Darth Smaug Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 Dudes..."GOD" doesn't exist...there is NO heaven where your soul will remain, there is NO old big (maybe perverted:D ) guy above that watches each and every one of uss....Jesus existed true but he was just somebody who let's us believe that there is something so we notice him and he get's credit....anyway back to the topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikinor Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 WOW. Isn't that like attacking someones religion? My views on God are always changing but to make a statement like that. I bet your going to get stoned by those people in the bible now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Smaug Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 Jesus was the leader of a group followers that believed him...Well i don't believe him..When your heart stops beating you shut down everything turns black and you have no life left en you don't go to heaven... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikinor Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 OK. Thats what you beleive in but other people might beleive differently. Like if I said something against a religion thats in a way attacking them. So if thats what you beleive in thats fine. I keep what I beleive to myself. And back to the topic I still think that the Force and Anakin was like a God and Jesus role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Smaug Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 i aint attacking ppl who believe in that religion i'm just saying what i think of that religion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikinor Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 Yes but you are saying there WAS no god. You could say I beleive there is no God. And I am going to stop there before we get in trouble with the Moderators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Smaug Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 Good idea..So Jedi worship nothing they live by the force and have no god and feel the force as a god Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikinor Posted February 26, 2005 Share Posted February 26, 2005 In a way yes. At least thats what I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Kenobi Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 Yep, I tend to agree as well. If the Jedi did have a religous base it was a "nature" type religon like wiccans or something. They USE the force, they are in harmony with ALL in nature, bla bla bla you get the point. I'd call em' a force/nature worshipping religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Smaug Posted April 15, 2005 Share Posted April 15, 2005 Yes your right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astrotoy7 Posted April 16, 2005 Share Posted April 16, 2005 heh... the Smaug and Larz chat show be weary fellows, you know that type of stuff isnt allowed.... *lets ridiculous topic live, hoping it will die a natural death* mtfbwya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Smaug Posted April 16, 2005 Share Posted April 16, 2005 Originally posted by Astrotoy7 heh... the Smaug and Larz chat show be weary fellows, you know that type of stuff isnt allowed.... *lets ridiculous topic live, hoping it will die a natural death* mtfbwya I just said my thought about Christ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astrotoy7 Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Originally posted by Darth Smaug I just said my thought about Christ..... great, after having closed another religion thread around here that went astray it is worrisome when God and Christ come into discussions about a SCI-FI/FANTASY MOVIE I was moreso referring to the stream of posts between Larz and yourself that were minutes apart... I dunno why, but I will try to let this thread die a natural death rather than close it... I will leave this closing thought.... *sandals and sabers dont mix* mtfbwya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hidden One Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 The Force. (which everyones said.) but it's not really a god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomie Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 I think that Jedi don't worship the force, as has been pointed out in the earlier posts. Why? Think about it. Earth already has five or so major religions. How many would there be in an entire galaxy filled with different races? Considering any being with enough potential can become a Jedi, it would seem stupid if they force poeple to worship the Force when the join the order. Besides, since in the Star Wars Galaxy the Force has been proven to exist, is it really 'believing'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Jaxu Posted April 18, 2005 Share Posted April 18, 2005 the jedi worship the force we've seen it in many movies and books i believe the force is their god Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted April 19, 2005 Share Posted April 19, 2005 Do they really? Or is this just the belief of certain Jedi? I don't get the impression that the movie Jedi "worship" the Force (not onscreen), though they treat it with respect. It's possible they do, but not the only possible interpretation. Is the Force their "God" and the "Jedi Code" their religion? (or the "Sith Code" for the Sith?). Maybe, maybe not... The Force is scientifically observable in Star Wars (unless you're somebody like Han Solo who's apparently never seen enough to know if it's real or just tricks), so yes, to the Jedi would it really require faith? What is a religion if it doesn't require any faith? Perhaps the Jedi have "faith" in the Force, in order to use their powers, or they have a "personal relationship" with it in order to use it to their needs. But then again it may be like a scientist manipulating the forces of nature in order to use technology. We don't really know. The Jedi, if anything, would have faith that "their way" of using the Force is superior to that of say, the Sith. But the Force itself is a provable reality apart from the believers. In other words, the Force affects even people who don't believe in it. Now, that said, in real life, a believer in God would say that God rules over even people who don't believe in him, true. But I hope you see my point. If God was 100% proven to exist, even by people who weren't religious, then God would become a scientific fact, and cease being a religiously revealed truth. You could still have religions about what God wanted for your life or something, but again, I hope you get what I'm saying. If we take the idea that "life creates" the Force, that might imply that the Force didn't create the universe, and thus isn't supreme. But then again, not all religions insist that God is the creator of all things (the Greeks worshipped a pantheon of gods who weren't even the first gods, they just took over and killed the old gods, called