munik Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 Originally posted by C'jais Can you give the location of those 3-4 dinosaurs? I'm very interested in this. One of the descriptions is in Job 40:15 and the next few verses. That one says behemoth. Later on in chapter 41 there is talk of a leviathan. The behemoth could be any animal, not just a dinosaur, and the leviathan could be a metaphor for god. Hell, it could all be metaphor, as it's the bible and not a real good place for discerning facts about history. I don't know of the other places in the bible that talk of supposed dinosaurs, that is just the one I've heard people refer to when they say the bible speaks of dinosaurs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Largo-LaGrande Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 Originally posted by Lost Welshman Lol, has anyone else seen the life of brian? What did you just think of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted April 23, 2003 Author Share Posted April 23, 2003 If you want to discuss things, do it in PM or AIM please. Not here. You're trying to get this off topic and turned into a debate. but anyway, since someone already lit the match. I'm posting this, then pouring a bucket of water on it Most of us loved reading about dinosaurs at some time in our lives. In 1993, the movie “Jurassic Park” stimulated the public interest in dinosaurs far beyond its previous level. As a result, increasing numbers of people have thought, “Since we have found all these fossils and dinosaur bones, we know dinosaurs existed. How come they are not mentioned in the Bible?” Actually, dinosaurs are mentioned in the Bible, and we will prove it by doing the following three things: Examining the Bible’s text and the related scientific facts. Explaining the accuracy of the Bible. Exploring what we are taught in school and through the media. The Bible’s Text The Bible refers to many the common animals we know today. The list includes lions, wolves, bears, sheep, cattle and dogs along with various kinds of birds, rodents, reptiles, and insects. What is interesting is that this extensive list includes three animals that we no longer recognize. These three are (in the original Hebrew language) tanniyn, b@hemowth (yes, it’s spelled correctly—at least as close as we can get in Roman characters), and livyathan. Although we alter the spelling of behemoth and Leviathan slightly, we still use those same words in bibles today. However, tanniyn is always translated into another word when we write it in English. Tanniyn occurs 28 times in the Bible and is normally translated “dragon.” It is also translated “serpent,” “sea monster,” “dinosaur,” “great creature,” and “reptile.” Behemoth and Leviathan are relatively specific creatures, perhaps each was a single kind of animal. Tanniyn is a more general term, and it can be thought of as the original version of the word “dinosaur.” The word “dinosaur” was originally coined in 1841, more than three thousand years after the Bible first referred to “Tanniyn.” To make things clearer, we constructed the following table comparing the scientific names with the Biblical names tanniyn, behemoth, and Leviathan. “Dinosaur” Names, Then and Now Name and date first written in the Bible Scientific Name (best estimate) and date the name appeared tanniyn (dragon) before 1400 BC dinosaur 1841 AD behemoth before 1400 BC brachiosaurus 1903 AD Leviathan before 1400 BC kronosaurus 1901 AD How we got these new names is interesting. In 1822, Mary Ann Mantell became the first person to discover and correctly identify a strange bone as part of a large, unknown reptile. Her husband, Dr. Gideon Mantell, later named this creature an “Iguanodon.” From that time forward, these forgotten animals were given names chosen by the people who rediscovered them. Of course, the Bible, written between approximately 1450 BC and 95 AD, does not include any of these names. Reading the Bible carefully, you will realize that no living creature matches the descriptions of behemoth and Leviathan. However, if you grab your kid’s dinosaur book, you will notice several possible matches for each one. Let’s examine those. Behemoth has the following attributes according to Job 40:15-24 It “eats grass like an ox.” It “moves his tail like a cedar.” (In Hebrew, this literally reads, “he lets hang his tail like a cedar.”) Its “bones are like beams of bronze, His ribs like bars of iron.” “He is the first of the ways of God.” “He lies under the lotus trees, In a covert of reeds and marsh.” Some bibles and study bibles will translate the word “behemoth” as “elephant” or “hippopotamus.” Others will put a note at the edge or bottom of the page, stating that behemoth was probably an elephant or a hippopotamus. Although an elephant or hippopotamus can eat grass (or lie in a covert of reeds and marsh), neither an elephant or a hippopotamus has a “tail like a cedar” (that is, a tail like a large, tapered tree trunk). In your kid’s dinosaur book you will find lots of animals that have “tails like a cedar.” We would expect behemoth to be a large land animal whose bones are like beams of bronze and so forth, so whatever a behemoth is, it is large. A key phrase is “He is the first of the ways of God.” This phrase in the original Hebrew implied that behemoth was the biggest animal created. Although an elephant or a hippopotamus are big, they are less than one-tenth the size of a Brachiosaurus, the largest (complete) dinosaur ever discovered.