El Sitherino Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn hey, new jersy, I'm from there. anyway, no, I'm not hostile to change, just sinful change. I mean, homosexuality is a sin, pure and simple. My father once told me that many people used to say the same exact thing about interacial marriages... kinda odd... funny that oral sex is also sinful but I have yet to hear anyone try to ban it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDurp Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 i dont think that sins can really be taken seriously anymore. i read a book about when leonardo da vinci and john wyclif first questioned christianity, they were shunned and not taken seriously. remember the ten commandments? what was the first one again? oh yeah, lying! you cant tell me you have never lied before in your life, so you can't talk about sinning being a sinner yourself. what is it that is sinful about homosexuality? its different! the christians that declared it a sin were the same ones that burned pagans at the stake for having idealogical differences from themselves. how can you take those people seriously anyway? homosexuality being a sin is hardly good enough to make a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage. ever heard of seperation of church and state? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn [You are] only specualting that they arent there, That's argumentum ad ignorantiam, the fallacy of assuming something is true simply because it hasn't been proven false. Originally posted by yaebginn seems kinda mean to persecute someone when he doenst have a lying history and he says that they are there. Certainly you aren't talking about Bush? His history of lies runs deep. Harken oil? A promise to the citizens of Texas that his goal was to be Governor and not use the seat as a stepping-stone to the Whitehouse? WMDs in Iraq? Originally posted by yaebginn yes, a centrifuge, parts to a warhead missile. why else would there be a centrifuge buried under garden? A centrifuge is not a "part to a warhead missile." It's a possible means of enriching uranium. It was very incomplete and an artifact of a time when Iraq did, indeed, have the capability. Look, you're under the mistaken assumption that I'm arguing for Saddam or Iraq. I'm not. I'm arguing against Bush's stated agenda. I'm arguing against the wisdom of abandoning a more serious threat of Al Qaeda to invade a nation that was already in check, wasting countless billions of dollars and thousands of lives in the process. I'm, therefore, arguing against Bush's credibility. I voted for him for Governor of Texas. I admit it... he took me in. But let me offer you his own words: clicky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn the latter is true. Gays are a larger spreader of STDs. I challenge you to cite a reference to that. It is patently false. According to Laumann, et al (1994), only 6 million Americans identify themselves as homosexual. Even if every single one of them had an incurable STD, it still wouldn't suggest that "gays are a larger spreader (sic) of STDs." According to the American Social Health Association, "The estimated total number of people living in the US with an incurable STD is over 65 million (ASHA, 2001). If, however, you meant to indicate HIV rather than STDs, it is true that the incidence of contraction is higher among homosexuals than heterosexuals. But, according to the CDC (January 2001), 15% of all new cases of HIV in that year were contracted through heterosexual contact and the number is rising quicker than expected by many. Limbaugh stated that that 15% was a myth and that it didn't exist, not that the incidence of homosexual transmission was higher than heterosexual. In other words, he lied. Originally posted by yaebginn none of our post were as long as skinwalkers. Hey... Groovy landed that thing on the Senate doorstep three pages in. There was a lot of fallacious material to address. If I had been in on it from the beginning, I'd have answered in several individual posts, but as it was, I still entered much less verbage than that boran-guy... who I noticed abandoned the thread after I addressed most of his fallacious remarks. References American Social Health Association (2001). Facts and Answers about STDs. http://www.ashastd.org/stdfaqs/statistics.html Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (January 2001). HIV Prevention Strategic Plan Through 2005. http://www.cdc.gov/nchstp/od/hiv_plan/default.htm Edward O. Laumann, John H. Gagnon, Robert T. Michael, and Stuart Michaels, (1994). The Social Organization of Sexuality: Sexual Practices in the United States Chicago:The University of Chicago Press Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn ...I'm not hostile to change, just sinful change. I mean, homosexuality is a sin, pure and simple. So is having a crucifix with Jesus nailed on it; so is doing any work or trade (going to the mall) on Saturday; so is disobeying your mother and father; so is it to "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's" goods. And those are commandments. I don't recall "thou shalt not pack fudge," yet pseudo-christians work and go to the malls on Saturday (or Sunday if your faith has re-written that part of the Bible) while wearing "graven images" of christ, in order to purchase the bling-bling and new cds or cloths that their neighbors are wearing. These same pseudo-christians pick and choose which sins they keep and which they avoid. Bleh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET Warrior Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by SkinWalker And those are commandments. I don't recall "thou shalt not pack fudge," I can't believe I read that It's hilarious and disturbing all at once, and it came up in a reasoned debate which makes it funnier You're out of control Skin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaebginn Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 now to shoot your points out of the water. >Interracial is ok because at least the parts match up. >I have sinned before, everyone besides jesus has. But its one thing to slip up