Oh Screw This!

[MaximumMayhem]

After trying to hold onto hope that LucasArts would learn from their mistakes, its all gone down the drain after reading info on these boards about the one huge cluster f*ck Battlefront II is before it's even been released.

 

* Total lack of knowledge by the developers when it came to characters, ships and placement of the above. The whole clone trooper skin debacle id expect to come across in a mod devised by a proud 8 year old who yet doesnt have detail specific memory. What a blatant slap in the face to not only hardcore Star Wars fans but to those who know more than just what happened in the films. I consider myself a fan of the events and characters that transpired during the Clone Wars and it sickens me to the stomache to see what they have done.

 

* The engine. Why in the blue hell use the same engine? I dont want to hear "it costs more money and takes more time", because if that were the case, why not release all the 'additional features' we see here under an expansion whilst working on something a little less dated? Was the original so flawed to sh*t that they jumped ship? Probably. Lets screw it up alll over again! There were multitudes of BASIC improvements that were needed before it was time to move house. A quick fix may work for console kids and those who throw money at any Star Wars branded experience (which LA seem to realise), but each to their own.

 

* I dont have so much blame to lay on Pandemic as i do on those that wield the whip. LucasArts seem more keen to generate money than to create a quality TRUE TO LICENSE experience. What we end up with seems to resemble a cheaper imitation version of the real thing. Dont worry LA: You'll feel it soon enough. Bite a hand so many times, and it will no longer feed you.

 

Not to tread on the toes of anyone who is still hopeful for this title as hope is a great thing, but i see a quick fix abomination released only for sheer financial gain that will bomb just as well as the first.

 

I agree with TK's every post.

 

If anyone has any queries regarding the rather brief points ive spilt out, then by all means, ill flesh them out in more detail for you should you desire, but i must cut this visit short as im about to play a game that you all should bother with - Battlefield 2.

 

Adios

- Steve

[Rebel_Trooper]

I was thinking of making a thread like this, as a complaint to everything the devs have done wrong, like make up the Jet Trooper, giving the Rebels transport being a Republic Gunship, putting the hangars on the side of an SD, letting the DT appearing on battles such as Hoth, all EPIII clones being 501st (blue stripe) and so on. I just decided it was a bad idea though.

 

To sum it all up:

YOU ARE COMPLETELY RIGHT!

[Redtech]

Damn, you people need girlfriends, F-A-S-T! (I know it's an alien thing, but you can get used to people of the opposite sex).

 

I'm going to repeat this until someone starts getting fed up. SWBF2 is a game!

 

Not a sim

Or a realistic game

Or even a detailed game

 

It's an arcade, play for 2 hours, drop, pick up again, drop game. You'd need a team the size of Team Kojima if you wanted to make everything bang on accurate and up to detail, but with the detail of a Tom Clancy shooter.

 

You ain't doing that in less than 2 years!

[Rebel_Trooper]

What an intelligently written, moving opinion.

 

Damn, you people need girlfriends, F-A-S-T! (I know it's an alien thing, but you can get used to people of the opposite sex).

 

It puts the point across without having to degenerate into insulting people with the opposite view! And you can actually have girlfriends while wanting a perfect game! It's called wanting a perfect game!

 

I'm going to repeat this until someone starts getting fed up. SWBF2 is a game!

 

And it's a boring and lame one at that.

 

Not a sim

Or a realistic game

Or even a detailed game

 

Well, you're right there. It's not. What a shame, it would be so much more if it was a bit more realistic.

 

It's an arcade, play for 2 hours, drop, pick up again, drop game.

 

Wow, you managed to keep playing for 2 whole HOURS!? You sure do endure a lot of crap!

 

You'd need a team the size of Team Kojima if you wanted to make everything bang on accurate and up to detail, but with the detail of a Tom Clancy shooter.

 

Here you are right. I'm not asking for precisely accurate levels of recoil when you fire the E-11, just a bit more realism would be nice.

 

A good game is much like a good book. It pulls you in. You are intrested.

A bad game is like a bad book. It's a steaming pile of s1-1@!

 

You ain't doing that in less than 2 years!

 

No. I would rather wait 2 years for a rare near perfect game than a year for some shoddy piece of crap that tires me after 5 minutes of playing.

 

You have your opinion, I have mine. Time to move on.

[MaximumMayhem]

Enough of the Kojima crap. You may also think that girlfriends are the result of acheiving the highest form of existence, but they are far from it. What people do in their private lives aside is their own business, im talking about getting your money's worth and having a quality title based on a film license. Is that so hard to ask for?

 

As far as genre goes, i never read that this is an "arcade" game. Its an First Person Shooter and thus has BIG shoes to fill, especially seeing as this isnt some hokey little title, but something based off one of the most successful franchises in existence. Im not being some Star Wars picky fanboy, but its obvious that Pandemic havent done their research. Either that or theyve been severely restricted by other parties (gee.. guess who!). This is where the problem lies. It may mean diddly squat to you as this is a foreign mental opinion, but im letting it be known that i wont be insulted by LucasArts any longer.

