C'jais Posted February 19, 2003 Share Posted February 19, 2003 Essay on the school system and its hierarchy of popularity. This is long. Likely too long for most of you, but don't worry, you only have to read the start of it to get the gist of what it's about. Being 17 myself, I can easily see evidence of this system in my daily life, even though there's nothing immediately similar to "high school" and "college" in my country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reborn Outcast Posted February 19, 2003 Share Posted February 19, 2003 Well I read most of it. And one line stuck out at me that is VERY untrue at my highschool. Being smart seems to make you unpopular. Thats the exact opposite at my school. In fact, being a dumbass (pardon my language) such as stealing and stuff makes you unpopular. I am smart and it shows in my grades and all my other friends are smart but we're one of the most popular groups. I don't know if our school is weird or something but our popular groups don't all hang out with each other. Yes there are the nerds and the Goths that noone "popular" really wants to talk to but in a sense, (now get this) if you look at it, NOONE in my school is popular or unpopular. The "cool" kids think that the nerds and Goths are unpopular BUT (and trust me I know this) the nerds and the Goths think that the "cool" kids are unpopular. Popularity in my school is what one thinks about ones self and not what the school thinks about that group. For example... I could think I'm sooo popular but 3/4 of the school could think I'm sooo unpopular. I guess our school is different because I hang out with everyone and everyone hangs out with everyone to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted February 19, 2003 Author Share Posted February 19, 2003 Your school does sound a bit strange, if there are no outcasts, and no mobbing as a consequence. Maybe your position has clouded your view of the school? Try reading more of the essay, as the authot goes to lengths explaining why being smart makes you unpopular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted February 19, 2003 Share Posted February 19, 2003 at my school everyone who doesnt wear AF clothes is picked on unless they are jocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 I am a nerd, i was ranked number one in my class until this semester, got my first B, and now i'm 3rd. But I'm not picked on for it, and i'm not unpopular. I actually have many friends from all different classes (i'm a senior this year) i'm not one of the "popular" kids..but it's kind of funny.....the "popular" kids in my school are no envied by anyone else....actually, they're mostly disliked because they think they're so superior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrion Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 It's wierd. I'm smart,but I get poor grades in my math(mostly due because I came into honors in second trimester,thus making me trying to regain 1 trimester of knowledge). I'm kinda popular,I mean, I have friends in almost every class,and I have friends I can go to at lunch,('cept for art,but I'd rather be alone then). It's all wierd. Ah well, I have a few nerdy friends. They arent bad,they're just different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwing Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 Popularity isn't even an issue at my school. The issues my school is more the culture-based cliques that form...although alot of students are trying to change that. (and succeeding ) I think the important thing about the real world is not that it's populated by adults, but that it's very large, and the things you do have real effects. That's what school, prison, and ladies-who-lunch all lack. That and other things postulated in the article don't hold true for my school...so I guess it really doesn't apply. As for the apparent running subtopic: I have no idea if I'd be considered a nerd. I'm not sure what a nerd is. ^^;; Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunClown Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 Is this essay supposed to be for American schools only? I can see where the guy is coming from, but he seems to rely on stereotypes way too much. My school kind of had a situation similar to Reborn Outcasts. However, I will say something that may be of interest in relation to this article. A few months before I was finishing school, a person who went to my school became a household name in Australia and shared the same last name as me. So the next day I get people acting nicer towards me who would have been snobbish before. This happened for about a week or two, until I had worked out why they were being so nice and said I wasn't related to this person. Then it all went back to normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowTemplar Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 Those of you who state that bullying is not a problem in your school are, IMVHO, blind. Most of what is in that essay actually holds true, at least in the cases that I know about. He does, though, underplay the educational benefit of the educational system. The very fact that he is able to write the essay is a testament to that. Also, in my experience, the problem is not in yrs 11-17, but rather in yrs 6-15. One point that he fails to adress, however, is that of leadership. Every time there is a scandalous bullying event in the news (teacher being bulled by parents/students (yes that actually happens in Denmark) or students driven to the edge of suicide by bullying), there is a failure in the leadership of the school. If the school leader is strong, then he can coordinate the teachers in a zero-tolerance policy towards bullying of the students, and that actually helps. And teachers being bullied by parents can, insofar they act in accordance with the school rules, send the angry parents to the leader of the school. If, on the other hand, the leadership is weak, then the teachers that actually try to do something about students bullying each other will get bullied themselves by colleagues who are afraid that they too will be ordered to do something about it. The only one to stop bullying amongst the teachers is the head of the school, but with a weakling in that chair, it's not going to happen. The second effect of a weak leadership is that the teachers will be left with responsibility that exeeds their madates and competences, because the leadership shifts jobs to them. That's my 2 cents... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reborn Outcast Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 Originally posted by ShadowTemplar Those of you who state that bullying is not a problem in your school are, IMVHO, blind. Most of what is in that essay actually holds true, at least in the cases that I know about. This is about popularity (not bullying), which, in my school at least, doesn't seem to be a factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted February 20, 2003 Author Share Posted February 20, 2003 Originally posted by Reborn Outcast This is about popularity (not bullying), which, in my school at least, doesn't seem to be a factor. Lack of popularity and bullying tend to go hand in hand. Most of you are describing a saintly school society in which none are unpopular, no one gets bullied, no one gets excluded from social activities and there's no hatred for the minority. I'm really sorry, but I just don't buy that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kstar__2 Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 this is fun, i go to a "nerd" school (well not really, but it is the highest possible high school) and you still see that devition (sp?) though i am a huge geek myself (really) everybody "accepts" me, no-one is giving me wierd looks. that's not true, the're a couple of guys that keep bugging me and my friends (alot of non-nerds too) but i guess they just don't like my face. i think that the nerd in school, become immence populair when they are in the "real world" because they knwo alot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowTemplar Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 Originally posted by kstar__2 i think that the nerd in school, become immence populair when they are in the "real world" because they knwo alot. Time is working for us, yes. With each passing day I see more and more proof that I was right, and those bullying me were wrong (every time I get a report card, for example). All power to the nerds! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunClown Posted February 21, 2003 Share Posted February 21, 2003 Does being smart make you a nerd? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZBomber Posted February 21, 2003 Share Posted February 21, 2003 People don't call me a nerd. I'm not popular. I'm not unpopular. People find me funny, because I'm always acting weird (example: In the middle of class, I will purposley yell out something like Leprachauns) Everyone laughs, even the teachers. The teachers don't say I'm fresh, cause I don't get in trouble. I have nerdy friends. If peopel make fun of them, I will stick up for them. (One of my friends is fat, for example) so when people make fun of him, I stick up for him (Sometimes, a Pyschical Lesson ) I'm smart, but the ladies in my school don't go for the big tough, punk guys. they go for the kind, smart ones. You wouldn't want to end up with someone who can't spell there name. Even if I was a nerd, I wouldn't care. As long as I had some friends, I would be happy. Yeh. 'll go back to my corner now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeskywalker1 Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 people who like different things in my school are the outcasts. i like Star Wars, but not a lot of other people do so they dont like me. they say your a nerd because of all that science fiction stuff. i know 5 or 6 people who like star wars. the rest say they dont or they are not a big fan of it. other things are laughed at too. being smart for example makes you sort of an outcast. im an average student who gets pretty good grades. As Bs and a C once in a while. i think you have to just find your group of friends, and stick with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeskywalker1 Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 Originally posted by C'jais Lack of popularity and bullying tend to go hand in hand. Most of you are describing a saintly school society in which none are unpopular, no one gets bullied, no one gets excluded from social activities and there's no hatred for the minority. I'm really sorry, but I just don't buy that. for once i agree with you. theres always someone being bullied, you just dont see it. there is no school were someone doesnt get beat up or mentally abused. in fact i dont think there is anywhere on earth you can go where someone isnt bullied. sorry for posting twice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunClown Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 i like Star Wars, but not a lot of other people do so they dont like me. they say your a nerd because of all that science fiction stuff. Huge tip. If there are any Star Trek fans here and you don't want people thinking your a Trekkie, instead of saying Star Trek, say Star Track. People will think your not a trekkie then. Anyway, those people who say they don't like Star Wars are probably closet fans, trying to stay popular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psydan Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 You mean I'm not popular anymore? Lol, well, everyone at my school who thinks they're cool, and trys too hard, it's kinda obvious they're not, but everyone that I can see has a group of friends, and though some of us are different, I can