What does the Republican party do?

[Tommycat]

Following this election I have heard numerous people claim that "Republicans need to do something to woo more Latinos and African Americans to their side."

 

But HOW? African Americans vote Democrat by a VAST majority. Generally above 90%. This in spite of the fact that we DO have quite a few prominent African Americans in the party. Personally I loved Herman Cain for the primary, then the blah blah woof woof about his sexual conduct. Here in AZ we have Vernon Parker, an African American. But he isn't drawing the black vote. No matter what we do, we get called the racist party. I think that's pretty well a lost cause.

 

I honestly think that we really need to take a step back and review our priorities instead. Many people actually agreed with Mitt on fiscal matters, but I think it's the social matters that really turned the tides. Here are the things that I think need to be changed by the Republican Party:

 

1) DROP THE OVERLY RELIGIOUS! Seriously! Yes, we were founded on Christian Ideals. BUT we are not just a Christian nation. We are especially not a hard core evangelical nation.

 

2) Support ending the war on drugs! It's a huge financial drain that produces very little if any results. It jails many people who otherwise would be upstanding citizens. It also adds to the unemployed and those who are on the government dole, as a conviction for a drug related offense now has his job options severely limited. It's like Prohibition. All it did was create a new criminal organization.

 

3) ABORTION IS LEGAL, GET OVER IT! Really... this is a losing proposition for Republicans. Support only ensuring that they are safe for the mother. I don't think it should be free, but it should be available.

 

4) Stop opposing safe sex education. For heaven's sake... You cannot just teach abstinence only. It does not work for everyone. Inform kids that yes, abstinence is the best way to prevent an unwanted pregnancy, but by no means is it the only way. You don't want abortions, but oppose safe sex education? SERIOUSLY???! Education is the best defense. Yes, ideally it should be the parents, but they are not doing their job, so let the schools do it.

 

5) Along those lines... Stay out of people's bedrooms. If Adam and Steve want to get married. SO BLOODY WHAT! Let them. I don't want the federal or local governments in my bedroom. Neither do same sex couples.

 

That's my 5 point plan to get the Republican party back on track. What are your ideas?

 

(And don't bother posting if you are simply going to say that the Republicans need to go away. Unless you are saying that both parties should... But This is more for what would be CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, not essentially "Go away you racist republicans")

[Q]

I agree with everything you're saying.

 

The GOP is just clueless when it comes to social issues, and I really don't see that changing until the older generation dies off.

[kyrie]

I agree with everything you say about what needs to change in the GOP, get the batsh!t crazy people out. There is such a thing as being too far right, the ultra right wing are boarderline fascists just as the ultra left wing are boarderline socialists. Yes fascism and socialism are 2 different political views. Until the GOP embraces the ideals of the party of Lincoln, T.R. and Ike they will continue to slip into the history of our country.I have heard all about the GOP before Nixon. What happened to the party that embraced the building of our infrastructure, or the trust busters that they were before the 1920's? Ike in the 1950's who believed in the idea of the rich sacrificing more money to the betterment of our country as a whole. I am an old school republican who has been pushed out by the ideas of the party. I am a fiscal conservative who actually embraces true fiscal responsibility. It is possible to keep a strong military but do we really need to be the policeman of the world and spend twice as much as the rest of the world combined?

[mur'phon]

Not a big fan of the Republicans, but it's fun to discuss how to make them electable. Oh, and my suggestions are strictly what I think will help them get elected, not what I would like them to do.

 

Things they could do to win votes (regarding the next presidential election).

 

1: Support immigration reform. Yes, it'll be controversial within the party, however, those Latinos are going to keep increasing their share of the vote, so you better find something to woo them. That and the business wing will love it.

 

2: The day Obamacare takes effect in earnest is the day getting rid of it is going to be nigh on impossible. Sure, reform it if you want, but remember why you where terrified of touching health care for the elderly, the same applies here to a large extent. Bonus: this will also help with the Latinos.

 

3: You are on the wrong side of the electorate when it comes to abortion. Do something about it but remain more restrictive than the democrats (to keep social conservatives from deserting). Bonus: women will like this.

 

4: Gay marriage is so far almost a tie, but it'll get worse, so either do something about it now or after the next election.