 

If they release a product that is up to standard, then ill pay for it. Till the point that they stop disrespecting the consumer by churning out rehashed garbage, they wont have my support. Bottom line.

 

Please dont tell me that Battlefront achieved what it set out to do. You and I both know it failed miserably. Everyone deserves a second chance, but Pandemic's is getting quickly dashed in my eyes. Lets not talk Star Wars, lets talk any kind of representation that is meant to be true to an entertainment source; be it a film adaptation, a novel etc.. if it doesnt stay true, then it becomes somewhat of a travesty in the eyes of those who vastly enjoy its source.

 

Yeah, SWBF 2 is a game. The films are fictional films too.. whats your point?

 

The difference is that the subsequent films all got it right because they came from Lucas. Easy... the games though didnt come from Lucas and arent correct. Im not talking about the mere characters, promised space battles with idle capital ships that sucks out strategy (which now seem no different to land maps anyway.. as you still fly to land somewhere..), but the game play itself. Its whats at heart that counts and the heart of Battlefront behind its licensed facade gets boring fast. 'Pick up, put down' or not, boring games dont hang around long.

 

Now instead of improving their mistakes, theyre just doing it all again with a new flash in the pan.

 

Bang accurate and up to detail? Well Rainbow Six isnt exactly below detail. Battlefield, Call of Duty games, etc.. all seem to have the right detail. What, are you saying that a building from Mos Eisley has more complex rendered walls than a building in Iraq? Rubbish. You have a point though in stating that it would take a considerable amount of time to pull off. True.

 

Thats why sequels usually come out a few years later, instead of not even a whole year later. But thats okay because LA just pumps them out without a care in the world. You'll care though because you're forking out your hard earned money for an inferior product. A game may be a game, but all things should be taken seriously. You think that Valve treated Half Life as a joke even though its nothing but a game? Gaming is still an industry and ethics are always involved on some level. Otherwise you get trash..

[swphreak]

Rwar *whipcrack*

 

Remember to keep it civil everyone.

 

As for the topic, I think SWBF2 would be a waste of my 50 bucks.

[Commander Obi-Wan]

 

And it's a boring and lame one at that.

 

You are entitled to your own opinion...other people like the game.....for example...me!

[McCusto]

And it's a boring and lame one at that.

 

 

And you would know this. . .how?

[HordaK]

maybe he phoned Santa Clause, u know, Santa Clause knows everything

[TK-8252]

maybe he phoned Santa Clause, u know, Santa Clause knows everything

 

And he gets to play all the games early.

 

Lucky bastard.

 

 

But seriously, the way we know it won't live up to our standards is by simply watching the videos of it. It plays exactly the same as SWBF, which didn't live up to our standards either. Which is like a slap in the face.

[yellowblood]

I personly don't care if they will use Unreal 1 engine or put Anakin Skywalker against Darth Vedar in the same map. I am a proud fanboy who will love this game as long as it says STARWARS Battlefront.

 

They aren't selling a game, they are selling an idea. A briliant one.

[HordaK]

well, i undestand some points against SWBF2 and some not.....I dont understand why ppl dont like the game cause of the incorrectness of the units, ships, etc. It's just a game not a EP1 - EP6 Simulation. If u really want UBER Correctness why dont u cry about the respawn? I never saw any stormtrooper respawning in the movies....If u want to cry about incorrectness cry about the whole game, cause its not a simulation....

 

but ok i said i understand some points....

 

the only 2 things i really really hated about SWBF 1 were the A! of the useless Bots, if u have a 9 on 9 with 1 Human and 8 Bots each.....its not a 9 on 9 its just a 1 on 1, cause the bots in SWBF are even more useless than a destroyed Gonk....

 

The other point was the "U have taken a command-post" shi* every 2 seconds..i would liked SWBF1 much better if it has the Movie Battles 2 Game Mode...an objective based Team Deathmatch, without any respawn (except if the soldiers got reinforcements) MB2 is 1000 times better than SWBF 1 and its just a MOD for JA not a Full Game....but i know they got rid of the "only Command Post" Capturing so the one reason for me to not buy SWBF2 is not anymore...

 

the only point that should stop me from buying BF2 are the Bots, dunno if they are really that kinda better than in BF1, so i would be happy if some Beta Gamers like Custo could tell me something about the new AI in SWBF2

[Redtech]

What an intelligently written, moving opinion.

I aim to please.

 

It puts the point across without having to degenerate into insulting people with the opposite view! And you can actually have girlfriends while wanting a perfect game! It's called wanting a perfect game!

And you're expecting a Star Wars game to be that? Well, Petroglyph may deliver with their RTS, because they've been making these kind of games for over ten years (that is a link).

And it's a boring and lame one at that.

You=win. I'm taking the POV of playing it with a friend of mine, I'll get back to that.

 

Well, you're right there. It's not. What a shame, it would be so much more if it was a bit more realistic.

I hate the term "realistic" because Star Wars is so inconsistant. Check out how much damage Solo's pistol does when escaping with the Falcon in Ep4. Would you want every pistol to cause that much damage? Screw the E11.

 

Wow, you managed to keep playing for 2 whole HOURS!? You sure do endure a lot of crap!

