SMI:SE #1 on Steam revenue charts

[Guy.brush]

You complain about over the top voice acting? What about TOMI? What about the Hrrharrhrrharrhrr of LeChuck? If MI:SE voice acting is over the top, i dunno what TOMI's is.

[Zak McKracken]

You complain about over the top voice acting? What about TOMI? What about the Hrrharrhrrharrhrr of LeChuck? If MI:SE voice acting is over the top, i dunno what TOMI's is.

 

 

I haven't played TOMI yet so I can't say. And I'd rather judge it myself then read all the reviews, praise/criticism. So I've deliberately kept myself in the dark. But I am looking forward to checking it out.

[don_quixote]

So what are you trying to say here? I'm the only fan who's displeased?

 

No, you're not the only fan who's displeased, but just as you don't see any point to the fact that most people are pleased, I don't see the point to note that some people are not. That is not a surprise.

 

 

And I guess you don't understand how useless it is to say, "well no one is going to be satisfied no matter what we do." Pay more attention to what I said instead of saying, "So what?" If everyone used that excuse about any kind of work they did then the world would be full of people doing mediocre jobs just because of a base attitude. So it goes without saying.

 

MI:SE is not your vision of how the game should have been and you've been clear on that. The game has flaws, no doubt, but they are a game breaker for you. They are not for everyone, since MI was not a perfect game when it came out, and especially not in its original iteration.

 

 

And the cat's out of the bag. You are fine with mediocrity, others are not. It's a personal thing to settle.

 

I enjoyed the game, you didn't. You are free to play the much superior original MI (make sure to play it in EGA for that extra superb atmosphere and authenticity). Me, I'll take the inferior MI:SE.

 

So everyone who doesn't agree with you is not a realist? The original games are sparse? Do you know a thing about drawing and composition? Scroll up a little bit to Thunderpeel's post and look at the original scanned paintings and tell me those are sparse.

 

The original scanned paintings ARE NOT what ended up in the game. Those are gorgeous scans (which may or may not be used in MI2:SE if it gets made), but they looked NOTHING LIKE it once converted to 320x200. They ARE sparse because the technology of the day was extremely limited. Give it to kids used to modern games and see what the reactions of most of them are. Heck, _I_ have a hard time getting used to the graphics, and I was around for the original.

 

 

I could just as easily be as pompous as you are acting and say you only like the Special Edition because you have to justify your $10 spent. Don't presume you know why people feel a certain way and proclaim yourself a realist, that's not nice. Is everyone else then living in some kind of sub reality, then?

 

Nothing I said was pompous; I do think it strains reality to suggest that the graphics as they currently are in MI2 are something worth celebrating in this day and age. Great for 1991? Sure.

 

 

You also seem to imply that everyone who doesn't like the new art style and sees mistakes only plays games made before 1995. It's really not that easy.

 

That is an assumption without cause. My point was that the generations who originally played the 80s and 90s games will always have a special place in their hearts for them, but the later generations will mostly not accept big fat pixels. There is a certain amount of nostalgia at play here.

[SyntheticGerbil]

No matter what LucasArts does or does not do to the game, someone WILL NOT be satisfied.

 

Yeah but like I said, that reasoning doesn't help either way. Why say it?

 

Watch here, if I take your statement and add some ellipses at the end, and finish it myself this way:

No matter what LucasArts does or does not do to the game, someone WILL NOT be satisfied...

 

"...so the team should still do the best damn job they can do!"

 

That doesn't really fit. The reasoning that no one will be satisfied with what you do is already negative so it makes more sense within context to finish your sentence negative like this:

 

"...so the team should just not even bother worrying about it."

 

That is not okay and that reasoning incurs such sentiment.

 

I'm not trying to just make a stink for the sake of it, but relying on the argument that not everyon'es going to be satisfied is really unproductive, fails to address any issues whatsoever, and does not help conversation flow. Businesses have traditionally thrived on trying to satisfy as many customers as possible. So why do some of you keep repeating it like mantra?

 

I'm less bothered by the voices than others because I usually don't expect great voice acting in games anyways. I've been conditioned with average voice acting over the past decade or so that I don't see too much of a problem with MI:SE voice acting outside of "Love" being said out loud.

