lonepadawan Posted August 22, 2003 Share Posted August 22, 2003 Watching the new trailer... I came up with a theory about the red Twi'lek at the end of the trailer. The player is a yellow twi'lek wearing similar clothes. Is it possible they've gone with an evil twin/clone/person who just happens to look like you idea for the baddie? They even use the saber style sabers... Now while this wouldn't ruin the game for me it would be most annoying. Dark Mara in MOTS was cheesy but could at least be explained (The sith temples defence.. mara confronting her past.. you get the idea) I could be totally wrong of course. But .. discuss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boinga1 Posted August 22, 2003 Share Posted August 22, 2003 That'd be SWEET! But I don't think it's likely. Besides, they appear to be on Hoth, and I think Hoth maybe an early level, based on the lack of dual/double sabers shown. Besides, then they'd have a better than than "You must be the saber-wielding troublemaker". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Hmmm....an intriguing theory, but I don't think it's likely. :/ I have no problem myself with having an evil twin or something, if it was well implemented, and there are certainly opportunities in the storyline for such an instance. Personally, I like it when your main character is carrying some past 'baggage' around, and has to deal with issues from their past. That can serve to build a stronger and more 'fleshed out' character. Of course...due to the number of selectable races for SP, I would imagine it is more difficult to lock down specific past events, because a character of each race would have grown up in different circumstances, and it would take a lot of work to try and cover all of those parameters. The other thing is...Twileks are the only race where you could have a red skin like that. You don't get red Rodians, after all...so how would they portray evil twin characters for the other races? It seems a lot of work for something that would not seem that necessary as a plot point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro The Hutt Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 I think the clothing was similar because quite simply... they're on Hoth, it seems like your character will be crammed into something warmer (the Kel'Dor tossing his saber at an AT-ST on Hoth, which can be seen at the top of this board sometimes, seems to indicate that too) so it'd be logical that the outfits would be somewhat similar. Both all tucked in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 The other thing is...Twileks are the only race where you could have a red skin like that. You don't get red Rodians, after all...so how would they portray evil twin characters for the other races? It seems a lot of work for something that would not seem that necessary as a plot point. Darth Maul anyone? Of course those are supposed to be tattoos, but still. What's to stop the others from using similar techniques? And the "evil twin" wouldn't necessarily have to be red, just different looking than you, but same species. It's an interesting idea, I hadn't thought about it before. Saying all the species have different pasts doesn't make sense, because you are playing the SAME CHARACTER who just happens to be a different species, but yet has the same name "Jaden Korr." Once you pick your character, it's as if YOU ARE JADEN KORR and the only Jaden Korr there ever was. No "other" Jaden Korr exists (except your evil twin, hehe) that joined Luke's Jedi Academy. Example: If the backstory is that Jaden Korr's parents were killed by the Empire and he/she joined the Academy in order to become a Jedi to right the wrongs committed by the Empire, then that will be the backstory regardless of if you picked a Rodian or a Twi'Lek. It will be your story, just happening to somebody else. The thing about "early levels" is that we don't know for sure how it works with all the selections. By definition you may have several choices, and so what to some might be an "early level" to others is a "later level." Then again, hasn't it been established that certian missions will be "mandatory" to unlock others, while there will be plenty that are "optional" to build up your force? If you skip a bunch of levels, does that mean you will earn your saberstaff or dual sabers later than you might if you had played all those early levels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclaimer Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 I agree with Kurgan and StormHammer on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy867 Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Would it be possible that she is more like an assistant that tends to do the work, kind of like the Thin guy from the latest Charlie's Angels movies. Because it would seem kind of weird to code the game to trace whatever you pick to make an evil twin especially with all the variations, plus with the saber, we could assess that she is probably a sith (possibly) but like Yoda says, always two there are.. A Master and an apprentice. What do you guys think? I just think IMHO that coding for a twin is a little too much for a Jedi game. But thats just me and how I dont perceive the whole excess baggage theory kind of ordeal. But of course then again the Red Twi'lek may as well be the Boss. What are some of the other theories you guys may have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Originally posted by Andy867 What do you guys think? I just think IMHO that coding for a twin is a little too much for a Jedi game. But thats just me and how I dont perceive the whole excess baggage theory kind of ordeal. But of course then again the Red Twi'lek may as well be the Boss. What are some of the other theories you guys may have? Yeah, I was just spouting tricks and nonsense. Maybe Red Twi'lek Girl is really a shape-changing alien like Zam Wessell...and just morphs into your player race to mock your appearance. You know...that would actually be rather fun... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonepadawan Posted August 23, 2003 Author Share Posted August 23, 2003 As I said I would prefer it NOT to be an identical twin baddie. I'm glad the more enlightened forum members pointed out obvious flaws with my ideas. And I see now I am also wrong to say they have the same saber styles, as the yellow twi'lek wields two sabers.. What will annoy me though if everytime a character with two sabers drops it will look like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro The Hutt Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 The Sith are gone, only dark Jedi remain now hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dilandau-Sama Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Originally posted by Pedro The Hutt The Sith are gone, only dark Jedi remain now hehe. Uh..., Siths are dark jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonepadawan Posted August 23, 2003 Author Share Posted August 23, 2003 The sith are extinct.. without training from a formal sith master, your not a sith. Your just an evil jedi who happens to use the darkside. Apparently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dilandau-Sama Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Originally posted by lonepadawan The sith are extinct.. without training from a formal sith master, your not a sith. Your just an evil jedi who happens to use the darkside. Apparently No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Originally posted by Kurgan And the "evil twin" wouldn't necessarily have to be red, just different looking than you, but same species. You just need a goatee Originally posted by SithOfDoom! No. Are you saying that the Sith are not extinct, or that you don't need a Sith master to be a Sith? I don't see how you are correct in either case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanTB123 Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 A Dark Jedi is not necessarily a Sith. He must be trained specifically as one, as Maul was trained by Sidious, and Anakin was trained by Palpatine. The Sith can be considered a darkside cult, a specific culture. You don't just decide to use your powers for evil, and suddenly become a Sith. All the characters in JK1 were Dark Jedi, not Sith, because they had either never received Sith tutelage, or had chosen not to receive it. To add to that, a Sith is not necessarily more powerful than a Dark Jedi - he just has different practices, I would presume. To stay on topic, I don't think you would need to program the game to recognize any variations of your character in order to generate an evil twin. They could just create a single evil twin depending on what race/gender selection you make (a human male bad guy, a human female bad guy, a rodian bad guy, a twi'lek bad guy, a Kel Dor bad guy, and a Zabrak bad guy to serve as the counterpart to your character). Am I making any sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Think of it this way... the "Force" exists in the Star Wars universe, and it has a Dark and a Light side. There are various "schools/philosophies/religions" whatever you want to call them that react to the Force. The Jedi Order is a Light-Side based religion that has certain teachings and goals. The Sith is a Dark-Side based religion that has different goals, but some similar practices (such as preference to Lightsaber proficiency, etc). "Dark Jedi" are those who have begun in the Jedi school, but turned away from the Light-Side teachings toward those of the Dark. Yet they have not "converted" to the Sith philosophy, and may not even know that it exists. Now with this in mind, it would be fully possible to use the Force, yet have no connection to the Jedi or the Sith (in the canon films of course, those two schools are all there is, but perhaps there are people out there who were "looked over" who have the Force, such as Anakin and Leia). The two philosophies are rivals, so they seek to snatch up whomever they can who show's natural ability. In the films we see Dark Jedi (the term was coined by Tim Zahn in the EU IIRC), that is.. Jedi who became "corrupted" by the Dark Side... Dooku and Vader. Of course they also converted to the teachings of the Sith, so they were "both" in a sense. Maul and Palpatine on the other hand were never Jedi, but pure Sith. In the later EU, it would make sense for Dark Jedi not to join the Sith, if 1) they didn't know about the Sith 2) they had no allegience to them (ie: they feel it's not the best way to power). It is possible of course that individuals would try to revive the lost teachings of