Ever played Galactic conquest 2-player co-op on Playstation with a friend, on hard? It's a laugh on Hoth when he bails out at 50 ft from a snowspeeder I'm flying, to kill anyone trying to spawn outside the AT-AT's while I'm roping it. Although, yeah, that is a bit odd with the fall-damage.

 

Here you are right. I'm not asking for precisely accurate levels of recoil when you fire the E-11, just a bit more realism would be nice.

I want blood and brutal melee moves like Republic Commando. Now that was closer to a war than Battlefront was. Can't believe in Ep 3 Lucas put in the intro "WAR!!!" Nah, you don't say, that's only the title of the series!

 

A good game is much like a good book. It pulls you in. You are intrested.

A bad game is like a bad book. It's a steaming pile of s1-1@!

Buy Beyond Good and Evil, that is a brilliant game, although system specs are pretty high, but it's so touching at the ending. The music can bring tears to the eyes.

 

No. I would rather wait 2 years for a rare near perfect game than a year for some shoddy piece of crap that tires me after 5 minutes of playing.

Fair enough, but you can't do it in 2 years, that's what I'm saying. Now if BF1 never existed and they started it then and finished it now, it'd probably be of a different standard, wouldn't you agree. It's very difficult to create something completely new in such a short space of time. Not without doing an "Epic" and making sure you get loads of downloadables as you go alon (thinking of UT2003-UT2004).

 

 

You have your opinion, I have mine. Time to move on.

Believe it or not, we're on the same team, just I don't like shouiting about games much. No, really.

 

Okay, Rebel Trooper, enough with quoting you.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Enough of the Kojima crap. You may also think that girlfriends are the result of acheiving the highest form of existence, but they are far from it. What people do in their private lives aside is their own business, im talking about getting your money's worth and having a quality title based on a film license. Is that so hard to ask for?

2 things, you shouldn't cry so loud about a game, I mean, in a war where millions of people die over fuel resources, or the lack of them, where terrorism is judged by the colour of the victim's skin and where a blind eye is turned to the rape of natural resources, it seems a bit "off" to start moaning about a game so violently. The thing is, get some balance, go out, do something useful. You hate the game, do not play it. It's why I wouldn't play Splinter Cell 1.

 

Second point, Team Kojima have a knack for putting A LOT of effort into Metal Gear games. Did you know that MGS2 and 3 use the same engine? Play them both and it isn't obvious. But check out the attention to detail in the animations, the scenary, the movements, even little things like water, rain, animals and guard behvaiour nuances. Now I'm not saying that MGS games are perfect, but you can see that they bother to put in far too much attention to detail sometimes, something that isn't really done in most FPS although run-and gun games by ID and Epic have the advantage of lots of experience and support for original and innovative (and creative) moddlers and map designers by third parties as well as in-house.

 

As far as genre goes, i never read that this is an "arcade" game. Its an First Person Shooter and thus has BIG shoes to fill, especially seeing as this isnt some hokey little title, but something based off one of the most successful franchises in existence. Im not being some Star Wars picky fanboy, but its obvious that Pandemic havent done their research. Either that or theyve been severely restricted by other parties (gee.. guess who!). This is where the problem lies. It may mean diddly squat to you as this is a foreign mental opinion, but im letting it be known that i wont be insulted by LucasArts any longer.

I know for a fact that the games that have diverted away from Lucasarts control probably work better. X-Wing Vs Tie Fighter has EU ships and most people would argue it's one of the best space shooters around to date and still being sold to this day. Also Knights of the Old Republic stands by its own merits and does better because of it. Because Battlefront is closer linked to the films then certain "pressures" are implied. Also, consider that the average fan can not really tell clone armour apart, I don't see it as a big deal, especially when it's uncertain what armour patterns were worn on planets like Bespin or Kamino for that matter, would they be wearning the new uniforms or what?

 

If they release a product that is up to standard, then ill pay for it. Till the point that they stop disrespecting the consumer by churning out rehashed garbage, they wont have my support. Bottom line.

Why tell me? It's obvious, I'm very picky about my games as a "poor" student, so I need to get stuff that comes from trusted sources and developers who I know deliver consistantly.

 

Please dont tell me that Battlefront achieved what it set out to do. You and I both know it failed miserably. Everyone deserves a second chance, but Pandemic's is getting quickly dashed in my eyes. Lets not talk Star Wars, lets talk any kind of representation that is meant to be true to an entertainment source; be it a film adaptation, a novel etc.. if it doesnt stay true, then it becomes somewhat of a travesty in the eyes of those who vastly enjoy its source.

You're arguing agains someone not interested in the argument. We're on the same side, I just hate people getting wound up so heavily and personally over something, that as you said, you will not buy. There are MANY games that are pure garbage compared to their source, heck Constantine comes across as a crap film AND game compared to the comics. Star Wars is unique in that the crap/decent ratio is surprisingly high just by the number of games produced (unless you liked Super Bombad racing).

 

Yeah, SWBF 2 is a game. The films are fictional films too.. whats your point?