 

Granted LucasArts is probably the company that has been the most successful at top notch voice acting so far, the apex being Grim Fandango, so it does come with some expectations by many fans.

 

The original scanned paintings ARE NOT what ended up in the game. Those are gorgeous scans (which may or may not be used in MI2:SE if it gets made), but they looked NOTHING LIKE it once converted to 320x200.

 

"NOTHING LIKE," huh? Forget rose colored glasses, I think you just plain need glasses. Either that or you could try toning down your hyperbole if you are planning to add anything to the topic at hand.

 

Nothing I said was pompous

 

If you say so, Mr. "Realist." Be sure to inform us in every thread what's real from now on, though.

[don_quixote]

"NOTHING LIKE," huh? Forget rose colored glasses, I think you just plain need glasses. Either that or you could try toning down your hyperbole if you are planning to add anything to the topic at hand.

 

Excuse the NOTHING LIKE, and replace it as a PALE SHADOW. The artwork looks like someone scanned the originals and then converted it to a very low resolution and reduced it by by thousands of colours. Which is exactly what they did, of course.

 

If you say so, Mr. "Realist." Be sure to inform us in every thread what's real from now on, though.

 

Sorry, I disagree that MI2 as it currently is (or original MI1) is something that shouldn't be missed with if it turns out like MI:SE. I think it strains credulity to suggest MI2 looks good as it is. It looks very, very, dated, which it is, of course.

 

 

PS: Your sarcasm and hostility doesn't do much for your case.

[SyntheticGerbil]

Excuse the NOTHING LIKE, and replace it as a PALE SHADOW. The artwork looks like someone scanned the originals and then converted it to a very low resolution and reduced it by by thousands of colours. Which is exactly what they did, of course.

 

Thousands of colors? Remember what I said about hyperbole? I'm sure they probably couldn't even scan thousands of colors back then anyways with the hardware they were using. Those backgrounds are still very true to the originals. Don't be stubborn for the sake of it.

 

PS: Your sarcasm and hostility doesn't do much for your case.

 

Besides that I've already stated most of my points elsewhere and a lot of the proof is in the screenshots posted in other threads with red arrows drawn all over them, I actually feel I did pretty good job without resorting to base name calling and flaming considering all the incendiary remarks you have already made towards me and personally singling me out already. Did you just sign up here just to argue with me and to tell me to keep my mouth shut?

 

No, you're not the only fan who's displeased, but just as you don't see any point to the fact that most people are pleased, I don't see the point to note that some people are not. That is not a surprise.

 

You are free to play the much superior original MI (make sure to play it in EGA for that extra superb atmosphere and authenticity). Me, I'll take the inferior MI:SE.

 

Sarcasm, you say?

 

Don't forget that everyone one of us at Mojo and the Lucasforums who have been interested in Monkey Island for years was looking forward to playing a good remake with a grand excitement that diminished as more and more screenshots, videos and information was released. People were not like, "BAH HUMBUG, A REMAKE" right off the bat. There is some disappointment involved here that can't be ignored. For some more than others. Either way, none of that excuses the cut out garbage on their backgrounds, unhidden layers, and somewhat buggy gameplay.

 

Many here seem to be under the idea that anyone who is upset doesn't want any game LucasArts ever made to be remade. That is not true, they just needed to do an overall good job with good craftsmanship and no one will complain. They could certainly start by being truer to the original and not taking the liberty to reinterpret the style and tone themselves. Certainly they don't have to merge it closer to CMI as they spoke of in the making of video and wrote for the descriptions of their concept work on the Facebook page.

 

If this remake truly exists to bring in new fans only, then why did they go into so much into how they are going to please old fans? Why pay Ron Gilbert to come into your making of video? I think many underestimate the amount of Monkey Island fans that exist compared to new players.

[don_quixote]

Thousands of colors? Remember what I said about hyperbole. I'm sure they could even scan thousands of colors back then anyways. Those backgrounds are still very true to the originals. Don't be stubborn.

 

I'm sure they could, but the final, completed game was VGA, in 256 colours and a resolution of 320x200. Yes, it is entirely possible that the original scans contain thousands of discernible colours. You can make Hercules style graphics look (somewhat) true to the original, but it's a stretch to really think that's good enough. I do think your love of the original game is obvious, and it's perhaps blinding you to just how dated it looks.

