Abstinence

[Emperor Devon]

From the pet peeve thread in Ahto, the abstinence thread is now born...

 

So, are you all for or against it?

 

I'm for abstinence. To give some opening statments, I think sex before marriage is disgusting behavior. It increases chances of STDs when people have it with one than one partner, causes teen pregnancy, and can take away a very happy memory on wedding day.

 

It's kind of amusing to be debating this topic when your username has doctor in it, Doc.

 

Thoughts?

[TK-8252]

Abstinence has a high failure rate.

 

Besides, if a couple pledges abstinence, they just have oral or even... gasp... anal... sex instead. There are loopholes. Two to be exact.

[St. Jimmy]

I agree with ED and pretty much for the same reasons too. People will say "oh what if they're going to get married anyway?!" Is it really that hard to wait? It's not like you've got engaged to get married in five years. (If you have,... then it sucks to be you! ) But, yeah, I agree with Devon.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

I don't believe in marriage so I don't see a reason to abstain from sex.

[Samnmax221]

Abstinence, not in this year, or ever really. Kids will **** other kids, kids have been ****ing other kids since the beginning of time. Even if you tell kids not to **** each other they will still **** each other. The only thing you can do if you have kids who are ****ing other kids, and getting ****ed in return, is educate them about safe ****ing, so they don't get an STD or a ****ing baby.

[Emperor Devon]

I don't believe in marriage

 

Hm. Interesting.

 

There are loopholes. Two to be exact.

 

If a couple is actually looking for loopholes, I don't see why they would decide upon abstinence in the first place.

[TK-8252]

Abstinence, not in this year, or ever really. Kids will **** other kids, kids have been ****ing other kids since the beginning of time. Even if you tell kids not to **** each other they will still **** each other. The only thing you can do if you have kids who are ****ing other kids, and getting ****ed in return, is educate them about safe ****ing, so they don't get an STD or a ****ing baby.

 

****ing agreed.

 

To suggest that kids just stop ****ing is unnatural. I would call abstinence a perversion. The natural state of humans, like all animals, is to **** like rabbits.

[Emperor Devon]

I would call abstinence a perversion.

 

And I would call whores, sex trafficking, STDs, porn videos and sex parties a perversion.

[TK-8252]

And I would call whores, sex trafficking, STDs, porn videos and sex parties a perversion.

 

I'm not cheering those things on, but they are surely more natural than abstinence. Prostitution is the oldest industry. Porn and casual sex, etc. is exactly what god natural selection ordered.

[Samnmax221]

And I would call whores, sex trafficking, STDs, porn videos and sex parties a perversion.

And Wonderfully enough a personal choice.

[The Doctor]

It's kind of amusing to be debating this topic when your username has doctor in it, Doc.

Oh be quiet you.

 

It depends on the situation.

 

Pre-marital sex with someone you've just met and will most likely not see again in your life (some people refer to this situation as a 'one night stand') is stupid. Casual, meaningless sex is for monkeys, squirrels, and the like.

 

People will say "oh what if they're going to get married anyway?!" Is it really that hard to wait?

If you've found the person you want to spend the rest of your life with, why wait? What's the point? If you practise safe sex, and intend to get married anyway, then there's no point in waiting.

 

It's not like you've got engaged to get married in five years. (If you have,... then it sucks to be you! )

Actually, it is like that in some cases. My girlfriend and I intend to get married once we're both done school. It's a recent decision, but one we both feel comfortable with. It may not be in five years - it may be closer to ten - but the fact remains. And you could only be so lucky to be in my place. Finding the one person you want to spend the rest of your lives with at such a young age doesn't happen very often.

 

And before anyone starts with the 'you're young, you don't understand love yet' bull ****, I'm going to say this: I've heard it all before. So save us all some time here and shut te **** up. I've heard the speeches. I've heard the thinly velied 'you're too much of an immautre dumb**** to understand love' comments. They piss me off. Teenagers are just as capable as knowing love as people who are 20+.

 

I don't believe in marriage so I don't see a reason to abstain from sex.

Let me guess: your parents divorced when you were a child, didn't they? Or have you yourself been through a divorce? If I'm way off base, then let me know, but in my experience, the people who don't believe in marriage are the people who've seen the worst examples of it.

 

And I would call whores, sex trafficking, STDs, porn videos and sex parties a perversion.

That's one thing I can agree on. But pre-marital sex doesn't always lead to this stuff. Only when it occurs between two stupid people do these things arise.

[Emperor Devon]

they are surely more natural than abstinence. Prostitution is the oldest industry.

 

And what is so wonderful about being natural?

 

And Wonderfully enough a personal choice.

 

Smoking is a personal choice. Hitting small children is a personal choice. Killing yourself is a personal choice. How does that matter?