[1] A Brachiosaurus could therefore easily be described as “the first of the ways of God.” Comparing all this information to the description in your kid’s dinosaur book, you may come to the conclusion that “behemoth” is not a normal animal, it is a dinosaur—the brachiosaurus. Note: Some paleontologists have found fragmentary leg bones, ribs, or vertebrae which they propose belong to “new” sauropods larger than Brachiosaurus. Examples of these include Amphicoelias, Argentinasaurus, Sauroposeidon, Seismosaurus, Supersaurus and Ultrasaurus. There currently is not enough evidence to really determine the size of any of these, and some paleontologists believe that they are merely large examples of known dinosaurs like Brachiosaurus or Diplodocus. In any case, only the “modern scientific name” of behemoth would change. The point would still remain that behemoth refers to a dinosaur, not a “modern animal” like an elephant or hippopotamus. Leviathan has the following attributes according to Job chapter 41, Psalm 104:25,26 and Isaiah 27:1. This is only a partial listing—just enough to make the point. “No one is so fierce that he would dare stir him up.” “Who can open the doors of his face, with his terrible teeth all around?” “His rows of scales are his pride, shut up tightly as with a seal; one is so near another that no air can come between them; they are joined one to another, they stick together and cannot be parted.” “His sneezings flash forth light, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning. Out of his mouth go burning lights; sparks of fire shoot out. Smoke goes out of his nostrils, as from a boiling pot and burning rushes. His breath kindles coals, and a flame goes out of his mouth.” “Though the sword reaches him, it cannot avail; nor does spear, dart, or javelin. He regards iron as straw, and bronze as rotten wood. The arrow cannot make him flee; slingstones become like stubble to him. Darts are regarded as straw; he laughs at the threat of javelins.” “On earth there is nothing like him, which is made without fear.” Leviathan “played” in the “great and wide sea” (a paraphrase of Psalm 104 verses 25 and 26—get the exact sense by reading them yourself). Leviathan is a “reptile [1] that is in the sea.” (Isaiah 27:1) [1] Note: The word translated “reptile” here is the Hebrew word tanniyn. This shows that “Leviathan” was also a “tanniyn” (dragon). Unlike behemoth, who is huge, Leviathan is ferocious and terrifying. Many references (we have not listed them all) refer to the sea, so Leviathan is probably a sea creature. Although some bibles refer to Leviathan as an alligator or crocodile (and both of these are fierce) neither of these is a sea creature. They like the water, but they spend much of their time on land. Further, the question “Who can open the doors of his face. . . .” implies that nobody can pry Leviathan’s jaws open. Yet we are all familiar with “alligator wrestlers” who routinely pry open an alligator’s jaws. Alligators do not match the description of Leviathan—and we are not done yet. The description of the scales is interesting. Several verses describe these great scales. Compared to Leviathan’s armor, iron is like straw and arrows ca not make it flee. Let’s face it, an arrow can do a lot of damage to a crocodile or alligator. This is not a description of either of them—or any living animal we are aware of. And now for the key ingredient: fire. It is hard to read Job 41:18-21 without realizing the Bible is telling us that Leviathan breathes fire. That alone will eliminate almost every living animal. Yes, there is one animal that can spew fire in today’s world. It is called a bombardier beetle. This beetle is a native of Central America, and has a nozzle in its hind end that acts like a little flame thrower. It sprays a high-temperature jet of gas (fueled by hydroquinones and hydrogen peroxide with oxidative enzymes) for protection. Now, if a Central American beetle has a built-in flame thrower, so could Leviathan. By the way, crocodiles and alligators are out of the picture on this one, don’t you agree? Before we leave the topic of fire, there are two more notes you may find interesting: The history of every culture is filled with stories of fire-breathing dragons. If you think about it, in all the past ages wouldn’t someone have made up a story of a fire-breathing lion or something? Nobody did because the dragon stories are based on truth, and only “dragons” breathed fire. It is easy to imagine Leviathan as a member of the dragon (tanniyn) family. (Plus, Isaiah 27:1 strongly implies this connection.) Many fossil dinosaur skulls contain unexplained, empty passages. Scientists have not been able to guess the reason for these passages. Would it make sense that some dinosaurs used these passages as “gas tanks” for the combustible mixture used to “breathe fire?” Comparing all this information to the