Should Revan be tried/executed by the Republic?

[mjpb3]

you know, this reminds me of a part in tsl when you talk to Atton about his past. one part of the converstaion goes like this:

 

Atton: "What makes you think you've got the right to interrogate me on anything? You've got plenty of lives to answer for - all you Jedi do."

 

one of the dialogue choices for the exile is: "My power gives me the right."

 

do you believe this? does power give you the right to do anything? no, it doesn't. Revan is a murderer. does he/she deserve mercy because he/she is powerful? no.

 

I've never responded to that dialog that way, so I can't answer that particular query.

 

But, I can say that what I meant by what I wrote is this: why would you consider killing off a powerful force user who, if you play the lightside, has the potential of helping out so many?

 

I repeat, what Revan did was wrong to the infinite power, but she has a chance to redeem her past mistakes and help out the galaxy in such a significant way, why would anyone want her dead? What purpose, other than revenge, would that serve? Justice? No, justice would have been Malak's attack on Revan actually succeeding in her death. But Malak bungled that and Revan lived.

 

What path you choose for Revan is yours to choose. I chose lightside, so I say that the Republic turning around and putting Revan to death after she saved the galaxy is a big mistake.

 

Repeat again, but EVERY force-sensitive and force user in the galaxy has the possibility to turn to the darkside. If the Republic is given the power to ever start executing fallen Jedi, especially after they have returned to the lightside and gone on to help the Republic in some way, then that is highly hypocritical and wrong. It would be a great catalyst for the Jedi Council to begin suggesting that Jedi not help the Republic at all. Next time they can save their own sorry butts.

 

All of this is my own opinion, of course...

[Jediphile]

No, we don't actually know whether the republic kills criminals or not, but i think that it's very possible, especially since there are a lot of mass murderers in Star Wars. in my opinion it's safe to assume there's a kind of death penalty there.

 

So there are mass murderers, so what? I don't think that in any way speaks to whether there is a death penalty in the Republic or not. There could be, but I doubt it has much to do with how bad the criminals are.

 

the problem that i have with this statement is that i think you seem to be saying that Revan saves billions, and then promptly kills billions of people, so in other words, he/she kind of "breaks even" and everything is alright. this is not the case. saving a person is not an excuse for suddenly turning around and shooting them. even though Revan did save a substansial amount of people, it cannot, does not excuse you from killing them.

 

Agreed, but I don't think that is what The Architect was saying. To me he is just saying that while Revan did do evil things, he also did good that you cannot merely dismiss.

 

you know, this reminds me of a part in tsl when you talk to Atton about his past. one part of the converstaion goes like this:

 

Atton: "What makes you think you've got the right to interrogate me on anything? You've got plenty of lives to answer for - all you Jedi do."

 

one of the dialogue choices for the exile is: "My power gives me the right."

 

do you believe this? does power give you the right to do anything? no, it doesn't. Revan is a murderer. does he/she deserve mercy because he/she is powerful? no.

 

Agreed. I might want to allow Revan redemption, but what power or force-connection he might have doesn't matter. It is a non-factor. His acts, his state of mind, his intentions, his motives, his accountability, and what circumstances may or may not have forced his hand are what matters. The rest doesn't. Might is NOT right!

 

in my opinion, executing stops if your kill count is under 1,000,000

 

"How may does it take before it becomes wrong?"

 

I guess Picard finally has his answer

 

. no seriously, if a fallen jedi kills that many people, do they still deserve to get redeemed? i don't think so.

 

No, I agree with the LS exile, when he tells Kreia that nobody is beyond redemption. Vader probably killed more in his time (and he killed children - yuck!), yet he was still redeemed in the end.

 

How can I accept that? Well, apart from the fact that I insist on believing in the possibilty of rehabilitation (which is just another word for redemption in this context), there is also a coldly logical aspect to it - if someone evil cannot be redeemed beyond a certain point, then it means that there is nothing to appeal to, because that person knows that you will condemn him no matter what. If that's true for Revan, then why bother saving the Republic, defeating Malak or destroying the StarForge? If you see it that way, then Revan really might just as well go for the dark side, since the LS is no longer possible. I would refuse to believe that.

