The Return of Kick (among other things)

[WadeV1589]

Why is the person who stated kicking was in beta but removed for the final arguing that it should be there now? Wonder if he realised that by saying it was there and removed, it was a conscious decision by Lucas and Raven to remove it. Therefore it WAS there and IS NOT now, it has been decided to not be there and you're gonna have to live with it.

 

Do you honestly think the S/O CTF community leaving JA would harm sales? This game brought in fresh new players and kept a lot of old ones, the new players certainly aren't going to complain about kicks going - they never knew any better. The players that aren't S/O CTF are overwhelmingly buying the latest, or trying to with a few (counting on your hands) exceptions. Then how many people in S/O CTF are going to keep the game and play it anyhow? Some of you will, the "patch" you're asking for is not a patch, it's to please a relatively small percentage of JA customers. Money wise, it's just not financially viable, of course you could say they can just add it into the next actual patch (which we all know JA does need for things such as graphics [FPS]), simple, it's extra time, extra money and you're just not in great enough numbers for them to listen.

 

Am I saying you're wrong to want it? No. Am I saying you're insane to demand it should be there? Quite possibly. You speak for a minority of the market, and don't give us the crap of the S/O CTF community is large...it may be, but a lot of it is new players who know no better about kick, the kick wanting S/O CTF players are a tiny minority of the overall JA community and will get even smaller as new people buy the game. You're quite literally not worth the hassle you're expecting.

[ganjalf]

com

[ganjalf]

Obviously raven has targeted the game for less skillful, push mouse one and run, players. However, we're asking that competetive players needs are met. This isn't 'we want kicks!11', its 's/o ctf is stalemating, fcs can't be stopped. Theres no ways added, so we need a new way, or the old way back'.

 

whoever the hell said that.......

 

u playin the same game mate cos anyone who stands there clickin as fast as thye can in front of me is a dead man.come on come test and ive been playin since jedi knight 1 so ummm really u could say im a competitive player and i reckon theyve done their best to make it an all round balanced game if ur gonn abitch and moan do it urself...

[Blankie]

boredom aside, why is anyone trying to argue Furion or Al or anyone else? They have 0 control over where JA goes from here. I'm fairly certain raven has heard your complaint... nothing more you say/do will convince them any more/less. Given their past track record, you'll probably have to end up waiting for a pro-mod or something to make things the way you want it. They seem to want JA to be slow paced twirling ballerina madness. Oh well.

 

But you aren't going to convince Furion or Al *ever*... about anything. Trust me, you have guys like that on almost every forum.

 

Enjoy coming up with ur witty responses.

 

Blank

[traj]

Originally posted by Spider AL

traj:

 

Look, if you insist on mutilating my name, I'll just have to call you Trajic all the time. Your call.

 

Seriously though, do stop the childish flaming. You're just showing yourself up, nobody else.

 

 

 

How do you think you got your name AL? You called me Trajic and I fired back. Then you flame, we flame back, and once you see StormHammer you say "Seriously though, do stop the childish flaming. You're just showing yourself up, nobody else."

 

You remind me of the kid who punched me in the arm in elementary school. When I punched him back he ran to the teacher and said I hit him for no reason.

 

But you and Storm are right. I feel like I'm in fourth grade again and it makes me sick. Although you're not guilt free here and you know it. Anyways, I'm done. The points have been made. I'll act like a grown up from now on, can't speak for anyone else though.

[traj]

Originally posted by Blankie

boredom aside, why is anyone trying to argue Furion or Al or anyone else? They have 0 control over where JA goes from here. I'm fairly certain raven has heard your complaint... nothing more you say/do will convince them any more/less. Given their past track record, you'll probably have to end up waiting for a pro-mod or something to make things the way you want it. They seem to want JA to be slow paced twirling ballerina madness. Oh well.

 

But you aren't going to convince Furion or Al *ever*... about anything. Trust me, you have guys like that on almost every forum.

 

Enjoy coming up with ur witty responses.

 

Blank

 

Good post. You're right.

[C'jais]

I'm not Stormy himself, but would you two *please* stop the personal vendetta?

 

Not only is it way off topic, it's also ruining my good mood

[Rumor]

Originally posted by FurionStormrage

And Raven, as the sole developer, and Lucas Arts, as the sole publisher, removed them. If they worked, as you assert, why were they removed? COULD IT BE that kicks were considered to NOT work in MP as a game imbalancing move? If you can answer that one without violating your NDA than please do so.