description in your kid’s dinosaur book, you may come up with the conclusion that Leviathan is a kronosaurus. The kronosaurus is the best match of any known creature to the description of Leviathan What We Are Taught (In School and Through the Media) Since humans are in the Bible, we unconsciously think that dinosaurs were extinct—and therefore not mentioned in the Bible. As you have just seen, the Bible not only refers to dinosaurs, but has detailed information about two of them. Unfortunately, our public school system and the media have convinced us that dinosaurs were extinct at least 60 million years before man appeared on earth. They have done such a good job in this area that we can not imagine people and dinosaurs living at the same time. The fact is that dinosaurs were created only one day before mankind, not many millions of years earlier—and there is have evidence to support that statement at http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/creation.shtml btw C'jais, check out http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/b_proof.shtml sometime There, you got your requested info. Please no debating inside the forum. Continue in AIM or PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedantic Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Very nice poem, it's too bad someone had to go and play semantics with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agen Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Why don't the people who wanna discuss that gibberish go to the senate chamre or something. This a topic about a poem. A nice poem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munik Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Ok, I made a big deal about using the word "hands". So what? I didn't ask you anything, my first post didn't require a reply. Yet you reply to it then tell me not to debate what you say. So I do, then you reply again and then tell me again not to debate with you. If you don't want to debate anything stop posting stuff. Simple as that. I am not trying to get this post off topic. You posted a poem, then everyone replies with praise. There is no topic there. None. So a discussion comes up, and I did not start it with any malice, just pointing out something. So what's the harm there? We get to discuss something interesting amongst ourselves. This upsets you why? Are the only replies allowed here ones that stroke your ego? Can we move past your poem? This post has evolved, yet you want it to stay as it was, a thousand replies stating "good poem". The senate is not the only forum for discussion. This forum is here for discussion as well. Says so on the link. If you don't like the discussion going on here, why do you keep reading the replies? I know Rp keeps checking back to see if the new post is more praise for his poem, but why everyone else? Do you guys like reading more replies of praise for Rp's poem? Or do you just keep reading so you can post a reply telling me or others to stop debating, or to take our discussion elsewhere? So, if you are gonna make it your mission to keep people from discussing things in this thread, I reckon you won't reply to questions or opinions to your last post. Except to tell me to stop discussing. Not that I would expect much in the way of a reply, considering you cut and pasted that whole thing. I sort of figured someone who has "gone through EXTENSIVE studies on the Bible" and believes that riding the coat tails of his father gives him merit would be able to formulate and express his own ideas and opinions. Hell, if I wanted a discussion with someone who just posts what others say I could talk with Breton again. Oh, but I forgot, you don't want to debate here. Just to post stuff and ignore the replies. Convenient. And to finish, most of that cut and paste post was crap. It wouldn't surprise me if you got it out of a Jack Chick pamphlet, it leaves you with the same nasty taste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkiTzoGuy Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by RpTheHotrod [HUGE snip] Learn to quote properly -C' That is very interesting! thanks for the info!, buti knew about the behemoth and leviathan already but not the other thing mentioned. But anyway thanks for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted April 23, 2003 Author Share Posted April 23, 2003 hey uh, munik...how about....stop replying? You're still trying to continue a debate. Now to the person above... Np The Bible has a lot of interesting things in it to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 I am not trying to get this post off topic. You posted a poem, then everyone replies with praise. There is no topic there. None. So a discussion comes up, and I did not start it with any malice, just pointing out something. So what's the harm there? We get to discuss something interesting amongst ourselves. This upsets you why? Are the only replies allowed here ones that stroke your ego? Can we move past your poem? This post has evolved, yet you want it to stay as it was, a thousand replies stating "good poem". Hate to say it here, but he has a point.... Everyone did sort of jump down his throat