Round one : Fight!

[obi]

You want to know more about my fighting story, eh TK? Very well, pull up a chair, and Grandpa Obi will tell you. Almost exact detail, the best I can remember it.

 

I was walking to the math portable, and the same people that did the same crap every day pushed my books into the mud. It had been raining, you see. Anyway...

 

I said "Stop it, you do this everyday. It's starting to piss me off."

 

"Oh I'm scared!" The bully said, as his toadies laughed, and then he pushed me, asking me what I was going to do about it.

 

It was that time I punched him right in the face. It was the best feeling I have ever had. The guy held his hand up to his face, and stared at me, scared to death. Well, that little wuss told the principal on me. I went to his office to explain the story.

 

Suspension? No. Hospitalization? Not even close.

 

The principal knew I was the victim in this case, and didn't punish me at all. Those very smart people who created all of these instances were given lengthy amounts of suspension. The principal even told me "Off the record, Good job."

 

From that point on, I took crap from nobody.

 

Not all fights lead to suspension. Not all lead to immidiate hospitalization and WW III. Not everything revolves around one person or their actions. Look out for yourself, damnit. Don't be someone's punching bag.

 

I still say give 'um Hell if they ask for it. It'll do you a lot better in the long run, and you'll feel better for standing up for yourself.

[TK-8252]

You forgot one thing, you crazy old coot. What grade was this?! That makes a big difference.

 

Originally posted by jokemaster

and that's why you don't understand what teachers do in certain situations when rules are broken. here endeth the lesson.

And you do? Administrating the JK3Files gaming server (see my sig) gives me a sense of responsibility and rule enforcement. Now, this may not be the best example, but hear me out:

 

Yadda, yadda, we don't allow laming. Now, some people choose to lame back when they are lamed. We don't allow that! This is about the same as people fighting back when they are bullied. But instead of that, it makes my job as an administrator much easier when people report lamers via /amsay and let themselves get killed. When people lame lamers, BOTH people are kicked. No matter how noble it may seem.

[obi]

Oh, this was years ago. Way back in the eigth grade. I believe it was the eigth, but I could be wrong. It was middle school era though.

 

Some of those toadies are actually friends of mine now, heh. The bully, I have no clue where he went to.

[ET Warrior]

Yeah...that's the thing to do, have mommy and daddy call the school and tell them about the big bad bullies that are pickin on their sweetum...awwwwww.

 

First of all, word'll get around that your parents had to fight your battle for you. That right there sets the tone for the REST OF HIS SCHOOL LIFE. Kids are MEAN, they will use ANYTHING you give them to make your life hell. Sure, one bully has been temporarily averted by calling the school, but you just became the prime target of 10 other bullies.

 

And what happens in college? Mommy and Daddy aren't there. The campus police have a lot more important things to do than deal with some guy who wants to start crap with you.

 

I've been in one fight in my life. I was in KINDERGARTEN. I was getting picked on every day by a group of three kids. Everyday at recess they'd tease me, chase me, push me over. I talked to the teacher, she yelled at them, but nothing changed. So my parents told me to stand up for myself.

 

Next day, they came up to me, and I charged the bully and knocked him to the ground, and I sat on his chest and hit him right in the face. I had to stand next to the wall during recess as punishment, and I've NEVER had another fight or even almost fight in my life, and those kids NEVER picked on me ever again. You've never broken the rules or been in a fight, so you dont know ANYTHING about how people react to it. You know nothing about how bullies respond to a fight, so your arguments have no basis.

 

I think that if your parents actually cared about you, they would care if you got suspended. Suspension goes down on your permanent record. I don't think that Michael wants any of that.

 

I think if your parents care about you they'll want you to stand up for yourself and don't make other people fight your battles for you. And, please, come on. Your permanent record..oooooo. I can see it now, 10 years down the road Mike's at a job interview. "well sir, your application is very impressive, and you'd be perfect for the job, but, we called your middle school and it appears you got suspended once for fighting. We can't have that kind of scandal associated with our company, so you don't get the job."

