Limitations.

[Prime]

Nope.

 

Just re-checked the D20 Star Wars RPG Core Rule Book, all the Blasters have no Ammo or Shots listed catagories in the equipment area, so they indeed never run out of power, and are considered charged between games.

IIRC there are optional rules to cover this though. They just felt that having hard rules would slow things down, even though they technically do run on power packs.

[Cygnus Q'ol]

@IS, Why not include those as well:D

Like I said, it should be optional, like setting the difficulty, except that it's not the challenge but the experience details.

 

@TOM, So you're saying that the saber usually has a longer or shorter life?

Is the book "official"?

Why did he need the cartridge in the first place?

\

 

Like I said, you're barking up the wrong tree.

Had these gameplay options been apart of the original game experience, I wouldn't see a problem implimenting or upgrading them by now.

 

BUT, they weren't, and the gameplay experience has been established to a degree. These additions to gameplay, IMO, would alter the experience to a degree that would make it seem to be a totally different game altogether.

 

I can understand your point, however you are two games too late.

[IndianaSolo]

@IS, Why not include those as well:D

Like I said, it should be optional, like setting the difficulty, except that it's not the challenge but the experience details.

 

Because of the logistics of implimenting them. What you're asking is for the developers to basically waste time and money on features that most of the gamers wouldn't even use. When games are being made and they have to adhere to a strict schedule, useless features that most people would "turn off" are the first things to go. And I'm sure that lightsabers running out of energy would fit that category because the vast majority of people wouldn't want to micromanage their lightsabers.

[Hallucination]

No. It just seems like another thing to worry about, and KOTOR is too short for it to matter. Might be a good idea for a mod, RJM.

[RobQel-Droma]

Yeah, it seems like some of the ideas are more for a mod than anything, like wielding two saberstaffs, having dual colored saberstaffs (those two already have been), having a different Ebon Hawk paint scheme, replacing T3 and HK, etc.

 

Except in the case of this one, I doubt that anyone even could do this. Even if they were willing to put in the time, I don't know if it would be possible.

[PoiuyWired]

What I see is, there are many levels of role playing...

 

Well technically you can make eating a must-do function in the game, so did going to the shower room... but how much fun would there be?

 

If you mean by having to "recharge" weapons back in the ship as a function I can sort of understand, but it gets annoying really fast, unless you have a good "recharge all" interface or something...

 

Speaking of which you should also have a storage locker...

 

Now, trying to give different clips for different guns and different ammo, and a hardness factor to repaire and a... it would get REALLY annoying...

 

Remember, our "gametime" is not going 1:1 with the "realtime" ... and spending half an hour of maintinance time just recharging stuff in the game is just... boring...

 

Its like making you wait a few hours for each flight trip when you play... all the while you have to play "the sims" with your kotor character, feeding them, getting them to shower, and try not to kill them while they are cooking, and avoid being found while cheating with the muscular wookie...

 

As funny as that may sound, it is not a kotor game. Its just another type of thing. If you want a game like that for kotor, feel free to mod though, but making official stuff like that is annoying to say the least.

[RobQel-Droma]

I'd quote all of that for emphasis, but its too big.

[SITHSLAYER133]

im srry but hell no what would be the point would only waste time and energy looking for new types of charges for your weapons

[JediMaster12]

Agree there

[REDJOHNNYMIKE]

@Jae, "overloaded inv" That's part of the reason for this, without some kind of "using them up" you just stockpile everything, or turn them into more credits than you'll ever use, if your blaster rifle overloads (say by using Power Blast 15 times in a row) that basic blaster pistol you just picked off a corpse becomes worth more than a computer spike.

And as for the rest, yeah some of that could be boring, but some could be entertaining for some people.

 

@RQD, I'd wait about 5 years for it, that would give them time to...

A. Fix most of the bugs, make the new story, add new features, apply finishing touches,

B. Use newer liscensed software which already works well, make a new story, add features from games that already use software, apply finishing touches.

Either way seems all right to me, as long as the game keeps growing. A game doesn't evolve, it's the product of work and imagination, and if that starts to slow down it will just be less than it could've been.

If you want a good example of rushed product, go play TSL again.

 

If you are "never really told" then it's still entirely probable, and a believable integrateble tactical strategy implement, combat no matter what you do is just boring, having weapons that actually deplete energy increases the intensity.

The only times that combat in kotor is truly satisfying is during the few bossfights if you're a little underleveled and it comes right down to who's going to have the last hitpoint. It's not that it's to easy (there are hardcore mods) but that's still to limited with a lack of intensity.

 

"non energy" The reason you're half right there is due to a serious lack of large scale combat in kotor, if it wasn't just 6 rep soldiers vs 8 sith every once in a while you'd actually use those shots. Limit a blaster rifle cartridge to 500 shots and increase the number of enemies to balance the weapons. I don't remember exactly, but I believe the animation for the blaster rifle has three shots (only one of which hits)? then figure out how many of those attacks it actually takes to bring a target down, then when you factor in attacks and modifiers which allow for more fire per turn, it starts to stack up. Even if they don't make larger areas with more enemies on screen, there should be a believable way of introducing more enemies after a first wave so you don't just force jump and decapitate the entire group (3) collect loot and be done with the area.

