Kreia handmaiden's mother?

[Manny C]

There is nothing in the game to either negate or confirm it, meaning that at this point it's entirely up to the discretion of the writer. If in the next game they decided to make it either one way or the other, there would be no consistency error.

 

Personally I dont think it was intended. If it were the case, I don't think Kreia would exhibit such indifference/dismissal of Brianna. If you think about it from Kreia's perspective, especially moments before her death, you'd think she might want to reveal the truth, as there isnt any point in concealing it anymore.

 

At the end of the day I don't think it matters much, it doesnt change anything.

[Corinthian]

No, Devon. More like "You'll do it, because I'm your mother and I know what's best for you, young lady." Then Brianna would be like "But moooooom" and Kreia would be like "No buts, now go do it." And then we'd have an episode where Kreia starts dating again and gets married to the Exile, but Brianna hates him because he's not her real Dad, and then she gets a crush on him...

[Sir Vougalot]

In all the times I've played this game I've never seen those conversations you posted in your videos, Shem. I take it from the comments that these take place if you are doing poorly at becoming closer with Brianna? I've never been unsuccessful so I wouldn't know.

 

Anyway, I have always really liked the idea that Kreia is Arren Kae, but as the story in the comic books progresses I find it far more likely that Krynda Draay will become Darth Traya, i.e Kreia.

[jinger]

I don't see the resemblance between Brianna and Kreia. No freaking way.

Right. None at all...

Boy! XD look what I've found. I made that piccy, ages ago, and I still think they look alike. But now I've made more than that I made a video on youtube with the most significant hints from the game.

 

[TKA-001]

The idea of Kreia being Handmaiden's mom is second-place on my list of things that I'm very glad never made it into the final game (the first being that Darth Nihilus is the Exile's evil half).

[jinger]

the first being that Darth Nihilus is the Exile's evil half

Just out of curiosity, who said that? Cos it obviously defies what little we know about Nihilus. That he's a man, for one, and the Exile is a woman.

[Sir Vougalot]

And we know that Nihilus is also a ghost encased in his armor, which he attached his consciousness to once his hunger had consumed his body, according to The Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide. Not that that's much better than the evil half theory, though (which, by the way, I am certain originated with a poster here and was not something Obsidian planned to use in the story).

 

And we now know that Kreia is not Krynda Draay, since the latter has died in the comics. Clever how the writers messed with our minds on that one, though!

[jinger]

They're messing alright, they're making a mess. The Campaign Guide claims that his physical body is no more, but promo arts for TSL show a human body beneath his robe (an arm) while he's fighting Atris, and now Hasbro even says Nihilus wears dreadlocks under his hood^^"

 

I never bought the Krynda theory, but for that matter I'm pretty sure they won't let Kreia be Arren Kae either. They're making a habit out of denying theories such as this with their latest works, for the sake of plot twists. I hope they'll never get to that, and let Kreia's origins remain a mystery. Fortunately, while the Campaign Guide seemingly does speak of Kreia as if that was her name, it does not mention her early life, and it does not mention Arren Kae, thus leaving an opening.

[Giant Graffiti]

And we now know that Kreia is not Krynda Draay, since the latter has died in the comics. Clever how the writers messed with our minds on that one, though!

"I thought you had died in the Mandalorian Wars..."

 

Although I really don't submit to either theory. Kreia is Kreia.

[Sir Vougalot]

That's a very early promotional image you're referring to, Jinger. It can't be considered canonical mainly because that sparring match never took place, and the game doesn't even give us any evidence that Atris even knows of Nihilus' existence. Both of his hands and arms are completely covered up in the game, which is the final authoritative canonical depiction.

[luckyariot]

Also keep in mind that the Campain Guide refers to Atris as Darth Traya, which obviously never made it into the final game. Unlike the cuts, however, this seems to have been put there to be interntionally ambiguous. I rather liked the idea of Arren Kae being a seperate person, because there is no build up towards any type of Reveal, but then again, this is all subtext anyway... Who knows.

[luminara.unduli]

I know this thread is old but i think this is something none of you have mentioned. if you have then i didnt see so soz.

