KotOR 3 - No Obsidian Please!

[The Source]

I think this is why game modding is so popular, as its free and it is no cost to the player if they play a highly anticipated mod and it turns out to be well below their expectations.

Yeah. However, I don't buy games, so they can be finished by outsiders. Modders are fans who want to have fun. Obsidian is a group of professional designers, and they should have put in the time. KotOR II was their first company portfolio piece, and it reads off like they are freshmen in college. That is horrible. If KotOR II and NWN 2 are examples of their work now, I can only imagine the garbage they will develop later.

[Gargoyle King]

Yeah. However, I don't buy games, so they can be finished by outsiders. Modders are fans who want to have fun. Obsidian is a group of professional designers, and they should have put in the time. KotOR II was their first company portfolio piece, and it reads off like they are freshmen in college.

 

Maybe, but i think your criticisms on Obsidian are perhaps a bit too harsh. If there is anyone to blame, it's probably LucasArts for putting pressure on Obsidian to get an earlier release of the game; which we all know is the reason why Kotor II felt like an unfinished experience.

[The Source]

Maybe, but i think your criticisms on Obsidian are perhaps a bit too harsh. If there is anyone to blame, it's probably LucasArts for putting pressure on Obsidian to get an earlier release of the game; which we all know is the reason why Kotor II felt like an unfinished experience.

Personally, I don't care about whose fault it is for the deadline change. KotOR II should have been Obsidian's push to put their best foot forward. Instead, I got excuses to why the game was finished in an incomplete state. Very unprofessional. Personally, I would have worked some serious overtime. I would have made adjustments earlier, so I can edit the game off correctly. Expecially if this was a Star Wars game. KotOR II could have been Obsidian's greatest step forward.

[Gargoyle King]

Personally, I don't care about whose fault it is for the deadline change. KotOR II should have been Obsidian's push to put their best foot forward. Instead, I got excuses to why the game was finished in an incomplete state. Very unprofessional. Personally, I would have worked some serious overtime. I would have made adjustments earlier, so I can edit the game off correctly. Expecially if this was a Star Wars game. KotOR II could have been Obsidian's greatest step forward.

 

Now i can see where your coming from, it is true therefore that if Obsidian wanted to make the game the best to their abilities, then this would have been reflected in the final product. Its a good thing there are modders out there willing to finish off Obsidians work for them (Team-Gizka).

[The Source]

Now i can see where your coming from, it is true therefore that if Obsidian wanted to make the game the best to their abilities, then this would have been reflected in the final product.

Wouldn't you?

 

If you were given the task of creating KotOR II, wouldn't you take this opportunity to create a high quality and polished off game for a high-profile company?

 

Man. I would be working my asp off until I couldn't sit.

[Gargoyle King]

Wouldn't you?

 

If you were given the task of creating KotOR II, wouldn't you take this opportunity to create a high quality and polished off game for a high-profile company?

 

Man. I would be working my asp off until I couldn't sit.

 

I suppose I would, yes; the fact that they got paid to develop makes you wonder why they weren't motivated to do so!

[Pavlos]

Wouldn't you?

 

If you were given the task of creating KotOR II, wouldn't you take this opportunity to create a high quality and polished off game for a high-profile company?

 

Man. I would be working my asp off until I couldn't sit.

 

Interesting...

 

Mac, while I do believe that Obsidian was a little arrogant to think they could do so much in such a small time-frame (they've admitted as much), I think you need to consider what position they were in. This is a new company with just its founding members at the start of development and thirty six developers (according to the game credits) by the end. That is an incredibly small team to develop a AAA title and over an incredibly (yes, I like this word) short development span of thirteen months. LucasArts pushed the release date forwards to Christmas. Could Obsidian refuse? Most likely not, they did not have the industrial clout that, say, BioWare did and as a new company it is inadvisable to say to your employer that you cannot finish in time - they may decide to drop you and seek out another developer, or drop the game entirely. If they had extended development times, would they have gotten paid enough to cover the extra time? Would they have run into the ground, like Troika?

