FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Ok I know the chances for this are slim due to legal/creative reasons (as in a developer taking ideas from players etc.) but I still want to suggest it. Power duel sounds great and all, and as a No Force type of match I see it as being really fun. However in a Full Force duel I see it as being nothing short of a nightmare unless the two man team is very unskilled. Two guys just patiently whoring drain and chipping away at a defenseless opponent would be unstoppable even for the most skilled of players to deal with unless the one man “team” was given some extra advantage the two man team did not have (faster Force regen time etc.) However a *very popular user created game mode played by full force players in jk2 is 2v2. Granted we have to do it in a TeamFFA game type but think about this: A team of two players faces another team of two players. When a member of one team is eliminated he sits in “limbo” and does not respawn (ala Counter-Strike). Once both members of a team are eliminated they go to the bottom of the “list” just like in normal duel mode and the next “team” waiting in line comes up to face the winning team. 10 wins = new map etc. just like duel mode. 2v2 is very popular (even more so than TeamFFA) among jk2 Full Force Saber only players and those of you who have played it know how much fun it is. I know this probably could not make it into the 9/16 release but as an idea for a future patch addition I think it would be very well received by the JA community. It really has a lot of potential for fun because you simply don’t know how it could turn out. It may be a quick slaughter or it may come down to a 1v1 “last man standing” match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obi-Wan X Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 EXCELLENT idea. This was exactly what I was thinking should happen in power duel. Though to be honest, I think this will be included. Unless some "beta" source has already said otherwise . If they ONLY included 2 vs 1....then I really wouldn't even play the mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Author Share Posted August 7, 2003 Well we really can only guess what it (power duel) will be like until 9/16 so I’m basing my assumptions on the fact that it has been confirmed as being 2v1 dueling. Like I said who knows if any “perks” will be given to the one man “team” but if it is pure base game play and if the confirmed returning powers like drain and lightning are available it’s going to have an incredibly high frustration factor for the single guy. In No Force it could really shine if for no other reason than people can not heal them selves but Full Force is a totally different issue when (if drain is anything like it was in JK2) two guys can totally render a guy helpless and heal themselves at the same time while taking shots at him as well. The reason 2v2 has always been so well received by JK2 players is it brings the “best” of duel and TeamFFA game types and eliminates he things people hate about them. The chaotic “10 guys flying all over the place” nature that turns people off from TeamFFA is not there with just 4 people but the “20 minute stand offs” that make some people dislike dueling is not there either because people tend to “Rambo” when they have a partner backing them up. Not just people in the saber community play 2v2, but a lot of gunners do it as well so it really has the potential to be a popular game type across the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HertogJan Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Yeah 2-2 is very popular, in my clan we mostly played 2-2 matches, sometimes 3-3, but we had to host the games ourselves on the Zone... So pleeeeeease make a 2-2 dueling mode, it's all I'm asking for right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emon Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 I'm sure players don't respawn and keep going after the single enemy... In JO, you don't respawn in a duel unless the duel fraglimit is set higher, so I don't see why this should be different. And about 2 vs 1 being such a challenge, well, duh, that's the whole idea. If Force spamming is a concern, just disable those powers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Author Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Emon And about 2 vs 1 being such a challenge, well, duh, that's the whole idea. If Force spamming is a concern, just disable those powers... Point I was trying to make is there is a very large community of players who do like Full Force (F.Y.I that means no powers disabled in case you needed that cleared up) and 2v1 while it may be played by some of the NF crowd, it will be shunned by the majority of Full Force players because of the frustration factor alone. Reason being is not because it's a "challenge", it's because it's so utterly impossible to pull off if base settings are used across the board for both teams and if the powers are similar to JK2. When something is challenging people will play it. When something is frustrating they will avoid it. CTY was a perfect example of that. Ever been the Flag Carrier in a game of CTY? In theory that game type sounded fun. But in reality the guy who got stuck with the job of being FC got the living hell beat of him by an entire team who could use any force available while all he could do is trot along at a snails pace and swing a saber. Back when there were CTY servers and I checked them out, it seemed like every two minutes the FC would get fed up and disconnect out of frustration. Someone else