montnoir Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 Jesus people! You're fussing over the full-on face to face Obi - Grievous fight being too easy but Palpatine cutting up 3 Jedi MASTERS in 2 strokes while the Jedi were fully aware they were going to arrest a Sith... is completely believable?! Let me guess how you explain that. Palpatine got the drop on them and "he's that good". Yeah right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 Let me guess how you explain that. Palpatine got the drop on them and "he's that good". Yeah right Sith Lord > half-droid alien who got his lungs and organs crushed by Windu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaV™ Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 The start of the fight with Palpatine was pathetic at the start I mean I know he's a Sith Lord, but WHAT THE HELL? he killed three Jedi Masters in a matter of thirty seconds they barely even put up a defense! That's pathetic! What was Lucas thinking when he had Palpatine kill the three masters off so quickly? I mean he wanted to show Palpatine was powerful, but that was too much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 how come they can't bring over his fighting? Because cartoon fighting is stylized in a different way than movie fighting. It'd look absurd, like a fat man trying to squeeze into a replica of Audrey Hepburn's dress from breakfast at tiffany's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobQel-Droma Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 It'd look absurd, like a fat man trying to squeeze into a replica of Audrey Hepburn's dress from breakfast at tiffany's. That might be pretty hilarious to watch. I didn't have much problem with the Palpy vs. Jedi Masters fight, it was ok. He makes a sudden unexpected spinning jump at them, and pretty much just sticks his lightsaber straight out and stabs through a Jedi's chest. I don't find that stupid, the Master was probably taken off balance and shocked at Palpatines attack too much to try and block a stab like that. And the other Master was cut down right down a few milliseconds after him; He was probably taken by suprise to, and wasn't fast enough to block it. Now the last Master being instantly cut down I have trouble with, he went down too quickly after seeing all that, but he was the only one that I have trouble believing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 Jesus people! You're fussing over the full-on face to face Obi - Grievous fight being too easy but Palpatine cutting up 3 Jedi MASTERS in 2 strokes while the Jedi were fully aware they were going to arrest a Sith... is completely believable?! Let me guess how you explain that. Palpatine got the drop on them and "he's that good". To quote Cecil B. Demented, "MOVIE ****ING MAGIC!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynk Former Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 In the end it's apparant that the people who did the Clone Wars toons didn't do Grevious properly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montnoir Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 To quote Cecil B. Demented, "MOVIE ****ING MAGIC!" Have 3 Jedi MASTERS (that have painstakingly been painted out as being l33t swordsmen throughout 3 to 5 movies) just stand there looking stupid while being cut down by a lightsaber = movie-magic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edlib Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 "The Dark Side clouds all..." Palpy's sheer presence causes the Jedi to lose touch with the Force somewhat. Mace says as much in Ep.II. That is why Obi and Anakin get captured by Grievious earlier in the movie, and why they can't understand how it happened. Palpy unleashed, with his full power on display, should be enough to stun any Jedi master short of Yoda or Mace. Yoda says that later in Ep.III... and even each of them lose to him. Anakin is the only one with enough inherent Force control to overcome Palpy's influence. That, plus the fact that most Jedi masters have never fought another opponent using a lightsaber outside of training or friendly sparring. The Sith have been thought extinct for hundreds of years... how much call has there been for the Jedi to train in fencing with an opponent as skilled as they? Up to that point, the only Jedi in generations who have fought hand-to-hand against a Sith are Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, Anakin, and Yoda. And none of them have fought the Sith master,.. only apprentices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 if his whole persona was to be cowardly, then why make him a tough sob in the toon?Because he has to be a credible threat. He is tough enough to defeat "average" Jedi, but struggled against one of the Order's best lightsaber masters. Plus, he couldn't be too powerful in the movie because that had to be reserved for Vader. If Grievous was unstoppable at killing Jedi, Then the Emperor would have less of a need for Anakin. Plus, it shows that Kenobi is a cut above, which helps make his defeat of Anakin more believable, since Anakin gets hyped quite a bit. Also, the whole coughing thing is used to show that cyborg technology is far from perfect, and that it does not create a superbeing, dispite the physical enhancements. It is important to show that what Vader becomes later is not ideal and makes him less that what he potentially could be. This is key to understanding why the Emperor wanted Luke in the OT. If GG was able to defeat almost any Jedi because of his cyborg body without any drawbacks, that would imply that the suited Vader was more powerful because of the suit. When in fact, he was worse off because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaV™ Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 Also, the whole coughing thing is used to show that cyborg technology is far from perfect, and that it does not create a superbeing, dispite the physical enhancements. It is important to show that what Vader becomes later is not ideal and makes him less that what he potentially could be. This is key to understanding why the Emperor wanted Luke in the OT. If GG was able to defeat almost any Jedi because of his cyborg body without any drawbacks, that would imply that the suited Vader was more powerful because of the suit. When in fact, he was worse off because of it. I guess you never watched the Clone Wars? Mace Windu made him have the cough when he used an