 

To be honest, to produce a 40+ hour game in thirteen months with a team of just under forty people is nothing short of remarkable. And to paraphrase what Prime said once, most developers would kill for a "failure" like KotOR II - a major seller and a game that met critical acclaim with over 35 game of the year awards.

 

Edit: I don't think we can question Obsidian's devotion to creating games. People don't get involved in that business (not in the small firms - i.e. not EA) because they want the money. They go into it because they love creating games. I, for one, was impressed with their second game, Neverwinter Nights 2, and their continuing support is admirable - not only for having good intentions but the extent of the support (I mean, there is a lot of community-developer communication going on over on the BioBoards, something I find impressive).

[Jediphile]

Mac, while I do believe that Obsidian was a little arrogant to think they could do so much in such a small time-frame (they've admitted as much), I think you need to consider what position they were in.

 

Chris Avellone has said that he blamed himself for not cutting another planet earlier, which I take to mean cut a planet out so the end game could get more attention. Looking at TSL, I do tend to agree.

 

However, Obsidian has also said that this was a situation beyond the capacity of the company or words to that effect, which I take to mean they were left with little choice when Lucasarts pushed the deadline... Somehow that always made me think of the words "rock" and "hard place" for some reason

 

This is a new company with just its founding members at the start of development and thirty six developers (according to the game credits) by the end. That is an incredibly small team to develop a AAA title and over an incredibly (yes, I like this word) short development span of thirteen months. LucasArts pushed the release date forwards to Christmas. Could Obsidian refuse? Most likely not, they did not have the industrial clout that, say, BioWare did and as a new company it is inadvisable to say to your employer that you cannot finish in time - they may decide to drop you and seek out another developer, or drop the game entirely. If they had extended development times, would they have gotten paid enough to cover the extra time? Would they have run into the ground, like Troika?

 

That's the situation in a nutshell...

 

To be honest, to produce a 40+ hour game in thirteen months with a team of just under forty people is nothing short of remarkable. And to paraphrase what Prime said once, most developers would kill for a "failure" like KotOR II - a major seller and a game that met critical acclaim with over 35 game of the year awards.

 

Agreed. While I lament what TSL could have been, I also don't lose track of how Obsidian was able to push out a workable (if cut) game in so short a time. In and off itself that is an incredible achievement IMHO.

[mjpb3]

Chris Avellone has said that he blamed himself for not cutting another planet earlier, which I take to mean cut a planet out so the end game could get more attention. Looking at TSL, I do tend to agree.

I don't think cutting a planet would have made a difference. What Obsidian should have cut to were some game elements that just flat out don't work properly.

 

 

 

The whole influence system for example. Sorry, but the influence system sucked, IMO. It simply does not work no matter what you tweak. And for Obsidian to base the basic dialog with NPCs against the influence system was stupid, also IMO. The way Bioware based game dialog against the Star Maps and experience points worked just fine for me, why wasn't that continued?

 

(BTW, I have NWN II but it won't run on our system, but an online friend has played and swears that the influence system in NWN II is just as, if not worse than, KotOR II. Geez, Obsidian, give it rest already! The whole influence concept isn't working. Move on to something new already... )

 

 

 

And while I did/do like the ability to make soooooo much stuff at the workbench, it wouldn't have absolutely killed them (Obsidian) to cut that aspect, or at least to tone it down a bit--you know, to pay more attention to something more important, like say the actual storyline, now would it?

 

 

 

Agreed. While I lament what TSL could have been, I also don't lose track of how Obsidian was able to push out a workable (if cut) game in so short a time. In and off itself that is an incredible achievement IMHO.

Yes, but to release, what in my opinion, is a far inferior product to the first game (storyline-wise and simple playability) is not something to be all that proud of.

 

 

 

Seriously, once I completed KotOR II, I sat on my sofa (played this on the XBox first) and thought, "WTF!? Did I--did I do something wrong somewhere? What the hell was that all about?"