 

5: Leave drugs alone, you are on the side of the majority of the electorate for now (and among your voters especially so). Really wish it was different. Alternatively, do not prosecute those using drugs where said drugs are legal, while being officially against it.

 

6: Don't bother with the blacks, they are not increasing their share, are mainly located in safe states, and are going to be a nightmare to persuade.

[Pho3nix]

I agree with everything you're saying.

 

The GOP is just clueless when it comes to social issues, and I really don't see that changing until the older generation dies off.

 

Though looking back at human history, new generations never guarantee anything. Here's to hoping for a change in human consciousness for the better.

[Tommycat]

mur'phon

1) The thing about immigration reform is we DO support reform, but not amnesty. Granted it would win us a large majority of hispanics to do so, it just loses those of us in border states. For getting elected, it might be a good idea though.

 

2) As a more moderate Republican, I know exactly where we went wrong on the Obamacare issue. We should have offered a better alternative. People get a bit scared when you talk about getting rid of something like that. But you need to have some form of health care reform, because the prior system was not working.

 

3) Yep. Abortion should be off the Republican platform. Or if it remains, move more towards regulation to make it safer and more consistent.

 

4) As I said, get outta people's bedrooms. Those that are heterosexual(outside the extremes) could care less about gays. It's not an issue that they think about. Those that are gay, it's a pretty big issue.

 

5) My point on the war on drugs is that it's working it from the wrong angle. Rather than trying to cut the heads off the hydra, simply treat the people who have the addiction. regulate and tax the ever lovin poop outta recreational pharmaceuticals like we do with ciggies and booze. Gives people the opportunity to enjoy themselves, adds to the revenue, cuts spending(by BILLIONS). If nothing else stop prosecuting specific drugs like pot.

 

6) Sadly, I know. Probably better than you do. It's probably going to take getting the african american population to actually listen to Republicans first before we can get even a chance of bringing them to our side. That wouldn't happen with a rich white guy candidate going against a black president. So this time there was almost zero chance of winning them this time.

[thejman217]

My five point plan:

 

1.) Keep abortion legal. I don't believe abortion should be made illegal. This would be very inconvenient for the women who are raped and those with SERIOUS health concerns. One senator (can't remember for the life of me) even went as far as to say: "Being impregnated, no matter which method in which it occurs, is god's will." Another more unusual comment, in my opinion, was: "The body of a woman has the ability to keep the sperm from creating an infant once it enters the body" which is why i believe he lost his senator position in one of the states in one of the Michigan/Cleveland/Indiana/Illinois areas. I feel that the woman should make her own decision, and then live with the consequences no matter what they may be.

 

2.) Tell Bill O'Reilly to stop calling the whites in America now the minority. I know that the Republican party holds no REAL power over the Fox News Network (which is a republican station), but America is still two-thirds white (66%), so they could ask him to tone it down.

 

3.) Bring production back to America along with energy independence, and stop exporting jobs to China and other places. Governor Romney is a big fan of this, though he denies it.

 

4.) Reconsider beliefs on the right to bear arms without registration (do I have to list the reasons and consequences?).

 

5.) Keep gay marriage legal. Most versions of the bible state that gay marriage is intolerable/wrong/etc. Romney wanted to make gay marriage illegal. I don't know about what others here think, but it sounds to me like he's trying to impose his religion on the country, whether he is doing it on purpose or not.

[Alexrd]

I'm not American, but I am conservative. From an outsider POV, I need to ask a couple of questions before supporting your statement:

 

1) DROP THE OVERLY RELIGIOUS! Seriously! Yes, we were founded on Christian Ideals. BUT we are not just a Christian nation. We are especially not a hard core evangelical nation.

 

I would agree. Being a christian myself, I think there is an excessive "bad rep" around the Republicans that they are "a bunch of fundamentalists". Religion is important, but it shouldn't be the center focus of a political party.

 

2) Support ending the war on drugs! It's a huge financial drain that produces very little if any results. It jails many people who otherwise would be upstanding citizens. It also adds to the unemployed and those who are on the government dole, as a conviction for a drug related offense now has his job options severely limited. It's like Prohibition. All it did was create a new criminal organization.

 

I don't know how it works there, but arrest should be used only for cases with heavy drugs. The rest should be dealt with with fines.

