MM-86 Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 I want SWGB 2 to be more of a "Star wars strategy game", rather than a "Strategy game with some star wars units". You are not supposed to have a favourite civ beacuse they are good, but beacuse you like that civ, you saw it in the movies and liked their style/units ideologi or whatever. I play as the Trade federation, absolutely not beacuse they are good, i think they suck though they shouldn't, but beacuse i loved the Trade federation in the movies! So I want SWGB 2 to have less made up units like the Pummel and the ships, and better effects on the units showing up in the movies. Ofcourse, Gungans must get some kind of AA-unit, but they don't really need an airforce. GLA in CC Generals doesn't, and they can handle that pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joesdomain Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 I agree with MM-86 all the way! Better graphics and sound! Good dogfights with fighters! Ground units able to shoot at air! Etc.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joesdomain Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Rebel Alliance with Ewoks and Mon Calamari Confederacy with Trade Federation Royal Naboo Gungans Wookies Galactic Empire Galactic Republic Expand civilizations to allow at least 40-50 buildable units per civilization. Examples: For instance- 7 aircraft- (Rebel Airbase- X-wing, Y-wing, A-wing, B-wing, E-wing, V-wing, Medium Transport) Galactic Empire Airbase- 7 aircraft (Tie Fighter, Tie Interceptor, Tie Advanced, Tie Defender, Tie Bomber, Imperial Lander, Imperial Lamda Class Shuttle) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joesdomain Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Continued: Unique Units for Empire would be Dark Troopers, Imperial Probe Droids, Imperial Officers, Repeater Stormtrooper Mechs- AT-ST Walkers, AT-PT Walkers, and AT-AT Walkers Troopers- Stormtroopers, Stormtroopers on Dewback, Imperial Navy Troopers(Guards) Imperial Navy Troopers with Thermal Detonators, Imperial Scout Troopers with speeder bike (special ability can be used as scout, guard on or off bike) Also, Snowtroopers would be used in snow or tundra planets -List of Bounty Hunters that have special abilites Rebels: I already mention the aircraft in an above post. I think the troopers and mechs will work from GB1. Unique unit: Armored Airspeeder, Rebel Officer, Troopers would change abilities and clothes to adapt to enivronments like Yavin 4 troopers for savannah's and plains Rebel snowtroopers in tundra or snow, Forest troopers for places similar to endor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Joe - nice spam you've got on the other threads. Why did you split that post into three? MM-86 - I agree. As a matter of fact, in my SWGB2 document I'm writing I've been thinking of giving the Rebels no Mechs. They had none in the movies, didn't they? To compensate, they can get quite a variety of Troopers and Aircraft. Mechs really don't fit with the Rebel's style of fighting. I think it could work quite well. I thought "AoM Norse have no archers, and they aren't disadvantaged", but if you say the C&CG GLA have no aircraft, that sounds like even more evidence that it can be balanced properly. Is C&CG out yet? I may have to get a copy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swphreak Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 It's been out... I've had it and GLA is stronger than they look. Those Stinger Sites paired with a GLA hole can do damage against incoming attacks. And the bomb trucks rule..... If the rebels arn't gonna have much mech... the troopers are gonna have to be uber to take on an AT-AT unless the person is expected to have Speeders to take them down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 I was thinking along these lines for anti-mech stuff: Instead of having "Trooper Recruit->Trooper->Heavy Trooper->Repeater Trooper" You would have "Trooper Recruit->Trooper->Heavy Trooper" with Repeater Trooper as a separate unit. The Repeater Trooper would not be as good as a normal Trooper vs other Troopers, but would instead be good against mechs. So a few civs have Repeater Troopers or heavy weapons teams to take out the mechs. For Rebels, however, they also have a Guerilla, which can plant explosives on mechs or buildings. Then there is the Airspeeder, which is moderate vs Mechs, and in the last Tech-Level the Rebels can get a B-Wing, which is strong vs mechs and decent vs buildings, but not that great vs Troopers and other Air. So Rebels have probably the best range of Troopers (but not the best quality Troopers) and the best range and quality of Air, but no Mechs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM-86 Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Nice to see that people actually agreed about my opinion. And yes, CC Generals is in the stores now, a friend of mine have played it and think's it's great, GLA works perfectly without any airforce! One thing that MUST be added in SWGB 2, Battleships! They should be "Uber-units" with several gun batteries and able to store, repair and launch fighters. Although, they could be weak against ground based airdefence (Ion cannon for example), and big formations of fighters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM-86 Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Nice to see that people actually agreed about my opinion. And yes, CC Generals is in the stores now, a friend of mine have played it and think's it's great, GLA works