 

"ammo" An interesting point, We've been using words like "blaster" simply to reffer to a gun in a general sense (I admit to that;)) So what we need is more distinction between individual weapons, instead having each weapon size class (for lack of a better word) blaster, rifle, carbine, etc. be used for one type of ammunition there should be distinctions between wether the pistol is a blaster pistol (and what exact type of energy it fires, and how it's converted from a stored to fired state) or a chemical based massthrower pistol (and what types of ammunition [slug, shot], and what force is used to drive them [gunpowder]) or wither a rifle emits superheated gas, focused light, or propels a small mass.

Just for the record, what is the official starting ammunition and final energy state of whatever the gold standard blaster pistol is, please state any other types you know of? I haven't read a SW encyclopedia since I was younger, I think it was gas based, but I'm not sure.

 

"force" Except that you do "pull it out of a tank" you can pull off more force junk than yoda and the emperor combined and it comes right back, and you can equip an item to most inventory slots which will "pull it out of a tank" even faster.

Personally I think it would make more sense to have most of the higher level powers become much more difficult to use, and more rare, to make them worth more.

 

Yes, a plasma grenade should do more realistic damage, and a thermal detonator should be the priceless "Holy Handgrenade" that it really is;)

 

I'm a dev, and I have the option of hiring some extra people to make my game appeal to a 25% larger market? How many kotor games have been sold? And how many more might have been sold if they'd inlcuded extra optional features to get an extra 25% who are into deeper combat?

[Darth Windu]

I'm a dev, and I have the option of hiring some extra people to make my game appeal to a 25% larger market? How many kotor games have been sold? And how many more might have been sold if they'd inlcuded extra optional features to get an extra 25% who are into deeper combat?

Care to explain where you got your 25% figure from? Frankly, I doubt someone who is looking at the game will say

"Hmmm, new Force Powers, new Story, more weapons but I'm not sure if I should buy it. Oh hey, wait, there are annoyingly boring additions like replacing ammo, I have to get it now!"

[jedi3112]

Agrees with Windu

 

First of all it is debatable whether or not lightsabers can run out of energy. It has never been stated in the movies that they do. I have also seen several power sources mentioned for the lightsaber. One of wich is the Force. Mostly lightsaber never run out of energy in the games. for example JK, limited ammo, but unlimited lightsaber use. Battlefront 2, limited ammo (with exceptions) but the lightsaber never runs out.

 

About the other weapons

 

Why wouldn't a blaster be able to recharge itself? They do in Battlefront sometimes. As well as in other SW games, ranged weapons do recharge themselves, though these are used in bigger things (X-wings and stuff) it would be possible for smaller things as well. An X-wing may have a bigger generator, but the guns also require more energy, and an X-wing also has shields to maintain, engines, life support, targeting computer. Also energy doesn't have any weight. Unless you want to take Uranium with you for your blaster. Maybe you should get radiation sickness after a while as well?

 

If it's about realism, maybe it would be a good idea to have headaches, or you can die after dinner, because the food has gone bad. Or you suffer from overweight. Wait, I just had a brilliant idea, medpacks won't do you much good, you have to go see a medic to get your wounds healed. When in the hospital with serious injuries, you have to wait 6 months (when playing 24 hours a day), because you're in the hospital for those 6 months. Or what about getting killed in a speeder accident. And BTW saving isn't real either, so what about if you die you have to begin all over again.

 

About the shields, I don't like them the way they are either, I would like to see them the way they are in most RTS games. An added set of HP slowly regenerating over time.

 

About the armor, I would like to see it damage absorbing, not damage preventing (or preventing damage through absorbing it).

[RobQel-Droma]

And as for the rest, yeah some of that could be boring, but some could be entertaining for some people.

 

I think "some" should be turned into "one." I'm serious, you're the only one who thinks this is a good idea.

 

I'd wait about 5 years for it, that would give them time to...

 

You are absolutely nuts. I'm sorry, but you are. 5 whole years!? I am not waiting five years for one game to come out.

 

"non energy" The reason you're half right there is due to a serious lack of large scale combat in kotor, if it wasn't just 6 rep soldiers vs 8 sith every once in a while you'd actually use those shots.

 

Exactly. A lot of KotOR has no combat at all, although that is mainly what it is. And because 1) you aren't some soldier participating in large battles all the time, and 2) it is a RPG, not a FPS/

 

Limit a blaster rifle cartridge to 500 shots and increase the number of enemies to balance the weapons. I don't remember exactly, but I believe the animation for the blaster rifle has three shots (only one of which hits)? then figure out how many of those attacks it actually takes to bring a target down, then when you factor in attacks and modifiers which allow for more fire per turn, it starts to stack up.

