dyehead Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 lol how can he see me while his back is facing me and he's bouncing around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{DHU}Screed Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Originally posted by dyehead LMFAO... Suiciding is nub. If you can't get back to your base fast enough, that's your own fault. You sir obviously never played CTF with any one that was worth a damn. I am a returner, after I kill the flag carrier USUALLY theres someone there to recap it. Sooooooo what I do is /kill respawn at the base and try to stop the enemy flag carrier from getting back to his base. Also, I can defend that flag I just returned alot easier than running ALL the way back to my base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyehead Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Yes, I know all of the reasons to suicide, and I still have no desire to do it, nor do I accept the reasons to suicide as valid reasons to abuse a command used to solve a bug issue. I played CTF with every major clan you can name.. div3rse, FK, =X=, NJA, you name it, I killed those people. I suppose I could also be called a returner, but I also intercepted returners, and cappers along the way. Not once did I use suicide, and I was successful at what I did. I am not calling anyone that suicides a newb, or stupid, I'm just saying that I consider it cowardice in the situations that I mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the weiner dog! Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 screed I think that whole suicide rant was a joke. At least I hope it was since /kill has been used in every single game of CTF going all the way back to quake 1... Then again this is the world of star wars people, lots of weird things happen when they are around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyehead Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Actually I am quite serious about it, Weiner Dog. If there is a way to disable it on my server, I will do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumor Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Originally posted by dyehead Yes, I know all of the reasons to suicide, and I still have no desire to do it, nor do I accept the reasons to suicide as valid reasons to abuse a command used to solve a bug issue. I played CTF with every major clan you can name.. div3rse, FK, =X=, NJA, you name it, I killed those people. I suppose I could also be called a returner, but I also intercepted returners, and cappers along the way. Not once did I use suicide, and I was successful at what I did. I am not calling anyone that suicides a newb, or stupid, I'm just saying that I consider it cowardice in the situations that I mentioned. cowardice? in a game? yeah, maybe if someone just hides so they can't be killed...but killing THEMSELVES so they can do their job better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyehead Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 If you read the situations I posted earlier, such as gripping a speed rager, or when I would knock someone down and be 1/2 second from my DFA contacting their torso, they suicide. My problem has mainly always been with one person, who most people really dislike, who would suicide whenever he came within range of me. I suppose that left a rather terrible taste in my mouth. No one has answered the question as to what a raven developer would say that /kill should be used for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the weiner dog! Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 heh To each their own I guess. I guess it can be "abused" to some degree. I've been kicked a couple of times and banned a while back but in all fairness to the server I was on, I abused the hell out of it and played like a bastard so I probably would have kicked myself too. I am primarily a 1v1 player and as most of us do, I have a "by any means necessary" mentality when it comes to winning (hacking not included of course). To me: /kill Drain a back up capper waiting for a grab /kill Repeat /kill Repeat Watch him get pissed off because he has to roll back to the base (no gas for speed or absorb) Watch him get gang banged by our guys who just respawned is a perfectly acceptable tactic. The way I look at it, if a capper has the grapefruits to wait in our base and stand on our flag stand, he better be ready for some nasty treatment. But I know not everyone sees things like this. In games like RTCW ET spawn camping is a big unwritten no-no but I do it and have 0 problems with people who do it to me. I guess it just all boils down to how cheap and hardcore you want to get when you play. Duels are a lot like this too. Some people look at players who strafe jump around maps and use level 2 lightning as their only form of attack as being "gay" or cheap, but in reality it's pretty clever. It's a perfectly sound strategy and if you can't adapt to it, you really can't criticize it but that's just how I look at things. I know others don't see it that way though. The thing is while in "pub" matches I can agree with maybe not being a total bastard with the way you play, in ladder matches you better not screw around or expect any slack. When I used to pub duel we would not "whore" all the time but in official matches all the nice guy crap went out the window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jello123 Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 to go into spectate mode or change teams if they really cared about it theyd fix it up in ja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashRam Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 waaa waaa I didn't get the 1 point for the kill because he suicided!!!!!111111 COWARD!!!!111111 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyro Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 OH MY GAWDS WUT WOUD THE RAVEN DEVLPER SAY WUT WOUDK HE SAY AOBUT PTK OR THE LAME DRAIN WHORAGE OR RAGING DFA IN FFA OR DIREFCTUIONAL KICK OR... STFU WHO CAREAS WUT RAVEN DEVELOPER WOUJDKO SAY ACTUALY WHO CARES WAT U SAY STOP INSERTING NONSECNSCIAL ARGUMENTS THAT HAFNVE NO BERAJING ON QUESTION AT HAND A GAME IS WAHT THE GAMERS MADE IT ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT RAVEN COULED HVE FORESEN 95% OF TACTICES USED BY PEOPLE THAT HAVE PLAYED JO ALMSOT *TWO YEARS* AFTER RAVEN MADE IT? R U SERRIOUS? U THINK THEYD LOOK AT A DEMO OF ME FF DUELING AND SAY "OH I PREDICTED MOST OF MOVES HE IS DOING"? IF ITS IN THE GAME AND THEY DIDNT TAKE IT OUT LETS JUST ASSUME THAT ITS OK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the weiner dog! Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 oh and /kill was in every quake based engine since well, quake 1. (not sure if it was in doom). for an "official" answer you would need to go to someone other than Raven, like John Carmack from id software. in a nutshell it is there if you get stuck in a map and can't get out without a respawn. it's also accepted as a bread and butter tactic in every quake engine based game of CTF man, sorry but it is looked at as being just part of the game like strafe jumping. People did it in all 3 quakes, they did it in RTCW, EF, you name it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyehead Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Yeah well I have very strict rules on my server re: respect, language, racism, etc.. I can see where in a real match such strategy might be important, but on my server, I'd prefer it to be a fun-for-all kinda thing. No one cheaping someone else because they CAN.. know what I mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jello123 Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 omg do u slap ppl with academy mod for saying "fag" !1!1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Side Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Man this thread is so off topic now =/ but i seriously dont see why suicide is a coward act in s/o CTF(even in guns?)but again it ur server so u can do as u please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumor Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 well that is your perogative. you try to provide a family atmosphere. plus, its your server. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyehead Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Thanks for understanding, guys. Now let's get back on topic. BRING BACK KICK! *holds picket sign* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[D]Fugs Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Oh my word I've never heard so much claptrap in all my time. Spider AL, you are the biggest excuse for a competitive player I have ever had the misfortune to address. Any good/high level player wants MORE - more options, more features, more opponents. I think you just don't want kick because it will cramp your specific playing style. Your few, repetitive, shallow points are based not on fact, as you would have us believe, but on your own, poorly rationalised personal opinion. Ordinarily, I wouldn't be here to indulge your drivvle, as it was becoming quite tedious, but we are discussing a game I love and many people here, including some of the cream of the JK2 community, are trying to be constructive for the good of the software, the community, and ultimately the developers. Your continued torrent of verbal diarrhea not only jeopordises the effectiveness of this thread, and hence the success of Jedi Academy itself, which still has a great potential, but I felt a personal urge to speak up because, quite frankly, I think you're an extremely poor ambassador for our country. In fact I'll go so far as to say you're a twit, and I have no wish for you to be associated with myself or the rest of the UK Jedi Knight community. Intelligent, skilled gameplayers are trying to indicate actual specifics in current JA gameplay many offering solutions off-hand, mainly (not surpisingly due to the title of the thread) the return of kick. As an option. Now I just cannot believe for the life of me why people would be so opposed to an option being introduced into a new videogame. Arguments like "splitting the community" are ridiculous when compared to alternatives like creating mods, and if you think this game doesn't need a patch for one reason or another than you're very much mistaken. As good as Raven are at balancing, they're not stupid, and they realise that they cannot attain a perfect result first time, which if you think they have, are even more of a fool than you seem. So please, enough with your completely irrelevant Quake1 axe analogies, or pie-in-the-sky suggestions, like "..updated engine.." or "..new effect of weapons.." What weapons exactly? What effects, specifically? A fifteen meter saber? There are NO NEW FORCE POWERS in this game, what the top players are telling you on this thread may be derived from 18 months play in a "different" game, but the experience is gained from a scenario with the same combat system: virtually identical weaponry and force powers and very similar saber moves. Your "adapt and overcome" argument is inadequate. Now I didn't actually make this post just to get Spider to shut the smeg up; I wouldn't set myself such a fruitless task. I'd like to vouch for the return or kick, as it instantly add's to the game, it's a much loved move, it solves the CTF Flag Carrier problem, (for saber only and guns - why should we have to use guns to frag the flag carrier it's Jedi and I have a saber) and it will further incorporate the new "kill the enemy on