 

kreia in tsl is actually 50 years old according to wookieepedia. that means because handmaiden was 25 at the same time, that means kriea would have been 25 during birth. of course the use of darkside makes you look considerably older, and being headmistress at the sith acadamy means that she dealt out the punishments. most likely a dose of force lightening or choke or even scream to put the student back into their place. people were sent to detention room for the slightest things like not killing 10 enemy's fast enough so she would have overused it.

 

p.s. only most serious crimes kreia would have dealt out.

:) hope ihelped

[comkiller]

Sure they look alike, take away kreia's hood and wrinkles and they loo exactly the same. same half :¬: half look

 

I also notice a loop with Shem making the same argument over again with no new proof, actually no proof WHATSOEVER, and then most everyone else shows him proof that his theories aren't necessarily right.

 

also I think you were reading the http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/301/notwistshkv7.jpg to literally. IMO at least it was saying that there is no "Luke, I am you father" moment about why the exile is chosen instead of any other Jedi and that the exile isn't set aside for a reason that wasn't flat out directly stated in the first 10 minutes of the game, not anything to do with anyone's parentage.

 

and even if it DID refer to parentage, there wouldn't be a moment like that, it would seem cliche to harken back to that classic moment when so much else about the game refers back to the original trilogy and quotes it on numerous occasions. It would of ruined the story and those moments of nostalgia if Kreia actually came up and said "Brianna, I, am your mother" a few scenes is fine like finding the recording of the exiles trial when Kreia quotes obi-wan, but actually using that up front would make it feel more than a little silly

[SkyWoulf]

i think one big question we need to ask ourselves here is, who cares? Even if the information the game gives is ambiguous enough to justify that kreia is handmaiden's daughter, the fact is that it doesn't affect the story. ]

 

 

Kreia? Handmadien's daughter? i would like to know when she gave birth! lol

[DeathScepter]

personally I don't think that Kreia is Kae but canon can go either way.

[ANGLVD3TH]

I think a big issue in this argument is that many of the skeptics assume that all arguments for it are arguing it's proof, when supporters have been, IIRC, the only ones to specifically state that it is impossible to tell one way or the other. Personally, there is far too much of a "no coincidence" theme in all o Star Wars. A side point, the fact that a major controversy has arisen over interpretation of a mysterious character tells me the writers are doing it right. Some of the best parts of fiction are figuring out the hidden meanings and reading between the lines. Some of my favorite video game plots are when you see two different interpretations of the same story, especially if you figure out things by putting the two halves together. Today the convention has become that one must force feed the story because we need to market to the dumbest common denominator, this feels like a nice refresher. And as for those arguing "well female is cannon and you don't get the dialog as female soo....", cannon also has both gender exclusive party members along for the ride. And its irrelevant in any case, it doesn't disprove the theory, just makes it less likely. In the end, supporters have much circumstantial evidence, and the only evidence against is Kreia's word....

[90SK]

The idea of Kreia being Handmaiden's mom is second-place on my list of things that I'm very glad never made it into the final game (the first being that Darth Nihilus is the Exile's evil half).

 

Just out of curiosity, who said that? Cos it obviously defies what little we know about Nihilus. That he's a man, for one, and the Exile is a woman.

 

This was described by Chris Avellone of KotOR II developer fame, he described the Exile as being a force wound resulting from the mandalorian wars and the destruction at Malachor, and he describes Nihilus as being a similar beast, with the same background of being a result of and deriving power from the Malachor cataclysm primarily. Nihilus is defeated when he attempts to drain the Exile but his power rebounds because it is like he is draining himself because the Exile is like a light side version of what Nihilus is (or a converse if the Exile PC is darkside).

 

The concept isn't really in the game aside from the part where Nihilus can't drain the exile and gets weakened, which I suppose happens regardless of alignment or gender, though neither of those play a difference with this idea anyway from a canonical point of view.

 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Nihilus @Behind the scenes

 

 

My take on it is that Nihilus found ways of feeding on the force disruption at Malachor that allowed him to develop his technique of force drain that made him so powerful. The Exile's severed force connection resulted from the battle of Malachor IV, so the connection is clear there.