 

3) ABORTION IS LEGAL, GET OVER IT! Really... this is a losing proposition for Republicans. Support only ensuring that they are safe for the mother. I don't think it should be free, but it should be available.

 

If it still is under discussion, I think abortion should only be legal in cases of rape, malformation of the fetus, or when the mother's life is at risk. I believe people should be responsible for their actions. Everyone is free to do whatever they want, as long as they accept the consequences. If you have sex, there is an high risk that you can get pregnant. If you use protection, there is a much smaller chance of that happening (but there is a chance nonetheless). If people know this, how can they act surprised when it happens? How can they claim that "we" are telling a woman what to do with her body, when she was the one who decided that?

 

This is just my view on the abortion issue (I know it may have flaws), and I don't expect everyone or anyone to agree with me.

 

4) Stop opposing safe sex education. For heaven's sake... You cannot just teach abstinence only. It does not work for everyone. Inform kids that yes, abstinence is the best way to prevent an unwanted pregnancy, but by no means is it the only way. You don't want abortions, but oppose safe sex education? SERIOUSLY???! Education is the best defense. Yes, ideally it should be the parents, but they are not doing their job, so let the schools do it.

 

Agreed. That is essential.

 

P.S:

No matter what we do, we get called the racist party. I think that's pretty well a lost cause.

 

It's a bit ironic how some of the media pass that idea out, but don't mention the amount of people who vote for Obama (or support him) based on his skin colour. And a lot of people do. To me, that's racism aswell. Ideally, the colour of one person' skin should be irrelevant. The end.

[thejman217]

It's a bit ironic how some of the media pass that idea out, but don't mention the amount of people who vote for Obama (or support him) based on his skin colour. And a lot of people do. To me, that's racism aswell. Ideally, the colour of one person' skin should be irrelevant. The end.

 

I am a Democrat (and yes, there are many flaws within our party, as well as the Republicans'), but I also find it very strange that the Republican party is considered a racist party. If I'm not mistaken, there are several African-American politicians holding very high positions in the Republican party.

 

On the other hand, many, many people's political views are based off of what TV political stations say. NBC calls the Republican party racist because they claim that the Republicans said that they are "shocked" that so many white voters cast their vote for Obama.

 

It is a sad thing when I see people in my school base their political views based on what Fox, NBC, CNN, and others say. People should form their opinions on the Presidential candidates based on what they believe in, not what others (their parents, or news stations) believe in. For example, conservatives that regularly watch Fox claim that Obama is a socialist/communist, he wasn't born in the U.S., or that he is a Muslim because his middle name is Hussein. On the other hand, Democrats who regularly watch NBC claim that that Romney, Ryan, and the rest of the Republican party are racist.

 

It both confuses me and intrigues me to no end.

[Alexrd]

I am a Democrat (and yes, there are many flaws within our party, as well as the Republicans'), but I also find it very strange that the Republican party is considered a racist party. If I'm not mistaken, there are several African-American politicians holding very high positions in the Republican party.

 

On the other hand, many, many people's political views are based off of what TV political stations say. NBC calls the Republican party racist because they claim that the Republicans said that they are "shocked" that so many white voters cast their vote for Obama.

 

It is a sad thing when I see people in my school base their political views based on what Fox, NBC, CNN, and others say. People should form their opinions on the Presidential candidates based on what they believe in, not what others (their parents, or news stations) believe in. For example, conservatives that regularly watch Fox claim that Obama is a socialist/communist, he wasn't born in the U.S., or that he is a Muslim because his middle name is Hussein. On the other hand, Democrats who regularly watch NBC claim that that Romney, Ryan, and the rest of the Republican party are racist.

 

It both confuses me and intrigues me to no end.

 

True.

 

In my country there aren't many party-related newspapers or TV channels. But when something happens to the media sector (either cuts in salary, or the government privatizing some media companies that cost too much) they can forget their deontology and ethics and become a bunch of sensationalists whose news and opinions end up affecting the public's view (it's happening right now, unfortunately).

[Canderis]

Honestly, i wish we never saw what the politicians looked like. If we never knew what color they were or religion or what, and only judged them on what they stood for i think our country would be quite a bit better off.

[mur'phon]

@: Tommy: My suggestions was for wining votes, not things I'm in favor of. If I was to list how I want the republicans to change, I'd have different suggestions.