 

Then, after two more playthroughs, I finally had to get on the Bioware and Obsidian boards to actually realize that that was how the game was supposed to end. Uh...okay...

 

 

 

I think what it all boils down to is that Obsidian had absolutely fabulous ideas for KotOR II, ideas that IMHO would have made for one d@mn fine gaming experience that I would probably still be playing right now, but that they overreached themselves on the whole game concept and it turned around and bit them in the a$$ when the former lords of Lucas Arts wanted the finished product earlier than anticipated. You can blame Obsidian for their own hubris, or you can blame the former lords of Lucas Arts. But either way, the game is still bad, IMO, no matter who is truly at fault.

 

 

 

To me, and this is still my own opinion, KotOR still is the better of the two games, even though, yes, Obsidian introduced newer game mechanics, etc... KotOR still shines brighter on the gaming frontier for me because it is a more cohesive and out-and-out better game than KotOR II is, as it was released.

 

So they released the game in 13 months. *shrug* It still isn't a finished product, as is, to me...

 

 

 

And another thing, for a company to almost completely rely on outsiders (i.e. amateur game devs and fans/modders) to have to tweak--and in all truthfulness, FIX--their product isn't the most reliable way to build one's name in the gaming industry.

[Jediphile]

I don't think cutting a planet would have made a difference. What Obsidian should have cut to were some game elements that just flat out don't work properly.

 

I think Avellone meant that in the sense of cutting work on one planet so that they could do the endgame right. Given how TSL ends, I do see his point...

 

The whole influence system for example. Sorry, but the influence system sucked, IMO. It simply does not work no matter what you tweak.

 

Well, I'm on the fence there. I agree the influence system was very badly implemented, but it was a good idea IMHO. It also lacked consistency - if I turn Handmaiden evil, then she shouldn't be complaining about me taking DS choices, for example.

 

And for Obsidian to base the basic dialog with NPCs against the influence system was stupid, also IMO. The way Bioware based game dialog against the Star Maps and experience points worked just fine for me, why wasn't that continued?

 

If the influence system had worked better, it would have been preferable to KotOR's system, I think. Problem is, influence mattered in far too few situations.

 

And while I did/do like the ability to make soooooo much stuff at the workbench, it wouldn't have absolutely killed them (Obsidian) to cut that aspect, or at least to tone it down a bit--you know, to pay more attention to something more important, like say the actual storyline, now would it?

 

No. But now that it's there, I'd like to keep it. It IS a nice feature, I think.

 

Yes, but to release, what in my opinion, is a far inferior product to the first game (storyline-wise and simple playability) is not something to be all that proud of.

 

Well, I can't argue with that. It was Lucasarts choice and not Obsidian's, though. And since LA is quiet on the subject, I guess we have our answer.

 

Seriously, once I completed KotOR II, I sat on my sofa (played this on the XBox first) and thought, "WTF!? Did I--did I do something wrong somewhere? What the hell was that all about?"

 

Then, after two more playthroughs, I finally had to get on the Bioware and Obsidian boards to actually realize that that was how the game was supposed to end. Uh...okay...

 

Your experience mirrors my own and probably that of most other players. Like I said, Avellone admits they should have devoted more time to the endgame. Once you meet with the masters on Dantooine, the whole plot takes a huge turn to the left. It's such a shame, since the plot is actually pretty solid IMHO

 

I think what it all boils down to is that Obsidian had absolutely fabulous ideas for KotOR II, ideas that IMHO would have made for one d@mn fine gaming experience that I would probably still be playing right now, but that they overreached themselves on the whole game concept and it turned around and bit them in the a$$ when the former lords of Lucas Arts wanted the finished product earlier than anticipated. You can blame Obsidian for their own hubris, or you can blame the former lords of Lucas Arts. But either way, the game is still bad, IMO, no matter who is truly at fault.