the ground" moves, and the 3 different ways to get up from the knockdown. So, maybe we should continue this discussion, in which your not welcome Spider AL, and try and find out why people don't like kick in Jedi Outcast, or don't like the idea of it in Jedi Academy. If it's because people found it difficult to do, and therefore could not compete with other players, maybe we should make it easier, like it is in JA SP. Here you don't need a double tap just hold direction and jump exactly like the wall grab, it's a less elitist skill but can be used to perform some brilliantly timed long range aerial attacks. I'm sure a few will say "it's not in the movies" but hey, neither are the kata's and I don't see Obi Wan running along walls, or sideflippin' them for that matter. Then if we find out why the masses don't like the move (yeah ok we know they got owned by it all the time) then maybe we could change it a bit so it suits all our needs better. 1 health damage, 10% chance of knockdown, headshot required; whatever, you can see where I'm going with this. Oh, and I expect we'll get the gun users complaining too, like Spider guy here, who's probably as happy as a pig in **** now he can run around with absorb and speed on, lobbing grenades at people with no virtually no chance of getting sabered apart from the odd thrown one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the weiner dog! Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Ouch, Al just got slapped with a large trout. Serious though, this guy does make very valid (and well written) points. I'm glad people do understand where all this is coming from and it's nice to see that some people are actually reading what is being posted rather than just skimming and spitting out old recycled responses from a year ago that have no bearing on this issue. And Al, this guy admitted it, we all have said it, hell even Cjas admitted it, Jedi Academy is only a "new game" in name. The overwhelming majority of the games content and game play dynamics are an identical port of Jedi Outcast, it's not just similar in the play structure but it's the exact same code. 1 new gun. 2 new stances with a few swings. some nerfing on a lot of the old stuff. new maps. wall walk moves. that's it man, nothing more. rest is all Jedi Outcast ported over. Time to join the rest of the real world and admit it in public as well, I know it's going to be hard to swallow your pride but I'm sure you can do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyehead Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 His pride is more like a horse-pill, though.. hehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabrobot Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Originally posted by the weiner dog! And Al, this guy admitted it, we all have said it, hell even Cjas admitted it, Jedi Academy is only a "new game" in name. The overwhelming majority of the games content and game play dynamics are an identical port of Jedi Outcast, it's not just similar in the play structure but it's the exact same code. 1 new gun. 2 new stances with a few swings. some nerfing on a lot of the old stuff. new maps. wall walk moves. that's it man, nothing more. rest is all Jedi Outcast ported over. Time to join the rest of the real world and admit it in public as well, I know it's going to be hard to swallow your pride but I'm sure you can do it. Wow, nice...you throw a huge insult at Raven, and yet you expect them to release a patch for you...have you considered why Mike decided not to post on this thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumor Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 insult? where? i don't see him saying this game sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabrobot Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Raven spent the last year putting a large amount of effort into making JA, and then you call it a mod for JO...that is one of the worst insults you could say to a developer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Side Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Effort? where u saw the effort from Raven? Originally posted by the weiner dog! The overwhelming majority of the games content and game play dynamics are an identical port of Jedi Outcast, it's not just similar in the play structure but it's the exact same code. 1 new gun. 2 new stances with a few swings. some nerfing on a lot of the old stuff. new maps. wall walk moves. that's it man, nothing more. rest is all Jedi Outcast ported over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabrobot Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Well, there are many things but I think I'll focus on the multiplayer engine differences, since you seem to be under the misconception that it's 80% the same as that of Jedi Outcast. Some things which come to mind are: It has a shader limit 16 times higher than that of Jedi Outcast. This probably means nothing to you as you aren't an editor... The ICARUS 2 scripting engine has been implemented in Jedi Academy multiplayer. This probably means nothing to you as you aren't an editor... There is now the ability to have vehicles in JA MP (at least in Siege...but it's still part of the JA MP code). It means that you can pilot an AT-ST, ride a Taun-Taun (and a speeder, a Rancor, a Wampa, and any animals/ridable things which people make) and you can fly X-wings/Tie fighters. Not all of these are actually used in the levels, but the functionality is there to be used in custom levels. Those are some very big changes, but are hardly the only ones. I'm too tired to go into more detail, and a Raven person would be able to go into the changes best, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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