 

look, i know i sound like i'm coming across as a stone cold jerk that thinks that anyone that does something wrong doesn't deserve redemtion. i'm not like that, or at least i like to think i'm not lol. but taking this seriously, does Revan really deserve redemtion?

 

Yes, but not just for his own sake. The galaxy will fall if Revan does not save it, and the galaxy deserves that. Must we kill those who have erred in the past to move on? I don't think so. Because if we must, then we're really killing them for our own peace of mind and not for whatever crimes they committed. That means we'll condemn because we cannot tolerate them in our society, which is also not justice. Oh sure, we can wrap it up whatever nice, convenient euphemism we care to about how some crimes are so severe they deserve capital punishment, but I'll always feel that society is then punishing them accused because of how we feel about him or her rather than because of what he or she has done.

 

he/she killed billions of people. in my humble opinion, a lot of people seem to be tossing the number "billion" around as if it were a statistic. numbers tend to really give you that kind of feeling. but Revan killing billions of people is NOT a statistic. (caps used for emphasis, not to hurt anyone's feelings) you cannot toss around the number billion like just a number. i know it's hard, because nothing here is real, and these are (virtual) people that died. of course this is all just a videogame, but the point is that we're pretending that this really happened, and the question is, what would you do? i just don't feel like Revan deserved redemption. okay, that's all. sorry if anyone got offended, i'm not saying anyone is assuming billion is just a statistic, i'm just making sure.

 

It's not only about what Revan deserves. The Republic also deserves to see that it IS possible to come back from such severe crimes and atone for your misdeeds. That doesn't mean that Revan gets to "break even" - after all, wrong is wrong. But if Revan is condemned on the basis of being beyond redemption, then isn't it really because those left behind are so filled with sorrow and anger that they demand vengeance even as they call out for justice? And if that's the case, isn't that the non-jedi version of falling to the dark side? And if they have fallen to their baser emotions, then how can they blame Revan for doing the same?

[SilentScope001]

Revan fell to the LightSide in Canon, at the end of K1.

 

But he now has gained more memories within the 5 years from the end of K1 to the begining of K2. It is these memories that had him flee the Republic to the Unknown Regions.

 

I think it was not Revan's personality that fell to the Lightside and redeemed Malak, but rather the reprogrammed self of Revan. That self has been destroyed once Revan regains all his memories. Therefore, you cannot use the "I redeemed myself!" argument in my eyes. In the Republic and in the Jedi's eyes? Sure, you can! Republic so weak it has to accept redemeption and the Jedi loves redemeption because it is a betrayal of the self and an acknowleding of their ideas being correct. What about the Common person? They'll be very screaming and forming lynch mobs...but they will never have any say in politics.

 

Is it messed up for a LightSider Revan to be betrayed by the Republic? Sure, which would have been a great way of disposing Revan in TSL rather than send him off in the Unknown Regions to fight the whole True Sith kaffule. Set the stage of Revan getting betrayed by the Republic, and the game mood suddenly changes. It would become much more darker. Prehaps, at the end of the game, you learn why Revan did all of this (finally revealing about the True Sith), and then Exile gets in his Ebon Hawk, and search for Revan's prison, to free him and prepare for a new war...

 

How can I accept that? Well, apart from the fact that I insist on believing in the possibilty of rehabilitation (which is just another word for redemption in this context), there is also a coldly logical aspect to it - if someone evil cannot be redeemed beyond a certain point, then it means that there is nothing to appeal to, because that person knows that you will condemn him no matter what. If that's true for Revan, then why bother saving the Republic, defeating Malak or destroying the StarForge? If you see it that way, then Revan really might just as well go for the dark side, since the LS is no longer possible. I would refuse to believe that.