Titans, who were in charge a long time ago). Or we could interpret Yoda's comments about the Force being created by Life as simply that the Force exists, and life makes MORE of it (ie: makes it expand), not that life created it in the first place. Otherwise we'd have to speculate that one day some creature started spitting out Force, then more creatures started doing it, and it eventually grew and encompassed the universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sargent_johnson Posted April 23, 2005 Share Posted April 23, 2005 neither jedi nor sith have gods.except for those blasted sith lords. the jedi use the force as a god i think and use it to hold up the peice while on the other hand its the same with the sith except they abuse the force and use it only force power and death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Kenobi Posted April 23, 2005 Share Posted April 23, 2005 Ok here's what I think if the big George Man had an account and would comment. I believe he'd say that since the force has existed in a galaxy far far away since the beginning; there is no need for "gods" of any type. I personally have never heard any mention of gods or the like in any of the Star Wars movies and I've seen them all. Even the Sith Lords are rulers and tyrants not gods. No where that I've heard of does anyone describe or say that they are. I might be wrong but I don't think I am. I don't think Jedi could have a god anyway. Because to me to worship a god requires dedication to them not the force. It would require some degree of passion via devotion lest they "fall" Hell there might be a church of the Jedi in ole' George's mind for all we know cause really thats where the Star Wars Galaxy is....In his head Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astrotoy7 Posted April 23, 2005 Share Posted April 23, 2005 this argument begins to border on frivolous the minute anyone starts assigning any religious import to any part of what is ostensibly an "modern type of flash gordon movie"(George Lucas' own words, describing Star Wars)... One could pretend to be clever, and discuss GLs relationship and inspiration from Joseph Campbell, but that has been done and is well known to all.. I love SW, I love the characters, tech and music. I love EU but do I think of such things. No. To do so would be wasting time in a magnificent fashion. If you really want to debate god, go look up some Theological texts. Theres plenty of great debates/odeas out there. None of which have anything to do with a certain space opera mtfbwya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Kenobi Posted April 23, 2005 Share Posted April 23, 2005 No ones trying to be "clever" or put something in GL's own words as you put it As far as I can tell no ones debating "the real god" their chattin' about the poss. of one in the SW universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted April 28, 2005 Share Posted April 28, 2005 Out of Universe Lucas intended the Force to represent religious faith and spirituality (encompassing all religions). He believes in "God" and in "good" and "things work better in life when you choose the good." Those are Lucas's words. He didn't go into specifics, but there you have it. In Universe we don't really know for sure. It's entirely possible, I think, that the Jedi Order, while being philosophical in nature (they follow a moral code that is not scientifically testable in a lab, only felt to be "true"), the Force itself is a scientifically testable, repeatable and verifiable phenomena (even if it is rare, in a huge galaxy of countless intelligent inhabitants and only 10,000 Jedi). Acknowledgment of the Force thus does not require faith, the principle element in all religion (of course what one does with that power is definately a philosophical/religious question). In the time of the OT, Han Solo can doubt the Force because the Jedi are all but extinct. Apparently that info has been so successfully suppressed that even well-traveled people like Solo can believe that it's "all simple tricks and nonesense." Then again, there are people who disclaim modern science and claim various well established theories are bunkum today... Individual Jedi may have their own religious beliefs apart from the Jedi Order, or they may have no religion at all, or their work may be their religion. Do Gods exist in Star Wars? Well, there's the (fanon as far as I can tell, but based on hints in the EU) "Hyperspace Aliens" theory, which speculates about a "super race" that built these various spacial anomalies and super techs. We need not assume that it was just some really powerful aliens who disappeared one day, for all we know it was a deity or two or three. And with powers like that, they could definately be considered "god-like." Does a religion exist about them? So far, I don't think so. At least the Jedi aren't shown to pray to them or something. It's like a lot of things, we don't see characters going to the bathroom [or sleeping for that matter (unless it's super important to the plot like some prophetic dream or somebody getting ambushed in their sleep)], but we assume they do so regularly. They may also go into their rooms and pray to their god(s) of choice when the audience isn't watching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clonearcman Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 I think that they worship certain objects also. Like in KOTOR you can get the Heart of the Guardian and it says that the sith worship the crystal. Sith are dark jedi so technically jedi worship the force but that is among other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomie Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Sith are dark jedi, but also more than that. Sith have a very distinct culture, so I don't think this is enough evidence to cinclude the Jedi do the same as well. The only thing the Jedi and Sith have in common, I think, is tha fact that they both use lightsabers and forcepowers. But not even the same type sabers and powers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Technically the Sith aren't Dark Jedi. True, according to the TPM novelisation the first Sith were in fact renegade Jedi, so the term would be fine for them, but that was 2,000 years before the prequel movies. (*insert retconn that fits the "old history" of the Sith from the KOTOR comics & games back into continuity*) The Sith are their own Order, though sometimes Jedi do leave the Jedi Order and join the Sith, such as Anakin/Vader and Dooku/Tyrannus. But like Palpatine/Sideous was never a Jedi, and Darth Maul (we never know his true name, Roy) were never Jedi, so the term "Dark Jedi" would not apply to them, and most Sith throughout SW history. Supposedly only 20 Jedi left the Order "voluntarily" (whatever that means) in their entire run, according to the AOTC novel and other supplementary sources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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