[TK-8252]

Yeah, uh... my parents actually took the time to raise me RIGHT.

 

And some of my friends at school were severly bullied. I can tell from observation what can happen. I was a victim of minor bullying, but had I retaliated, I'd have really made a bad choice. Instead, I just shrug it off. I know that their life is really screwed up, it must really suck to be them.

[ET Warrior]

Originally posted by TK-8252

Yeah, uh... my parents actually took the time to raise me RIGHT.

 

How about you go tell my parents how badly they screwed up on their son. It's not like he's a college student who graduated with a 3.996 GPA with a strong work ethic, doesn't drink, smoke, or do drugs. But yeah. They totally messed up raising me. Because I know how to look after myself and don't need other people to save me from all of lifes problems.

[Crow_Nest]

Stay out of sight from him, when you see him coming quickly run away.

 

Or just fight back...

[TK-8252]

Originally posted by ET Warrior

How about you go tell my parents how badly they screwed up on their son. It's not like he's a college student who graduated with a 3.996 GPA with a strong work ethic, doesn't drink, smoke, or do drugs. But yeah. They totally messed up raising me. Because I know how to look after myself and don't need other people to save me from all of lifes problems.

Well you have failed to learn one thing - fighting does not solve life's problems.

[ET Warrior]

Originally posted by TK-8252

Well you have failed to learn one thing - fighting does not solve life's problems.

 

Hmmm, I fought once, stopped getting picked on, never got picked on again, went through school, didn't get rejected from college because of my fight in kindergarten...I'm not really sure how standing up for myself didn't solve my problem.

 

I'm not sure if you understand, we aren't telling him to walk around looking to beat the crap out of anyone who looks at him wrong. THAT won't solve anything. But standing up for yourself and not acting like a six year old girl when things start looking bad WILL solve things.

[TK-8252]

Originally posted by ET Warrior

I had to stand next to the wall during recess as punishment

Try solving problems WITHOUT getting punished doing so. If you got in trouble for taking care of a problem "your way", maybe that means it's not the proper way to deal with the situation.

[ET Warrior]

Are you KIDDING?

 

I was 5 years old, I had to stand next to the wall for 30 minutes. HOLY CRAP. Life altering event right there let me tell all of you. It didn't matter by a week later. All that mattered was I'd earned enough respect for those guys to stop bullying me.

 

If I'd done it in high school and gotten suspended, it wouldn't matter by now. Nobody would care. If the subject ever came up, it would go something like this "So'd you ever get in a fight in high school?" "Yeah, this one guy kept gettin in my face and bein a real jerk, so I knocked him down and hit the piss out of him" "Way to stand up for yourself"

 

I REALLY hope you never have to deal with the Real world TK-4463545, because I dont know what you're going to do.

 

edit---and, just because i'm curious, let's say they pass a law requiring you to wear shorts at all times, no matter the weather. And it's really cold and snowing out. Are you going to wear shorts? Or are you going to be smart and wear some pants so you don't get frostbite?

[TK-8252]

Originally posted by ET Warrior

Are you KIDDING?

No.

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

I was 5 years old, I had to stand next to the wall for 30 minutes. HOLY CRAP. Life altering event right there let me tell all of you. It didn't matter by a week later. All that mattered was I'd earned enough respect for those guys to stop bullying me.

Just because you beat up one little twirp you go around telling people to break the rules, beat people up, continue the tradition of caveman violence!

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

"Way to stand up for yourself"

"Way to get yourself suspended." "Way to get yourself grounded for a month." "Way to continue immature violence."

 

Do two wrongs make a right?

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

I REALLY hope you never have to deal with the Real world TK-4463545, because I dont know what you're going to do.

Are you having trouble counting? And BTW, school IS the real world. I'm in the real world right now, and I'm doing fine.

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

edit---and, just because i'm curious, let's say they pass a law requiring you to wear shorts at all times, no matter the weather. And it's really cold and snowing out. Are you going to wear shorts? Or are you going to be smart and wear some pants so you don't get frostbite?

You can always move.

[ET Warrior]

Originally posted by TK-8252

And BTW, school IS the real world. I'm in the real world right now, and I'm doing fine.