 

Well, I agree with Kreia that redemeption is a betrayal of the self...but then you pose the question why would Revan want to save the Republic?

 

He's doing it as a scarfice. He's not going to want to redeem himself in the eyes of people, he can't do that at all. He's going to die. But will he redeem himself in the eyes of his party? In the eye of Mission and Carth, in whom Revan indirectly destroyed both their planets through the formation of the Sith Empire? Will he redeem himself in the eyes of...himself? If he does, like how Bao-Dur redeemed himself, then Revan has done something great.

 

The LS is possible, but nobody will care for what you do, and nobody will parade you or love you. That doesn't mean you should fall to the DS. Instead, it means you must still remain on the LS, if only to please your own soul, and to still note that you need to do good deeds. Forget redemeption in this case, a good deed is still a good deed. Revan won't get any penance for killing Malak and blowing up the Star Forge, but he did kill Malak and blew up the Star Forge. That is a LS action in and of itself, and nobody has to go and say, "Here's a medal!" to prove it.

 

...And, even though it might detract from my point, there is the Corellian religion of Heaven (the Netherlands of the Force) and Hell (Chaos). Revan is doing all this, maybe, to go to Heaven, a place that is far better?

[Jediphile]

^^

 

I agree that Revan did because it was the right thing to do. I doubt that redemption in the eyes of the Republic was a consideration. It certainly wasn't for me, when I played Revan.

 

I think the same is the case when Revan leaves for the unknown regions. Somehow reading the above, I almost get the impression that Revan might have fled the republic because remembering his past condemns him, since it makes him Darth Revan again. If so, then I don't agree. I think Revan just remembers the danger of the true Sith and that's it. If he is the hero I played, then that would be enough reason to go and confront them. I don't see him reverting to his evil self simply because he remembers or fleeing the republic because he might be held accountable for past misdeeds that he now remembers, because to me he already faced the music on that.

[SilentScope001]

I think the same is the case when Revan leaves for the unknown regions. Somehow reading the above, I almost get the impression that Revan might have fled the republic because remembering his past condemns him, since it makes him Darth Revan again. If so, then I don't agree. I think Revan just remembers the danger of the true Sith and that's it. If he is the hero I played, then that would be enough reason to go and confront them. I don't see him reverting to his evil self simply because he remembers or fleeing the republic because he might be held accountable for past misdeeds that he now remembers, because to me he already faced the music on that.

 

Well, true, Revan is your character.

 

But you do remember about the True Sith and why Revan (previous self) fought against him. That could condemn him, as it could affect his self and what he did [Revan's remembering of the True Sith did drive him into the Unknown Regions, after all]. Since you contorl Revan, you decide if this is true or not. I'm not saying Revan fled the Unknown Regions to escape the lynch mob once he decides what to do, I think Revan became his old self and then went into the Unknown Regions to finish off the True Sith.

 

Wiping out the Old Revan Self may in fact be necessary, in the True Sith Civil War storylines that have been written, Revan fell to the DS, and amass a huge army to attack the Republic...AGAIN. I think that the Jedi Council would want to grab Revan and throw him at the execution's block to prevent "Jedi Civil War II", which may be sure to happen.

 

"Facing the music"? Referring to the memory wipe of Revan? Almost forgot of that, which is quite intersting. If Revan lost all his memory, then that could be an argument against execution. He's already executed. Some parts of his memory remain, but then Revan could argue that he doesn't exactly remember everything, and most of his new, re-programmed self remains. Doubt if that argument is true, but it will be one that the Jedi Council and Republic might accept. It might depend on what memories Revan has. If Revan remembered talking to Exile about her good looks, that is an innocent memory. If Revan remembered plotting about how to get rid of Exile or parade him as a trophy by placing her at the command of the fleet on Malachor V, right after Exile leaves, that is a guilty memory.