and sin. its another to purposefully live in sin. I mean, they reject God, and they will pay for it with their souls. > No, skin, its not. There is proof that they were there. They coulda been moved, buried, hidden, whatever. And the centrifuge was to be used in with the WMDs., Why the heck else would it be buried? Bush is a good, hoenst,Christian man. He has lied beofre, everyone has. I am not knowledgable in the topics that you said he leid on, I'll research them and come up with a conclusion. >No, I emant STds, but I worded it wrong. Gays are a minroity, right? But statistrically, if you take the percent of them that spread STDs and the striaght peoples percent, the gays would have way more. I'm against boran believe it or not, stupid clan stuff and we argue alot. I'm ot bashing u for ur long post, it was jsut crazy long and I dont read crazy long posts. >God syas many things that arent mentioned in the ten commandments, but are still to be followed. One, having a crucifix isnt a sin, which is it? The saturday thing isnt valid, either. you have to keep it holy, remember it, worship on that day. I have some bible references I believe made by Paul and one in Leviticus, I'll post em in a bit once I get 'em. I have em written down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDurp Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 did you ever stop and think if god didn't exist? if all that you worship was a lie? if you were not meant to credit all of your achievements to an inanimate figure? apparently you didn't. you got stuck up in all the religious things being said that you forgot that there are other different people out there. think of jesus' message, treat people as you would like to be treated. and you are treating gays like crap because some book that you read says its a sin. its odd, muslims don't say homosexuality is a sin, so what makes christianity the right religion, or is your hate against gays not religious at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaebginn Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 I have thought what if it isnt real b4. I then thought back and figured it was. it'd take a while to say why, I maybe will later. but no, I dont treat gays like the crap they pack. Love the sinner hate the sin. I hate what they're doing, but they are a human, and I love them as a creation of God. Gays are alot like democrats to me. I dont like them as a whole, like their beliefs and such. But individually, they are ok. except gays are worse than dems. cause they are living in sin, while dems can be christian, too. btw, guys, dont move this thread, there is no flaming going on, its fine here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanLingo Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 did you ever stop and think if god didn't exist? Did you ever stop to think if God did exist? I'd rather worship a lie all my life and die satisfied than be wrong and burn for eternity. Anyway, no one has any obligation to respond to SkinWalker. He is obviously racist and considers himself above the post word limit (thus taking advantage of anyone that is not a Super-Dee-Dooper Moderator). He can have the welfare money, but he doesn't get my time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaebginn Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 right this is my philosophy. If God doesnt exist, I turn out the same as everyone, dead. but if he does, and i believe, I go to heaven. if he does and I dont believe, I am in hell. I'd rather be in heaven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDurp Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 of course i think about if god exists. i live 15 miles from colorado springs, THE EVANGELICAL MECCA OF THE WORLD! And yaebginn, you're wrong, if god dosen't exist you can still be better than people by doing things to help others in this life. To me what you said is selfish, you believe that you can only do something good if you get a reward out of it, in this case heaven. you never stopped to think that you could be nice to someone for the sake of being nice, out of the goodness of your heart. this is why i don't believe in god, because I am so unselfish, that i try to treat everybody equally, even gays. i dont think some inanimate figure should control who i treat well, that is the epitome of fascism covered up by religous views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by VanLingo Anyway, no one has any obligation to respond to SkinWalker. He is obviously racist and considers himself above the post word limit (thus taking advantage of anyone that is not a Super-Dee-Dooper Moderator). ... wow. You really think Skinwalker is a racist? Could I ask you to support this accusation? If you cannot present anything that suggests this, I will have to count that as a flame and report it. Also post word limit? the hell are you on about? Is anyone going to help me in why christians find it okay to belittle gays rights but yet they don't find it a big need to make oral sex illegal, it's just as sinful and held on the same grounds as sodomy and homosexuality in the bible. PS: this thread will be moved, not because there are flames, but because it is obviously a debate and should be placed where debates are to take place. And VanLingo I suggest you stop spouting such arrogant crap. I for one will not stand for any accusations against someones character when no evidence is around to even suggest it. clicky Much of our society has embraced many perverted sexual practices that are considered in the Bible as abominations to God. Homosexuality is among the list of deviate or abnormal sexual practices however, there are many other practices that can be included as well. Pornography, pedophilia, prostitution, bestiality, oral sex, phone sex and computer virtual reality sex, just to name a few of them. also, it's legal in 24 states to marry ones first cousin. Could someone help me figure out what's up with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn No, I emant STds, but I worded it wrong. Gays are a minroity, right? But statistrically, if you take the percent of