Was it justified?

[Emperor Devon]

Jimbo, the children are being raised by the men and women to become as vicious as their parents. Sand People culture places an extremely heavy emphasis on how wonderful it is to kill people who are not of the same species. They might have died anways, because Sand People do not raise their women to be able to survive independantly, and children are incapable of survivng in deserts or fighting off Tatooine's ferocious wildlife.

 

I myself think it was justified. For both the reasons I listed above, and because it's rooted in human nature. If someone makes you suffer, you try to make them. It's completely natural.

[Davinq]

Total justification, that was.

They aren't human. They're animals, and I killed them like animals. And not just the men. The women and children too.

Treat unto others as others would treat unto you.

[Point Man]

Except that Tusken Raiders aren't humans.

 

We slaughter animals regularly (either for food or for fun, i.e. hunting), and yet it's considered perfectly fine by most Americans it seems.

The Tuskens are sentient. Animals hunted by humans are not. I also do not believe in killing animals for sport (or out of anger, for that matter).

Jimbo, the children are being raised by the men and women to become as vicious as their parents.

That's the same thing they said about the Vietnamese. It did not wash then, and it does not wash now. Justice is dependent upon only punishing people for crimes they have committed. You do not slaughter a whole village for what a few people did.

 

I myself think it was justified. For both the reasons I listed above, and because it's rooted in human nature. If someone makes you suffer, you try to make them. It's completely natural.

It is natural for people to act out their anger. The concept of justice is completely founded upon the principle that, while natural, it is not justified.

[Emperor Devon]

That's the same thing they said about the Vietnamese.

 

Not completely. Tusken society advocated the killing of outsiders for uncounted millenia. The children would have done the same thing they did to Anakin when they themselves became adults.

 

You do not slaughter a whole village for what a few people did.

 

A most valid point, which Anakin could do nothing about. He had no way of telling who had tortured and killed his mother. To see it from his perspective, if a group of people tortured and killed Jae, and you had the power to kill them all at will, but no way to tell who was guilty, and they all would try to kill you if you tried to kill one of them, would you do it?

[Point Man]

As a soldier, I have been trained not to engage in a battle when you do not recognize your enemy. Anakin should have had the same training.

[Hallucination]

But Anakin wasn't a soldier, and if he was I think he would have still been angry enough to kill them.

[Emperor Devon]

He had it and more. The Jedi teach discilpine greater than anything present in soldiers today. But when a beloved family member dies before your very eyes, can anyone refraine from that? I imagine few can.

[Hallucination]

Jedi training doesn't include how to deal with the death of a parent, and he was a tad bit more attached to his mother than the other Jedi.

 

P.S. The picture in your sig is punishable by being stabbed to death. With a spoon.

[Emperor Devon]

Jedi training doesn't include how to deal with the death of a parent, and he was a tad bit more attached to his mother than the other Jedi.

 

As Jedi are seperated from their parents as infants, that is completely understandable.

 

P.S. The picture in your sig is punishable by being stabbed to death. With a spoon.

 

I'll add that.

[TK-8252]

I can honestly say that jimbo fett is a better man than everyone else on this forum. It's nice to see that SOMEONE around here has a heart... unlike me.

[Raven_Onasi]

I would have done the same thing if I were in Anakin shoes. But was it justified? The Tuskens seemed to mindless killing machines that their only perpose in life is to kill and survive by any means necessary, and they killed Anakin only living relative. So I'm going to say it was justified. Case closed, court is now adjourned (j/k)

[Dagobahn Eagle]

Nope. Killing all those innocents for what their warriors did? Nope.

 

Jimbo, the children are being raised by the men and women to become as vicious as their parents.

I sincerely hope you do not apply that to real-life politics.

[Emperor Devon]

I sincerely hope you do not apply that to real-life politics.

 

I do not.

[Maverick5770]

I think It's what I probably would have done, aside from the women and children. Is it right, no, but it is natural, Jedi or no.

[Prime]

Of course it wasn't.

[Darth InSidious]

Jimbo, the children are being raised by the men and women to become as vicious as their parents. Sand People culture places an extremely heavy emphasis on how wonderful it is to kill people who are not of the same species. They might have died anways, because Sand People do not raise their women to be able to survive independantly, and children are incapable of survivng in deserts or fighting off Tatooine's ferocious wildlife.

 

I myself think it was justified. For both the reasons I listed above, and because it's rooted in human nature. If someone makes you suffer, you try to make them. It's completely natural.

 

But if you kill them, if you take those lives, you become no better than the Tuskens themselves. In some ways you become worse.

 

Genocide is inexcusable for any reason.

[machievelli]

The decision that another intelligent life form is really not worthy of that respect is the basis of slavery and genocide. Killing any that stopped him from taking his mother, I can accept that. But the 'nits make lice' argument has been used for more mass murder than even religion can claim.

 

If Nimitz had carried out his commentfrom Pearl Harbor, the American people may have cheered until they wondered how we'd take responsibility for over a hundred million dead. Since half of any population is women and children, would you cheer that fifty million Japanese children and women were killed just because they were Japanese?

 

We were appalled that the Germans a sopposedly civilized people had done the same to 12 million, 5.5 million of them Jews. Do you think anyone could have rationalized ten times that number of noncombatants alone?

 

By that definition, everyone who is not an Arab deserves to die, as Al Qaida has stated.

