McCain Vs. Obama.

[ChAiNz.2da]

let's get back on topic guys.. you know Obama Vs. McCain, and keep the personal insults down to minimum (like zero). If you want to continue to badmouth each other, email works great. These forums.. not so much. -Cz

[Nedak]

*Snort* Yeah, a bunch of under-trained, poorly-equipped, and outnumbered civilians could never defeat the army of the greatest empire in the world, could they?

 

Oh.

 

Wait.

 

Yeah, give the Brits nukes, tanks, stealth bombers, and thinks that we can't even imagine.

 

I bet we would have won the revolutionary war then.

 

But frankly, we're digressing from my original point, which is that humanity has a tendency towards Evil, not anything about rebellion or revolution.

 

Tendency? That doesn't mean were destined to everlasting evil..

 

Also, you're taking your sources from the bible.

 

I suggest to keep religion and politics separate. It's what is killing our country the way it is.

 

let's get back on topic guys.. you know Obama Vs. McCain, and keep the personal insults down to minimum (like zero).

 

I was.. sort-of on topic. haha

 

Back on topic then!

[Corinthian]

The Bible enlightened me. Everything I see in the world just makes it more and more obviously true to me. I haven't been using the Bible as a source. Frankly, I didn't anticipate the debate flaring into a tangent on how I'm wrong because I don't believe Humanity is some kind of paragon of virtue.

 

I don't see myself advocating mixing religion and politics, either. You're projecting a bit, aren't you?

[Nedak]

Frankly, I didn't anticipate the debate flaring into a tangent on how I'm wrong because I don't believe Humanity is some kind of paragon of virtue.

I never said it was a "paragon of virtue".

 

I don't see myself advocating mixing religion and politics, either. You're projecting a bit, aren't you?

 

You did the moment you brought up "Original Sin".

 

 

Anyways, I'm going to respect the Mods and not respond to you after this unless it has something to do with McCain VS. Obama.

[Web Rider]

The Bible enlightened me. Everything I see in the world just makes it more and more obviously true to me. I haven't been using the Bible as a source. Frankly, I didn't anticipate the debate flaring into a tangent on how I'm wrong because I don't believe Humanity is some kind of paragon of virtue.

 

I don't see myself advocating mixing religion and politics, either. You're projecting a bit, aren't you?

 

If he gets to stay off topic, I'll wait till a mod just prunes this or splits it to go back.

 

First, your twisting the words people have said and you know it. Nobody said humanity was a paragon of virtue, we simply defended it from being called the epitome of evil. And any tangent brought about here is brought about solely of your own doing.

 

And you are being called wrong because that is the truth. You have made a dozen inaccurate claims, you have falsely accused the whole of humanity of being responsible for the faults of some, and stated that no advancement in society and culture has been made since the time of the greeks simply because a few pockets of things that existed then still exist now.

 

And nobody is projecting, you are bringing religion in to this discussion and denying it is flagrant disrespect for people's ability to read the words you've written in this topic. "original sin" repeated regerences to your religion guiding your thoughts, more mentions of the Bible as defining fact. If that's not "bringing religion" into this discussion, you must simply not be reading the words you've written.

[Corinthian]

I never suggested that McCain's policies had anything to do with original sin. That's just my perspective on human psychology, which has only a passing relationship with politics.

 

You defended it very poorly, given that basically all your comments are "No, you're wrong, Corinthian, humanity is good guys." I mean, come on, Rider, you can do better than THAT.

 

Because it's the truth? Riiight. Where'd you get the malev-o-meter, and what's humanity's baseline on it?

 

He's projecting because he's suggesting that my belief in original sin somehow effects politics, which is frankly ridiculous. I didn't say anything about bringing religion into the discussion, but we got onto the subject of humanity's baseline morality and thus my belief in original sin was brought into play. I won't apologize for 'letting my religion guide my thoughts' given that the presence of a deity WOULD TEND to throw a bit of a curveball into anyone's belief system.

[Web Rider]

I never suggested that McCain's policies had anything to do with original sin. That's just my perspective on human psychology, which has only a passing relationship with politics.

What forum are you reading? McCain hasn't been in this discussion for almost a page now.

 

You defended it very poorly, given that basically all your comments are "No, you're wrong, Corinthian, humanity is good guys." I mean, come on, Rider, you can do better than THAT.

And you've done any better? your arguments are at best, weak, arrogant and heavy handed. And All I've said is "humanity has good IN IT" I have no said all of humanity is good. And if you blatantly lie about what's been written I'll start reporting your posts for flagrant harassment.

 

Because it's the truth? Riiight. Where'd you get the malev-o-meter, and what's humanity's baseline on it?

Funny, I haven't seen YOURS either.

 

He's projecting because he's suggesting that my belief in original sin somehow effects politics, which is frankly ridiculous. I didn't say anything about bringing religion into the discussion, but we got onto the subject of humanity's baseline morality and thus my belief in original sin was brought into play. I won't apologize for 'letting my religion guide my thoughts' given that the presence of a deity WOULD TEND to throw a bit of a curveball into anyone's belief system.

"projecting" is the act of putting what one feels on to others. To project your feelings or opinions is to take what you think, what you feel, and claim to see it in others.

 

And what on earth are you talking about with "the presence of a deity"? Did God come down and tell you to write these posts? I'm not asking you to apologize for anything, I'm TELLING you to admit to it instead of beating around the bush and changing the topic.

[Arcesious]

Wow... Well I certainly missed out on quite the sniping deathmatch...

 

Oh wait... It's still going.