[Jediphile]

But you do remember about the True Sith and why Revan (previous self) fought against him. That could condemn him, as it could affect his self and what he did [Revan's remembering of the True Sith did drive him into the Unknown Regions, after all]. Since you contorl Revan, you decide if this is true or not. I'm not saying Revan fled the Unknown Regions to escape the lynch mob once he decides what to do, I think Revan became his old self and then went into the Unknown Regions to finish off the True Sith.

 

Wiping out the Old Revan Self may in fact be necessary, in the True Sith Civil

War storylines that have been written, Revan fell to the DS, and amass a huge army to attack the Republic...AGAIN. I think that the Jedi Council would want to grab Revan and throw him at the execution's block to prevent "Jedi Civil War II", which may be sure to happen.

 

Well, I don't see if that way. I'd compare Revan to another fictional character with amnesia - Jason Bourne. There are differences between the two, since Bourne subconsciously chooses amnesia because he cannot bear the guilt of his deeds any longer while Revan has it forced upon him either by chance or by the council, but otherwise I find the two character similar. Revan slowly begins to remember things from his past even in K1. Bourne does too, and by the end of "The Bourne Identify" he remembers quite a bit about his past. Does that mean Bourne is a guilty murderer now? I don't think so, because he was already resolved to be a different person. That he remembers more and more doesn't matter, because it's not that much different than if someone had given him a video-tape of his life or simply just told him all the bad things he did. In "The Bourne Supremacy" he begins to remember more, and by the end he goes to Moscow to confess the murder of a politician and his wife to their surviving daughter. He accepts responsibility and admits it. Does this mean he should now be condemned? I don't think so, because even though he remembers, the person who now admits to the deed and regrets it is not the same person who committed it in the first place. It's a different person looking back on those deeds with horror and disgust.

 

Of course, whether the same is true for Revan or not is for the player to decice, but it was true for my Revan, in which case remembering all the bad things Revan did would not condemn him. Indeed, it would be punishment in itself to be an ethical person and yet have to accept that you did all these terrible things in the past.

 

"Facing the music"? Referring to the memory wipe of Revan?

 

Actually, I was referring more to the LS ending of K1 with cheering crowds as Vandar speaks of "the redemption of Revan, the prodigal knight". I sure didn't get the impression from the scene that there was a lynch mob out to kill Revan for his past deeds.

 

Almost forgot of that, which is quite intersting. If Revan lost all his memory, then that could be an argument against execution. He's already executed. Some parts of his memory remain, but then Revan could argue that he doesn't exactly remember everything, and most of his new, re-programmed self remains. Doubt if that argument is true, but it will be one that the Jedi Council and Republic might accept. It might depend on what memories Revan has. If Revan remembered talking to Exile about her good looks, that is an innocent memory. If Revan remembered plotting about how to get rid of Exile or parade him as a trophy by placing her at the command of the fleet on Malachor V, right after Exile leaves, that is a guilty memory.

 

I don't think memories are "good" or "evil". They're just memories, another form of knowledge. I don't think that getting them back would necessarily condemn a person, because that would require that memories dictate who you are, and I don't believe that. It is your disposition and your convictions that determine who you are. Even if LS Revan got all his memories back, that would just remind him of all his past deeds, and being a good person, that would bear its own punishment, because he would be forced to see what he has done. I'm sure Ulic would have welcomed forgotting that he killed his brother, but it is precisely because he does and remembers that he sees the errors of his ways and can be redeemed.

[SilentScope001]

It's a different person looking back on those deeds with horror and disgust.

 

Problem is, well, he was accountable.

 

I may be sorry for the crime I have committed. But that means I still committed the crime. The thing is, I'm worried of the fact that if Revan is allowed to get off scot-free for his crime, then we get to see thousands amongst thousands of Sith Lords, just before they get killed by the Jedi, banging their heads against the wall to lose their memory. Then the Jedi would not want to kill the Sith Lord and the Sith Lord can live. Indeed, the Sith Lord may end up being a different "person" and may be programmed to be replused by his actions of his former self, but the Sith Lord got off free for his crime. If we don't punish Revan, then who CAN we punish?