 

Nihilus is able to track force sensitives in a way that relates to jedi whose connections have not been severed in the same sense as the Exile. Seeing as Nihilus is a sith master capable of incredible power, we can assume that his knowledge would make him understand the nature of the Exile or not, in this case apparently not hence why we have more of a shadowy perspective of him in game, whereas Sion takes a more personal and intensive method of searching, going to Peragus and Korriban and even meeting the Exile head on outside the Trayus core.

 

 

I daresay personal conon is useful here, I like to believe everything I like about KotOR II and its unfolding story by the hands of both the developers original plans and also the restored areas of content that expand and fill out the game. From a strictly canonoical perspective, the characters of KotOR II and the details of their exploits are about as infamous as the actual conflict represented by the game in the Star Wars timeline. We do not hear much about them because they are connected to a shadow war waged on the Jedi specifically, while the republic was still experiencing fallout from the Revan/Malak Sith crisis which we also see ultimately absorbed by the Sith Emperor's War two hundred years later...

[Darth Avlectus]

All this talk about mothers is getting me "excited". I'm having a hard time keeping my "excitement" contained.

[Xinaith]

I've put a bit of time into researching this, After a while I came up with was basically this.

Kreia was a Jedi Master until she was exiled at a young age for an affair with a corellian official who she was protecting. After she was exiled she turned to the dark side having became obsessed with Sith Alchemy. After becoming accepted into the Sith Order she had the baby which was discovered by the current Dark Lord. (His name escapes me) He examined the child, handmaiden and sensed a strong force of light in her and due to kreia's extravagant power she was allowed to send the child away. She then became the Dark Lord's apprentice. Everything after that is unrecorded until the events of Kotor 2.

[Lord Foley]

Kreia? That is not her name.

You know who I am, but you will be unable to voice it, to remember it.

And she doesn't mean her identity as Darth Traya, because Mical explicitly states that he recognizes her in spite of the dark side:

I know you - not even the markings of the dark side can hide it.

The council conveniently doesn't call her Kreia, though they recognize her and think she died in the Mandalorian wars.Brianne noticeably mentions that the body was never recovered. Kreia knows all about Arren Kae. Both are Revan's first master. Both are exiles. Kae + Traya= ??? profit.

 

Honestly, the alternate theory is that Mical and Atris recognize some other secret identity she had? That the body never being found and the name Kreia being spoken by no one that knew her from before are coincidences? That Revan had two first masters and two final masters? That the Handmaidens' saying betrayal runs in Brianne's blood and the whole Darth Traya thing just kind of coincide?

 

It doesn't matter that they don't specifically say she is Kae. They explicitly state that she is NOT Kreia.

[DeathScepter]

I've put a bit of time into researching this, After a while I came up with was basically this.

Kreia was a Jedi Master until she was exiled at a young age for an affair with a corellian official who she was protecting. After she was exiled she turned to the dark side having became obsessed with Sith Alchemy. After becoming accepted into the Sith Order she had the baby which was discovered by the current Dark Lord. (His name escapes me) He examined the child, handmaiden and sensed a strong force of light in her and due to kreia's extravagant power she was allowed to send the child away. She then became the Dark Lord's apprentice. Everything after that is unrecorded until the events of Kotor 2.

 

sources please. another thing, The only Jedi Master that had any affair was Arren Kae and she slept with Yusani an Echani general. Arren Kae was a loyal follower of Revan during and after her time as a Jedi. Kreia is a virtual unknown that could or could not be Arren Kae. But it is known that Kreia is a prideful woman. So her claiming to be Revan's first master is not out of character. It is possible that Kreia was Revan's true first master.

[starwarzchick112]

Hi DeathScepter! It's me, RogueLeader, from the KFM forums. I go by my Youtube username here. And I do think that Kreia is Arren Kae.

[DeathScepter]

hi RogueLeader, I am siding on cautious that Kreia/Arren Kae debate and saying they are NOT the same person. Until it is canon that Kreia is Arren Kae, I am still thinking that they are two different people.

[Blix]

Yes I have had suspicions that Kreia is in fact Arren Kae, but you know Chris Avellone so...

[TKA-001]

Regarding Kae's disappearing body... Yeah, my "personal interpretation" is that it got pulverized into jelly by the Mass Shadow Generator. Like the millions of others killed by it.