 

No. It isn't. School is the sheltered world where the adults all look out for you and you can pretend that what happens outside doesn't really affect you. College isn't even the real world, though it's a lot closer to it. Don't be naive.

 

 

 

Fine, you can move. How about if a law is passed worldwide requiring you to smoke a pack of cigarettes a day in order to stimulate the economy. You gonna take up smoking and give yourself emphysema?

[TK-8252]

Originally posted by ET Warrior

No. It isn't. School is the sheltered world where the adults all look out for you and you can pretend that what happens outside doesn't really affect you. College isn't even the real world, though it's a lot closer to it. Don't be naive.

Education is a very important part of a person's life. If you do not get a good education you can't do much when you get into the so-called "real world". Right now, my real world is school. There are many different ways you can look at something.

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

Fine, you can move. How about if a law is passed worldwide requiring you to smoke a pack of cigarettes a day in order to stimulate the economy. You gonna take up smoking and give yourself emphysema?

How do you suggest that you get every single nation on this earth to be in agreement with a law? There are limits to "what if" questions.

[Kain]

It comes to down to the school one would assume. In my old school, if you didn't fight, you got beaten more and more and more, simple as that. If you put the guy down, and you had enough sense to end it, you never said anything to each other again. Of course, my school is ghet-to, flat out. Your lucky if you get a one-on-one at that damned school. My last fight was my last fight, flat out. Why? Because I made enough of an impression to make people think I was homicidal if was pushed enough. How? Dirty fighting, like I was tellin Micheal(except the banjo, that was just for humor). Thats all you gotta do(one would think its universal). Slam heads into lockers, throw spines against corners, throw chairs, slam face first into the floor, slam face into the protruding lock part of the locker, and when hes barely fighting anymore, duck his punch and put him in some kind of hold until someone gets there(very hard at my school, given the crowds that fighting creates). Never worry about it again.

[Alegis]

I imagine this forum fight to be greater than michealmeexp's real life fight

[leXX]

Originally posted by TK-8252

I hope you read farther than that first sentence. It's really not much of an embarassment if you're walking down a hallway and all of a sudden some kid knocks you out with a fist blow. I mean... you didn't call that kid out and then chicken out.

 

It's not an embarassment to get hit in the face and not fight back? Somehow, I think it is.

 

Michael did not mess with him! The bully just picks some random kid and beats him up? Not a good reputation.

 

This bully just beats up random kids why? Because noone has ever taught him a lesson or stood up to him. He doesn't give a crap if he gets into trouble with the school or his parents. He needs a taste of his own medicine. That way he'll think again before picking on someone.

 

The school does, because they're taking care of their problems correctly, rather than resorting to breaking school policy.

 

So after you've told the teachers and they have told the boy off, suspended him or even expelled him, what do you think his next move will be? He will just keep beating you up, inside or outside of school.

 

Not from what I've seen. Beating a bully up only makes them want to get even.

 

No, in the majority of cases it will put a stop to it and the bully will either think twice or pick on someone else.

 

No, they can expell the bully, and he doesn't come back.

 

He will be waiting for you after school. Watch your back.

 

Don't be suprised when you get a phone call in the middle of the day, the principal informing you that your child has been suspended.

 

Why would she get suspended for defending herself? It's perfectly within her rights and within the rules of the school.

 

 

No, it's the smart thing to do. People who fight are going by their caveman instincts. They don't know the proper way to react.

 

The proper and normal way to react is to defend yourself. You cannot rely on everyone else to fight your battles for you.

 

Refusing to fight a bully is not weakness. It's showing that you're not stupid. And if more people bully you, nothing stopping you from telling the school again!

 

Get beaten up, tell the school, get beaten up, tell the school, rinse and repeat. Such a nice way to live your life, being a punching bag for every bully in school.

 

Yeah, uh... my parents actually took the time to raise me RIGHT.

 

Don't you dare tell anyone that their parents bought up their kids wrong by telling them to defend themselves. There is no law against self defense.

