the future of the jedi series ...

[yolkboy]

I like what txa1265 and Tyler posted. What KOTOR did with the morality meter was good. What you said affected you and the outcome of the game. Opening up special powers and such. So combined, both of you made very good points which I totaly agree with both of you.

 

Now I've read through the thread and didn't here anything about co-op. Personally I would love this feature. Some friends and I going through with lightsabers facing stormtroopers or republic troops (sticking with the light side / dark side idea from txa) and sith/jedi. Of course there can't be too many people though. Maybe 2 other people including yourself so a small group of 3 jedi/sith. Internet co-op would be awesome as of couse LAN capable as well. Each player can level up the way they want to keep things unique.

[AJL]

I think it would be nice if next JEDI game would have less combat

and more talking, investigation, sneaking, ... And it should be far

in the future or past... (pretty much like KOTOR but where the

control of the character works like in JK fps...)

[Jackel]

Originally posted by darth makaan

Geo mod is too buggy. That's why only RF and RF2 used it. Havok is the future

 

by Havok do you mean the engine used in Half Life 2 ?

 

if so thats the Source engine , Havok is the physics engine that has been added in to the Source engine

[Tidus01]

I've thought of this idea and started notticing more and more ppl are becoming interested in the idea of an rpg side to JK. It would be amazing, just to think of it, going from planet to planet (single player + planet in multiplayer = server) getting robes, saber hilts/sabers and power ups for them, armor, guns, swords, etc. It would be so intriuging moving through planets meeting new players, being able to duel with them, trade with them and TEAM UP WITH THEM!!!!

 

I must state : teaming up within a partenership if by bots or players would just be the next best thing.

Thealso introduce vehicles...and yer they already did, but im talkin' about creating/customizing/buying a vehicle that will either transport, fight (or both) for you.

They should introduce buildings where only you have access to... there by, to save your progress you must go to yiur appartment in the building and it will save from you. ( this way no abuse of getting killed = losing items perhaps, etc.)

This game should let you control the factor ofbeing able tochoose your deignated possition within the game ( Jedi, City Gaurdian...aka Police, etc.)

What I am trying to propose is that a Jedi Universe/Galaxy is created with certain boundries set to keep the game enjoyable for all.

 

Thats all folks!

[Tidus01]

Also I would like to mention that the Jedi Academy/Outcast style fighting should remain the same(if not changed for the better!) That wayall would be intrested in the game: RPG lovers and JA lovers and FPS lovers. This game, if created , would be a very "free will...be what you want game"...just asi said, with boundries.

[Obi_Kwiet]

I think the next Game should be done with the Doom 3 engine or done in house. I would aslo like to see some more vehiles, and have them well implemented. Also, many force powers. I would also like to see faster more powerfull bullets. The guns in this game are a joke. Also would like to see you actually be able to choose your path. Mabey 100+ missions, and the choises you make actually affct what game you play. My idea of non-leiarlity is NOT "choose what order you do the missions in the three piers" and NOT You can choose the DARK side right before the last mission and if you do the light jedi will fight you instdead of attack you." That was realy stupid. The levels had almost no puzzles, and were very short. That big fuss Raven made about it not being linear was a big lie. They lied about alot of srtuff in JA. It wasnt an expansion pack, it was a 50$ patch!

I want to play as Kyle agin also, and if its not too much to ask have a story line that a 2 year old, MIGHT have some kind of a passing intrrest in.

[Tyler_Durden]

I think true non-linearity is something you would find in games such as grand theft auto or even kotor to some extent. Moreso GTA because you could accept missions in any order you choose, plus you have a HUGE world to explore, not even a world, a city. Now if this were done in terms of a jedi/star wars game, not galaxies, but a First Person game all it's own for SP/MP , with similar gameplay to JO/JA without the need to play online, i think it would be the greatest SW game ever. I have posted ideas on other topics of this nature but here's a review:

 

First of all you start out as a regular person making his/her way around the galaxy. From the outset you assign points to your profile, thus crafting the person you would like to be in the game. You could assign yourself as a force sensitive, go to the academy and train to be a jedi or you could have good hunting instincts and are a fast talker so you could be a good bounty hunter. You choose your path by your actions via the dark/light side meter, so if you get your kicks picking off innnocent bystanders you would be more prone to evil, thus the game would act accordingly by having people be afraid of you or being unwelcome in a certain town or planet.

