Rumor Posted June 15, 2004 Share Posted June 15, 2004 Originally posted by [nWo] Filth whine whine whine. let the noobs have their fun 2. you aren't the only people with the right to play. This is not good christian behaviour! Shut the **** up noob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted June 15, 2004 Share Posted June 15, 2004 No need to start flaming here guys. [nWo] Filth since you've made it your purpose to be a troll since you signed up, consider this your warning! Hopefully the mod makers and developers can work together on a solution to fix this. If you must discuss the "secret commands" don't post them here, but relay via PM. As was said, if these commands stayed secret this long, maybe a little discreteness can help prevent them becoming too popular until a solution is found. It's odd that these commands are usable by non admins though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amidala from Chop Shop Posted June 15, 2004 Share Posted June 15, 2004 Well, good news and bad news: JA Plus Mod 2.0 appears to block most or all of the debug moves, so kudos to slider. I guess it's a good thing his mod is so widespread, it will slow down spreading of the hacks. The bad news is that if a server is running a mod that doesn't specifically block the debug moves, it is vulnerable. My disruption instagib server, which doesn't even have lightsabers, is vulnerable. I'll have to read the log later to see if they made lightsabers appear where there aren't supposed to be any, but they were talking on my other CTF server about how the hacks worked on my disruption server. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neverhoodian Posted June 15, 2004 Share Posted June 15, 2004 Originally posted by [nWo] Filth And btw. JKA MULTIPLAYER SUX!! DONT WASTE YOUR MONEY ON IT!! ... Good for you. Maybe if you were a bit more specific as to WHY you hate JA (other than "it sux"), I wouldn't give you such a hard time (as would many other forum members). I don't mind what people think as long as they give arguable and insightful reasons as to why they think that way. But enough of getting off topic. It's too bad that this is happening to JA. This is why game companies are reluctant to release a game's source code in the first place. Some smart@$$ always tries to find ways to wreck the game. Take Delta Force 2 for example. On the official servers, you have people flying and shooting off an unlimited supply of grenades at a ridiculously high rate of fire. What's worse, they move so erratically that it's well nigh impossible to kill them. It really ruins the game. Hopefully it will never become that bad for JA. Still, it is worrisome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Sigh, anyway back to the real discussion... where are Master Hex and RazorAce? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master William Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rad Blackrose Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Indeed. Now back to the matter at hand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--ZeeMan-- Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 you notice how you can view ips if you're a moderator or admin? *waves bye* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 The debug moves problem is caused by the mod maker in question not building his .dll's properly. If you forget to make Final builds and instead make Debug builds, then all kinds of debug commands get left in - commands which are only meant to be avaliable duing test time and never were meant to end up on 'proper' servers :/ Sounds like certain mod makers realised this later rather than sooner - and hence their earlier releases were full of Debug stuff... And unfortunately, I know of no way to disable any of these debug commands if Debug builds have been made. The developers would not have needed any way to disable these commands, since they were only 'suppost' to be avaliable for testing purposes in the first place... So in short - players aren't doing anything clever to 'hack' these servers -they are taking advantage of a gaping wide hole of opportunity inadvertantly (but - gotta be said - noobishly) left open by the mod maker in question... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amidala from Chop Shop Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 My servers were running basejka_pushfix and disruption. The exploits continued under JAR 1.2 but are pretty much stopped under JA Plus 2.0. And Orion2486 says that JA Reloaded 1.4 will have those exploits blocked. Are you saying that basejka_pushfix, disruption, and JAR 1.2 were not built as Final versions, and plain basejka should be OK because it isn't running a mod? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion2486 Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Actually I think chosen had been playing around with the debug commands and left the debug check uncommented or something, but its now cvar restricted in 1.4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--ZeeMan-- Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 ok, so ja+ and jr are going to block them. what about omni and x mod? does anyone know about those? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 If Xmod2 and OJP block them then I'm fine. I just don't want to be forced to use an ampunish friendly admin mod. ; p But, interesting point if you say it's a MOD problem and not a basejka problem. Pushfix is nice, but it only fixes one annoying bug, better to have that than to have exploits like this I guess. Somebody should make a new linux compile that fixes that (if it's the case). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK-8252 Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 XMod and OJP never had debug problems. They're some of the few mods done right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Cool. If that's "all it is" we should spread the word among mod makers and admins. Once that's cleard up and the popular mods are fixed, then it should be out in the open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 JA+ Mod block all debug cmds and cheat cmd since the beginning of the mod it is even one of the main things i did when i begun with JA+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Are you sure slider? I thought I had heard that you could activate them on certain early versions of admin mods (And I was quite sure JA+ was specifically mentioned). And if I'm reading what people are saying - it sounds like it's still going on, apperently with several mods - including your own... If I'm wrong about this, I apologise. But that's what i'm getting from reading these posts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 perhaps it was the case on the first version 1.0 or 1.1 but i corrected it very quickly it makes a long time it is corrected i just took a look on all the cmds that you can use in JA+ and absoluty are blocked if you know a cmd that is not blocked tell me i will see if you are right but i am nearly sure you are wrong but perhaps i missed some debug cmds in all this code so tell me the cmds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Slider, This was my point though. If you just make Final builds, you wouldn't have to try and find all these debug commands. They get taken out automatically Try doing a quick search for: #ifdef _DEBUG See all that stuff coming up? THat's all the stuff your adding to your builds which shouldn't be there in the first place. Not only are you adding commands and cvars which shouldn't be there, your also adding loads of unnessesary test code and debug trace stuff which will be eating up a few unnessesary cycles here and there (not much granted - but still, your mod is running slower as a result...) You don't release debug builds man - seriously! Debug builds are for testing and (funnily enough) debugging - your not suppost to use them on 'real' servers. This is very basic stuff... btw - the reason this didn't happen in JO is because we had the .qvm compiler avaliable. THis automatically makes 'release' builds, stripping out all the debug stuff. (Or at least the default configuration of the .bat files used made release builds. Not sure if it's possible to set them up to make debug builds. But anyway - that's a side issue. THe point was it didn't take any brain power to make sure your compiling release builds in JO - whereas it does in JA. Well, not that much tbh. But you at least need to switch configs on your compiler...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 hehe i am not a novice i already checked all of that and all my version are relaeased in FINAL_BUILD i was only saying that perghaps there are cmds that i didn't see and that are not in IFNDEF FINAL_BUILD block ir IDFED _DEGUG blocks but i just took all the cmds one by one to be sure, and normally except if i missed some of them all those cmds are not compiled in the mod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 and all my version are relaeased in FINAL_BUILD OK - good. ...but you also removed the _DEBUG pre-processor define right?! If you didn't do that, your builds are still chock-full of debug code... No-one has ever triggered a debug command in my mod - EVER. And I've never had to go hunting down these commands in code either. You wanna know why? Because my mod doesn't have debug code in it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 of course the _debug flag is not in the release versions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 Ahh -I think I see your problem slider. I've just downloaded v2.0_fixed of your mod, and the windows .dll looks to be the right size (Debug builds are a LOT bigger than Final builds - about twice the size)... ....but your linux .so file is way too big to not be a debug build. It's nearly 2MB's!! It should actually be around half the size if it was a proper final build - 0.7 MB or so... So looks like your windows build is ok, but your linux build is DEFINELTY debug. Do you build the linux files yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 no it is not debug the _debug flag is not set if it is debug it would spam the games.log with debug message check it and you will see there is not _debug message the flags used in windows version are the same as the flag in mu linux makefile execpt several differences due the difference betweend the 2 OS i think the difference of sizze is due to the fact the instrution in linux OS is totally differenct from the windows one i use the last versions of GCC and it compiles of the code for i586 if you think that the _degug code is compile in the linux version try to execute cmds that appear only in _degug blocks or find debug message in the games.log for example damage saber, or move trace debug..... you will see they do not appear perhaps if i had used ICC it would given the same size as in windows dll... but i doubt of it because the official basejka linux .so file is about 2Mo and was compiled by raven itself so it is the same size as mine and they used ICC so i don't really see the need of using ICC when you have a free programm as GCC iCC is not free, and i have not money to spend in that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 i think the difference of sizze is due to the fact the instrution in linux OS is totally differenct from the windows one Heh -whatever you say... So you obviously think it's sheer co-incidence it's only certain mods that have (ever) had this problem then?! Well - I tried guys. If you wanna keep using JA+, expect to find some more interesting little 'features' in the linux version... ...call it a hunch if you will ..just out of pure morbid curiosity though - please mention one example of a debug command that Raven let 'slip' into their final builds which you have subsequently had to 'fix'... [edit] Obviously send in a PM rather than post in the open here... [/edit] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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