[Corinthian]

Oh, right, sorry. You were complaining about how I was mixing religion and politics, I figured you must have assumed I was defending McCain or something like that. Frankly, it's kind of hard to track your thought patterns.

 

Alright, I'll go with that - There is some good in Humanity. I'm just saying we're more inclined towards Evil. History backs me up.

 

Hey, I've got a book that backs me up, and it even claims to be the Word of God. That's got to be worth at least one or two points.

 

Yes, thank you for the lesson, Web Rider. Unfortunately, I ALREADY KNEW THAT.

 

What I'm going on about is that the existence of a God logically SHOULD alter one's beliefs a considerable amount, including political beliefs. Geez.

[Web Rider]

Oh, right, sorry. You were complaining about how I was mixing religion and politics, I figured you must have assumed I was defending McCain or something like that. Frankly, it's kind of hard to track your thought patterns.

Yours are equally difficult to comprehend their direction.

 

Hey, I've got a book that backs me up, and it even claims to be the Word of God. That's got to be worth at least one or two points.

Yeah, well I've got a book that backs me up, it's written by some other god who said differently.

 

What I'm going on about is that the existence of a God logically SHOULD alter one's beliefs a considerable amount, including political beliefs. Geez.

I read it as the presence of god in your writing should alter the thinking of others. If it is yourself, then I suppose that the belief in the presence of a powerful entity in your own thoughts or writing would alter the way one things.

[Nedak]

Oh, right, sorry. You were complaining about how I was mixing religion and politics, I figured you must have assumed I was defending McCain or something like that. Frankly, it's kind of hard to track your thought patterns.

It sounds like you're having a hard time keeping track of your posts.

 

Alright, I'll go with that - There is some good in Humanity. I'm just saying we're more inclined towards Evil. History backs me up.

No you choose to only look at the Evil in humanity rather then the many good deeds we have done. The only reason you focus on the bad is because the bad things that have happened are more negatively impacting then the good things. As humans we tend to focus more on the bad then the good.

 

Hey, I've got a book that backs me up, and it even claims to be the Word of God. That's got to be worth at least one or two points.

 

I don't mean to start disclaiming beliefs in a political section, but I have a book that claims itself to be the words of Harry Potter. That has to be worth one or two points right?

 

 

What I'm going on about is that the existence of a God logically SHOULD alter one's beliefs a considerable amount, including political beliefs. Geez.

 

"I don't see myself advocating mixing religion and politics, either."

 

Sound familiar?

 

Alright, I'm officially done.

Couldn't resist.

[Corinthian]

So basically, were 1:1. Okay.

 

I don't recall trying to alter anyone's thinking, but if you WOULD alter your thinking to suit my beliefs, I'd be much obliged.

 

Yeah, Han, you got a point. My posts are filled with such utter brilliance, tracking every direction I'm going in is like stepping on the Mountains of Madness, where my genius feeds back on itself.

 

What good deeds? They are, for the most part, done by one or a small handful of good individuals. That hardly undermines my point. In fact, it kind of reinforces it.

 

I'd put that at a one point. Harry Potter never claims to be a God.

 

I'm not in politics, so it doesn't matter.

[Arcesious]

I suggest this thread be split off somewhere... Way off topic.... BTW, Corinthian, how hard is it to be positive about humanity? Seriously, come on! For all the bad in our history- we have made so much progress. Times change. And today is quite a fluctuating time. But if people can't change because of pessimistic dogmas... Well that's just no fun.

[Corinthian]

Pretty hard, actually. What's there to be positive about? I'll cut an individual some slack, give him or her the benefit of the doubt - certainly Humanity is not pure evil, as evidenced by sterling individuals like Mother Theresa, but as a whole, humanity really hasn't changed since the Roman Empire.

 

And, for the record, I prefer 'realism' to 'pessimism'. Namely, I dislike deluding myself as to the morality of humankind. Assuming the worst in this world is the smartest thing you can do.

[Arcesious]

Lol, 'delusion' and 'realism'? I dare say why we haven't changed enough because of religion. What if everyone all at once thought; "Hey, maybe it is possible for things to be better." Instead of thinking "well everyone's so blind and ignorant that nothing can change." You can be the change the world needs. Everyone can. Instead of looking to the sky for answers... The slightest difference makes a difference. That's why, whenever I get off of the Bus from school, I say "thank you sir/ma'am" to the driver. If we all just said thank you, or encourage each other, or give that poor waitress a big tip- the world would be way better off! Let's build each other up- not break each other down!

[Corinthian]

You REALLY think saying "Thank you, sir, or madam" will change the world? Did you get that from a public service announcement? That's charmingly idealistic, but you ARE aware you don't live in a Saturday Morning Cartoon, right?

[El Sitherino]

Alright, I'm just gonna go ahead and close this thread for religio-emotional bull****.

Keep the arguments to facts people, this is debate not a pissing contest.

 

Secondly, 150,000 is not middle class. That's upper class.

 

 

And finally, just because man may be more inclined toward evil does not excuse evil acts. You want to encourage and further these acts, do so elsewhere. Here, and in America from what I remember, we're civilized people and can do better than evil acts.

It's funny how someone who's probably never been shot likes to make a lot of tough talk when it's not his ass on the front lines getting shot. Now I'm not in the military myself, but I've sure as **** seen a lot more combat than any of you likely will, taking a life no matter what is a heavy toll on anyone.

 

I think you would all be well advised to remember we have to think about the things that are more important when it comes to elections. Besides, everyone complains about activist judges. No legislating outside the legislative branch. Let's keep your personal beliefs there, write your representatives.