 

The thing that would be the hardest but the best feature is to be able to travel from planet to planet, also there would be a flying mode, so you can go to different space stations and what not or have battles in space, picking up left over junk from the ships you destroy. I also thought there could be a way to aquire npc's to help you so if you need a squadron to get a certain job done, you would just have to hit a cantina or station and put out some credits. You would also have the option for them to help you out on ground missions so you could tell them to cover you while you take out a squad of troopers. It would be cool too if the game had a feature so if you want to go to a certain planet, you would just hit a button and go into hyperspace.

 

I think a game like this could be done with the morrowind engine or the engine microsoft used for freelancer. This would save time and money because the engines are a little older but i'm sure the developers could modify it so that it would look cool and get the job done.

[lukeskywalker1]

Is my point not getting across, basically, all ive read is possible, or unrealistic. 100+ levels? You want to wait 10 years? Why dont you make a map (with scripting, and a story line, and we will see how long it takes) A good duel map can take hours upon hours, and with the quality they put into JA, days, maybe weeks, for one map. My first FFA map took me about a month and a half to make. SP is a bit more complex than MP though. You need scripting for it to be good. And the problem is, a lot of scripting was done (more than you realize) but you just didnt notice it. I mean, its small things and big things. Ill tell you from experience, scripting takes a looong time. But its 100% necessary, and required to make a good game.

 

More vehicles? No problem, make one. If you dont have modeling software, no problem, load up good old MS paint and notepad, and skin one.

 

I mean, I see what you people are saying, but it is all possible in JA. Go make the levels you want. They give you the tools to do it.

 

Another thing, RPGing and FPS cannot mix. Its obvious, look around the forums, and on any JA server. Unless, the company decides to put in an RPG game mode, then that would be alright.

 

you would just hit a button and go into hyperspace.

 

Hyperspace is possible in JA. You just most likley have not seen it. Its only being used by the asteroids team right now, but its in the code already. This means, you can have your traveling from planet to planet, by using hyperspace. Raven did a lot of work on the game, it just wasnt implemented. They should have implemented it, but.... they didnt, for reasons we dont know about.

 

I've thought of this idea and started notticing more and more ppl are becoming interested in the idea of an rpg side to JK. It would be amazing, just to think of it, going from planet to planet (single player + planet in multiplayer = server) getting robes, saber hilts/sabers and power ups for them, armor, guns, swords, etc. It would be so intriuging moving through planets meeting new players, being able to duel with them, trade with them and TEAM UP WITH THEM!!!!

 

 

Isnt that SWG?

 

I must state : teaming up within a partenership if by bots or players would just be the next best thing.

 

Ever hear of Team FFA? Ok, maybe not what you want. Hmmm.... bots can team up together in FFA. There might be a way to get an NPC to recognise you as an alli in MP (half of scripting doesnt work in MP) but, if you can get the NPC to realize your an alli, it should follow you. Not to mention, you and someone else in an FFA server can team up, and attack everyone else. Clans do it all the time

 

Now I've read through the thread and didn't here anything about co-op. Personally I would love this feature. Some friends and I going through with lightsabers facing stormtroopers or republic troops (sticking with the light side / dark side idea from txa) and sith/jedi. Of course there can't be too many people though. Maybe 2 other people including yourself so a small group of 3 jedi/sith. Internet co-op would be awesome as of couse LAN capable as well. Each player can level up the way they want to keep things unique.

 

You know what, I know a guy making Co-Op for JA right now as we speak! And guess what, its for MP, and can obviously support more than 2 players. You want to play with a friend, well... just play on LAN, or the internet.

 

- More skill development. I'd love to see a 'train-up' based skill system, where you learn and apply various skills.

 

They did that, notice how you gain lightsaber stances as you go up in levels. It was done in JK2 too.

 

The realistic saber effects on the environment would be awsome, but I honestly dont think they would be willing to modify an engine to get that kind of effect. Leading squads is also a great idea, after all isnt that what the jedi were doing in the clone wars?

 

Like I said before, possible. Good NPCs follow you, and attack bad NPCs. They even communicate with each other, and *can* with the enemies.

 

The stuff (and more) of what I listed above is possible, without codeing. All you need to know is a little mapping, scripting (maybe some modeling on the side, for a little variety) and then your good to go.

 

The good thing about a game like JKA is, you can customise it yourself. With some work and effort this stuff isnt that tough to do, just a little time consuming.

 

When I first heard about the non linear single player, i thought maybe it was a decision you had to make ingame. This is a bad example, but, if you go left, it loads one level, if you go right it loads another. You know things like that (which are possible, and very easily done) You just need a good story.

 

You can make an RPG map in JKA very easy... just the money system would not be possible without coding. Personally, I like to frag things, but everyone has an opinion. As it looks right now, there wont be another JK game for at least 2 more years (this assuming there will be one, and they have already started) You might as well try to get the most out of what you have. Think of how great JKA would be if someone included (but not overused) this stuff?