 

 

Besides that I've already stated most of my points elsewhere and a lot of the proof is in the screenshots posted in other threads with red arrows drawn all over them, actually feel I did pretty good without resorting to base name calling and flaming considering all the incendiary remarks you have already made. Did you just sign up here to argue and to tell me to keep my mouth shut?

 

You are usually more combative? What incendiary remarks appear in my OP, apart from disagreeing with you?

 

 

Sarcasm, you say?

 

Don't forget that everyone one of us was looking forward to playing a good remake with a grand excitement that diminished as more and more screenshots, videos and information was released. People were not like, "BAH HUMBUG, A REMAKE" right off the bat. There is some disappointment involved here that can't be ignored. For some more than others.

 

A lot of you here seem to be under the idea that no one wants any game LucasArts did to be remade ever. That is not true, they just need to do an overall good job with good craftsmanship and no one will complain. They could certainly start by being true to the original and not taking the liberty to reinterpret the style and tone themselves.

 

You've noted that you do not want a remake if it is like MI:SE. That indicates a satisfaction with what is, really, far less than what the new version offers. The style and tone has to be reinterpreted because the original is graphically ambiguous by necessity.

 

Now, MI2:SE is a different story as original highly detailed artwork (maybe) exists in entirety and it would indeed make sense to base the artwork off it. Still, it is highly unlikely that the graphics of a potential MI2:SE would be worse than they are in MI2.

 

 

If this remake truly exists to bring in new fans only, then why did they go into so much into how they are going to please old fans? Why pay Ron Gilbert to come into your making of video? I think many underestimate the amount of Monkey Island fans that exist compared to new players.

 

It, I am sure, aims to please both.

[Monkey Mania]

LucasArts' forum is filled with complaints, I'm sure they will address these problems with MI2SE.

[SyntheticGerbil]

LucasArts' forum is filled with complaints, I'm sure they will address these problems with MI2SE.

 

One can only hope if another remake happens.

[LordTrilobite]

The thing is, they could have done a better job on SE, and in some views (including mine) should have done better.

 

I terms of style, some are pleased with it, some aren't. Some mind the extra injected humour in the voices, some don't mind it.

But there are parts in SE that are rather sloppy, like the forest and lots of clipping problems, and the interface isn't as good as the original, aspecially for puzzles that require combining items.

[SyntheticGerbil]

You've noted that you do not want a remake if it is like MI:SE. That indicates a satisfaction with what is, really, far less than what the new version offers. The style and tone has to be reinterpreted because the original is graphically ambiguous by necessity.

 

Now, MI2:SE is a different story as original highly detailed artwork (maybe) exists in entirety and it would indeed make sense to base the artwork off it. Still, it is highly unlikely that the graphics of a potential MI2:SE would be worse than they are in MI2.

 

I really wish you had not replied to my original post, sat on it for 30 minutes past my last edit and then replied. There were a few things in there I had changed.

 

Anyway, I don't think any of the graphics in Monkey Island 1 and 2 are that ambiguous as you seem to think. They actually have a very strong atmosphere and tone for games from 1990 and 1991. You can argue all you want against that but I'll never agree and I'm sure plenty of long time fans feel the same. I don't think anything is really up for reinterpretation here. Sloppily copying and pasting tons of graphics in Photoshop for trees, bushes, and leaves certainly isn't a reinterpretation I like for instance. I don't know how familiar you actually are with the promo images for the game or Purcell's work, but you can also use drawings from the Adventurer issues, boxart, and manual for reference.

 

If you think it's "highly unlikely" to draw worse graphics for a MI2:SE than the original, then I'm afraid there's no hope in talking to you. A bad or lazy artist can screw up anything no matter what resolution you are working in. If they hypothetically keep remaking the games that have not been rereleased on Steam yet in their original versions, this team *will* hit a hump where their new graphics are going to look like ass even in comparison to the old ones with a smoothing filter. I predict a MI2 remake will make this obvious, but for everyone else who is easier to please may feel the same somewhere around the hypothetical Day of the Tentacle remake. At the moment, they have either proved they are not skilled enough for further games or just didn't care enough. Dela Longfish's stuff is good so I don't doubt him, the rest has yet to be spoken for unless I get credits.