Also, on immigration, it might be enough to simply put a "path to citizenship" bill in front of Obama before he can present one himself. Of course this probably won't happen. Sure make the illegals work to get citizenship, but right now, the only thing that has proven effective for keeping them out is a tanking economy.

 

Originally posted by thejman217 .3) Bring production back to America along with energy independence, and stop exporting jobs to China and other places. Governor Romney is a big fan of this, though he denies it.

 

There is a reason why every politician say they'll do it but never does, so I'm kinda curious how you want to achieve this without hurting the average american.

[thejman217]

There is a reason why every politician say they'll do it but never does' date=' so I'm kinda curious how you want to achieve this without hurting the average american.[/quote']

 

How would bringing back production to the U.S. (giving back jobs to the laid off Americans) and making us energy independent (giving back even more jobs) hurt the average American. I'm no politician, but how would it harm us?

 

how you want to achieve this

 

Hah. I am not the president, or any other politician for that matter! XD

[Tommycat]

For my perspective, the reason I would not limit abortion only to rape is to prevent people from feeling like they have to cry rape to get an abortion. It's also to prevent someone who may have been traumatized from having to explain it to cops. Sure, a woman who is raped should report it immediately, but sometimes they hurt too much. Another thing is that some men actually use pregnancy to tie down their women. Keeping them barefoot and pregnant blah blah woof woof.

 

mur'phon: This is a wish list essentially. It's not like it's going to affect policy, or really change the party, so feel free to point out what you would have the Republican party strive for.

 

As for the immigration reform, I actually kinda like the DREAM act. BUT I did not like that it was back doored in. Right when AZ wins the right to check people's citizenship, Obama fired that off... But I'm a little close to that issue. It's also why my land down near the border is essentially a biological hazard. Thanks to the president several more illegal border crossers died in the southern AZ desert. (as I said, I'm a little too close to the issue)

 

How would bringing back production to the U.S. (giving back jobs to the laid off Americans) and making us energy independent (giving back even more jobs) hurt the average American. I'm no politician, but how would it harm us?

Um... shipping jobs overseas was AFTER Romney left Bain. Or are you talking about the external company that moved the phone bank overseas...(source) You might want to be a bit more specific.... But really sending jobs overseas or not is NOT the job of the president. You can provide incentives, tax breaks, write offs, or even grants to businesses that hire within the US, but then that would be "Giving money to the wealthiest 1%"

 

OR you could up the spending and spend a boatload more cash on weapons development which must be done within the US by US citizens to prevent foreign persons from getting the designs to your latest military hardware... I mean it's not like we're worried about a budget crisis or anything.

[mur'phon]

How would bringing back production to the U.S. (giving back jobs to the laid off Americans) and making us energy independent (giving back even more jobs) hurt the average American. I'm no politician, but how would it harm us?

 

Because the tools for doing so tend to hurt the average american. Take the "moving jobs back part". If politicians put a massive toll on foreign goods to bring back production, that'll A:make those goods way more expensive, hurting the average american and B: make the rest of the world retaliate by putting a massive toll on american goods, killing exports. Same applies to most conventional ways of getting jobs back/energy independence.

 

Oh, and regarding abortion, another reason for keeping the law liberal is that plenty of women will take illegal (and dangerous) abortions if the law is restrictive.

 

Alright, now for the wishlist.

 

1: Taxes are a means to an end, not the devil himself. Identify the ends you want then check which taxes you can live with/concede while negotiating with the democrats, because lets face it, if you want to balance the books, you need to do it with one messy compromise.

 

2: There is no big scientists conspiracy. Scientific consensus is not a perfect guide to the truth, but it's the best we have.

 

3: The military isn't sacred, an the world is not filled with large foes who plot your destruction. More butter, less guns (or heck less guns lover taxes if that sounds nicer).

 

4: Keep in mind your own interests in the middle east, put some serious pressure on both Israel and the Palestinians to get a permanent solution to that conflict (and do it before you risk having Israels neighbors turn hostile). Seriously, there are few things as responsible (fairly or not) for Americas problems with other nations and motivating terrorists. This applies to the democrats too.

 

5: Cut ties with the social conservatives.

 

6: Point one and two from my first post.