[t3rr0r]

Originally posted by AJL

I think it would be nice if next JEDI game would have less combat

and more talking, investigation, sneaking, ...

splinter cell with a lightsaber.

[Obi_Kwiet]

I thought 100 levles was impossible too, but i hear HL2 will have that many. I rather wait awile for a good game the blow 50$ every 6 months for a bad game.

[TheLiberator34]

There are three areas I think need to be messed with in the next JK series.

1. Combat- The saber system needs to be altered to make it so fighting another saber wielder is a truly interctive experience. Ex: your opponent attacks and you parry in response. Some of the defensive side of the saber system should remain automatic( blaster deflection) but some of it should definetely be put under the player control. Stealth and stealthy knockout and attacks should also be an option.(ala thief or splinter cell). Also, a force power should be included that allows jedi to shrug off powers non force users are vunerable to( mind trick and grip in particular)

 

2.Skills- I really think they need to put in a Kotor style skill system. That way if you want to access codes from a computer or pick a lock or mess with a base's security systems you either need an ally to do it(NPC, co op buddy, whatever) or you learn how to do it yourself. You should not be an human swiss army knife from the start of the game. It doesn't make sense and it would let you include allies regularly on mission to fill in the roles you don't want to deal with.

 

 

3. Plot- Personally I think Kyle katarn still has plenty of life in him as a character. Since most people here don't seem to like an NJO based storyline, why not chronicle Kyle's continued endeavors to guard the valley of the jedi. Or if you hate playing kyle you could jump ahead a hundred years or so to his decendant(s) still trying to protect the valley and maybe stopping darksiders from getting their hands on artifacts and places of force energy. That's basically been the story behind all of the JK series anyways. Throw in some training missions and some stand alone missions and you got a game.

Phew! Well that's my two cents folks.

[Tyler_Durden]

Actually, RPGing and FPS DO mix. Check out elder scrools 3 morrowind. That is an fps style rpg that could be altered to support a good star wars rpg. Another thing is that the MP code is radically different from the SP code, a lot of people, myself included were turned off by this so in that respect it wouldn't work, plus the scripting in MP is second-rate compared to the script potential in SP. This is all speculation though, as JA was the last game to use any quake 3 code. Personally, i found making levels, scripting, coding in doors and all that was rather cumbersome, i'd like to see it simplified with a different engine. Hopefully they'll make the next game with half life source, i heard somewhere that valve is gonna release the source code for HL2 soon after release, a great example of encouraging and helping out that community. Other devs should take note. Peace.

[txa1265]

Originally posted by Obi_Kwiet

I thought 100 levles was impossible too, but i hear HL2 will have that many. I rather wait awile for a good game the blow 50$ every 6 months for a bad game.

Yeah, but HL2 will also wash your socks for you ... oops, wait, they stole that code, too ... oh, well ...

 

 

But remember that SoFII had '60+ action packed levels' ... but was less than 20 hours long. What we'd want is a long game, not a 'numbers game'.

 

As for the whole RPG thing - Morrowmind is an action-rpg, not a 'real' RPG. Not is it an FPS. But I do like the skill system.

 

I think the melding point has to be adding RPG elements to a FPS core. I also think it has to be optional - just like you have a difficulty level, you should have a RPG-level. The game length should not include side-quests, and still be long. Of course I'm not saying there shouldn't be side-quests - OF COURSE there should be.

 

Mike

[PhobicDagger]

I agree that the saber combat should be improved upon. In JO especially, matches tended to boil down to two people bouncing around a level trying to get the drop on each other with a heavy red attack, with the occasional saber lock occurring. Greater things could be done, particularly on the XBox. What about using the normal look-move system with the two thumbsticks to traverse a level, with the usual method of employing attacks to take out groups of weaker enemies, accompanied by the option of a lock-on system, where activation one stick could be used for movement, and the other for determining the placement of your saber, in order to deflect incoming blows and change stance to launch various attacks.

I especially agree with yolkboy's comments on co-op multiplay.

Two (or more) Jedi fighting back-to-back against an overwhelming force of Remnant and Reborn troops is an immensely appealing idea.

Someone else also commented on a different way to handle the force jumping. A nice idea-if done right, it could indeed ground the saber battles...make 'em a bit more hardcore.

A geo-mod style engine is definitely needed. They're LIGHTSABERS, for god's sake! They should be cutting through everything! But element's of Deus Ex: Invisible War's engine wouldn't go amiss either. Advanced lighting affects are the very thing this series needs to make the battles even more dramatic.