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Let me guess: your parents divorced when you were a child, didn't they? Or have you yourself been through a divorce? If I'm way off base, then let me know, but in my experience, the people who don't believe in marriage are the people who've seen the worst examples of it.

You can keep the Freudian bull**** to yourself kthx. I don't believe in marriage because I don't believe in religion nor the myth that marriage somehow constitutes the epitome of love. I also believe that humans are not naturally monogamous and that two people can only be together for so long before they get bored with one another or pissed at each other. I'm also a cynical bastard.

 

Smoking is a personal choice. Hitting small children is a personal choice. Killing yourself is a personal choice. How does that matter?

Hitting kids hurts others (revelations ITT), as does suicide. Sex does not, and neither does smoking for that matter.

[Q]

I've been abstinate for 10 years now, and it's the right choice for me. I don't look down on people who aren't, unless they try to convince me that I'm not "normal" because I am.

 

I don't look down on people who are sexually active out of wedlock because, as TK said, it's perfectly natural. I was once that way, but nothing good came out of it (it made me feel cheap), so I quit.

 

I just decided I'd wait for Ms. Right to come along, and I'm just not content with Ms. Right Now.

[TK-8252]

And what is so wonderful about being natural?

 

Sex is as natural as breathing. Since breathing can be very dangerous - such as when a chemical is in the air - does that mean that we should refrain from breathing? Of course not. We'd die. Refraining from sex won't kill you, yeah, but it sure can frustrate some people to the point that they do crazy ****, like rape and murder and ****. No not all people not having sex are crazy but you never see guys from the Middle East blowing themselves up because they're getting so much sex all the time. They want virgins in heaven, because they ain't gettin' any on Earth.

 

 

Smoking is a personal choice. Hitting small children is a personal choice. Killing yourself is a personal choice. How does that matter?

 

If you want to smoke, I say fine. But I have no drive in my mind towards smoking, like people are driven to have sex by their hormones. Hitting children is not a personal choice, because it involves another person (the child). If you want to kill yourself, I say to do what you must. Not my choice to make for you.

 

Etc.

[Samnmax221]

Smoking is a personal choice. Hitting small children is a personal choice. Killing yourself is a personal choice. How does that matter?

Except for hitting small children (If it's your kid and it breaks the rules belting it once is perfectly acceptable) these lifestyle choices are completely okay. Smoking, and killing yourself only affect you. These are victimless crimes and should not be punished.

[The Doctor]

You can keep the Freudian bull**** to yourself kthx. I don't believe in marriage because I don't believe in religion nor the myth that marriage somehow constitutes the epitome of love. I also believe that humans are not naturally monogamous and that two people can only be together for so long before they get bored with one another or pissed at each other. I'm also a cynical bastard.

You're right, marriage is not the epitome of love. Marriage is an act of love, not a state of love. The epitome of love is the love of God, but let's not make this a religious thing.

 

You (I'm too lazy to find out exactly who at the moment) say that sex is a natural thing. So is murder. Back before the civilised age - indeed, even before the rise of Homo Sapiens, going back as far as the earliest mamalian life - and even with the lower life forms today, males regularly murder each other for dominance or a mate.

 

I'm sorry, but child abuse is a personal choice. A child has no say in whether you beat them or not. You decide to do it. It's your choice.

[Emperor Devon]

Casual, meaningless sex is for monkeys, squirrels, and the like.

 

Glad to see some sense here.

 

What's the point?

 

People can decide not to get married despite becoming engaged. I've seen it before. Waiting to have sex until marriage is a form of commitment, and can make your wedding an even more enjoyable day.

 

f you've found the person you want to spend the rest of your life with, why wait?

 

Actually, it is like that in some cases. My girlfriend and I intend to get married once we're both done school.

 

...

 

It's a recent decision, but one we both feel comfortable with.

 

If your decision is a serious one you're going to follow through on, then the best of luck to you.

 

Teenagers are just as capable as knowing love as people who are 20+.

 

I agree, though their brains have not fully developed yet, especially in areas related to long-term thinking. No, I'm not prejudiced about it, that's a simple biological fact.

 

If you want to smoke, I say fine. {snip}

 

That was an example. My point is how is the fact that some things are personal choices matter?

 

Sex is as natural as breathing. {snip}

 

Doesn't explain why some people would decide against it, but again, what is so wonderful about the fact that it's natural? Deoderant isn't natural, for example.

 

belting it once is perfectly acceptable

 

Debatable, but for a different topic.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

You're right, marriage is not the epitome of love. Marriage is an act of love, not a state of love. The epitome of love is the love of God, but let's not make this a religious thing.

It can be an act of love.

 

I'm sorry, but child abuse is a personal choice. A child has no say in whether you beat them or not. You decide to do it. It's your choice.

If you're comparing the "personal" choice that is child abuse with the personal choice that is having sex... you're not doing it right. You're also neglecting the matter of legality and what what the other person feels. Beating the **** out of a someone makes them feel... bloodied and abused and is also illegal-making love to someone (should) make them feel good, and it is also perfectly legal.