 

However, I guess this is a problem with Star Wars in general, especially with David Brin. All you have to do is say, "I'm sorry" and you are off the hook and are redeemed with no punishment. Somehow, that doesn't seem to be right, as it disrespect the lives of the people the Sith Lord harmed, and it provides an impetus for other people to commit the crime. "Okay, so I'll fall to the Dark Side. So what? If I lose, I'll admit I am wrong and then I will live."

 

It lacks teh deterrence effect and...isn't fun.

 

Actually, I was referring more to the LS ending of K1 with cheering crowds as Vandar speaks of "the redemption of Revan, the prodigal knight". I sure didn't get the impression from the scene that there was a lynch mob out to kill Revan for his past deeds.

 

He did? I thought Vandar didn't name Revan at all, just gave the person the medal to cover up the whole Revan's Mindwipe.

 

The Republic and the Jedi Council are the ones in power. They decide what happened to Revan and they chose him to live. Heh, even I would choose him to live, only because he is a good resource and a tool, and he wants to redeem himself. But at least keep some tabs on this Revan, he might flip out again!

 

I don't think memories are "good" or "evil". They're just memories, another form of knowledge. I don't think that getting them back would necessarily condemn a person, because that would require that memories dictate who you are, and I don't believe that. It is your disposition and your convictions that determine who you are. Even if LS Revan got all his memories back, that would just remind him of all his past deeds, and being a good person, that would bear its own punishment, because he would be forced to see what he has done. I'm sure Ulic would have welcomed forgotting that he killed his brother, but it is precisely because he does and remembers that he sees the errors of his ways and can be redeemed.

 

Well, I used Locke's definition because it made sense as for defining who is 'a person'. A person is someone who has the same memory. So, if Revan (post-wipe) does not have the memories of Revan (pre-wipe) then they are not the same person. Then again, maybe you use David Hume's idea of a "person" being a bundle of sensations, in which case, well, he's right too. The sensastions have been modified, thanks to the brainwashing/re-education of Revan. Revan has new sensastions, that of memory, but the previous sensastions of Revan, that of the Jedi properganda machine, still remains and taints Revan's preception of that memory. Therefore, Revan (pre-wipe) is not the same as Revan (post-wipe), even with the same memories.

 

Alright, if we can verify Revan really does have different sensations (which I believe we can't), I will agree. Revan should not be tried/executed by the Republic because of him being a different Person (altough, I would still be open to the idea of the deterrence effect). I still want the guy watched though, just in case he does flip and fall back to the Dark Side. A bit of paranoia never hurts anyone.

[Nancy Allen``]

Hmm, should Bastila be held accountable for the deaths she caused when falling to the Dark Side? What about Juhani? How about Canderous for fighting in the Mandalorian wars? Should Jolee have been punished for not killing his wife when he had the chance? The Jedi's answer was he learnt his lesson the hard way. Maybe the same can be said for Revan.

[SilentScope001]

Hmm, should Bastila be held accountable for the deaths she caused when falling to the Dark Side? What about Juhani? How about Canderous for fighting in the Mandalorian wars? Should Jolee have been punished for not killing his wife when he had the chance? The Jedi's answer was he learnt his lesson the hard way. Maybe the same can be said for Revan.

 

The Jedi would say that to everyone but Canderous. Canderous shows regret, and promised to leave his life of violence, but then reverted, and ends up leading a clan that glorifies violence in a Sith-like manner. So, Canderous is cursed for his crime, while everyone else is okay and have no sin...all because everyone else admitted they are wrong, and Canderous would not do such a thing.

 

Kinda of like how Satan fell from God's eyes in my Holy Book. Satan knew what he was doing was wrong, but still had convictions that He was better than the feeble Human race that God placed and honored, and that he would not demean himself and his ideas. Satan was a great follower of God, but Satan declared war on God because God told him to bow down to a Human.