 

For one thing, because this is an RPG, those "three shots" just count as one, by the way. Now, keeping that in mind, lets look at a sample situation. I am playing as Mira on Nar Shaddaa against the Ubese. I have dual pistols with rapid shot. Now, it mostly takes me three rounds to take down a Ubese. With Rapid Shot, that means I am shooting two shots per round, for a total of six shots per Ubese. My other pistol is using three shots per Ubese, since Rapid Shot doesn't give it an extra attack.

 

Now, at that rate, it would take around 83 Ubese to run out of ammo on my first pistol. Now, taking into acount that my second pistol is now doing all the work, about nine shots per Ubese on the one pistol I have now. Those first 83 Ubese have gotten the power pack (on the second pistol) down to 251 shots out of 500 (83x3=249). Now, divide 251 by 9, and you have about 27-28 more Ubese that you can take on. Now, the grand total is 111 Ubese for 2 Blaster Pistols. You could play through that section of Nar Shaddaa about five times and not get to that amount.

 

So, adding this all to the increasing amount of damage your pistols can do, and how much better Mira can get, (therefore decreasing the amount of shots used) you could probably go through several planets without having to buy blaster packs once, especially since you can get simple blasters fairly easy.

 

In fact, that brings up another point. The amount of ranged weapons you get is enormous by the end of the game, and besides, a lot of my characters use melee weapons instead, except for a few. So to go through all that work of putting little "324/500" blaster ammo indicaters, and keeping track of it all, along with buying the exact type of ammo for it is a waste of time; You might not even need it.

 

Except that you do "pull it out of a tank" you can pull off more force junk than yoda and the emperor combined and it comes right back, and you can equip an item to most inventory slots which will "pull it out of a tank" even faster.

 

Not according to Yoda. He says that The Force is a energy field that surrounds us and lives in us, so it is not "ammo" that you have to draw out of this big pool of Force. The Force is something that inhabits you and surrounds you, always. From what you were saying, you said that the Force was some limited "ammo" that you had, and then when you used it all, you had to go get some more; It doesn't work that way.

 

The Force will be with you...Always. - Obi-Wan Kenobi

 

Yes, a plasma grenade should do more realistic damage, and a thermal detonator should be the priceless "Holy Handgrenade" that it really is

 

So a thermal detonater and plasma grenades are now insta-kill weapons (or close), as it "realistically" would be. Some guy is playing KotOR III, and he meets a group of Sith troopers with an "elite grenadier." His character is pretty good, so he really isn't worried about anything, then all of a sudden the grenadier throws a plasma grenade. BOOM! All of a sudden he sees the "Your whole party is down" message and goes "What the ****!?!? It was just a plasma grenade, I played the other games and one wouldn't kill me instantly!" Yeah, that would be great.

 

If you are "never really told" then it's still entirely probable, and a believable integrateble tactical strategy implement, combat no matter what you do is just boring, having weapons that actually deplete energy increases the intensity.

 

First off, I wasn't saying "never really told if it could last in a Sith Lord fight", I was saying "a lightsaber could last indefinitely, we are never really told an exact amount of how long it could last." Watch AotC. Obi-Wan and Anakin, facing off against thousands of battle droids and geonosians, then goes on to fight with a Sith Lord in a heated fight. Do their sabers buzz and sparkle and go out? No.

 

Watch RotS. Obi-Wan goes against thousands of battle droids and Separitists, and ends up going against the quadruple wielding Grievous, then chases him on a Utaupau beast. He ends up falling to the water far below and yet at the end, does his saber buzz and sparkle and go out? No.

 

What I was saying, is, lightsabers are built to last for a very, very long time. They are a Jedi's weapon/tool, and often Jedi only have their robes and lightsabers during some missions they undertake on Outer Rim planets, so obviously they would be built to last. Sabers aren't cellphones; Jedi don't carry chargers that hook up to a power conduit to plug into their saber.

 

I'm a dev, and I have the option of hiring some extra people to make my game appeal to a 25% larger market?

 

Did you forget a period between the 2 and the 5? I think you were meaning 2.5%. RJM, look around you- this idea is definitely not popular.

 

If KotOR was an FPS, I would say absolutely. I have JA, and yeah, it does add a whole new aspect with limited ammo. But, lets compare the two. JA has a total of around 9 or 10 ranged weapons- and there are about 2-3 each that run off the same ammo. Now, look at KotOR. Countless weapons, I'm not even going to try and count. Would 100+ be a good guess for ranged weapons, or maybe even more? And most of them are all different; As I said before, a Charric is different than a blaster pistol, a bowcaster is different than a sonic blaster, and a ion weapon is different than a disruptor rifle. And there are many, many of each in the KotOR universe.

 

Now, talk about armor. Same exact applies for armor, about the same ratio too- JA doesn't really have any armor, just the clothes that you pick at the beginning. A lot of other FPS are the same, you don't go around and pick up 20+ different types of armor, upgrade them in-game, and use all the different types of them in the game.

 

So, you need to understand that this is a very complex and detailed RPG, not, repeat not, an FPS.