 

Speaking of NDAs... Why are you even talking about the closed beta? This supports you, how?

 

once the game is released the nda on gameplay issues is lifted.

 

thanks for proving your lack of knowledge.

[Rumor]

Originally posted by ganjalf

Obviously raven has targeted the game for less skillful, push mouse one and run, players. However, we're asking that competetive players needs are met. This isn't 'we want kicks!11', its 's/o ctf is stalemating, fcs can't be stopped. Theres no ways added, so we need a new way, or the old way back'.

 

whoever the hell said that.......

 

u playin the same game mate cos anyone who stands there clickin as fast as thye can in front of me is a dead man.come on come test and ive been playin since jedi knight 1 so ummm really u could say im a competitive player and i reckon theyve done their best to make it an all round balanced game if ur gonn abitch and moan do it urself...

 

key word: STAND

 

no capper with half a brain will stand there swinging his saber.

 

thanks for proving YOUR ignorance as well.

[FurionStormrage]

Originally posted by Rumor

once the game is released the nda on gameplay issues is lifted.

 

thanks for proving your lack of knowledge.

 

And how many beta tests have you been involved in? Considering that I am in three company-product wide betas currently, involved in over 35 beta testing programs in the past, and am managing our entire company's beta testing program I think I may know a thing or two about beta programs.

 

But then again, waiting to finish the whole thread before trying to prove me ignorant would've helped here because Ardent and I had a nice little (and civil) chat about it a few posts ago.

 

Thanks for playing!

[Th4t Guy]

I have noticed that Spider keeps bringing up the point that adding kick would have a effect the whole community if it was put back into all game modes and that we need to think about how what we want effects the community(Thats how i interperated it so correct me if i am wrong). But why do you think kick was taken out. People from other communities probably complained about it in not thinking about how it would effect other communities as well. So really now...why is it wrong for us to complain about kicks not being in there when it started with other people complaining and not thinking about the adverse effects it would have on other communities. So why dont you get on them about why removing it was a bad idea in the first place and that they should have thought about the effects it would have on other communities.

[boinga1]

Actually, I noticed very few people actually asking for kick to be removed. However, A LOT thought kick was over-used.

 

Well, it was. Without reading a sinlg efan e-mail, you could probably watch a few JO games and see that it was over-used. So, Raven's solution was to remove it.

[Spider AL]

why is anyone trying to argue Furion or Al or anyone else? They have 0 control over where JA goes from here.

Oh, nobody's tried to argue with us. They've just tried to flame us. And we have as much control as anyone here, which is to say, very little. Only as much as we shout... And we only shout as loud as those we disagree with.

 

traj:

 

How do you think you got your name AL? You called me Trajic and I fired back. Then you flame, we flame back, and once you see StormHammer you say "Seriously though, do stop the childish flaming. You're just showing yourself up, nobody else." You remind me of the kid who punched me in the arm in elementary school. When I punched him back he ran to the teacher and said I hit him for no reason.

I got my name when I saw a spider on the wall, my first day online.

 

/me sniffs

 

Those were the days.

 

"I fired, then you fired back"? Give me a break. Don't try to pretend that you weren't flaming from the moment we unwrapped the box and you sprang out, traj. In this case, you're definitely the first one to throw a punch. The fact that none of yours have connected so far is irrelevant, you still had violent intentions. And your first posts in this thread are naturally archived, so save any disputatious retorts.

 

But you and Storm are right. I feel like I'm in fourth grade again and it makes me sick. Although you're not guilt free here and you know it.

Thanks for telling me what I know. I know that you came on here to start a petty argument, in a vain attempt to distract people from the basic, logical point that I brought up and will continue to bring up:

 

Premature patching to a game is inherently dangerous, often resulting in serious damage to a community, and many alienated players. One has only to look at the record of games like Tribes, CS, UT and JO to see that this is the truth.

 

The patch that some NG CTFers are demanding on this forum is one that would affect (by their own admission) all other gametypes, which negates their argument that their understanding of NG CTF is sufficient to allow them to predict what the change they're lobbying for would do to the game, were it ported in. They don't play the game modes they're lobbying to affect, so by their own rationale, not mine, they should not be doing what they're doing.

