Master_Ginn Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Well being a Christian i've felt that my religion has a certain scrutiny against it. And I kind of feel like people in the united states that aren't Christian seem to be more tolerant and accepting of people of other religions than Christianity. Say i had a veiw on gay marraige(this is not a debate on gay marraige) do you think that my view would be flamed more than say a view of a Muslim? I guess the question i'm asking is, is the non-Christian U.S. population more tolerant of other religions over Christianity? Because i think if i had a classmate who was Hindu and he had a veiw on something, the rest of the class would try and not bash his statements so as not to be rude, but my veiw they would tear it apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kain Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Just a theory, but it may all stem back to when American's fought for their freedom against the Christian(Catholic) Church. Not to mention most non-religious types are always having Christianity rammed down their throats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 I can't say anything for others, but I know that I don't treat anything from the Christian religion any differently than I would from any other religion. If their opinion speaks of something I find to be intolerance than I will take offense and take a stand. I personally don't care if you are christian muslim jewish or anything else. If it makes you happy then it makes you happy, so LONG as religion isn't used as a basis for intolerance or discrimination, or used to try and back up foreign policy in the government Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiroki Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 I find most true Christians to be the most tolerant of all of others beliefs. It is only the zealots that will tell you not to even be friends with non-Christians. Posh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Originally posted by Hiroki I find most true Christians to be the most tolerant of all of others beliefs. I find that to be pretty out there. I mean, is it not part of being christian to NOT accept homosexuality? Isn't it part of being a christian to ONLY accept that YOU are going to heaven and everyone else is going to hell? That's not very accepting to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txa1265 Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Originally posted by ET Warrior I mean, is it not part of being christian to NOT accept homosexuality? NO, that is incorrect. Christian teachings are to treat all others with dignity and respect, regardless of their station, beliefs or standing. *However*, most Christian doctrine is also that the sexual act is intended for the purpose of propogation of the species, to be shared between a married husband and wife. That is why christianity frowns upon masturbation, extra-marital sex, etc. But with homosexuality it is taken further, as the early christians lived in the falling roman empire in which homsexual acts were part of the wontan hedonism and moral decay. In current society, I think there is a difficult choice between acceptance and condoning possible behaviour that is against the tenets of your faith - it wasn't that many years ago where the homosexual community was well known for promiscuity and disease. Originally posted by ET Warrior Isn't it part of being a christian to ONLY accept that YOU are going to heaven and everyone else is going to hell? Actually, a fundamental part of every religion is based on the belief that the teachings of *that* religion show the way to Heaven (or Valhalla, or whatever). But christianity shows that the way is based on being the best person possible, the most tolerent and accepting and helpful person, is what will get you your reward. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Originally posted by txa1265 Actually, a fundamental part of every religion is based on the belief that the teachings of *that* religion show the way to Heaven (or Valhalla, or whatever). But christianity shows that the way is based on being the best person possible, the most tolerent and accepting and helpful person, is what will get you your reward. THAT is interesting, because every christian that I have really talked to about it is confident that I'm going to hell if I don't accept Jesus Christ as my one lord and savior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZBomber Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Originally posted by ET Warrior THAT is interesting, because every christian that I have really talked to about it is confident that I'm going to hell if I don't accept Jesus Christ as my one lord and savior Then they misunderstood. No one is perfect...... ET - The church teaches followers to resist homosexual activities. It doesn't say to shun those who have commited homosexual acts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamtrip Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Well if all the organised religions quit trying to impose their beliefs on everyone, that'd be nice. I think its down to the unknown and the fear of racism. People in your class know your religion well and are likely to be of a similar ethnicity to yourself. Perhaps most have been christians or their parents have brought them up as christians and they now rebel against such stringent and seemingly silly values. This in their eyes may justify the mocking of your (what were their) views. People know less about, say Islam. If a muslim explains they wear a headscarf and the reasons why, people may seem to accept it. If you tell a story of how Noah gathered the few billion species of animals and herded them onto his giant wooden boat, people may mock you, even though both instances may seem equally ludicrous to people. If a muslim speaks of their beliefs, it's likely people know less about their religion and therefore don't feel they have the grounds to challenge such views. Secondly and increasingly common is the fear of racism. The fear being called racist by opposing such a person's beliefs and traditions (even though it's completely unrelated) may force people to not challenge a person's views. Combined with the fact that they probably deviated from your religion and know about the values of your religion, they may criticise it more than any other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Originally posted by ZBomber ET - The church teaches followers to resist homosexual activities. It doesn't say to shun those who have commited homosexual acts. Interesting... Leviticus: 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Seems to me that the bible says gays should be put to death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Ginn Posted September 22, 2004 Author Share Posted September 22, 2004 Um, guys this is not a discussion on homosexuality nor on how you feel religion is forced upon you, it's about whether people are intolerant of christianity, and more tolerant of other religions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elijah Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Originally posted by Kain Just a theory, but it may all stem back to when American's fought for their freedom against the Christian(Catholic) Church. I don’t know where you got that information but that is INCORRECT. The original pilgrims of America LEFT England to get away from the English catholic church which at the time had been Changed and FORCED upon all who lived under the authority of the king of England. The pilgrims of America came here to be free so they could believe in the God they wanted to believe in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wassup Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 I try my best to always treat people from all backgrounds fairly and justly. I participate in discussions and debates with others based on their arguments, not who they are. I think that this certain "scrutiny" or "bias" against Christianity is because it is the main religious institution that is making the headlines on controversial subjects like gay marriage and abortion, while the other religious groups are quite passive about their beliefs on these matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Originally posted by Feanaro Um, guys this is not a discussion on homosexuality nor on how you feel religion is forced upon you, it's about whether people are intolerant of christianity, and more tolerant of other religions. Sorry sorry, I was merely countering Hirokis point about Christians being more tolerant than non-christians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 I criticize everyone, to not do so is stupid and bigotry itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomie Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 I think the world out there is stupid. EVERY religion says that if you believe in their god, you'll reach heaven or whatever, and if not, you'll go to the opposite place, wich equals suffering. But three of those religions believe in the same god, and yet it is those religions that clash the most. I think that is the most important part, the God and since it's the same god, shouldn't they all get along? See how silly it is?. At least buddhism is a little more tolerant, i've heard. Well, in short: YES, i do think most unreligious people (Not only in America) are a lto more tolerant against a lot of people, simply because there's not really a reason for them not to, except sometimes fear of the unknown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kain Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 Originally posted by ZDawg I don’t know where you got that information but that is INCORRECT. The original pilgrims of America LEFT England to get away from the English catholic church which at the time had been Changed and FORCED upon all who lived under the authority of the king of England. The pilgrims of America came here to be free so they could believe in the God they wanted to believe in. See the 3rd word in my quote? Its THEORY. THEORY. THEORY. THEORY. Do you need a definiton of theory? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toms Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 i try and treat everyone equally (although you are naturally going to get the odd bit of bias). However: (a) I know more about christianity (so i can see more holes in it) (b) i am in contact with more christians (so i'm likely to be debating them more often) © christianity is (in the western world i live in) the most estabilished, powerful and dominant religion and so it has more of an effect on life around me (eg: headscarf thing matters little to me as it doesn't affect me, anti-gay thing matters more as i have gay friends, abortion, etc...) (d) most of the laws and constitutions of the western world (UK and US affecting me most) are based in some way on christian beliefs (laws on marriage, polygamy, etc..) (e) the current "leader" *choke* of the western world allows his "christian" beliefs to affect almost everything he does. (f) in the west at least christians aren't a minority, so they are perfectly able to defend and look after themselves, no matter what i say. So i probably end up in conflict with christians a lot more than other religions, but it isn't due to the fact i have less tollerance for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZBomber Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 Originally posted by ET Warrior Interesting... Leviticus: 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Seems to me that the bible says gays should be put to death. EXACTLY. Levitcus. Old Testament. As in over 2000 years ago. Times have changed: "But with homosexuality it is taken further, as the early christians lived in the falling roman empire in which homsexual acts were part of the wontan hedonism and moral decay. " Notice I didn't say the BIBLE, I said the CHURCH, as in, the Pope (for Catholics) and the leaders of the church for the other Christian religions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 So it's okay to just ignore the old testament? So why then is it still part of the Christian bible? I don't really want to get into this because it's not the purpose of the thread, but that makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider AL Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 So it's okay to just ignore the old testament? So why then is it still part of the Christian bible? As an unbiased atheist I would say you should ignore the old testament because it's an uber-fanatical hebraic text detailing how only those who believe in "t3h GoD" Jehova are going to enjoy their afterlife, and how everyone else will roast on his mighty spit, blah blah angel of death, smiting blah. The new testament's quite good by comparison. More peaceful, humble, a bit holier tbh. PS: Christian ideal = hate the sin, not the sinner. Many Christians hate homosexuals, but that's not true Christianity, is it. That's not what Christ taught in that bookie-thing. True Christians should love all sinners and wish them good luck in improving themselves, and yes, try to convince them to change, but should only hate the acts those sinners have committed. I mean, I'm not a Christian, but I don't particularly like the idea of homosexuality. I find it all a bit... "ewww". But that doesn't mean I want to smite all the people who happen to like all that business. Christians should be like me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZBomber Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 Good question ET. I think the only reason that it's in there is so it gives a little backround to the new Testament, like, the Prophets. I think a lot of more people would be Christian if the Old Testament wasn't in the Bible. A lot of the things said in there......seem.... aggresive, pherhaps even barbaric, to me. They gave "human charecteristics" to God, when we are supposed to think God isn't human, a supernatural powerful being. The Old Testament contradicts itslef a lot, i really don't like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamtrip Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 A lot of people would be christians if there wasn't the christian illumni/church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kain Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 I don't remember if I've ever posted this, but I think everyone of those religions is just a giant grudge against the powers before them. Worshippers of nature worshipped a satyr, as did the Greeks and Romans - the monotheis Devil is commonly depicted as a satyr. Homosexuality was thought of as great in Rome, even Alexander the Great had a male concubine he took on all of his campaigns, but monotheists are totally against it. Suicide was the only honorable way to really die in Rome, it showed that nobody but you was good enough to take your own life, but suicide in the monotheist religions is a huge taint on your soul which is impossible to clean because you're already dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamtrip Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 A lot of the christian church's positions were taken from St. Paul who lived after the bible was written. He was homophobic and a misogynist, giving rise to the Catholic Church's anti-woman, anti-gay stance. The Protestant faith however was a direct consequence of Henry VIII's rebellion against Rome's decree against divorce and remarrying. Set up as a faith tor ebel against traditional values and beliefs, the modern protestant faith is far more open to women and homosexuals. Theres no denying that both churches however, were merely there to control and indoctrinate the people, through fear and terror (of God). Such establishments are still somewhat effective today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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