 

It's flawed and broken. I would hesitate to call it bad, though, because that seems to me to speak to the quality of the plot.

 

To me, and this is still my own opinion, KotOR still is the better of the two games, even though, yes, Obsidian introduced newer game mechanics, etc... KotOR still shines brighter on the gaming frontier for me because it is a more cohesive and out-and-out better game than KotOR II is, as it was released.

 

So they released the game in 13 months. *shrug* It still isn't a finished product, as is, to me...

 

As I've said before, I like TSL's plot more, but think KotOR is a better game. KotOR may be less original, but at least it's finished. Not an unimportant factor, to be sure.

 

And another thing, for a company to almost completely rely on outsiders (i.e. amateur game devs and fans/modders) to have to tweak--and in all truthfulness, FIX--their product isn't the most reliable way to build one's name in the gaming industry.

 

To be fair, though, Obsidian did want to do a content patch for the pc version of TSL, but Lucasarts wouldn't allow it. In short, they didn't cause the mess, but they did try to clean it up where they could, but weren't allowed to.

[Char Ell]

You can blame Obsidian for their own hubris, or you can blame the former lords of Lucas Arts.

Query: to whom do you refer when you say "former lords of Lucas Arts?" Are you saying you used to consider LucasArts execs as "lords" until you played TSL or do you refer to former LucasArts employees or something else altogether?

 

After reading a not-so spoiler of NWN 2, I have to honestly say that Obsidian should not touch KotOR 3.

Based off comments made by BioWare staffers on BioWare's forums it doesn't appear that there is any real chance BioWare will develop KotOR 3. So that pretty much leaves Obsidian or some other RPG developer to make it happen. Sorry Mac.

[Jediphile]

Query: to whom do you refer when you say "former lords of Lucas Arts?" Are you saying you used to consider LucasArts execs as "lords" until you played TSL or do you refer to former LucasArts employees or something else altogether?

 

If I may make an assumption, I think that refers to a group of people involved with the KotOR projects who were fired a few months before TSL hit the streets. Otherwise I'm not sure at all...

 

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/08/13/news_6104775.html

[Pavlos]

The whole influence system for example. Sorry, but the influence system sucked, IMO. It simply does not work no matter what you tweak. And for Obsidian to base the basic dialog with NPCs against the influence system was stupid, also IMO. The way Bioware based game dialog against the Star Maps and experience points worked just fine for me, why wasn't that continued?

 

It's entirely a matter of opinion . I thought that the influence system was a nice idea and relatively well implemented but it didn't reach the level advertised; the tag line should have been "This time your choices affect everyone around you... to a point." In the end I think it came out as a nice minigame - which was probably not the intention.

 

Anyway, the idea of your companions telling you things only as you gain trust with them is a little more realistic than the "Oh, you've levelled up! I'm going to talk to you now about my past" affair that KotOR was. I think the foolish thing was for Obsidian to lock essential information about your party members (vital to the plot - the Mass Shadow Generator, anyone?) behind ridiculously high influence checks.

 

(BTW, I have NWN II but it won't run on our system, but an online friend has played and swears that the influence system in NWN II is just as, if not worse than, KotOR II. Geez, Obsidian, give it rest already! The whole influence concept isn't working. Move on to something new already... )

 

Well, I wouldn't go on the opinion of one person, especially when you haven't played the game yourself . In my view, the influence system works much better in NWN2 than it does in TSL. Mostly because your influence with the party members actually matters when it comes to the endgame - where the betrayals take place in a nicely written sequence. Also, there is a lot more NPC-party interaction, your party members are constantly butting in (something I missed in KotOR II) so there are plenty of opportunities to gain or lose influence with your companions.

 

Yes, but to release, what in my opinion, is a far inferior product to the first game (storyline-wise and simple playability) is not something to be all that proud of.