[Sabretooth]

tl;dr version of thread:

 

Be more like the Democrats to win the elections.

[kyrie]

Um... shipping jobs overseas was AFTER Romney left Bain. Or are you talking about the external company that moved the phone bank overseas...(source)

 

There is a video out there on the internets when Mitt was at Bain talking about how they moved production to China to make more money for his shareholders

 

Because the tools for doing so tend to hurt the average american. Take the "moving jobs back part". If politicians put a massive toll on foreign goods to bring back production' date=' that'll A:make those goods way more expensive, hurting the average american and B: make the rest of the world retaliate by putting a massive toll on american goods, killing exports. Same applies to most conventional ways of getting jobs back/energy independence.[/quote']

 

Our exports already have huge tariffs on them going to countries that we have free trade agreements with, why do you think Jeep is moving their production for the Chinese market to China? Most of the free trade agreements that this country has only work 1 way, what we need are fair trade agreements then products coming into this country from others will have tariffs just like our products going elsewhere. We have a $41.5 billion export deficit according to the US census stats, which means we bring 41.5 billion dollars more worth of goods into this country than goes out to the rest of the world. That is huge. A good reason to bring alot of domestic production back to the states is this: What if China all of a sudden decides it doesn't need to deal with us anymore and calls in the $1.4 trillion in debt it owns of ours and shuts us off on goods being imported by us? This is a national security issue as well. If we ever end up in a world war again we are totaly screwed most of the factories that would be needed for us to build everything we would need no longer exist, we are not the powerhouse in manufacturing we once were.

 

(source) Here is an article from a very conservative magazine called Forbes about the income inequality in this country and how it is damaging us.

 

(source A chart showing tax rates on the wealthiest Americans from 1945 to 2009.

 

(source CEO pay growth from 1966 to 2009

 

(source union membership 1930 to 2010

 

(source article from Bloomberg about income gap

[Tommycat]

There is a video out there on the internets when Mitt was at Bain talking about how they moved production to China to make more money for his shareholders.

 

I provided my source. So please give me some kind of cite. I mean Fact Check was kind enough to disprove it, so now you are calling the fact checking site wrong...

[kyrie]

I provided my source. So please give me some kind of cite. I mean Fact Check was kind enough to disprove it, so now you are calling the fact checking site wrong...

 

No I am not, and I am man enough to admit when I get my facts wrong too.

[thejman217]

Please don't turn this into a series of accusational posts and a bunch of "You're Wrong"s.....I am just merely asking questions and looking for answers to those questions.

 

"Kavar's Corner: A place for friendly discussion of serious topics."

[kyrie]

I had no problem with being told I was wrong on that, I admit I was wrong.

[Tommycat]

I thought this was a rather civil discussion. We asked for a rather important detail.

 

The point was, some of what you ask for is out of the party's hands. Or even to a degree are what the party wanted(Bringing overseas jobs back home was IN this year's platform), and it didn't help because people like yourself believe the party was for the opposite(not an accusation, just an observation). Perhaps Romney saying it in every stump speech wasn't enough. But I think the message wasn't powerful enough in people's minds.

 

At any rate, I was pointing out to you that while it sounds nice to say all that, the president really has little to do with it(might be why he failed as well). Here's what he can do. Make suggestions to Congress who will either listen to him, or ignore him. That's as far as he is able to go for the creation of a bill. There's a huge disconnect about HOW to bring those jobs back.

[kyrie]

I have an idea about how to do it, give financial incentives to the companies that open businesses here in the US. For every dollar spent on payroll they get a dollar off their tax liabilty on profits, also lower the business tax rate to 18% instead of the 25% it is currently to give the true small businesses an incentive to claim the money as profits instead of as personal income. Also every dollar spent on new equipment made here comes off their tax liability instead of being treated as profits because those dollars are not profit they are a re-investment in their business and their workers. Thas is my opinions feel free to point out any flaws in my thinking.

[Q]

tl;dr version of thread:

 

Be more like the Democrats to win the elections.

Except for the government takeover of private industry, regulating everything and quadrupling the debt part.

 

In other words, be more like Libertarians.

[thejman217]

Actually, Kavar's was created so that a certain group of people could troll with impunity and pull rank on anyone who called them on it.

 

Are you being serious or sarcastic?