for daring to point out a slight flaw in the poem (even if it was an insignifigant one)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowTemplar Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Oh, Cyber, shorten the quote, or remove it and make a one-line reference. Originally posted by munik rope would work as well but nails just add that little extra kick in the nuts. A common misconception. Rope would prolong his suffering. Do you have any idea of how long you can hang on a cross? For a great many days, surely longer than Jesus did. The Romans prodded him with spears and nailed him to the cross because they wanted him to die quickly and get it over with. Easter was coming up, y'see, and the Romans couldn't execute people during easter, or there'd be a popular uprising. And they didn't dare have him in prison, because they were afraid that his terrorist friends would come along and jailbreak him. The cross is not primarily an instrument of execution, it is more an instrument of torture. The convict's hands are tied to the cross, which is then lifted and positioned so that he cannot touch the ground with his feet. On most crosses there were a small board just about where the knees would end up. The idea was that the pain in the chest and arms from hanging in your hands would prompt you to place your feet on board to support your weight. The construction (sloping slightly downwards) and placement of this board means that you cannot possibly keep your feet on it for an extended period of time. At some point you'll slip off, causing you to fall slightly downwards, untill your slide is arrested by the ropes tied to your hands. The stress on your chest caused by this arrest will cause damage to your lungs which will, gradually and after having slided down several times, fill them with water. Thus you die from drowning even while hanging in the baking heat of summer. Very, very slow, and very, very agonising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by RpTheHotrod If you want to discuss things, do it in PM or AIM please. Not here. You're trying to get this off topic and turned into a debate. Hey, I didn't start this. I'm just responding to you talking about the flood. A flood that could never have happened. Although we alter the spelling of behemoth and Leviathan slightly, we still use those same words in bibles today. However, tanniyn is always translated into another word when we write it in English. Tanniyn occurs 28 times in the Bible and is normally translated “dragon.” It is also translated “serpent,” “sea monster,” “dinosaur,” How can it possibly be translated into "dinosaur" if the guys that wrote it weren't around at the time the word was invented? How we got these new names is interesting. In 1822, Mary Ann Mantell became the first person to discover and correctly identify a strange bone as part of a large, unknown reptile. Her husband, Dr. Gideon Mantell, later named this creature an “Iguanodon.” From that time forward, these forgotten animals were given names chosen by the people who rediscovered them. Of course, the Bible, written between approximately 1450 BC and 95 AD, does not include any of these names. What is this about? It has no relevance to proving that there are dinos in the Bible. It “eats grass like an ox.” A brachiosaur does not eat grass. Guess what that huge neck of it is for? Eating leaves, that's right. Strange really, that Job did not mention the unbelievably long neck, which is many more times longer than the tail. Describing this creature, I'd have focused on the gargantuan neck for sure. It “moves his tail like a cedar.” (In Hebrew, this literally reads, “he lets hang his tail like a cedar.”) Strangely, many creatures have such a long tail, including rhinos, elephants and hippos. It says it "hangs like a cedar", implying that it's leaves are turned upside down, matching many tails even such as horses. Its “bones are like beams of bronze, Matches any large land animal. His ribs like bars of iron.” What's with the fascination with metal? It couldn't possibly be a metaphor for something else, like an Apache helicopter? “He is the first of the ways of God.” IE: The biggest. Shame really, since whales are much bigger than any land living creatures. Could it be that the Bible is wrong here? Could it be that Job had no idea what the hell he was talking about? Could it be that the Bible should be read with the author's perspective in mind? “He lies under the lotus trees, Brachiosaurs cannot in any way lie down under such a small tree. In a covert of reeds and marsh.” Strange that these "dinosaurs" are mentioned so few times in the Bible, given that all species of creatures lived side by side then. In fact, there's logically not enough space for them, but what the heck. neither an elephant or a hippopotamus has a “tail like a cedar” (that is, a tail like a large, tapered tree trunk). Here he's forgoing his own translation. It hangs like a cedar. In any case, only the “modern scientific name” of behemoth would change. The point would still remain that behemoth refers to a dinosaur, not a “modern animal” like an elephant or hippopotamus. Maybe this guy could also explain why and how