 

I love TSL and I love KotOR. KotOR is a sweeping epic with a tight finesse that one cannot help but appreciate, I love it for that reason. TSL is a quiet character study where the primary theme is not "save the galaxy" but the master-pupil relationship. Up until Malachor V, I honestly believed that TSL was a better game than the first one. Tragically, the planet was as dead as everyone said it was. When I add up the pros and cons of both games, I see them as equal in stature, different but equal.

 

And another thing, for a company to almost completely rely on outsiders (i.e. amateur game devs and fans/modders) to have to tweak--and in all truthfulness, FIX--their product isn't the most reliable way to build one's name in the gaming industry.

 

I know someone who works for Sega and from what he's said, Obsidian seem to have a rather positive reputation among publishers.

[mjpb3]

Well, I'm on the fence there. I agree the influence system was very badly implemented, but it was a good idea IMHO. It also lacked consistency - if I turn Handmaiden evil, then she shouldn't be complaining about me taking DS choices, for example.

 

I never said it wasn't a good idea. It was! But it does not work no matter what you do to tweak it

(and believe me, I have tried! )

 

 

No. But now that it's there, I'd like to keep it. It IS a nice feature, I think.

 

I still would have preferred a better storyline to being able to make beaucoup underlays or overlays.

 

 

Your experience mirrors my own and probably that of most other players. Like I said, Avellone admits they should have devoted more time to the endgame. Once you meet with the masters on Dantooine, the whole plot takes a huge turn to the left. It's such a shame, since the plot is actually pretty solid IMHO

 

EXACTLY! Once you get to the masters on Dantooine the game goes from "Okay, this is sorta good" to "What the heck just happened? Did I do something wrong!? Did I miss something somewhere!?"

 

 

It's flawed and broken. I would hesitate to call it bad, though, because that seems to me to speak to the quality of the plot.

 

Seeing as how the plot depends on the playablity of the game, IMO, then I would still say the game suffers because the plot is screwed up in too many places to be able to truly defend it and say that K2 is a good game. It's not. Granted, there were some outstanding ideas and game mechanics implemented in the game, but to me, it is still a far cry away from the solidity of KotOR.

 

 

Query: to whom do you refer when you say "former lords of Lucas Arts?" Are you saying you used to consider LucasArts execs as "lords" until you played TSL or do you refer to former LucasArts employees or something else altogether?

If I may make an assumption, I think that refers to a group of people involved with the KotOR projects who were fired a few months before TSL hit the streets.

 

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/08/13/news_6104775.html

 

Yes, those employees are whom I am referring to when I stated "lords of Lucas Arts", as in dark overlords, as in I was being a complete smart a$$

 

 

It's entirely a matter of opinion . I thought that the influence system was a nice idea and relatively well implemented but it didn't reach the level advertised; the tag line should have been "This time your choices affect everyone around you... to a point." In the end I think it came out as a nice minigame - which was probably not the intention.

 

Totally your opinion, of course. Personally I thought the influence system was very flawed--and yes---sucked big time.

 

 

Anyway, the idea of your companions telling you things only as you gain trust with them is a little more realistic than the "Oh, you've levelled up! I'm going to talk to you now about my past" affair that KotOR was. I think the foolish thing was for Obsidian to lock essential information about your party members (vital to the plot - the Mass Shadow Generator, anyone?) behind ridiculously high influence checks.

 

Precisely why I say the influence system sucked. It was absolutely the first big major flaw I found in the game as a whole, and it has always bugged me that there are certain dialogs that you do not get as a player if the influence check fails--i.e. some of Disciple's dialog, and being taught Force Sight by Visas, etc... That is why I say the influence system sucks. The idea of it was wonderful, and if it actually did work as advertised, then I would be the first to say I am wrong, but on this, I don't think I am...

 

 

Well, I wouldn't go on the opinion of one person, especially when you haven't played the game yourself . In my view, the influence system works much better in NWN2 than it does in TSL. Mostly because your influence with the party members actually matters when it comes to the endgame - where the betrayals take place in a nicely written sequence. Also, there is a lot more NPC-party interaction, your party members are constantly butting in (something I missed in KotOR II) so there are plenty of opportunities to gain or lose influence with your companions.