[|GG|Carl]

I'd do this:

 

1. Try to ignore him/them.

 

2. Start taking kung-fu lessons.

 

3. Punch him you-know-where when he doesn't expect it, and run!

[Astrotoy7]

Originally posted by Rad Blackrose

...I have, and if you have seen the crap I have, you would realize that there is a time for words, and a time for fists to fly.

 

....for a minute there I though I was trapped in a vortex of a JA MP flamebaiting thread...... hello Rad, nice to see you in the swamp...

 

...6 man gangbang.... I dont like the sounds of that, and youre probably scaring little Mike.....

 

 

MTFBWYA

[Mex]

Hmm, no fight has happened yet and it's half term so no worrying about it for a week.

 

So far I've made up some tactics for when he next tries to bug me.

 

~ Try to punch him straight in the nose.

~ Try to get him onto the floor.

~ Try to keep him on the floor, so he can't retailiate.[sp? O.o]

~ Then erm, walk off....

 

So is that correct?

 

Fighting doesn't solve your troubles. That's like saying smoking weed solves your problems. I really don't think that if Michael and his parents raised hell with the school that they'd just ignore it.

 

My school does ignore it. I've made tons of phone calls trying to speak to the school about problems. The next day they act like I never spoke to them.

[jokemaster]

They had school when you were young granpa obi?

 

TK: First: Defending yourself isn't resorting to caveman instincts, it's relying on your preservation instincts. Second: Oh, so my parents compleetely ignored me because they told me not to take **** all my life? Third: you know, when you get out of school, you're really gonna suffer.

[Reborn Outcast]

Actually I can see where TK is coming from BUT there are a few things I disagree about...

 

 

I have been bullied on occasion. Not much, but a few times. I just shrug it and walk off, and they don't care and it hasn't happened in about a year. Now, I know that that may be not normal it terms of bullying, but, IF HE THROWS THE FIRST PUNCH THE LAW IS ON YOUR SIDE. It's called self-defense. So, don't throw the first punch, because from the way your school is acting when you call them, they won't care if he's been bullying you for a long time so that's why you hit him first. It'll be suspension/expulsion. But, if he throws the first one, the law is on your side to defend yourself. If you can, let him throw it and try to dodge it or at least me a little... Even if he misses you completely because you dodged, hitting him back is still self-defense.

 

So TK, you're telling him to just let himself be their human punching bag if they corner him somewhere?

[ET Warrior]

Mike, DON'T listen to the people who tell you to let him throw the first punch. SCREW getting in trouble, one punch isn't going to get you expelled unless you're going to some strict private catholic school (and probably not even then)

 

YOU throw the first punch. End that fight before it starts, if he comes up and pushes you throw a quick jab into his nose. Then when he pulls back in surprise throw another jab into his solar plexus (area right below the ribs) This'll probably bend him over, and if you want to finish it grab the back of his head, pull down as your knee comes up right into his face. Then odds are you can just push him over and walk away.

 

How do you suggest that you get every single nation on this earth to be in agreement with a law? There are limits to "what if" questions.

 

Fine, it's an American law, but you don't have enough money for a ticket out of the US, nor do you have a car. What're you gonna do?

 

Education is a very important part of a person's life. If you do not get a good education you can't do much when you get into the so-called "real world". Right now, my real world is school. There are many different ways you can look at something.

 

I didn't say I worry for when you get into YOUR real world. I said i'm worried about what happens when you have to deal with THE real world. You know, the one where you DONT have people looking out for you and mommy and daddy aren't there, and the police aren't really going to give a damn if you call them and say some guys been pushing you around and might beat you up.

[TK-8252]

Originally posted by leXX

It's not an embarassment to get hit in the face and not fight back? Somehow, I think it is.

Most of the time when people fight at my school, they're embarassing themselves more than if they'd just left it alone. Middle school fights look and are pathetic.

 

Originally posted by leXX

This bully just beats up random kids why? Because noone has ever taught him a lesson or stood up to him. He doesn't give a crap if he gets into trouble with the school or his parents. He needs a taste of his own medicine. That way he'll think again before picking on someone.