[Emperor Devon]

Valid points, though you must remember the Sand People are fictional characters more savage and bloodthirsty than what we see today.

[TK-8252]

Valid points, though you must remember the Sand People are fictional characters more savage and bloodthirsty than what we see today.

 

That's a good point. Because they are fictional it's hard to think of them like real people on Earth. In the Star Wars galaxy, would it be justified? Would people be outraged? I don't know. Anakin thought it was a good idea apparently at the time, then got pissed at himself for doing it. But when he told Padme, who was a very compassionate person, she didn't seem very upset. She wasn't like "holy ****, you're a murderer, I'm turning you in." Instead she married him. I'd imagine that slaughtering the tribe of Sandpeople would be like slaying a couple bears and their cubs. Pretty shocking but not worthy of outrage.

[Hallucination]

Valid points, though you must remember the Sand People are fictional characters more savage and bloodthirsty than what we see today.

That's one reason why I said it was justified, along with the fact I would have done the same thing in Anakin's shoes and I refuse to condemn someone for doing what I would've done. If anyone uses this reasoning but voted differently than I, it's either because they're a better person or don't like their mother.

 

If they were real people I would put far more consideration in my actions, and most likely would have just destroy one of those sand igloo things in which they live. And that's just because I hate igloos. And sand.

[machievelli]

Valid points, though you must remember the Sand People are fictional characters more savage and bloodthirsty than what we see today.

 

The comment 'nits make lice' came from our own dark ages. We have had people on this planet that make the Tusken raiders look like your next door neighbors. As a student of history, I cannot say that even a fictional people deserve annihilation, too many people have used the same ratioanle for real living human beings. The 'scalp' bounty put out by the British in the 16th century paid 40 pounds for every man, and 30 pounds for every female or child. The reason the Indians started taking scalps was because they seemed to think that Europeans (Some of whom believed that you had to bury every body part right down to hair and nails) were trying to bat them from going to their heaven.

 

As for brutality, a casual perusal of American history has indians being defined as animals before the mid 19th century.

[Nancy Allen``]

Gee I would. I don't care what the Jedi say, Yoda, Mace, anyone who thought it was wrong, if it happened to me I'd do exactly the same thing and furthermore anyone who hadn't had something like that happen to them has no right to complain.

[machievelli]

Gee I would. I don't care what the Jedi say, Yoda, Mace, anyone who thought it was wrong, if it happened to me I'd do exactly the same thing and furthermore anyone who hadn't had something like that happen to them has no right to complain.

 

Yet in society we assume we do have that right. We set a standard, and assume the rest of humanity must tread it. We Americans are the worst offenders because we're like the prosletyzing Born Agains. We have the 'right' to invade your privacy, ram our god, political or economic belief down your thoat, and you are fools if you don't listen.

 

That last paragraph is pretty much a breakdown of the policies of our governments and state departments since the nation began. If you get a chance, go by the state department and look at the 'Indian Treaty' room.

[Nancy Allen``]

Religion really has nothing to do with it. It's more a case of, regardless of your religious beliefs, a woman is captured and tortured to death and all you want is justice on those responsible, regardless of who it was that was responsible. How many LSF players succumbed to a desire for revenge on Korriban? I know I was spoiling for a fight. Those who have been in those situations or had beared witness to those situations really have a much better understanding of it all. Ideally from a Jedi's perspective one should be able to deal with it and move on, but as far as forgetting it goes this is one instance where I believe not only are the Jedi wrong I'd say to their face to stick it.

 

Just on what the Indians did, in their minds they were justified for what they did, the same as the Sand People probably believed they were for their actions. However, in both cases, and others as well including for white people and the West, it is very much double standered. They are willing to do that against others but heaven forfend should others do it to them for the same reason. This applies to today's world as well, I'll use Israel as an example. They are against the killing of their civillians, which is perfectly reasonable. They do exactly the same thing to Lebanon, and they retalliate by killing Israeli innocents.

 

Before you reply to this I support Israel, but not the actions they take here.

 

With Americans setting the standered or the West setting the standered, it is clear that people in the Middle East, given the terrorist acts Islamic extremists commit or the situation with Israel, or the Asian countries where people who are caught with drugs are put to death, very much believe in 'an eye for an eye' that Anakin believed, that we would feel seeing people harm kids for example. From a Jedi's standpoint I'm not sure how justified it is to, in Anakin's case, seek retribution for what the Sand People did, but I believe with the possible exception of a very select few everyone wants justice, even if it's not nessecarily in the same way.

[machievelli]

I actually went back to check because I didn't think I had made any comment based on my religious beliefs, which does not condone mass murder, but does have mitigation so a murderer can still be freed.

 

My point was if he had slaughtered every adult male, I would have not liked it but accepted it. But women in most primitive societuies either have a lot of rights or none at all. If it were an Afghan village he had descended on it would have been the women who had tortured his mother for example.

 

I do not condemn his actions, but as things flowed on, I think it unlikely that Anakion reported what he had done.

 

As for Israel, they have a right to exist. The fact that two back to back hardline governments have shattered the peace process started by Oslo does not remove that. Both sides quite honestly should take a serious chill pill, sleep for 72 hours, and then sit down and talk. Not bluster, not threaten, talk.

 

And i wasn't using the middle east as an example. Our treatment of mexico in the last century is proof enough.