So sayeth Yoda, "Everything". It's a game, as in a CONSOLE game, that's why when I play it on PC it sucks so bad. No really, I can wipe bots on a Playstation 2 thanks to auto-aim and optomisation for the PS2 controller, but on PC where although you are near enough 100% accurate with a mouse +/-10%, the projectiles are so slow it really lags that you can't hit jack without leading your target as if you're launching "mini-rockets" with the beserk mode in UT2003/4. Heck, you can't rocket jump without turning friendly fire off. It's hard to create consistant realism when the source itself is full of inconsistances. I take the movies as being Canon but details to be mucked around in slightly, because their physics is not going to work with ours. That's why Pandemic wont license the Havok engine (for example), because that simulates Earth Physics, but an AT-AT wouldn't be able to walk, (too heavy) hover vehicles would have trouble with momentum (no friction, NO BRAKES!) and you'd spend more effort modding it to take into account what is unreal, than what it is, although Bungie did a good job with Halo 2, despite it's inaccuracies with physics, so maybe that would have been something to see.

The difference is that the subsequent ilms all got it right because they came from Lucas. Easy... the games though didnt come from Lucas and arent correct. Im not talking about the mere characters, promised space battles with idle capital ships that sucks out strategy (which now seem no different to land maps anyway.. as you still fly to land somewhere..), but the game play itself. Its whats at heart that counts and the heart of Battlefront behind its licensed facade gets boring fast. 'Pick up, put down' or not, boring games dont hang around long.

You shouldn't really cuss a game that isn't out yet. Check the reviews when it's out and make your final decision. Anyway, you're oversimplifying BF2 and overgloryifying Lucas. I am not a fanboy and IMHO, Lucas "lost-it" when script writing Ep1-3. Heck, Republic Commando convinces me that Ep2/3 should have been that gritty and murky and that war is unpleasant, not "Yippee Kay Yay I just killed 100!" Oh well, it is a kids film with rediculous amounts of violence, but I'll let that pass or I'll begin quoting Maddox. For space maps, ever considered that if you let people land on your cap ship, you'll loose, so as a fighter, you can kill transports, or disable the guns by shooting them off, or just dogfight for hours. One of the controversies was whether the space maps would be too Rogue Squadron-ish.

 

Now instead of improving their mistakes, theyre just doing it all again with a new flash in the pan.

Find the thread which has the gamespy chatlog of the developers with some fans, it's quite interesting to see the claims they're making for the stuff they're adding. I'll leave it to your own judgement what you think of it.

 

Bang accurate and up to detail? Well Rainbow Six isnt exactly below detail. Battlefield, Call of Duty games, etc.. all seem to have the right detail. What, are you saying that a building from Mos Eisley has more complex rendered walls than a building in Iraq? Rubbish. You have a point though in stating that it would take a considerable amount of time to pull off. True.

I kinda like the Rainbow six, but I hate that the M16 seems to work for everything. The new one has a more diverse range of weapons suited for either long-shooting or bang in your face, rather than a "jack-of-all-trades" that the M16 was. Well, a building in Iraq was built by an Iraqi man so it's using "Real-world materials rendering" but yeah, linking back to my Kojima comment, if you've ever played the newer MGS (and not fallen asleep during cutscenes) then there's a lot of detail even in environment. Battlefield 2 has a rubbish single player though that makes BF1's look like an Halo-killer in comparison though.

 

Thats why sequels usually come out a few years later, instead of not even a whole year later. But thats okay because LA just pumps them out without a care in the world. You'll care though because you're forking out your hard earned money for an inferior product. A game may be a game, but all things should be taken seriously. You think that Valve treated Half Life as a joke even though its nothing but a game? Gaming is still an industry and ethics are always involved on some level. Otherwise you get trash..

Yeah, Valve rule though. Pandemic IMHO did better with Mercaneries, I haven't played it properly, but you get things like hijackable vehicles, OTT destroyable scenary and even little things like seeing your weapons visibly holstered. It kicks BF1's corpse around the floor. Anyway, ultimately, I'll be hard pushed to buy BF2, mainly because the PS2 ain't mine! But I would have to be "stunned to submission" to get it for my Laptop, heck would it even run? But I have a feeling that PC users may be dissapointed and that console users will get a better benefit (except online).

[zerted]

Ahhhhhhhhhhh. My head hurts, such long posts...

 

...No. I would rather wait 2 years for a rare near perfect game than a year for some shoddy piece of crap that tires me after 5 minutes of playing.

 

You have your opinion, I have mine...

If you think it only takes 2 years to develop a "<i>rare near perfect game</i>", you have obviously never programmed before.

[TK-8252]

Until HordaK and Redtech drop the childish insults, their posts do not dignify a response.

[Pho3nix]

MaximumMayhem: I salute you.

Almost like you read my mind, I was thinking about making a thread about the same complaints.

[HordaK]

childish? the only childish things here are ur arguments that this game sucks only cause the Clones have the wrong color etc (and i dont only mean ur comments TK) anyway i said i understand SOME points, but the above mentioned reasons are just dumb, dont try to tell me that Battlefield 2 is the pure realism compared to the real WW, if thats not childish i dunno what is

 

btw with ur useless comment u responded to our "childish insults" so wheres the point of ur post anyway?

