is a short and quick random fights. I think we should keep the current system we have, but slowly build the skill tree idea until its made properly. If it works well then we'll stick with it. From what I've read the skill tree is much superior to our current skill system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanqexe Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Not keen on everything costing the same amount. A hybridized version of the two EXP systems you propose would probably be ideal - more complicated, code-wise, but ideal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxstate Posted June 25, 2008 Author Share Posted June 25, 2008 What's wrong with everything costing the same amount? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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