 

You wouldn't have by any chance worked on this game? It's funny you just sort of signed up here to argue with me about the Special Edition only. I like talking about almost all LucasArts games, we don't have center on this. I can also go on and on about Steve Purcell's comic book work if needed.

[Nickelstein]

Don_quixote don't take SythenticGerbil the wrong way he is just like that...

[LordTrilobite]

I completely agree with SythenticGerbil.

[don_quixote]

Anyway, I don't think any of the graphics in Monkey Island 1 and 2 are that ambiguous as you seem to think. They actually have a very strong atmosphere and tone for games from 1990 and 1991. You can argue all you want against that but I'll never agree and I'm sure plenty of long time fans feel the same.

 

Hey, I do agree. It looks great for 1990 and 1991. It's very poor for 2009.

 

 

If you think it's "highly unlikely" to draw worse graphics for a MI2:SE than the original, then I'm afraid there's no hope in talking to you. A bad or lazy artist can screw up anything no matter what resolution you are working in.

 

Sure, but that's certainly not what's likely to happen and the MI:SE graphics are a vast (vast, vast) improvement over MI. Sure, it's possible that the next gen graphics of MI2:SE are going to be worse, but I certainly don't see that from MI:SE.

 

 

If they hypothetically keep remaking the games that have not been rereleased on Steam yet in their original versions, this team *will* hit a hump where their new graphics are going to look like ass even in comparison to the old ones with a smoothing filter. I predict a MI2 remake will make this obvious, but for everyone else who is easier to please may feel the same somewhere around the hypothetical Day of the Tentacle remake. At the moment, they have either proved they are not skilled enough for further games or just didn't care enough. Dela Longfish's stuff is good so I don't doubt him, the rest has yet to be spoken for unless I get credits.

 

Shall we post MI (with ScummVM smoothing filters) screenshots and MI:SE screenshots to see which of the two have graphics that look like 'ass' in comparison?

 

 

You wouldn't have by any chance worked on this game? It's funny you just sort of signed up here to argue with me about the Special Edition only. I like talking about almost all LucasArts games, we don't have center on this. I can also go on and on about Steve Purcell's comic book work if needed.

 

No I did not have anything to do with the game.

 

My sign up here has far more to do with tracking progress of future MI:SE mods, something I'm very happy about.

[SyntheticGerbil]

Shall we post MI (with ScummVM smoothing filters) screenshots and MI:SE screenshots to see which of the two have graphics that look like 'ass' in comparison?

 

Go for it.

[LordTrilobite]

And use the forest and church as locations for the comparison.

[Ergonpandilus]

Greetings, newbie here, but not to MI series.

 

Are you honestly saying, that it was a bad idea to launch MI:SE?!?? Even though I understand that the change in graphics can shock someone, but still overall the facelift was pretty awesome and nicely drawn with every little detail fitting perfectly to the scene. And I'm very eagerly waiting for the MI2:SE if it's going to be happen as it seems like a bit...

 

The original drawings were meant to low resolution screen and thus didn't had that many details. I really liked the way how they added new details to special edition.

 

Here's good example. It just screams for more details like barrels and bushes here and there etc.

 

Usually old men are mumbling new things and changes. Are you that old yet?

[Giant Graffiti]

Are you that old yet?

Yes.

 

Also, welcome to the forums!

[SyntheticGerbil]

Greetings, newbie here, but not to MI series.

 

Heard that before.

 

Are you honestly saying, that it was a bad idea to launch MI:SE?!?? Even though I understand that the change in graphics can shock someone, but still overall the facelift was pretty awesome and nicely drawn with every little detail fitting perfectly to the scene. And I'm very eagerly waiting for the MI2:SE if it's going to be happen as it seems like a bit...

 

Please go back and read every thread pertaining to this issue before you come in here and make your first post on an argument that has been over ad nauseam. It never amazes me that people keep signing up on the forums and swoop in thinking they have the obvious answer to why everyone is bitching and that once they state their reason, then everyone will stop.

 

Seriously if you guys aren't going to go over old threads and try to understand the problem here with the remake, then don't bother. I understand it's much easier to understand why someone likes a video game over why someone dislikes one, but get some perspective. Also it helps to have a general taste on what makes good art, composition, design, technique, and appeal.