[EnIgmA_XX]

So there are mass murderers, so what? I don't think that in any way speaks to whether there is a death penalty in the Republic or not. There could be, but I doubt it has much to do with how bad the criminals are.

 

i dunno, i know that my assumption is heavily unfounded, but every civil society we know of has had the death penalty at some point, and many still do. i think that it's a fair enough assumption to make that the republic has had the death penalty at some point in time, though not necesarily in the KOTOR era.

 

No, I agree with the LS exile, when he tells Kreia that nobody is beyond redemption.

 

How can I accept that? Well, apart from the fact that I insist on believing in the possibilty of rehabilitation (which is just another word for redemption in this context), there is also a coldly logical aspect to it - if someone evil cannot be redeemed beyond a certain point, then it means that there is nothing to appeal to, because that person knows that you will condemn him no matter what.

 

Yes, but not just for his own sake. The galaxy will fall if Revan does not save it, and the galaxy deserves that.

 

It's not only about what Revan deserves. The Republic also deserves to see that it IS possible to come back from such severe crimes and atone for your misdeeds.

 

I agree with all of these statements. it is hard to be redeemed for extreme cases, but there should usually, if not always be some kind of way, though i'm not completely sure if this applies to mass murderers. i also agree that the republic needs Revan. i'm not 100% sure that it will fall apart like a piece of tissue paper if Revan's not there, but they could definitely use him/her. despite this, though, i'd still have to say that it should not mean that Revan should live. as said earlier, power should not give you any rights or previlages. if a weak version of Revan is sentenced to death (hypothetically), then a powerful version of Revan deserves the same sentence. finally, though, yeah i do agree that the Republic does deserve to see that redemption is possible, though for such severe cases? i don't know.

 

Must we kill those who have erred in the past to move on? I don't think so. Because if we must, then we're really killing them for our own peace of mind and not for whatever crimes they committed. That means we'll condemn because we cannot tolerate them in our society, which is also not justice. Oh sure, we can wrap it up whatever nice, convenient euphemism we care to about how some crimes are so severe they deserve capital punishment, but I'll always feel that society is then punishing them accused because of how we feel about him or her rather than because of what he or she has done.

 

But if Revan is condemned on the basis of being beyond redemption, then isn't it really because those left behind are so filled with sorrow and anger that they demand vengeance even as they call out for justice? And if that's the case, isn't that the non-jedi version of falling to the dark side? And if they have fallen to their baser emotions, then how can they blame Revan for doing the same?

 

i have to say that i disagree with these statements. what SilentScope001 said is true:

 

However, I guess this is a problem with Star Wars in general, especially with David Brin. All you have to do is say, "I'm sorry" and you are off the hook and are redeemed with no punishment. Somehow, that doesn't seem to be right, as it disrespect the lives of the people the Sith Lord harmed

 

even though Revan didn't just say "i'm sorry guys, can you forgive me?" and killed Malak and destroyed the Star Forge, is it really enough? billions of people died under the hands of Darth Revan. i think that it is the worst kind of insult concieveable that you'd lose people in your family, and the murderer just walks away free. i know that the jedi say Revan's redeemed and Revan did really try hard to redeem him/herself, i understand that.

 

My question is this:

 

Revan killed billions of people and made their families suffer. is it enough for him/her to be redeemed because he/she tried to make up for it?

[SilentScope001]

Revan killed billions of people and made their families suffer. is it enough for him/her to be redeemed because he/she tried to make up for it?

 

Maybe Revan should just submit to punishment anyway. Not death, of course, but still punishment. He get tried, sentenced to a Uber-Punishment and then go off.

 

What would be that Uber-Punishment? Vrook (or maybe Kreia, she seems strong enough for it) doing a mindrape of Revan and causing him to feel pain as though he died billions of times, each time representing a time that Revan killed an innocent human being.