The discussion over rpg elements is unearthing some nice ideas, but I feel they shouldn't be taken too far. Done right, the JK series could well become all things to all people, but I think a cap should be put on them if these elements where ever to make it into the series. JK has always been an action game at heart, and for the time being at least, that's what should be concentrated on until they get that particular aspect RIGHT. Then they can fiddle about with the overall depth of the game.

[yolkboy]

Originally posted by lukeskywalker1

You know what, I know a guy making Co-Op for JA right now as we speak! And guess what, its for MP, and can obviously support more than 2 players. You want to play with a friend, well... just play on LAN, or the internet.

 

Do I sense a little hostility? I was implying to the SINGLE PLAYER aspect of the game when I said Co-Op. You know, going through the SP story with other people. Obviously I can play with my friends in Multiplayer. They don’t call it MP for nothing. I might have misled you a bit. It is probably that LAN/Internet Co-Op thing that I mentioned huh? Well here’s what I mean. (*Note - I’m still talking about single player) The game can be played on multiple computers. That way we don’t have to deal with split screens (I’ve always hated them). Now I know that not everyone has 3 computers that would be able to run the game. Therefore, I also proposed the Internet option of playing with two other people over the Internet. They can be a block away or half way across the world. I hope that clears up everything.

[lukeskywalker1]

Yeah, the guys is making a co-op mission for MP. You go in, and fight. Just like SP. You fight NPC (non playable characters) who attack you back.. not bots. You know you can load a SP map in MP. But because the MP scripting is not 100% like SP, many aspects do not work. Thats why you design a MP level, that includes SP parts, that will work correctly. Im not talking about normal MP, where you fight your friends.. i know what co-op is.

 

BTW, DL the new Siege map, you will see

 

• Hyperspace
  
• Scripted NPCs (at the end)
  

 

Just like I said.. all possible.

[yolkboy]

Well, if that's the case, I'll be sitting here by my computer waiting for this mod to come out.... I just hope that it is implemented into the next game right out of the box.

[lukeskywalker1]

Check out the mapping forum, youll see him mention it. Im not sure what his name was..... BTW, you have JA on Xbox? This is a player created mod/map thingy, so.. you might not be able to get it, unless you can DL player created stuff....

[Xemoka]

This is something i've thought about alot, and how they could do it for the better.

 

MULTIPLAYER:

First off you would need something that would change how the fighting takes place completly. what i hate about JA is the movement you have to do to avoid a saber, sure give the play the option to RUN around swinging wildly, however give someone the ability to WALK slowly and still be able to defend, heck make defence even higher.

 

Another thing that vex's me is the stances. One thing i loved about DFII is that there was no stances, you could move in 8 different directions with walking and running to do different moves (i'm talking SBX basicly). I like the idea of FORMS, give a jedi a different feel and let them customize.

 

The Life Meter. As far as i'm concerned sabers should be lethal, they should cut through HP like it was butter, and jedi's dont wear shields. If your fighting a merc your saber should hit there shield perhaps, and then when the shields gone thier hp just vanashes. however when fighting a Jedi the "shields" need to be blocking ability, perhaps like in MOTF mod for JK2 but with actual blocking animations, none of this I HIT YOU WITH MY SABER, oh.. dang.. your not dead. then it becomes a game of being able to hit the oppenent while he's swinging, and it stops the wild swings, or hitting the oppoent enough times so that his defence gets knocked down to nothing (he's off balance) and hitting him before it goes back up.

 

Mercs Vs Jedis really sucks, it needs to be fixed slightly, however this could be done in a mod of JA. Such as non-pullable weapons even though it could be possible, it really sucks being a merc fighting a jedi losing your weapon ALL the time. Other then that there needs to be defensive bonus' for the walking jedi and such, oh yeah, i have a gun, why can't a roll? make it a short roll just dont make it so i can't roll at all.. again.. jedi's dont have shields, if a merc hits a jedi in the back, they get hit and lose HP. Allow double weapons with double aiming with a lock on system, much like they do in consoles, although this seems UNFAIR because they can aim at you, they dont get the advantage of aiming at your head with it, and they have a greater chance of missing (toggle-able in controlls)

 

Other advancements: Such as if you stand still you become atuned to your enviroment, you get little markers on the side of your screens telling you that there is someone around and pointing to where they are, so you can get those pesky Merc's before they hit you in the back with a Bryar Pistol. Better Force powers, fix lightning please, make it so that it works and doens't just spit everywhere (IE it gloms onto one person or 2 people depending on how you aim), give the ability of force absorb to either absorb with a hand or by holding your saber up against it (like yoda did in EP2). Fix the sounds, give it actual saber sounds from the movies, and actual force sounds from the movies. in general add more force powers, and make them more player controlled, like throwing your saber at someone is only 1/2 of it, you have to pull it back or go up and pick it up. Add more acrobatic moves, for example if you jump up there are 5 different annimations, it's random on wich one you get and doesn't affect the outcome of where you land or anything, just makes it more asthetic, because that what the jedi are really about in the end.