[Redtech]

Until HordaK and Redtech drop the childish insults, their posts do not dignify a response.

Wait, you've been whinging non-stop about how much SWBF2 sucks on and on and when I do make a sensible (but long post), instead of reading it and making a point you sit back and moan again?

 

Damn, wish the Darkside was real.

 

Anyway:

2 things, you shouldn't cry so loud about a game, I mean, in a war where millions of people die over fuel resources, or the lack of them, where terrorism is judged by the colour of the victim's skin and where a blind eye is turned to the rape of natural resources, it seems a bit "off" to start moaning about a game so violently. The thing is, get some balance, go out, do something useful. You hate the game, do not play it. It's why I wouldn't play Splinter Cell 1.

Bonus points on finding where I am quoting myself from. I do agree that is a grave insult and if any of the repected elders like Kurgan wish to "bust my lip" on cusses that strong, then it is their right to do so.

[ET Warrior]

2 things, you shouldn't cry so loud about a game, I mean, in a war where millions of people die over fuel resources, or the lack of them, where terrorism is judged by the colour of the victim's skin and where a blind eye is turned to the rape of natural resources, it seems a bit "off" to start moaning about a game so violently.

Well that's a thoroughly silly thing to say. Simply because my life could be worse, doesn't mean I'm supposed to see a video game released and say "oh, well, it may be crap, but at least I'm not in a war-zone right now" We can say that for a lot of things. I shouldn't be upset when the Broncos lose, or if I do poorly on a midterm, or screw up at work, because hey. It could be worse.

 

But it does matter to some people. We choose what is important in our lives, and to some people video games are important. I am one of those people. I label video games as important because they are one of my main sources of entertainment outside of sports and movies. I also really like star wars, so a star wars video game SHOULD be something really awesome.

 

Now when something that is so much garbage as Battlefront gets released, well I think fans have a right to get mad, and be skeptical about a sequel. If you make a bad game, and release it's sequel in less than a year, you don't care about the fans, and you don't care about releasing a quality product. You care about the money that you're bringing in from the suckers who see Star Wars on a box and assume it must be great.

 

Battlefront 2 should've taken 3 years minimum to develop. and then it may actually have been worth buying.

[MaximumMayhem]

2 things, you shouldn't cry so loud about a game, I mean, in a war where millions of people die over fuel resources, or the lack of them, where terrorism is judged by the colour of the victim's skin and where a blind eye is turned to the rape of natural resources, it seems a bit "off" to start moaning about a game so violently. The thing is, get some balance, go out, do something useful. You hate the game, do not play it. It's why I wouldn't play Splinter Cell 1.

 

 

Oh how incredibly righteous of you. Just because I dont have the absolute power to halt all global wars, racism and destruction of the habitable Earth; doesnt mean i am ranked high enough to start discussing what is now in comparison, a non existant problem when compared to 'real' wordly issues. If that were the case, why even bother creating forums over such trivial things as mere games? Wouldnt any kind of non positive post immediately cease to be productive?

 

Well ill tell you something, if it wasnt for people like you (your being appalled by certain negative aspects of the world) and me, who voice their concern about everyday things that dont sit well however large or small they may appear (eg. be it the issue of pathetically narrowminded 'racial superiority', to the lacking service at your local shopping centre, to how the mechanic screwed you over because you dont know squat about your car); we'd be living the lives of happy, ignorantly blissful capitalist - 'hand your money over ' saps. If something doesnt smell right, by hell kick up a stink about it. Because in most cases, it keeps the bastards honest.

 

Someone in this thread stated that they will buy Battlefront because it has the STAR WARS title on it. Doesnt that sadden you? This sort of thing is at the forefront of my argument here. LucasArts have obviously grown a tad complacent towards the consumer and arent willing to focus behind a product 100%, because all they are interested in is revenue. On a much smaller scale, its no different to PG & E screwing over local townspeople and their very health, to make bucks. Like I said, its on an incredibly smaller scale, but appalling nonetheless. So while this may seem like crying over something irrelevant to complain about here; i beg to differ.

 

 

This message board is comprised of members that enjoy LucasArts games in general; the major percentage being those that enjoy Star Wars; and, ill take a wild assumption here in guessing they also enjoy Star Wars themed games too. So dont you (as someone who in some way, has the same sort of inclination to Star Wars as many others here do) feel somewhat insulted that a company is expecting you to pay money for something that is sub par? All the while, seeing other similarly themed titles which undoubtably prove it can be better granted technology in this current age? I mean, dont tell me its hard for a company who creates games (all they solely do for a business) to; on the amazing monetary budgets they have, create something more than a mediocre teambased FPS? We all know Lucas is one financially well endowed mammal and im sure that LucasArts themselves dont just get the $$ scraps, so it seems that this lack of quality is becoming a worry.