becomes FC, two minutes later another one leaves. I never said remove power duel or even change it for that matter, all I suggested is the official implementation of a game type immensely popular with both the NF and FF community, that being 2v2 team dueling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hibiki Kensaki Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Its prob gonna be like the lone person takes less damage and gives out more damage or something along the lines of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarus Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 I still believe force powers are simply used way to often. Force should not work very often against another equallly skilled jedi. Thats why they use sabers and not force powered guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txa1265 Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Tarus I still believe force powers are simply used way to often. Force should not work very often against another equallly skilled jedi. Thats why they use sabers and not force powered guns. Actually, I think that has to do with honor and the elegance of the weapon, not the effectiveness of force powers. But that isn't the point. In movie combat they generally use the force as part of their saber combat, not as a secondary attack - which is why ObiWan was surprised by Maul's push in EP1. Of course, we're not playing the movies, we're playing a game. I like seeing more options in all cases - make more people happy (or give more people something to complain about ... ). Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey_Wanderer Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 In a recent interview it was revealed that the single man in the power duel has some sort of advantage... force power etc... However, if the 1 man team was using absorb than the 2 man team would be out of luck, wouldn't they... (Unless they were total force hogs [Force Hog: A person who uses Dark Side force powers and runs away at the sight of a saber]) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blademaster_109 Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Mith[OmNi] In a recent interview it was revealed that the single man in the power duel has some sort of advantage... force power etc... However, if the 1 man team was using absorb than the 2 man team would be out of luck, wouldn't they... (Unless they were total force hogs [Force Hog: A person who uses Dark Side force powers and runs away at the sight of a saber]) good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Author Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Mith[OmNi] In a recent interview it was revealed that the single man in the power duel has some sort of advantage... force power etc... However, if the 1 man team was using absorb than the 2 man team would be out of luck, wouldn't they... (Unless they were total force hogs [Force Hog: A person who uses Dark Side force powers and runs away at the sight of a saber]) uhh yeah ok... absorb lasts 27 seconds? wait 27 seconds and once it runs out, drain the hell out of him. Back to original point, defenseless opponent. Never mind, you guys go back to playing duel of the Jedi master wars and bowing to lord yoda or whatever the hell it is you people do and forget I mentioned anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Solar Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Mith[OmNi] However, if the 1 man team was using absorb than the 2 man team would be out of luck, wouldn't they... Ummm..not exactly. They could wait for a few seconds so that the poor guy runs out of force and then completely destroy him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obi-Wan X Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 To be quite honest 2 vs 1 gameplaying just really doesn't intrigue me, I mean it just doesn't seem to be much fun in my eyes. Don't get me wrong, I really do like a challenge when it comes to games but 2vs 1 really don't sound like much fun. And certainly not enough fun to base a WHOLE new gameplay type on it. I think its safe to say that there will be an option for 2 vs 2, or 3 vs 3. And maybe unique maps as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txa1265 Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Mith[OmNi] In a recent interview it was revealed What interview was this ... ? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey_Wanderer Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by txa1265 What interview was this ... ? Mike Don't remember which one, but I've read at least 15 in the past few weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Author Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Mith[OmNi] I mentioned this before.... Yes... Absorb lasts 27 seconds. The Power Duel mode uses the Duel maps, so are you telling me those guys will be running away for 27 seconds until the time runs out? I just wouldn't play those guys. Obviously you have never played a Full Force duel with anyone who knew what they were doing, and yes people do exactly that. To beat a light sider you simple sit there and stare at your key board until the hum sound stops (obviously you need to evade any incoming attacks as well). Once absorb runs out, “whoosh” one big drain blast and light side guy is totally defenseless. Hold down the drain key for the rest of the match and he will never regenerate more than 4 Force points (points, not bars. 10 points being a single bar) and you will never have to worry about taking any damage because you will constantly be healing it back. Now multiply that X 2 darks draining a single guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Solar Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Mith[OmNi] so are you telling me those guys will be running away for 27 seconds until the time runs out? I just wouldn't play those guys. OMG! I don't know what to say... You "just wouldn't play those guys"? Like...because they "lame"? I bet you don't play those guys who don't bow either. Or the guys who kick. Or the ones who don't do everything exactly as you think they should do, you know: the "honourable way" a.k.a let you win every time. I'm sorry but... what you said was just stupid. OF COURSE THEY WILL WAIT UNTILL YOU RUN OUT OF FORCE! Wasting force on someone with absorb on is utterly stupid. Have you ever even played JO? (Sorry, I'm on a bad mood. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Author Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by Luc Solar (Sorry, I'm on a bad mood. ) /gets very frustrated with them as well... Every get the feeling no matter what you say the only thing that will penetrate is "Ok remember in Episode 2 when Yoda..." I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amas128 Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 There's a simple way to deal with the Drain thing. Kick them, swing while they're on the ground, put absorb on and repeat. Works every time. If they are being stubborn and running away, just use pull to bring them near you and start over again using heal when you get a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emon Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 You could just wait and find out.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Author Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by GC256 There's a simple way to deal with the Drain thing. Kick them, swing while they're on the ground, put absorb on and repeat. Works every time. If they are being stubborn and running away, just use pull to bring them near you and start over again using heal when you get a chance. #1 who says you will even land the kick (yes, they are easy to dodge)? #2 what makes you think a knock down will result even if you do land it (yes they are randomly generated by the game)? #3 kicking, activation of absorb and pulling all *deplete your force pool and put you exactly where they *want you to be. Depleted and helpless. I understand where you are coming from but that’s a FFA/CTF mentality you are using. Duelers are *very patient and will simply wait you out and whore you to death with drain and “chip away” attacks if you even try playing light side at all. #4 when is the match I challenged you to going to happen? All trash talk aside, I want to play you a in *friendly match and demo it to later be posted in this thread. You use what you feel is a sound strategy (outlined above) and I will use exactly what I stated above and show you just how much of a massacre one guy (let alone two people) can cause if base settings are used across the board for both “teams" (my original point and reason for suggesting 2v2 be considered later on down the road). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Payne Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 2 vs 2 sound great, but just like a team ffa with 2 players per team... I don't know how popular will be power duel, but I will play it a lot (its 3rd on my list with ffa and siege beeing the first 2). I love unfair fights, of course being me on the small team, one thing I used to do on JO was fight against 4 or 6 at a time (most times I went to CTF get the flag and stay on enemy base repeling waves of enemies that respawn at your side all over agin). That's a game you can't win, but it forces you to watch your force, develop evasing skills and you learn to hit your oponent without missing, as I said you can't win, but your "score" is how much you lasted against them. 6 mins without running and against 6 respawning enemies is my record, on minute 4 a guy apeared and start team healing me, the I let mysefl be killed because that was cheap. hahahaha I'm a crazy guy that likes to play suicidal. Power duel is going to be one of my favs modes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryudom Posted August 7, 2003 Share Posted August 7, 2003 2 vs 2 sound great, but just like a team ffa with 2 players per team... no, the differance is you die and stay dead. this type of game type would rock, like last team standing. also, why limit the teams? any combination should be possible, 2 on 2, 3 on 3, 2 on 4 etc... maybe make an option where a server can lock team sizes, like 2 on 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FK | unnamed Posted August 7, 2003 Author Share Posted August 7, 2003 Originally posted by ryudom no, the differance is you die and stay dead. this type of game type would rock, like last team standing. also, why limit the teams? any combination should be possible, 2 on 2, 3 on 3, 2 on 4 etc... maybe make an option where a server can lock team sizes, like 2 on 2 well I would default it to 2v2 just because of the time factor but yeah, like anything give the option for expanding and changing via rcon cvars. The thing is 2v2 is immensely popular with American and European clans but unfortunately I doubt Raven or most people outside of competitive circles know just how popular it is because the only way (currently) it can be done is if you have your own server/rcon of a server due to having to lock it down so people are not constantly joining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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