see that there aren't really any people who are as the author puts it "D" people. Everyone is basicly accepted, and the author seems to use a very stereotypical Jock/nerd veiwpoint.... but anyway. That's my veiw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Welshman Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 OK, I don't thinl this works in wales, the popular people are sometimes smarter than the unpopular, and most of the unpopular are dumbasses. So I gather, Im in the top class for most things, but im not exacly popular. Im not sayin I sit on my own and talk to myself, I have quite a large group of friends and am able to talk to people who I walk passed at random, Unless its a drugie, and they usually nod or say hi. Dont think Im THAT weird though, Its just what I do. I found this: The guys that guys envy, girls like. and stopped reading, not just because of that but most of the things in there seem completely diferent to life, except the 'elementary', or primary school bit. I think I used to be quite popular, dont know though because everyone seemed to be freinds(ish) The: The guys that guys envy, girls like., but is weird because the guys envy guys because the girls like them, not the girls like the guys because they are envied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted February 22, 2003 Author Share Posted February 22, 2003 A few logical points to remember. As the author said himself, being an outcast doesn't mean being friendless. A lot of you are pulling this from nowhere. You don't have to be a nerd to be bullied. Being smart doesn't make you a nerd or a person to be bullied - but it tends to be this way, as the really smart people usually have nonpopular hobbies etc. Last of all, to state that there are no persons in your school being bullied, no one is alone and outside the crowd and everyone has someone to talk to is just pure ignorance IMHO. I don't buy that horsesh/t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munik Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 I don't agree with the smart=nerd nerd=smart logic of the essay, but I understand the point. In my school, it wasn't so much as intelligence that made one popular or unpopular, as the amount of money ones family had. But I grew up in a very economically depressed, post-coal mining section of the Appalachian mountains. Not in the suburbs. So I believe the essay would still translate, even though it was written about a very different environment. I think that is why you see some odd descriptions of school life here. Not everyone grew up in the suburbs, and that is quite a specific type of life. I believed that school in the later grades was mostly a waste. I figure all that information could be learned in about a year, not 4 or 5. So I reasoned that later grades are there for the social interaction. Sort of to learn how to interact with others socially. What I never thought of was what the essay described. The social lessons that are taught are so specific to the few years of highschool that even they are useless. Social structure is jacked up in highschool, and while I went along with it then, I never realized what a waste it was. Except maybe as a harsh lesson of what not to do in a functional society. But maybe the lesson would be too subtle, except for those smart enough to see it. And then in turn the smart ones would later excel in a societal setting that they devised in opposition to the one they endured through highschool!! I just realized that I came to my own conclusion that exactly mirrors the one I just read in the essay. Wow. It's like an epiphany. I like how in the essay he points out that girls are much more crueler then the boys when it comes to bullying. Maybe in compensation for the lack of desire to physically harass? Or the inability to effectively intimidate. That's is also something that I believe endures on through maturity. Men outgrow the bullying aspect of adolesence, but women always seem to have that catty attitude. At least in my opinion. C'jais, I'm suprised to see that you are only 17. You just led me to re-formulate the opinion that all children are illogical, it must only apply to those children from the States. And maybe England too. So, in what land do they encourage such free thinking in their children? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted February 23, 2003 Author Share Posted February 23, 2003 Originally posted by munik I don't agree with the smart=nerd nerd=smart logic of the essay, but I understand the point. As do I. It seems as if he's trying to justify his suffering by drawing the conclusion that he was being picked on for simply being smarter than the average. Not everyone grew up in the suburbs, and that is quite a specific type of life. You're quite right - I should have taken that into account. My entire country is basically one, huge suburb. Could explain why I agree with his views on the school system. So, in what land do they encourage such free thinking in their children? Denmark - the land of beer and babes! Hint: look to the right of England, the top of Germany and the left of..... Sverige Thanks for the compliment (: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 popularity is for the self-concious. oh you know a person is self-absorbed when they call everyone "hey you" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reborn Outcast Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 Originally posted by munik C'jais, I'm suprised to see that you are only 17. You just led me to re-formulate the opinion that all children are illogical, it must only apply to those children from the States. And maybe England too. So, in what land do they encourage such free thinking in their children? I don't appreciate that little comment on the kids from the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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