 

A game isn't only the major things , it's the little details that make it a seller.

 

SINGLE PLAYER:

 

I'd like to see 2 campains. One from the Light Side, and one from the Dark Side. But make it realistic, for example if your on the Dark Side your not going to be going around saying your the vile evil of the story, your going to think your in the right about everything you do, make it seem like that.

 

Give it a good story, DFII had a not bad story, JO's was weaker, and JA's as much as it was somewhat user powered was weak for what they did. It could have been so much better.

 

Now for my responses to what people have said in some cases:

When you guys say that offline play affects online play, i personally think that stinks. I buy games for thier ONLINE play, i rarly play single player, i play the single player on Jedi Games so that i can learn how to play, not so i can affect what i do in MP. thats too much like Phantasy Star Online, and it gets boring to have to start a new "character" when everyone else is so uber powerfull. Go play Diablo II non-ladder and start a new character, had you been dueling others it would be next to imposible. You'd have to go around and kill creeps constantly to get anythign that would be good

 

Seige was good, for about 20 minutes. It gets old fast, it's always the same objectives, give it some sort of life somehow, either make LOADS of maps for it, or make the objectives change at random

 

Sorry if alot of this is rambling, but i'm just trying to say it all at the same time, and i'm rather unorganised inside my head, if it doesn't make sense, dont complain.. just move along, this is not the post your looking for.

[txa1265]

Actually some good thoughts, Xemoka - not that I agree with all of them, but what does that matter

 

I think one clear thing - the whole SP vs. MP thing.

 

Personally I don't care *AT ALL* if JKII or JA had no MP component. Sure, I've played it - but not much. It just isn't my thing. I'm not big into MP - and it isn't that I'm lousy, I actually do pretty well - about the upper middle of the pack on average (except on Jedi Master, where I was generally first or second, but that's another matter).

 

Max Payne 1 & 2 are horribly short, SP only games. Yet they are very good games and immensely popular. Despite being linear and having no player-based character development. Why? They are fun. The stories are good.

 

I love the Jedi games for the stories and the development - and for having the best weapon ever in a game.

 

As for the essentials of engines - things like ragdoll, solar flare, dynamic lighting, geo-mod and the like are just window dressing. The best game can have none of them and be good - and the worst game can have all of them and still be crap.

 

To figure out what you want, break down what matters most to you in these games. To me, it is:

- Action

- Story

- Role-playing

 

That's about it. I like nice graphics, but am not beholden to them. If a new Jedi game used the Q3 engine like JKII, but added more role-playing (more than JA as well) and lots of NPC's and side-objectives to a fresh story ... I'd be quite happy.

 

But that's me.

 

Mike

[yolkboy]

I have the PC version. I'm anti-console actually. Anyways, where can I find more information on this mod?

[PhobicDagger]

I agree that graphics aren't the be-all and end-all of games, but they certainly help. Compare the original X-Wing to X-Wing Alliance. Wasn't the atmosphere so much better? While I'm on the subject of atmosphere, the makers of the next game in the series should turn their attentions to the use of music. I feel this area is one that could (*should*) be much improved. Atmosphere is one thing that all Star Wars games should have by the bucketload, and anything that can boost it should be considered, as long as it doesn't get in the way of interactivity, or, indeed, the game in general.

For this particular series, action and story would be at the top of my list, also. I would dismiss RPG elements (for now) for reasons earlier stated. The developers simply haven't come close enough to unleashing the full potential of the series as it is, without weighing it down with further aspects.

Those are my thoughts, anyhow.

[Prime]

Originally posted by PhobicDagger

I agree that graphics aren't the be-all and end-all of games, but they certainly help. Compare the original X-Wing to X-Wing Alliance.

Yeah, but X-Wing Alliance came out 7 years after X-Wing. Jedi Academy came out 18 months after Jedi Outcast.

[lukeskywalker1]

Originally posted by yolkboy

I have the PC version. I'm anti-console actually. Anyways, where can I find more information on this mod?

 

I dont think theres much info out... just talk.

[GothiX]

Luke, you wouldn't be referring to the project of Freyr, Alien and Arkon, would you?