 

You go on to state the strenghts of different game developing houses. Whats stopping LucasArts from creating an engine as fantastic as Unreal or Source? Money restrictions? Hiring the top minds in the business? Microsoft seems to have stepped into the gaming market at a far later date than LucasArts and they are taking this business seriously with no problems. Hell, they acquired Rare and Bungie; whats stopping LucasArts from following suit in scooping up industry greats? You say ID and Epic have the experience. Its the people behind the name that add to this regard, not vice versa. Everyone has their price and it seems that LA isnt willing to pay for it, which is inpart; thanks to individuals that state they'll buy said product merely because it has 'Star Wars' on it. They (LA and othersuch A-holes concerned) need to know its about time to change this shallow tactic because it wont be putting the food on the table for much longer.

 

 

I know for a fact that the games that have diverted away from Lucasarts control probably work better. X-Wing Vs Tie Fighter has EU ships and most people would argue it's one of the best space shooters around to date and still being sold to this day. Also Knights of the Old Republic stands by its own merits and does better because of it. Because Battlefront is closer linked to the films then certain "pressures" are implied. Also, consider that the average fan can not really tell clone armour apart, I don't see it as a big deal, especially when it's uncertain what armour patterns were worn on planets like Bespin or Kamino for that matter, would they be wearning the new uniforms or what?

 

As far as control goes; there's 'control' and then there's 'blatant disregard for a license that puts off people who expect to see what they pay for'. Ie. Thought behind placement. It may sound extreme that some people are complaining about Luke Skywalker's lightsaber being green in Hoth; but Star Wars has become more of a familiar institution. Lightsaber colour sound farfetched? Maybe, but my 6 year old nephew can tell you that "pilot Luke" has a blue lightsaber and "jedi Luke" has a green one. Gaming and fiction is an illusion. Star Wars is a memorable illusion. Screw with it and people just wont buy it. You're right, Battlefront is much more closer linked to the films in that its meant to play them out; it seems that not enough pressure is being applied to make it a homage to them. Average fans may not be able to tell clone armour apart as the prequels have grown far more complex when it comes to visuals. Why not cater to ALL audiences by keeping basic elements of the game such as armour colour etc.. as they were in the films. Its a simply case of copycat. Doesnt sound that difficult does it? Then you'd be doing a larger % of people justice and bottom line is you make more money aswell as fulfill people's expectations. Smiles all around.

 

 

Why tell me? It's obvious, I'm very picky about my games as a "poor" student, so I need to get stuff that comes from trusted sources and developers who I know deliver consistantly.

 

Because if you're on the "same team" as you've stated, let alone picky due to your budget then why not intervene and have your say about the issue at hand here? Its either that, or let the 'Vote #1 Star Wars Branders' screw your gaming options to the ground by giving dishonest companies the room to drop the quality bar. Evil unchecked spreads, however small.

 

 

You're arguing agains someone not interested in the argument. We're on the same side, I just hate people getting wound up so heavily and personally over something, that as you said, you will not buy. There are MANY games that are pure garbage compared to their source, heck Constantine comes across as a crap film AND game compared to the comics. Star Wars is unique in that the crap/decent ratio is surprisingly high just by the number of games produced (unless you liked Super Bombad racing).

 

You must be, seeing as you posted a lengthy reply. Dont get me wrong, this isnt something I lose sleep over. As you say, its a game and games arent really meant to be taken on a serious level. Ive just had enough of game companies losing their respect for quality and working horizontally instead of working to a higher standard, raising the benchmark. Battlefront 2; for a sequel, hasnt provided any answers to the problems we've seen in the first; only more features with the same dated engine. You release patches to make up for your mistakes and not the same game with a GB or so of extras in it in repacked form. As a student, you'd understand this more than anyone. The bottom line is, LA has the resources to ensure that the 'crap/decent' ratio of games should be 1 in 10 atleast. They arent pushing the bar up, just forward.

 

 

It's a game, as in a CONSOLE game, that's why when I play it on PC it sucks so bad.

 

Then it has no business being on PC until it's done properly. Otherwise, why port something that "sucks so bad"? Its still being done though. Do you know the answer yet? Hence my post's purpsose is to alert the shi.. ahh unsavoury types that i wont stand for it, and that its about time they woke up or they'll be left behind in their pile of beta titles to keep them company while game houses that exist to make quality titles thrive. You want to talk about film? Why do you think Stealth bombed in the US when it was released? Ill tell you why, its because the public is fed up with all the action packed, brainless Bruckheimer sh*t released today. LA hasnt reached that rejection pinnacle yet, but theyre climbing the mountain well.

 

 

No really, I can wipe bots on a Playstation 2 thanks to auto-aim and optomisation for the PS2 controller, but on PC where although you are near enough 100% accurate with a mouse +/-10%, the projectiles are so slow it really lags that you can't hit jack without leading your target as if you're launching "mini-rockets" with the beserk mode in UT2003/4. Heck, you can't rocket jump without turning friendly fire off. It's hard to create consistant realism when the source itself is full of inconsistances.

 

Refer to last para. Exactly. So where or who does the problem begin with? Looks like you answered your own statement.