the dinosaurs are no longer here? Did God notice that it's physically impossible to stuff all these species on the earth at the same time, and thus decided to kill a few milion of them? “Who can open the doors of his face, with his terrible teeth all around?” This could match a crocodile. Prying open a crocodile's jaws in no easy feat, and there's only reason to do it if you're bent on subduing it for study. Why would these people do so? Perhaps it refers to the fact that they were simply scared of opening the mouth of it? Or maybe it was just really, really hard? After all, the Bible can't possibly exagerrate anything, right? Like the "beams of bronze", see? “His rows of scales are his pride, shut up tightly as with a seal; one is so near another that no air can come between them; they are joined one to another, they stick together and cannot be parted.” Ok, so it has a tough hide. I'm getting the feeling that it's referring to creature of myth, not a real one. Heard of the sphinx, the chimera, the kraken, the minotaur, the feathered snake, the medusa, the ogres, the dragons etc? Are these "based" on real creatures as well? Only the Bible's words are true fact, after all, right? “His sneezings flash forth light, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning. Out of his mouth go burning lights; sparks of fire shoot out. Smoke goes out of his nostrils, as from a boiling pot and burning rushes. His breath kindles coals, and a flame goes out of his mouth.” No dinosaur was capable of breathing fire. It would be of no f*cking use for a sea creature to breathe fire. Now we're definately talking about a myth creature, spawned only from people's imagination. “Though the sword reaches him, it cannot avail; nor does spear, dart, or javelin. He regards iron as straw, and bronze as rotten wood. The arrow cannot make him flee; slingstones become like stubble to him. Darts are regarded as straw; he laughs at the threat of javelins.” Why on earth would people use swords and slings against a creature living deep out in the sea? Regardless, an armour as protective as described here couldn't possibly fit on a swimming predator. While shark skin is tough, if it were as tough as this, it wouldn't be able to swim. This is ridiculous. Although some bibles refer to Leviathan as an alligator or crocodile (and both of these are fierce) neither of these is a sea creature. They like the water, but they spend much of their time on land. They hunt while in water. Perhaps a "sea" here is merely a very big lake? ST says that salt-water crocodiles exist as well. Let’s face it, an arrow can do a lot of damage to a crocodile or alligator. This is not a description of either of them—or any living animal we are aware of. Let's face it, an arrow or a sword can do a heck of a lot of damage to even a T-rex. This guy should grow a common sense. Now, if a Central American beetle has a built-in flame thrower, so could Leviathan. By the way, crocodiles and alligators are out of the picture on this one, don’t you agree? The biggest load of horsesh*t I've heard in a long time. He's basically rolling over dead now, at least in his terms of proving this to a biologist. I can tell you now that only the bombardier beetle is capable of breathing "fire" (it's not fire at all, actually) - because of its size. "If a beetle in Central America has a built-in flame thrower, so could Leviathan -nyah nyah!" Dude, somebody tell that guy that that's not even close to being an argument, or even a legitimate way of sidestepping the issue. The history of every culture is filled with stories of fire-breathing dragons. If you think about it, in all the past ages wouldn’t someone have made up a story of a fire-breathing lion or something? Nobody did because the dragon stories are based on truth Are they? Prove that, if you can. , and only “dragons” breathed fire. Perhaps because dragons are an old myth? Many cultures have known of snakes birds. It's only natural to want to crossbreed the two in order to get the ultimate flying terror. And of course, this is also why we have angels - wouldn't it be nice if we could fly? They're not real - they're creatures made up. Jeez. Do you want me to tell him that the monster under his beds aren't real as well? What a twit. Would it make sense that some dinosaurs used these passages as “gas tanks” for the combustible mixture used to “breathe fire?” Oh, it's as simple as a "gas tank"? Now he's just talking out of his ass. Most such passages are believed to produce high and low frequency noises, used in communication. Tell me again, what use would a sea predator have for a flame thrower? First of all, the heat dissipates quickly and have a range of less than a meter. Secondly, it'd require the swimming predator to actually sneak up on the still standing prey, take a good breath of air (good luck trying to do that with gills), and then use the oxygen to ignite the "flames". Naturally, such a thing could never, ever, possibly work under water. The kronosaurus is the best match of any known creature to the description of Leviathan Or maybe a crocodile, after all. Or a non-real dragon. Unfortunately, our public school system and the media have