 

This whole personal choice thing is kind of going off topic though...

[The Doctor]

It can be an act of love.

Poor wording on my part. My apologies.

 

~~~

 

If you're comparing the "personal" choice that is child abuse with the personal choice that is having sex... you're not doing it right. You're also neglecting the matter of legality and what what the other person feels. Beating the **** out of a someone makes them feel... bloodied and abused and is also illegal-making love to someone (should) make them feel good, and it is also perfectly legal.

I was actually comparing the personal choice to commit the act, ignoring the legalities. I wasn't saying that they were on the same level. Not by a long shot. I was merely contradicting the statement that

Hitting children is not a personal choice, because it involves another person (the child).

As far as I know, sex also involves another person. So by this individual's logic, sex isn't a personal choice either, which pretty much contradicts his own argument. Most likely poor wording on his part, but something I felt compelled to argue, just in case.

 

~~~

 

This whole personal choice thing is kind of going off topic though...

Actually, it's not, really. That's really what Abstinence boils down to. I can almost garauntee you that nothing I say will convince you to refrain from participating in pre-marital sex, correct? It's your... wait for it... personal choice.

 

EDIT: That last bit wasn't mean to sound condescending, I assure you. Reading it again myself, it kind of comes across that way, doesn't it? It wasn't supposed to.

[Samnmax221]

As far as I know, sex also involves another person. So by this individual's logic, sex isn't a personal choice either, which pretty much contradicts his own argument.

If the other person wants to ****, then it's perfectly alright. We're not talking about forcing yourself on anybody, we're talking about two (or the more the merrier) engaging in a consenting act.

[milo]

I'm with the Doctor on this one.

 

Pre-marital sex with someone you've just met and will most likely not see again in your life (some people refer to this situation as a 'one night stand') is stupid. Casual, meaningless sex is for monkeys, squirrels, and the like.

QFE. I'm not for abstinence, but getting wasted Saturday night and ****ing 5 different people is just stupid.

 

I'm not going to wait for marriage to have sex, but that doesn't mean I'll do it with just anybody. I want to wait to do that with my girlfriend, or fiancee. Just in case that person does get pregnant, I'd want to be sure that it's someone I'd want to be with.

 

 

It increases chances of STDs when people have it with one than one partner

So do it with a virgin.

 

causes teen pregnancy

Hey, if you use a condom + the pill/sponge/whatever, chances of pregnancy are very slim.

 

and can take away a very happy memory on wedding day.

Your first time actually isn't all that great. More like awkward and even painful sometimes. Why not practice a bit before you're married? Then your honeymoon could ****-tacular.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

I was actually comparing the personal choice to commit the act, ignoring the legalities. I wasn't saying that they were on the same level. Not by a long shot. I was merely contradicting the statement that As far as I know, sex also involves another person. So by this individual's logic, sex isn't a personal choice either, which pretty much contradicts his own argument. Most likely poor wording on his part, but something I felt compelled to argue, just in case.

 

~~~

 

 

Actually, it's not, really. That's really what Abstinence boils down to. I can almost garauntee you that nothing I say will convince you to refrain from participating in pre-marital sex, correct? It's your... wait for it... personal choice.

 

EDIT: That last bit wasn't mean to sound condescending, I assure you. Reading it again myself, it kind of comes across that way, doesn't it? It wasn't supposed to.

I edited another of my posts to address the child abuse/personal choice thing. As for the personal choice thing being off-topic, I was referring to the whole bit about child abuse and smoking and whatever else.

[The Doctor]

So do it with a virgin.

Just because you're a virgin doesn't mean you don't have an STD. Some STDs are passed down through genetics.

 

Your first time actually isn't all that great. More like awkward and even painful sometimes. Why not practice a bit before you're married? Then your honeymoon could ****-tacular.

****-tacular. That's awsome.

 

As for the personal choice thing being off-topic, I was referring to the whole bit about child abuse and smoking and whatever else.

Ah. Then you're right, that little bit is a little off topic, yes.

[milo]

Sex is as natural as breathing. Since breathing can be very dangerous - such as when a chemical is in the air - does that mean that we should refrain from breathing?

Lawl. Yeah, sex is natural. So are hairy legs, armpits, and genitals, but that doesn't turn me on. My dog took a **** in the front yard today. That's natural. Why do we use indoor plumbing? Why not do what's natural? Why do we wear clothes? Why do we eat food that has been prepared unnaturally? Why not eat raw meat? That's natural.

 

Just because something is "natural", doesn't necessarily mean it's something you ought to do.

Just because you're a virgin doesn't mean you don't have an STD. Some STDs are passed down through genetics.

I didn't know that. You learn something new every day.

 

****-tacular. That's awsome.

Thankyaveramuch. [/Elvis]