 

I have absolutely no reason to disbelieve my online friend, and considering that she is as big of a fan of KotOR as me, I will still trust her judgement... thanks.

 

 

I love TSL and I love KotOR. KotOR is a sweeping epic with a tight finesse that one cannot help but appreciate...

 

Precisely my point. I know K2 has fans, and believe it or not, in some ways I am one of them... to an extent. The overall IDEA of KotOR: TSL was outstanding, and if they (Obsidian) had pulled it off, I would be singing their praises from the rooftops and still playing the game right now. But, IMO, they didn't pull it off. The game is bad--not horrid, just bad.

 

My whole point is that I didn't plop down 50 bucks on the XBox version of the game and 50 bucks on the PC version to play a great IDEA. I paid that money to play a good game, on both systems, and as far as I am concerned, I got cheated out of 100 bucks in all because both versions of the game are very flawed. Granted, they did patch a few fixes from the XBox version for the PC version, but not enough for me to say they FIXED the game because it is still so very very broken.

 

 

I know someone who works for Sega and from what he's said, Obsidian seem to have a rather positive reputation among publishers.

 

Good for them.

 

I was speaking more from a fan of the company POV... as in would I buy another game from them after seeing what they have done so far... Well, obviously I am a glutton for punishment because I did buy NWN II--but hey! That was because of Bioware too.

 

 

But would I buy a strictly OBSIDIAN title? Err, probably not...

 

 

If Obsidian does make K3--if K3 is even made--yes, I will get it, just to see how it ends, but it will be with the old saying in mind (as I take the game to the register), "Hope for the best, but expect the worst"...

[Jediphile]

I still would have preferred a better storyline to being able to make beaucoup underlays or overlays.

 

Well, better story always gets my vote. The workbence is nice, though. But to be fair, I didn't even realise how much you could exploit it with the right skills at high levels until my fourth or so playthrough... So actually finishing the game would definitely have been preferable in any event.

 

EXACTLY! Once you get to the masters on Dantooine the game goes from "Okay, this is sorta good" to "What the heck just happened? Did I do something wrong!? Did I miss something somewhere!?"

 

Yes, that does seem to be the exact point where things started to go wrong. I don't recall anyone ever objecting to that.

 

Seeing as how the plot depends on the playablity of the game, IMO, then I would still say the game suffers because the plot is screwed up in too many places to be able to truly defend it and say that K2 is a good game. It's not. Granted, there were some outstanding ideas and game mechanics implemented in the game, but to me, it is still a far cry away from the solidity of KotOR.

 

As I've said before, KotOR is a better game than TSL because it's more polished and - more importantly - because it's finished. Yes they cut stuff from KotOR, too, but it didn't hurt the game. Sadly the same cannot be said for TSL IMHO. I still think TSL has a deeper, better, and stronger plot, though... and with more memorable characters, particularly among the villains.

 

Yes, those employees are whom I am referring to when I stated "lords of Lucas Arts", as in dark overlords, as in I was being a complete smart a$$

 

"Smart a$$" status now secured!

 

Precisely why I say the influence system sucked. It was absolutely the first big major flaw I found in the game as a whole, and it has always bugged me that there are certain dialogs that you do not get as a player if the influence check fails--i.e. some of Disciple's dialog, and being taught Force Sight by Visas, etc... That is why I say the influence system sucks. The idea of it was wonderful, and if it actually did work as advertised, then I would be the first to say I am wrong, but on this, I don't think I am...

 

Those are indeed bad examples of the influence system's flaws. I even think I missed Visas' force sight until I remembered something about that from one of the trailers and began looking into the matter... on my third playthrough. Not good indeed.

 

Precisely my point. I know K2 has fans, and believe it or not, in some ways I am one of them... to an extent. The overall IDEA of KotOR: TSL was outstanding, and if they (Obsidian) had pulled it off, I would be singing their praises from the rooftops and still playing the game right now. But, IMO, they didn't pull it off. The game is bad--not horrid, just bad.