 

I'm not saying those that like the Special Edition lack those qualities of good taste, but it would sure help for people to understand the game's visual flaws and why it upsets some, whether the art kills the game for someone or not. It would also help bring some deeper thought beyond the cliche "rose colored glasses" argument, because believe you me, this art is far from perfect, and if some of you can't understand from point one why someone would feel that way, then why do you think you are going to convince anyone otherwise?

[Gabez]

On the subject of "don't bother," SyntheticGerbil, if you don't have anything nice to say then don't bother saying anything at all.

 

Welcome to the forums, Ergonpandilus! Please ignore all the grumpy old men.

[SyntheticGerbil]

On the subject of "don't bother," SyntheticGerbil, if you don't have anything nice to say then don't bother saying anything at all.

 

Welcome to the forums, Ergonpandilus! Please ignore all the grumpy old men.

 

So people signing up just to argue (with mostly me it feels like) and call everyone who prefers the original graphic aesthetic as old or having something wrong with them is just as fine? It's certainly just as frustrating and no people are not crazy if they see flaws.

 

Come on, I think one can introduce themselves better on forums than making an argument your reason for your first post. Maybe at least have it be a part of the second post?

 

I understand anything you say or decide beyond this will trump my sentiment, but that's my take.

[don_quixote]

Heard that before.

 

Wait... if you don't post here, you're not a fan and are new to MI? You're an odd person, that's for sure.

 

 

Also it helps to have a general taste on what makes good art, composition, design, technique, and appeal.

 

Of course, this appears to be a quality uniquely available to... you? And others who complain?

 

 

I'm not saying those that like the Special Edition lack those qualities of good taste, but it would sure help for people to understand the game's visual flaws and why it upsets some, whether the art kills the game for someone or not. It would also help bring some deeper thought beyond the cliche "rose colored glasses" argument, because believe you me, this art is far from perfect, and if some of you can't understand from point one why someone would feel that way, then why do you think you are going to convince anyone otherwise?

 

I have now snapped a few screens in ScummVM (with a scaler no less!) and just have to do the same for MI:SE (unfortunately, PrtSc is nowhere near as fast as Scumm's screenshot option), and I think the rose coloured argument certainly works for MI:SE because the original is not a pretty game.

[SyntheticGerbil]

Of course, this appears to be a quality uniquely available to... you? And others who complain?

 

Now I did not say that. Flaws of course exist in the new artwork and it is not perfect. Don't twist my words, guy.

 

But seriously this argument is pretty much over (not that I haven't stated my case more than enough) since you wrote this:

...and I think the rose coloured argument certainly works for MI:SE because the original is not a pretty game.

 

We have nothing more to talk about. How am I supposed to convince you the original game *was* pretty if you don't think so in the first place? It's just going to be an exercise in futility. Someone else can go back and forth with you on your screenshots if they want. Adios.

[VoodooFX]

Anyone who's expecting LEC to change/improve any faults from SMI:SE with MI2:SE, should they ever make one, is going to be hugely disappointed (yet again).

 

They certainly won't be using hires scans of the original backgrounds, since Mr. Tiller himself said in one of the interviews that some test proved that they just don't work that well in hires.

 

After all the media released prior to game launch, I really don't understand what exactly were you people expecting to get?

 

Besides, if SMI:SE was a full-fledged-built-from-scratch remake, it would never have cost 10$. Now you could argue that you'd have been more than willing to pay a full 40-something $ price, but majority of people would not.

 

I for one enjoyed the SE and will be getting any other game they plan to remake. As long as they stick to one of Guybrush's possible final words: Never pay more than 20 bucks for a computer game

[Thrik]

Man, I came back off holiday yesterday only to have my dad raving about how the original Monkey Island has been re-released, he's already bought it off Steam, etc. He's also let my sister play it, who is only nine thus isn't really into ancient-looking games but thanks to the revamp has been absolutely loving it.

 

My own opinions aside (I've hardly touched it yet), I think it's really cool that older people and younger people are discovering and rediscovering the game as a result of its revamp. Both are people I know would never have played it (again) otherwise, as to be honest us serial re-players are pretty rare.