perfectly without any airforce! One thing that MUST be added in SWGB 2, Battleships! They should be "Uber-units" with several gun batteries and able to store, repair and launch fighters. Although, they could be weak against ground based airdefence (Ion cannon for example), and big formations of fighters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Vostok - that sounds suspiciously like my idea... Of course there is a difference, i think there should be (in addition to normal troops) the- Repeater Trooper - less armour and slower than normal trooper but has longer range, more powerful, better vs mechs Rifle Trooper - specialised anti-mch, anti-air rocket unit, poor vs troops and ship, less armour than normal trooper Sniper - fast, unarmoured trooper with very long range, excellent vs all troops but poor vs everything else Plasma Trooper - short range, slow, very powerful, instantly clears garrisoned buildings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM-86 Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 How about: Rebel trooper: Armed with a blaster rifle and thermal detonators. Good versus infantry, kind of good vs mechs, but in short range only! and not to good vs aircraft. Using blaster when firing at infantry and aircraft, using thermal detonators vs large groups of infantry, mechs and buildings. Repeater trooper: Armed with a small turbolaser on a tripod (?). Very effective against infantry, works nice on smaller mechs and decent vs aircraft, bad vs buildings. Moves slow, and deploys slow. Rebel officer: Armed with a blaster rifle. Have better hit accuracy than a normal trooper. Increases morale if attached to a group of troopers. Rebel commando (like those on Endor in ROTJ): Armed with blaster rifle, thermal detonators, and explosives. Using the weapons in the same way as the regular trooper does, with the exception that the commando uses his explosives on buildings. Tauntaun trooper. Armed with a blaster pistol, and bad smell! A fast scout unit with some anti-trooper capabilities. Rebel pilot: Armed with a blaster pistol. Sometimes comes out of shot down fighters, and can then be used on the ground. Bounty hunter: Armed with a hapzahard of weapons, and they are deadly, you know... I think that is all the infantry the rebels need, without making them non-star wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swphreak Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 I don't think it would be fun playing with them then. They gotta have some tanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM-86 Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 But the rebels didn't have any mechs in any star wars movie. And i think you should keep it as close to the movies as possible, otherwise, it wouldn't really be Star wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swphreak Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 oh no! another Purist! (joke) I will not turn this into another EU vs Movies/is EU Movies debate. They didn't have tanks in the movies.. well they got their *** kicked. plus, most of the battles the rebels won were in space..... If you want to stick with themovies, you have to get rid of the AA only mechs, and give the rebels a heck of a lot better air units. And have nrmal mechs able to shoot air, but at different accuracy(sp?) because we saw an AAT and an AT-AT take out some ships. And Gungans would have to lose the air and some of the mechs it has now. Naboo will have to lose all of it's mechs except for the Flash and Gian Speeders... you see where I'm getting at? If you stuck with just movie units, you got a boring game and balance issues. You have to have some EU in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM-86 Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 I didn't say that SWGB 2 should stick exactly to the movie, but as close as possible. As you mentioned, The rebels have much better air/space units in the movies, so they can use X-wings, Y-wings, A-wings, B-wings and Snowspeeders against mechs, and they can defend themselves against early mech assaults with turrets, Anti-vehicle cannons and shield generators. Ofcourse, these defenses have to be better against walkers than in the movie. The Naboo will only loose their assault mech, not a big loss i think. They have good Troopers, excellent airforce, and decent mechs. The Gian speeder did take out a heavily armoured AAT with one shot, and the Flash speeder seems to be fast and deadly against troopers. But i agree that you still have to add some units in the Naboo arsenal. Gungans will do fine without airforce. The GLA in CC Generals doesn't have an airforce, and that works fine. But you need to add some real AA-units. Or, how about this, the Gungan Fambaa shield generators must be penetrated before you can fire at the units inside it's protection, and fighters fly too high to do that. We saw that the Trade federation AAT work against aircraft, and their battleships can probably give a hell of an airdefence, and AT-ST's are equipped with side mounted rockets, wich should be able to take out some air-units, and the AT-AT's, well, i beleive you have seen them in action. I'm not against EU, i have read some, it's great stuff, but i just don't think EU units should be added, it's not really real Star wars. But to fill out some "gaps" of units i agree you can use units from EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 I agree, MM-86. I think if you wanted to remain true to the fighting style of the Rebels, there isn't much room for mechs. In