 

I take the movies as being Canon but details to be mucked around in slightly, because their physics is not going to work with ours. That's why Pandemic wont license the Havok engine (for example), because that simulates Earth Physics, but an AT-AT wouldn't be able to walk, (too heavy) hover vehicles would have trouble with momentum (no friction, NO BRAKES!) and you'd spend more effort modding it to take into account what is unreal, than what it is, although Bungie did a good job with Halo 2, despite it's inaccuracies with physics, so maybe that would have been something to see.[/Quote]

 

News flash: 90% of video games are based on pure fantasy. Somehow engines used thus far have been lenient when it comes to tackling the lack of reality issue. I dont see that as an excuse for a lack of a decent engine affecting gameplay physics. If that response were to come from the mouth of an LA PR, they'd need to go back to wording school. I admire your trying to come up with valid points, but they do nothing to cover for LA's lack of gaming engine quality.

 

 

You shouldn't really cuss a game that isn't out yet. Check the reviews when it's out and make your final decision.[/Quote]

 

No I shouldnt, but to merit that, ive read or seen very little to make me hold SWBF 2 in any sort of higher esteem. Perhaps you can prove me wrong in showing proof that Pandemic are really trying to dispel the screw ups that brought the original down. No, i dont count a server browser, buddy list and clan recognition as evidence. We ask for uncapped FPS and stable netcode and they give us a sprint button and space 'battles' - the story of Pandemic's life...

 

Anyway, you're oversimplifying BF2 and overgloryifying Lucas.[/Quote]

 

Quite the contrary as thats basically how simple BF2 appears to be, and theres little present glory when it come to re-enacting a basic Lucas vision in a game. If people who are mere fans of Star Wars are complaining, then obviously important parts of the SW theme have been lost.

 

I am not a fanboy and IMHO, Lucas "lost-it" when script writing Ep1-3. Heck, Republic Commando convinces me that Ep2/3 should have been that gritty and murky and that war is unpleasant, not "Yippee Kay Yay I just killed 100!" Oh well, it is a kids film with rediculous amounts of violence, but I'll let that pass or I'll begin quoting Maddox.[/Quote]

 

'Fanboy' is such a convoluted generalisation. I have much distaste for the ill conceived word. Republic Commando, despite its few misgivings, was designed to show another side to Star Wars. It strayed to a central theme not shown in the films and did that well, hence you didnt see that aspect in the movies; which depict seemingly invincible heroes you recognise and care about, who's lives are glossed over in action and romance and adventure. Instead we saw the other side of the spectrum, of unsing disposable heroes who saw less glory but equally as much action, all for what we knew was a doomed cause yet we; as the player fought for it as the clones did. A true tragic irony, but ill stop right there or ill start quoting myself.

 

For space maps, ever considered that if you let people land on your cap ship, you'll loose, so as a fighter, you can kill transports, or disable the guns by shooting them off, or just dogfight for hours. One of the controversies was whether the space maps would be too Rogue Squadron-ish.[/Quote]

 

..And here i thought there would finally be some decent battle strategy and instead we're cut short to something that resembles distant CPs you can fly to, oh and guess what kids; now there's more space to have aerial fights in, just like the movies! Thats all the immovable / planned flight path capital ships space scenario tells me thus far. To answer your question, ever considered that if you let people land on your Bespin platforms CP, you'll also lose? So as a fighter, you can kill other ships in a limited dogfight airspace, or disable the guns by shooting them off the platforms? Oh.. or just dogfight aimlessly for hours while players who capture CPs are actually helping your side win battles rather than pilots? The controversy i see here is nothing new apart from larger dogfight space which is hardly worth shelling out for seeing as dogfights are about as integral to a CP game as bananas are for termites.

 

Find the thread which has the gamespy chatlog of the developers with some fans, it's quite interesting to see the claims they're making for the stuff they're adding. I'll leave it to your own judgement what you think of it.[/Quote]

 

Claims are just that and can be incrdibly biased. I remember Joe Johnston once claiming that the new logo for Jurassic Park /// was chosen merely "because it looked cool". Oh yeah! Such claims always resound the same in everyone's mind. Talk is cheap Red, and like i said.. there's little there to merit confidence in this expan.. sequel.

 

 

Battlefield 2 has a rubbish single player though[/Quote]

 

Thats funny, wasnt Battlefront meant to be designed primarily as a multiplayer title? Last time i checked, this was 80% of Battlefield2's core emphasis, Battlefront's seem to be 50/50 and now with Battlefront 2, more like 60/40.. with this 501st Legion crap. What does this tell you about the supposed effort put towards multiplayer which is meant to be the game's selling point? Especially seeing as its obvious MP was a lacklustre experience ( to put nicely) in the original Battlefront.

 

 

Yeah, Valve rule though. Pandemic IMHO did better with Mercaneries, I haven't played it properly, but you get things like hijackable vehicles, OTT destroyable scenary and even little things like seeing your weapons visibly holstered. It kicks BF1's corpse around the floor.[/Quote]

 

If you clearly know that Pandemic can and have done better, then you see where im coming from.

 

 

Anyway, ultimately, I'll be hard pushed to buy BF2, mainly because the PS2 ain't mine! But I would have to be "stunned to submission" to get it for my Laptop, heck would it even run? But I have a feeling that PC users may be dissapointed and that console users will get a better benefit (except online).