convinced us that dinosaurs were extinct at least 60 million years before man appeared on earth. They have done such a good job in this area that we can not imagine people and dinosaurs living at the same time. The fact is that dinosaurs were created only one day before mankind LOL The "fact"... Rp, if you'd just edited it so this piece of text appears first in the post, I wouldn't have to go through all this - it instantly labels him a deluded creationist. And I can't really argue with a person who says all the work that's gone into radioisotope dating is blind luck and happy-go-lucky guesses, can I? btw C'jais, check out http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/b_proof.shtml sometime Nice. It says exactly what's posted here. Thus, they're lying, or deluded, fools. There, you got your requested info. Please no debating inside the forum. Continue in AIM or PM AIM or MSN is horrible for debating this. As are PMs, since this post would be chopped up into about 50 PMs due to the hideous character limitation. And you still haven't proved how the flood could possibly have occured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by RpTheHotrod hey uh, munik...how about....stop replying? You are not in a position to say that. He had a valid point, in that saying the nails were in his hands is not what really happened. He just wanted to get the facts across. And it's sad that I have to correct you on the flood myth once more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldritch Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by RpTheHotrod but anyway, since someone already lit the match. I'm posting this, then pouring a bucket of water on it Well, you're trying, but your post here is hardly the final say. What We Are Taught (In School and Through the Media) Since humans are in the Bible, we unconsciously think that dinosaurs were extinct—and therefore not mentioned in the Bible. As you have just seen, the Bible not only refers to dinosaurs, but has detailed information about two of them. The bible's supposed reference to dinosaurs is not very clear. The description of a Behemoth or Leviathan just doesn't conjure up a dinosaur image in my mind. Besides that, the "detailed information" is hardly detailed - it's actually quite generalized. As you may or may not know, ancient peoples often made up stories about heroes, adventure, and fantastic beasts. The Greeks particularly were famous for it, but many cultures had their own stories, and the description of Leviathan is no more realistic than the Krakken or Jormungund (which I believe is from Norse mythos) the giant sea snake. So why should the Jewish and Christian tales of creatures be dinosaurs, and not just food for the imagination? Unfortunately, our public school system and the media have convinced us that dinosaurs were extinct at least 60 million years before man appeared on earth. They have done such a good job in this area that we can not imagine people and dinosaurs living at the same time. The fact is that dinosaurs were created only one day before mankind, not many millions of years earlier—and there is have evidence to support that statement at http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/creation.shtml You're right... all of the millions of pieces of evidence in favor of the 60 million year divide that have been found is just a big cover-up for the real truth, which is that dinosaurs were created one day before mankind. Please come back to reality - this is not The Flintstones. Aside from the evidence for the fossil record and evolution (which there is a considerable amount of now), there are other pieces of evidence to consider. Plate Tectonics, the field of science which studies how the plates of the earth move, has done some fascinating work and provides more proof for an approximate age of the Earth (billions of years, not thousands). The Bible is an instrument of Christian faith and thus should not be used as a history book, especially in the face of so much contradictory evidence. There, you got your requested info. Please no debating inside the forum. Continue in AIM or PM Hmm... funny. The description the Senate carries states "Debate any topic worthy of Galactic recognition! Serious discussion only!" Unless I'm very much mistaken, I see the word 'Debate' in there, meaning that anything posted in here can and will be debated. If you don't want to hear arguments to your posts, go elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by Eldritch Hmm... funny. The description the Senate carries states "Debate any topic worthy of Galactic recognition! Serious discussion only!" To be fair, this was in the Swamp until it was recently moved (who moved it anyway, and why?) to the Senate. Rp is not to blame. I'm thinking of moving it back, as unless Rp wants to debate his flood myth any more, I think he'll find more people reading his poem in the Swamp. It's a shame that it doesn't get publicity enough, as it's a good poem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted April 23, 2003 Author Share Posted April 23, 2003 C'jais...I wanst commanding him to stop replying, I was suggesting he do so if he isn't trying to start something. Can't make a freakin post without someone wanting to start some sort of debate... It's a POEM sorry guys...I can't call this place home anymore. Farewell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldritch Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Perhaps you should move it back then, C'. It's quite obvious he didn't want to debate anything, and just wanted people to read his poem. The poem, by the way, is incorrect in stating that he was unguilty (is that even a word?), however. He was guilty both of breaking Jewish law (in their eyes, he was a false prophet) and of Roman law (disturbing the peace by riling the Jews). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted April 23, 2003 Author Share Posted April 23, 2003 The charge was blasphemy. To those who believe, He was not guilty because He WAS who He claimed to be. This will probably be my last post period for these forums. I'm saddened to see what has happened to these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZBomber Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by C'jais To be fair, this was in the Swamp until it was recently moved (who moved it anyway, and why?) to the Senate. Rp is not to blame. I'm thinking of moving it back, as unless Rp wants to debate his flood myth any more, I think he'll find more people reading his poem in the Swamp. It's a shame that it doesn't get publicity enough, as it's a good poem. I'd move it back. Its not really meant to debate in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by RpTheHotrod This will probably be my last post period for these forums. I'm saddened to see what has happened to these forums. Don't take it personal. I'd hate to see you leave, Jared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZBomber Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by C'jais Don't take it personal. I'd hate to see you leave, Jared. Hes not Jared, his Rp! BTW, did he mean not post in the Senate Chambers, or in all LF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted April 23, 2003 Author Share Posted April 23, 2003 All of LF. I can't even make a simple poem post without someone wanting to turn it into a debate. It's just not even worth it anymore. I'll do whatever when I get back from work, but for now...UPS calls me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Hey RP! Nice poem, man! I really liked it. Did you write it? If so, excellent work.... that's a talent I haven't been able to master (turning words into poetry....). I read through these posts and I realize that you are a victim of circumstances. It's hard to see it if you only go through the UserCP, but someone moved your thread from the swamp to the Senate. That's why everyone is "discussing" and "debating" the topic of your poem. Artistically, it's an excellent piece of work and I admire anyone with the ability to use rhyme, alliteration, and symbology among other linguistic techniques in order to create something beautiful. Don't get too p1ssed at these guys in the Senate... they didn't realize it was a thread moved from the swamp until already deep into the "debate" and perhaps you might not have realized it either. If *I* would have posted a reply, not knowing your intentions, *I* would probably delete my reply and send a PM to Cjais asking that he move it back to the swamp with a short note about what happened. That's what *I* would do, however... not that that's what anyone else should do.... unless they want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZBomber Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by RpTheHotrod All of LF. I can't even make a simple poem post without someone wanting to turn it into a debate. It's just not even worth it anymore. I'll do whatever when I get back from work, but for now...UPS calls me. Great. Thanks alot guys. Hope your happy. There goes one of my friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockV1.89 Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by RpTheHotrod All of LF. I can't even make a simple poem post without someone wanting to turn it into a debate. It's just not even worth it anymore. I'll do whatever when I get back from work, but for now...UPS calls me. What did you expect people to do? It's concerning religion. You've been around here long enough that you cant ever mention religion in here without someone calling you out on it. Just how it is in here... Like Munik said... did you just expect everyone to say "nice poem!" and leave it at that? I'd hate to see you split over something like this, but honestly, dude... you had to have known this would end up a debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Originally posted by ShockV1.89 I'd hate to see you split over something like this, but honestly, dude... you had to have known this would end up a debate. I don't think he did... it was revealed in the thread that he originally posted it in the Swamp, where he could reasonably expect no debate or religion bashing. It got moved and he may not have noticed this if he only clicked through it from the UserCP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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