the movies, there were two ground battles. On Hoth, they could have used Mechs quite adequately, but instead they used Snowspeeders. Obviously their air are better equipped if their mechs exist at all. On Endor, it was guerilla stuff. Again, no room for mechs. Having no mechs makes the Rebels very unique, and at the same time very true to the movies. In fact, if you wanted to give the Rebels access to all the air units they should get, they would probably be too powerful with mechs. So they have no mechs. Big deal. They have by far the best and most varied air force in the game to balance it out. They also get the best selection of troops, even if the troopers themselves aren't the best in the game. I could quite easily work. Of course, I'm assuming air will be better integrated so more units can shoot air than just aa units. If not it wouldn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorranSec Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 I don't think you should completely cut one type of unit from a civ. After all, the term 'Mechs' covers a huge range- from AT-ATs (heavy mechs) to AT-STs (medium mechs) to speeders (light mechs). I completely understand your points, and I agree that heavy mechs would be bad for the Rebs. However, I think that speedy yet weak mechanical units would be great for them. They would fit quite well with the fighting style- they're great for hit and runs, some could be incorporated with the commando/guerrila units, and so on. And I don't think the Rebels have the 'best and most varied air force.' They probably have the best fighter force, but they don't have the best air force, as they have very few capital ships, and only a couple of decent medium ships. You can't really say someone has the 'best and most varied ground force,' can you? Having no mechs gives them a ground force consisting solely of troopers, and seeing as their fighter forces aren't completely unlocked and in tip-top shape until the midgame, the Rebs would be extremely vulnerable to any kind of attack. And please don't rebut me on that point.... it's quite clear that you won't be able to unlock an X-Wing at the same time you can a Normal Trooper (or whatever you've decided to call them). Side note: 1000 posts! Hooray! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted March 29, 2003 Share Posted March 29, 2003 Congrats Corran! Rebs should have a few light mechs...remember gameplay>realism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swphreak Posted March 29, 2003 Share Posted March 29, 2003 Originally posted by CorranSec Side note: 1000 posts! Hooray! :D Welcome fellow spammer 1337 poster! You may now join the ring of what they call this "Overpost Club." But I do not understand what this "Overposting" is... I don't like it And the rebels have to have some light mech. they can have some "antique"tank from the Clone Wars or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 29, 2003 Share Posted March 29, 2003 Fair enough, a small mech could work well. However, the Rebels are somewhat deficient in the area of mechs. Just like the Gungans should be deficient in the area of air. Just let me sort something out, Corran: when I say Air Force I refer to the fighter-sized part of flying vessels. If I was to refer to anything bigger I would have said Space Fleet. Capital ships are not part of the air force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorranSec Posted March 29, 2003 Share Posted March 29, 2003 "Heh ehe mab I ab 133+, I sH00+ teh rale.." (sorry people..... use of the word 'l33t' invariably leads me to flashbacks of crazy UT multiplayer...) Okay, it seems we are all in agreement about the mechs. And Vostok, I know that the Rebels aren't that great at mechs, and I'm trying to show that by only giving them a few that suit their character and playing style. Even if somebody isn't that great at something, they should still have a little bit of it. Okay, so we have Air Force and Space Fleet cleared up. Still, it would be easier to understand if you said Fighters, Medium and Capital Ships..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM-86 Posted March 31, 2003 Share Posted March 31, 2003 As i have mentioned before CorranSec, the rebels can defend theirselves against early attacks with their turret-cannons, anti-vehicle cannons and the ion-cannon. All those defences showed up in TESB. I think the rebels could have a little anti-mech landspeeder, but no more. lukeiamyourdad True, in the original SWGB the rebels wouldn't have made it without mechs, but look at the RTS games of today! As i have mentioned here so many times, the GLA in cc Generals don't have an airforce at all, but the game is still balanced. This is about the coming SWGB 2, not the outdated (but still fun) SWGB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swphreak Posted March 31, 2003 Share Posted March 31, 2003 Yea, we saw how effective those turrents were [/sarcasm] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 31, 2003 Share Posted March 31, 2003 Lord I hate hacker-speak. Oh, I can't make up my mind whether to give the Rebels mechs or not! The arguments are good either way. Perhaps all their "mechs" operate like cannons, in that you have to deploy them for them to attack? When deployed, they might look like the turrets and ion cannon from the movies. Just a thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That sounds more of an artillery unit then a mech... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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