[EnIgmA_XX]

Maybe Revan should just submit to punishment anyway. Not death, of course, but still punishment. He get tried, sentenced to a Uber-Punishment and then go off.

 

What would be that Uber-Punishment? Vrook (or maybe Kreia, she seems strong enough for it) doing a mindrape of Revan and causing him to feel pain as though he died billions of times, each time representing a time that Revan killed an innocent human being.

 

Why do i get the feeling that Revan will get driven insane by this?

[PoiuyWired]

Well, like it or not he destroyed the starforge ans saved Republic's sorry behind. So he earned his freedom in the end. Yes there are millions(if nto billions) who would want to revenge on Revan boy, and I am sure many would try if they would learn of Revan's whereabouts. Trust me, for some killing him a million times would not me enough.

 

This is akin to Bothans trying to wipe the Vongs away from existance, right or wrong they would try to do it, and no saying sorry in anyway is not going to cut it.

 

The best way to effectively hurt Revan would be to make Bastila suffer in front of his eyes, assuming that both Revan/Bastila did not enjoy that.

[Jediphile]

Another thing to consider...

 

Bastila: "Jedi do not kill their prisoners."

 

This is more than just a statement, since it can be argued that it is Windu's refusal to adhere to that principle which makes Anakin stop him and fall to the dark side. And it's not just Anakin saying it out of convenience, since Windu does try to argue the point - "he is too dangerous to be left alive."

 

Problem here? However hated Revan may be in the Republic, he IS the prisoner of the jedi - they cannot allow others to kill him, nor can they kill him themselves (since that would be a dark side act). Either way: Revan must live.

[Nancy Allen``]

And they would be as bad as the Sith to do these things.

[SilentScope001]

Problem here? However hated Revan may be in the Republic, he IS the prisoner of the jedi - they cannot allow others to kill him, nor can they kill him themselves (since that would be a dark side act). Either way: Revan must live.

 

...But why does the Jedi spare their prisoners?

 

Simple, to 'redeem' them. Aka, memory wiping Revan.

 

And, as for Mace Windu, well remember that the Old Old Jedi Order of Revan is destroyed in TSL. If a new Jedi Order, the Old Jedi Order, is created by Exile's followers, this Order might become a bit more militant, willing to go and battle the Mandalorians and face off enemies. If true, Mace Windu would be representing the Old Jedi Order's militant attidues.

[Nancy Allen``]

That would ultimately depend on the Exile's feelings towards war. Did she think she was wrong to do so? Were her actions justified? Given how scarred she was at Malechor, enough to kill the Jedi Masters, I wonder if she has negative thoughts on war. For that matter, good and evil can be quite ambiguious. While the other Jedi were content to hide Lonna Vash has other ideas, now this is cut content so bear with me.

 

"I dislike passivity. Much like another Jedi I know. With the Council's blessing I decided to take the fight to the Sith."

 

Rather than hide on Nar Shaddar or Dantoine, like Zez Kai El and Vrook did, or with the Onderans as Kavar did, Vash sought out the Sith, went to their homeworld of Korriban to do so, and figured she would find the Exile there. Of further interest is that Vash never calls her 'Exile' but rather refers to her several times as a Jedi. One wonders how things might have panned out had she lived.

[The Architect]

the problem that i have with this statement is that i think you seem to be saying that Revan saves billions, and then promptly kills billions of people, so in other words, he/she kind of "breaks even" and everything is alright. this is not the case. saving a person is not an excuse for suddenly turning around and shooting them. even though Revan did save a substansial amount of people, it cannot, does not excuse you from killing them.

 

No. You misunderstood what I was saying, but that’s not your fault. I wasn’t exactly clear on what I meant. What Jediphile said on my behalf is what I meant. You cannot merely dismiss the good acts that Revan did/caused.

[Gargoyle King]

Execute Revan - Execute a key factor of the Old Republic, i think that this part of the Star Wars EU is far too interesting to destroy; that's like killing Yoda off in Episode 1!!