 

The patch the NG CTFers are demanding is clearly premature, barely a week after the game's release worldwide. Nobody can yet call themselves a "JA expert", and nobody can yet have sufficient understanding of the game's unique dynamic to claim to know how to improve it.

 

Therefore Raven should ignore this and all requests for a gameplay-altering patch. Ahhthankyouverramuch.

 

C'jais:

 

I'm not Stormy himself, but would you two *please* stop the personal vendetta?

 

Not only is it way off topic, it's also ruining my good mood

Hmm, I wish you admins could do something about all these incessant demands for patches. You know as well as I do the damaging effects they can have. But free speech must take precedent I suppose, even when these people spend all their time flaming those who oppose them.

[FurionStormrage]

@Th4tguy: Good question.

 

My speculation: RAVEN/LA removed kick for whatever reason or no reason at all. That's the gameplay they presumably wanted.

 

Some vocal members of the community are asking it to be put back IN.

 

Until we know WHY Raven/LA decided to remove it in the first place, asking for it to be placed back in with no seeming regard for other opinions is what some of us (myself included) are having a problem with.

[Jello123]

Originally posted by Spider AL

Jello: Writing a list of people you know online doesn't make your argument any less rubbish.

 

nono

 

i dont know half of these people

 

they are all from lucasforums in case you didnt know

 

if you wanted me to put people i knew too, that list would be 3 times bigger

 

I think you'll find that the number of people who don't want the game ruined is greater than the number of people lobbying for a patch on this forum.

 

the ruining of the game was your own opinion

 

like i said before..you do not speak for everybody

 

and refer to list for numbers

[traj]

Originally posted by Th4tguy

I have noticed that Spider keeps bringing up the point that adding kick would have a effect the whole community if it was put back into all game modes and that we need to think about how what we want effects the community(Thats how i interperated it so correct me if i am wrong). But why do you think kick was taken out. People from other communities probably complained about it in not thinking about how it would effect other communities as well. So really now...why is it wrong for us to complain about kicks not being in there when it started with other people complaining and not thinking about the adverse effects it would have on other communities. So why dont you get on them about why removing it was a bad idea in the first place and that they should have thought about the effects it would have on other communities.

 

Good point.

[BigFurryWhale]

OK, I just read up to page 9 I really have to say to al:

 

STFU and GTFO FAG. This thread is NOT about Who has the highest IQ or Who can pick apart others arguments better, or Who can talk with the best grammar or any bs like that.

 

THIS thread is about fixing our ****ing gametype. Now, you have stated your side of the argument about "seperating/fragmenting the community blah blah blah" but for a while it seems that all you've been doing is this:

 

al:

 

so/ff needs kick back

 

You forgot the period and to say CTF therefore, my intelligence is higher than yours and therefore i win.

 

/al

 

Now tell me, wtf is the point of that? ooo ooo you accidentally made a typo that "flaws" your argument. No one (except you) takes the time to spell and grammar check their ****ing posts, WE HAVE BETTER THINGS TO DO. So stop dwelling on our "poor grammar" or our typos and GTFO.

 

/rant

[dyehead]

Bring this man some potato salad!

[traj]

Originally posted by BigFurryWhale

OK, I just read up to page 9 I really have to say to al:

 

STFU and GTFO FAG. This thread is NOT about Who has the highest IQ or Who can pick apart others arguments better, or Who can talk with the best grammar or any bs like that.

 

THIS thread is about fixing our ****ing gametype. Now, you have stated your side of the argument about "seperating/fragmenting the community blah blah blah" but for a while it seems that all you've been doing is this:

 

al:

 

 

 

You forgot the period and to say CTF therefore, my intelligence is higher than yours and therefore i win.

 

/al

 

Now tell me, wtf is the point of that? ooo ooo you accidentally made a typo that "flaws" your argument. No one (except you) takes the time to spell and grammar check their ****ing posts, WE HAVE BETTER THINGS TO DO. So stop dwelling on our "poor grammar" or our typos and GTFO.

 

/rant

 

Nice post whale. Hope you get a warning a not a ban.

[Guest Jed]

That's it, I've had it, I can't stand reading any more flames or pointless arguing anymore.

 

BigFurryWhale, after multiple general warnings, you STILL decided to flame, do it again and you're not coming back here.

 

As to everyone else, if you can make some sort of promise that thread will go flame free, and there's enough demand for it, just send your pleading here.

 

Thread closed.