them that spread STDs and the striaght peoples percent, the gays would have way more. Show the math and I might accept that. Originally posted by yaebginn God syas many things that arent mentioned in the ten commandments, but are still to be followed. The authors of the bible also wrote a lot of junk that is ignored. How does society decide what's worth ignoring and what's not? Is it still permissable for a conquering army to enslave, rape, and abuse the female refugees (including the children) of a defeated enemy -killing every last male to the youngest child/infant? It was when Moses did it. Originally posted by yaebginn One, having a crucifix isnt a sin, which is it? It is if there is a "graven image" of christ on it. Christ is included in the description from the 2nd commandment that says "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above." Unless we're operating under the assumption that J.C. didn't go to heaven. Originally posted by yaebginn The saturday thing isnt valid, either. you have to keep it holy, remember it, worship on that day. I'd say read it. The 4th commandment doesn't end with "thou shalt remember the sabbath and keep it holy." It also states that "Six days shalt thou labour, [...] in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates." I believe the penalty prescribed elsewhere in the bible (not "mentioned in the 10 commandments") is that violators should be stoned to death. Originally posted by yaebginn I have some bible references I believe made by Paul and one in Leviticus, I'll post em in a bit once I get 'em. I have em written down. You need not. I've already read them. My point isn't that homosexuality isn't condemed in an ancient work of literature, its that many things are condemned and are ignored, particularly in the 10 commandments, which many theologians and believers consider to the be among the most important rules and values of the book. If christians were to adhere to all the rules and expectations of this ancient set of works, I'd be more apt to believe that their bias against homosexual behavior was religious rather than simple bigotry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by VanLingo Did you ever stop to think if God did exist? I'd rather worship a lie all my life and die satisfied than be wrong and burn for eternity. Ahh... yes. Pascal's wager. Good for you. Originally posted by VanLingo Anyway, no one has any obligation to respond to SkinWalker. Of course they don't. Particularly if they have little to say or the intellect with which to say it. yaebginn obviously does, which I can respect. Perhaps you do as well. Originally posted by VanLingo He is obviously racist and considers himself above the post word limit (thus taking advantage of anyone that is not a Super-Dee-Dooper Moderator). Or perhaps not. What "post word limit" do you refer to? I'm not aware of that limitation. And racist? I realize you prefer to not engage in conversation or discussion with me, but could you at least cite a reason for making that absurd statement? Maybe I mis-stated something or wasn't clear about something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaebginn Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 I am often nice, but ultimately, its to serve my Lord. He is pleased when I do nice things. I mean, I would be nice anyway, but this is a bonus. and the crucifix thing i meaning so we dont worship the idols of God, only God himself. Alot of the old testament beame obsolete once Jesus died for us, such as sacrifices. As I said (this applies to the rape thing, the sabbath thing, and the homo thing) alot were made oboselte after Jcs death. Homosexuality still is wrong, because God said that marriage shall be between amna nd a women and created them that way. And no, dont move this. why the heck would you move it? to bug cause I'm pretty much the only debater here ony my side (van lingo, too) and you just want to tick me off? >yaebginn obviously does what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDurp Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 and you and your lord thing bashing homosexuals' way of life is nice?! how can you worship someone like that?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn >yaebginn obviously does what? has intelligence to debate, without resorting to inuslts. We move it because this is a debate, and this (the slice taun-taun) is not the place for such a serious debate. You can still debate over in the senate, over there you'll most likely find more allies too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaebginn Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 neither me, nor my Lord has bashed a gay in this thread. My Lord never has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDurp Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 then why are they automatically going to hell for being gay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Demon44 Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn Gays are alot like democrats to me. I dont like them as a whole, like their beliefs and such. Also Originally posted by yaebginn I mean, the basic one, the guy you see every day. I have an empathy for them now. I know them as a whole, closer. Not a lot of self contradiction just a little Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaebginn Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 gays dont go to hell for being gay, they go for being alive. so would I, if I hadnt accepted the lord. and its not self contradiction, its a error in typing. I meant individual instead of whole for the second line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinWalker Posted August 1, 2004 Share Posted August 1, 2004 Originally posted by yaebginn >yaebginn obviously does what? Sorry, badly worded. I was trying to imply that you had something to say and that you did it intellectually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaebginn Posted August 1, 2004 Author Share Posted August 1, 2004 'preciate the compliment. some of u guys r good debaters as well. you know who you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.