 

BOW DOWN TO REVAN - THE TRUE LORD OF THE SITH!!

[EnIgmA_XX]

No. You misunderstood what I was saying, but that’s not your fault. I wasn’t exactly clear on what I meant. What Jediphile said on my behalf is what I meant. You cannot merely dismiss the good acts that Revan did/caused.

 

oops, my bad Architect. glad we sorted that out.

 

anyway, Gargoyle_King, i'd really have to dissagree with you. if Revan is to be spared (hypothetically), him/her being interesting should be the least of the reasons why. a mass murderer should definitely not be spared because they are powerful or interesting.

[Gargoyle King]

oops, my bad Architect. glad we sorted that out.

 

anyway, Gargoyle_King, i'd really have to dissagree with you. if Revan is to be spared (hypothetically), him/her being interesting should be the least of the reasons why. a mass murderer should definitely not be spared because they are powerful or interesting.

 

Hmm... touche, however i was merely talking in more of an enjoyment tone of the character - i'm sure everyone loves Revan and would not want his legacy to just 'disappear'. I can see your point however, a mass murderer should and probably would eventually would be brought to justice; like Malak before him, Revan will probably meet his downfall soon. We'll just have to see what will happens next in the Star Wars EU; with Old Republic graphic novels spouting everywhere and rumours of the third Kotor game, i'm sure the story of Revan will be settled sometime soon!

[SilentScope001]

Hmm... touche, however i was merely talking in more of an enjoyment tone of the character - i'm sure everyone loves Revan and would not want his legacy to just 'disappear'.

 

I would.

 

Sending Revan to the executioner's block is a fitting end to his legacy. He dies a traitor's death, like Darth Traya. Much more better than merely sending him off to kill True Sith in unknown space...that's for sure. The True Sith may be necessary to link K1 and K2 together...but that doesn't make it any less lame.

[Gargoyle King]

I would.The True Sith may be necessary to link K1 and K2 together.

This is what i have never really understood, asa didn't the True Sith dies out way before the time period of the Old Republic - i just can't see how this could be implamented into Kotor 3 if it is ever to be made.

[Jediphile]

I would.

 

Sending Revan to the executioner's block is a fitting end to his legacy. He dies a traitor's death, like Darth Traya. Much more better than merely sending him off to kill True Sith in unknown space...that's for sure. The True Sith may be necessary to link K1 and K2 together...but that doesn't make it any less lame.

 

The only reason I could think of for supporting that idea is to annoy all the Revan fanboys. But nah, I won't let them dictate Revan's fate like that, even if the idea is appealing in some perverse way

 

In the end, it would depend on the arguments, and given what LS Revan did during, at the end of and after KotOR, I don't think he deserves death. He did many bad things, yes, but he has also fought hard to atone for them. Besides, I don't approve of throwing lives away so casually... even if Revan himself did once.

[SilentScope001]

This is what i have never really understood, asa didn't the True Sith dies out way before the time period of the Old Republic - i just can't see how this could be implamented into Kotor 3 if it is ever to be made.

 

"You thought the corrupted remenants of the Republic were the Sith? ... You are wrong. The Sith is a belief. And its empire, the True Sith Empire, lies elesewhere..."

 

The 'True Sith' can never die off. How come? It's a belief. It does not matter if you are a member of the Sith species or if you are Darth Traya, you idenify yourself with the Sith. And what is the basic teachings of the Sith? Hatred of Jedi, adherence to the Dark Side.

 

The likely theory is that after the Great Hyperspace War, there lies a couple of Sith Lords that surivied the destruction of the Sith Empire, and lived in the Unknown Region. These people would be massacured. Another theory I held is that it is Sith spirits, long dead, entraped in Holocrons, but it is unlikely to be true. We just have to wait until K3...

 

In fact, I venture to state that WITHOUT the True Sith, there would not be a K3. K1 was a self-contained story, with Malak dead. Without any stronger force, there would be no way to unite K1, K2, and pave the way for K3.