the Sith, just as there were those who tried to keep the Jedi traditions alive (Obi-Wan, Luke, Yoda). And yes, the evil twin thing was an interesting bit of speculation. I don't know if its true or not, but it's fun to ponder about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonepadawan Posted August 23, 2003 Author Share Posted August 23, 2003 Well said Kurgan. However I suspect SithofDoom! will simply respond with another No. His signature just about sums up his intelligence in these matters I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro The Hutt Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 lol, but in the end, our answers on the twin matter will be answered in less than a month from now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy867 Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Originally posted by SithOfDoom! Uh..., Siths are dark jedi. Originally posted elsewhere All Sith are Dark Jedi, but not all dark Jedi are sith Can't remember what site I saw that on, probably listed earlier in this thread, but seems to be a very close logic to the truth, if there is one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanTB123 Posted August 23, 2003 Share Posted August 23, 2003 Originally posted elsewhere All Sith are Dark Jedi, but not all dark Jedi are sith This may be true to an extent, but the idea is that "Dark Jedi" and "Sith" are not synonomous with each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted August 24, 2003 Share Posted August 24, 2003 Well put Andy, although as I pointed out, as far as we know, Palpatine and Maul were never Jedi... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obi-Wan X Posted August 24, 2003 Share Posted August 24, 2003 Dark Jedi are simply users of the force that use it for dark intentions, or simply fall to the darkside. Take a look at Yun, he didn't join any Jedi Academy (correct me if i'm wrong) and then fall to the darkside. He learned of the force and used it for his own dark purposes. Now, a Sith is not exactly a dark jedi. It is a follower of the Sith teachings, and has recieved teachings from an actual Sith. If a Sith renounced his status, then he'd be a dark jedi. Teachings and beliefs have to be taken into account before you pin a label on them. While a Sith may be "Dark", he has entered an entirely different league, and is a Sith. To me, Sith >>>>> Dark Jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archonon Posted August 24, 2003 Share Posted August 24, 2003 I have seen this issue brought up so many times before but I've never weighed in my opinion. Since it has been put of for discussion again I suppose I'll put in my two cents. In complete honesty, I am going to go against the tide. I agree with Sithdoom, let me elaborate... The Jedi is the religion and subsequent name of the Order that "worships" this religion and its Knights. The Sith is the religion that "worships" the Dark Side and like its counterpart also fills the name or the Order who follow it as well as the name referred to its warriors, ie "Sith Warrior". The term Dark Jedi to me is a misconception, there is no such thing or at the very least is the same thing as a Sith Warrior. Why? In my opinion because the "Dark Jedi" do study and practice the Dark Side of the Force when they turn to the other side which means they study and practice the Sith arts. In every single movie the "Dark Jedi" are Sith Warriors or Lords; Maul, Tyranus, Vader and Sidious. Now obviously, Maul and Sidious were Sith practitioners since the beginning, while Tyranus and Vader are fallen Jedi. Still the latter two are Sith. Wether they were trained or not by a Sith Lord I see as unimportant as what they train into and the arts Dark Side is the Sith. I know you guys probably won't see it from my point of view but still that's how I sum it up. I do not take into account any EU explanations or definitions for my opinion, only what I've formulated from the movies Jedi = Light Sith = Dark If a Sith warrior repented or whatever and turned to the Light Side and joined the Jedi or worked with them as Vader and Tyranus did, he wouldn't be a "Light Sith", he'd be a Jedi. Same thing with the Dark Jedi, once they switch sides they are joining the Sith ranks and are therefore no longer Jedi but now are in fact Sith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obi-Wan X Posted August 24, 2003 Share Posted August 24, 2003 The thing is, using the dark side of the force doesn't automatically make you a dark jedi or sith. There have been various instances in the EU and Official Films where a jedi uses an offensive "dark" side power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted August 24, 2003 Share Posted August 24, 2003 Actually, there is nothing pointing out that a Dark Jedi is a Sith. Since a Dark Jedi is mainly considered a corrupted ex-Jedi, during the millenia where the Sith were considered extinct like Ki-Adi Mundi said, there could have been many corrupted Jedi yet he particularly said that the Sith were extinct. It seems more likely that Sith and Dark Jedi are indeed different. Look at a Sith as an anti-Jedi extremist while a dark jedi someone who uses the force for himself and not to kill all jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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