 

I wouldn't go quite that far myself. It definitely is flawed, but bad? Not IMHO. YMMV...

 

My whole point is that I didn't plop down 50 bucks on the XBox version of the game and 50 bucks on the PC version to play a great IDEA. I paid that money to play a good game, on both systems, and as far as I am concerned, I got cheated out of 100 bucks in all because both versions of the game are very flawed. Granted, they did patch a few fixes from the XBox version for the PC version, but not enough for me to say they FIXED the game because it is still so very very broken.

 

That does indeed suck

 

If Obsidian does make K3--if K3 is even made--yes, I will get it, just to see how it ends, but it will be with the old saying in mind (as I take the game to the register), "Hope for the best, but expect the worst"...

 

Well, I'd probably get K3 just to see what the heck happens next in the plot. But I agree that after the sorry state TSL wound up in, my expectations will be low indeed.

[mjpb3]

I wouldn't go quite that far myself. It definitely is flawed, but bad? Not IMHO. YMMV...

 

Sorry to disagree, but I think I meant what I wrote. To me, it is a bad game. Not horrid, just bad (mind you, I've played worse, but not by much). But then again, I was spoiled, I did play KotOR first.

 

 

"Smart a$$" status now secured!

 

Cool. I've never been an official smarta$$--well, except in my own family.

 

 

Well, I'd probably get K3 just to see what the heck happens next in the plot. But I agree that after the sorry state TSL wound up in, my expectations will be low indeed.

 

Exactly.

 

 

Once again, everything I've written is my own opinion, which I am entitled to, just as everyone else is entitled to their own opinion. I think Obsidian did good with the overall "concept" of K2, but the execution failed and the game suffers for it. Who to blame is a matter of opinion as well.

 

Anyway,I would love to see Bioware finish the KotOR storyline, but it ain't gonna happen, so I guess we will get Obsidian to finish the story. The whole point of my posts is to state that I just hope that they (Obsidian) don't screw up on K3 (if it's even made) like they did with K2...

[KyleOfHarpenden]

id like to see epic games work on it because that way they'll hopefully do what they did with gears of war(which is an amazing game) and bring out tones of free extra content =)

[Sam!]

I reckon Obsidion and Bioware did a good job, but I really actually liked K2 better. I reckon the plot was better and well... I like how you can get more lightsaber crystals and more items, but I must say I HATED being on Telos. Telos is the biggest mistake Obsidion made I reckon, but I think the part I hated most on K1 would be the Star Forge...

 

And is there any real proof K3 will be released?

[Jediphile]

And is there any real proof K3 will be released?

 

No, none. Not yet. Lots of speculation and false rumors, but that's about it...

[kotor_freak]

I agree that TSL could of been better, but i found it quite interesting, ok theirs some bugs, glitches, maybe a nice ending to sort out but it added up great.

 

I can only say that it's not they're fault seen as they were rushed to finish the game for an earlier release.

 

I can bet, if they're given enough time to make K3 it would be near flawless.

 

And ( if i can remeber correctly ) wasn't it Bioware that reccomended Obsidian to make TSL?

 

True, it could of been better, but given enough time, i reckon they could pull a game out that would be perfect.

[Darca Lar]

Yep, and if LucasArts wants to make up for it, they'll make the right decision.

[JediMasterJambi]

Obsidian didn't ruin KOTOR 2, Lucas Arts did.

[Jediphile]

Obsidian didn't ruin KOTOR 2, Lucas Arts did.

 

QFT

[kotor_freak]

OFT?

 

Quoted for.....?

 

Just type out the sentence, i'm not up to speed with all this "hip" talk

[Gargoyle King]

OFT?

 

Quoted for.....?

 

Just type out the sentence, i'm not up to speed with all this "hip" talk

 

Quite F****** True i believe? You'll see why then this wasn't typed into the thread!