 

Yeah, you're almost right... although I wish you werent and things were different. I personally dont see the fad in console FPS titles (as where's the fun or challenge in having auto aim play half the title for you?), but failiure to make a decent PC version is only a secondary concern compared to the immense lack of quality put into this costly, over glorified expansion; regardless of platform.

 

When i heard it was also headed for the PSP i didnt know whether to laugh or vomit. If there were ever a pamphlet handed out to prospective gaming studios, one section would read: "Multiplatform Gaming: The only way to whore half completed software to money throwing franchise loyal consumers!"

[Redtech]

Can I just tick the "agreed" boxes, and we can both quit the long posts? Especially since I'm not in disagreement. (Although perhaps I spend too much time in my computer labs..there goes my eyesight).

 

If you must know, for interest, politically, I'm an apathist. I have a right to moan, but whether I believe there will be change is another thing altoghether, on "a great many things". I just find it easier to ignore the "If Lucasarts made it, I'll buy it LOL!" comments. You're a strong and convincing writer, so you get my attention.

 

I will apologise however for any mean comments I made against you (take your pick). You've made a brilliant point that you're an excellant debater, in that case, you've earned my respect and the hat comes of to you, sir.

 

You have got me thinking though, that it is interesting that Lucasarts rarely hire any development teams of large stature (Bioware and Petroglyph are exceptions) nor give their other development houses the resources that they really need to create games that boot people in the shins and make them scream "OMFG! BEST GAME EVER+15!"

 

I will tell you that I am "on the fence" about Battlefront 2. I wont completely dash it until it's been through "my grubby paws" a few times. I do share your frustrations in that my close friend has the copy we play and I do get annoyed when he starts going about how great it is, or the Hoth level, while I'm twirling around with UT2004 at home. (Those vehicles are the shiznit, and you actually need skill to even drive a damned tank!)

 

It's disturbing when you think of how relatively small experienced development teams Valve, Epic etc can create strong games and strong brands while the Lucasarts chain can't remember the MTT is not in BF1! (Check the manual). Heck, WTF isn't it in EITHER game? It'd rule.

 

I will say that I don't like the way people moan about realism so strongly, due to the source of the game, (the films are realistic?) but yeah, little things like the time it takes bullets to fly, weapon accuracy, or unit animations (and yes, even physics) could be sorted out a little bit better, heck attention to detail is what we really want ultimately isn't it? We want little things in our games now that make us think "hey, y'know what, these guys actually care." I suppose it wouldn't be too hard to have skins appropriate to each level for the clones, (although I don't have a problem with their models, as weird as some of them look). But for a game like Battlefront, as it is, that ain't happening.

 

I mean personally, I'd want to play as the Royal Naboo or have customised armour (like Halo2/Republic commando) or the rebels having cammo uniforms for the majority of levels as appropriate, or Galactic civil war fights on Kamino and Clone war battles on Hoth (for pure comedy sake) and NO JEDI! I am so playing as Grievous only.

 

I think that because it is on console, I DO expect a decent S/P mode. I think Valve had the right idea in having games available for download, especially if they're only multiplay, which, in all fairness I wouldn't have objected to BFront being, then download+play online is sensible and logical. Of course Lucasarts haven't even bothered to update their site for Battlefront yet, so I doubt they'd care for the server-work required.

 

But this is what it's all about, cash-cows. While other developers have to struggle to get masterpieces like Sacrifice or Battlefield going, as long as it's got the Lucasarts logo, it's an insta-win.

[MaximumMayhem]

Im afraid things are worse than they look.

 

'Battlefront II Beta Forum'

 

Just have a read of some of the many disgruntled posts. The severity of this game's imminent downfall now looks far worse than many initially thought..

 

I wont even get into the so called developer chat which featured such gems as: "The singleplayer campaign is pretty awesome too. Yoda smackin' down droids on Kashyyyk is teh cool" .. and I always thought that sort of talk was reduced to total idiots or immature children who dont know any better.

[TK-8252]

childish? the only childish things here are ur arguments that this game sucks only cause the Clones have the wrong color etc

 

In addition to all the other stuff, like basic gameplay and physics, yeah. How childish of me to expect a decent game for $50. All games from now on will be crap, and anyone who critisizes them will be deemed childish. Gotcha.

 

btw with ur useless comment u responded to our "childish insults" so wheres the point of ur post anyway?

 

That maybe you should realize that resorting to insults only looks foolish? I don't know. Just pointing it out.

 

Wait, you've been whinging non-stop about how much SWBF2 sucks on and on and when I do make a sensible (but long post), instead of reading it and making a point you sit back and moan again?

 

Oh I read it. But I'm not gonna feed your fire. If you throw around subtle little insults (like you just did again), no way am I going to acknowledge it. So please, use the internet for good, not evil.

[zerted]

What is good? What is evil? Is the acknowledgement of a failure to acknowledge, the acknowledgement of the said failed acknowledge or the acknowledgement of the failure to acknowledge?

[TK-8252]

What is good? What is evil? Is the acknowledgement of a failure to acknowledge, the acknowledgement of the said failed acknowledge or the acknowledgement of the failure to acknowledge?

 

Word.