If someone just beats up random kids, he doesn't belong in school. Beating him up will only make him angry. See, most of the time, bullies don't know what exactly their goal is. They don't know when to stop.

 

Originally posted by leXX

So after you've told the teachers and they have told the boy off, suspended him or even expelled him, what do you think his next move will be? He will just keep beating you up, inside or outside of school.

How is he going to beat you up inside school? He's long gone. And why would you make plans to meet up with the bully outside of school so that he can beat you up? Unless he lives in your neighboorhood or something, he can't really hunt you down.

 

Originally posted by leXX

No, in the majority of cases it will put a stop to it and the bully will either think twice or pick on someone else.

Not from what I've seen.

 

Originally posted by leXX

He will be waiting for you after school. Watch your back.

Then don't meet him.

 

Originally posted by leXX

Why would she get suspended for defending herself? It's perfectly within her rights and within the rules of the school.

People have been suspended from my school for self-defense. Administrators will not take the time to find out who threw the first punch.

 

Originally posted by leXX

The proper and normal way to react is to defend yourself. You cannot rely on everyone else to fight your battles for you.

No, because fighting isn't allowed. Self-defense is accepting the fight and joining in.

 

Originally posted by leXX

Get beaten up, tell the school, get beaten up, tell the school, rinse and repeat. Such a nice way to live your life, being a punching bag for every bully in school.

Every bully, after seeing that every bully before them was suspended and/or expelled is going to beat you up, despite them knowing their future?

 

Originally posted by leXX

Don't you dare tell anyone that their parents bought up their kids wrong by telling them to defend themselves. There is no law against self defense.

Then why was someone from my school suspended for self-defense? My parents tell me to follow school rules, it's nice having a clean record. And I've never been in a fight. That has to tell you something about how my procedure works.

 

Originally posted by Michaelmexp

My school does ignore it. I've made tons of phone calls trying to speak to the school about problems. The next day they act like I never spoke to them.

Then have your parents set up a meeting with the principal. If they still don't listen you could practically press charges.

 

Originally posted by Reborn Outcast

IF HE THROWS THE FIRST PUNCH THE LAW IS ON YOUR SIDE. It's called self-defense. So, don't throw the first punch, because from the way your school is acting when you call them, they won't care if he's been bullying you for a long time so that's why you hit him first. It'll be suspension/expulsion. But, if he throws the first one, the law is on your side to defend yourself. If you can, let him throw it and try to dodge it or at least me a little... Even if he misses you completely because you dodged, hitting him back is still self-defense.

 

So TK, you're telling him to just let himself be their human punching bag if they corner him somewhere?

No, the rules of the school clearly state No fighting. What is self-defense? Accepting the bully's invitation to a fight. I've seen so many kids suspended for self-defense. They thought they were being noble standing up to a bully, instead they got themselves suspended for a stupid mistake. And you can't be their "human punching bag" if you don't let yourself be one. First, don't let the bully(s) find you. Second, if they do find you, you don't let them trap you. Last, if you are trapped, push them away and run! Pushing is not fighting.

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

SCREW getting in trouble

Michael doesn't want to be in trouble, I don't think. He's a good kid.

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

Fine, it's an American law, but you don't have enough money for a ticket out of the US, nor do you have a car. What're you gonna do?

Most likely there will be thousands, if not millions of protestors in the country. The law wouldn't last long.

 

Originally posted by ET Warrior

You know, the one where you DONT have people looking out for you and mommy and daddy aren't there, and the police aren't really going to give a damn if you call them and say some guys been pushing you around and might beat you up.

Who the hell is going to beat you up after you finish school?!

[El Sitherino]

don't let them find you? so what I'm just supposed to not go to school? I wouldn't want to be on the run the whole time at school, I'd prefer to punch the asshole right in the face so he'd leave me alone. And self-defense is not accepting a fight, it's called ending the fight. You're school is extremely foolish to not investigate fights when that is part of nation wide procedure, therefore they are breaking the law. Schools are supposed to investigate all fights and find out who threw the first punch and why it occured.