poweful Jedi move (force push) and it caused an large dent in the chest of Greivous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montnoir Posted November 10, 2005 Share Posted November 10, 2005 The good General had the cough very early in the pre-production and as the Clone-Wars micro series was greenlighted the ones responsible, had access to character data and came up with the l33t idea as to "how Grievous got his cough". The general would have coughed in the movie regardless if the Clone Wars series was made or not and regardless if he got damaged in them or not. They had no impact on the movie. See? Grievous got damaged in the series because he coughed in the movie. Not the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 I guess you never watched the Clone Wars? Mace Windu made him have the cough when he used an poweful Jedi move (force push) and it caused an large dent in the chest of Greivous. Yeah, and they did that AFTER they added Grievous' cough to the movie. Anyway, Montnoir, my early comment was a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeskywalker1 Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 I thought grevious was stupid. They shoulda... IDK... done something else... he was just thrown in... I mean they could have mentioned him in the other movies. Sorta like Jabba, you see him breifly in episode 4, which introduces him, and then in episode 6 it doesn't seem like george just threw him in to take up time in the movie. Dooku was ok, but he was killed to early, in my opinion. Grevious just popped up out of nowhere... The cartoon's don't count because a lot of people who watch the movies don't watch the cartoon. They are like "what the heck" when someone like grevious pops out of nowhere. I also thought a robot coughing was stupid- someone explain this to me... I havn't seen the cartoon... nor do I know anything about the character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hallucination Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 ^^^He coughs because he isn't a robot, but because hes a cyborg. Part organic. He smoked to much back when he was in his reckless twenties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 ^^^He coughs because he isn't a robot, but because hes a cyborg. Part organic. He smoked to much back when he was in his reckless twenties. Smoking will kill you. This has been a public announcement by the Future Cyborg Mothers Against Smoking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaV™ Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 Yeah, and they did that AFTER they added Grievous' cough to the movie. Oh yeah where's your proof? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobQel-Droma Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 When I first say Grievous come in coughing, the first thought in my mind was "smoker!" I thought they should have said something about him in the other movies, perhaps mentioned him, he was kind of abrupt. But I didn't have any problem with it, besides, as far as I know, General Greivous only because a prominent part between Episode II and III. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 Oh yeah where's your proof?The interview given by the Lucasfilm guys 2 months before production of the second volume of Clone Wars. As well as an interview with Gendy, maker of the Clone Wars cartoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 I guess you never watched the Clone Wars? Mace Windu made him have the cough when he used an poweful Jedi move (force push) and it caused an large dent in the chest of Greivous.I know. That is the in-universe reason. But Lucas has stated what I have said above on several occasions. And like Sithy said the creators of the Clone Wars cartoon confirmed this as well. I also thought a robot coughing was stupid- someone explain this to me... Uh, he's not a robot? I havn't seen the cartoon... nor do I know anything about the character.Obviously. Apparently you also missed Revenge of the Sith because they go out of their way to show he is not a robot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edlib Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 I thought grevious was stupid. They shoulda... IDK... done something else... he was just thrown in... I mean they could have mentioned him in the other movies. Sorta like Jabba, you see him breifly in episode 4, which introduces him, and then in episode 6 it doesn't seem like george just threw him in to take up time in the movie. Dooku was ok, but he was killed to early, in my opinion. Grevious just popped up out of nowhere... Grievous exists for only one reason: To serve as a plot device to separate Obi-Wan from Anakin so Anakin can be seduced by Palpatine outside of Obi-Wan's influence. G.L. could have perhaps used another different pre-existing character for that purpose, but he chose to show a new character, mainly to use him to foreshadow Anakin's cyborg future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaV™ Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 And I suppose Dooku's death by Anakin at the start of the movie was just another step torwards the darkside? He was already getting the feel of the Darkside ever since Tatooine when he slaughtered the Tuskans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeskywalker1 Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 Uh, he's not a robot? Obviously. Apparently you also missed Revenge of the Sith because they go out of their way to show he is not a robot. They didn't go "out of their way." By the time you see anything organic on him ... or in him, hes about to die. I was confused the whole first part of the movie when he was caughing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Sitherino Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 I don't get it, people complain about Grievous being thrown in to move the plot forward. But what about Lando? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeskywalker1 Posted November 12, 2005 Share Posted November 12, 2005 Lando had a backstory. He was previously introduced by Han... breifly. He just "fit in." Plus, he didn't die 45 mins after he was introduced. And Lando had a HUGE part in both ESB and ROTJ. Grevious popped in... talked... caughed, caughed some more, got in a cool fight, advanced the story, caughed again... then died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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