USA Successor

[Revlt Coranier]

I didn't read all the pages, because it's late and I'm tired. But let me just input my two cents. F*ck god. Religion should have nothing to do with government. And Curious George does look like a chimp . I am ashamed to be an American. When I went on vacation to Switzerland and Italy, I wanted to stay there and never come back to the garbage heap that is the USA.

 

God could be punishing us for doing something, as a father punsihes his son

So when we bomb Iraq and make all those innocent Iraqi civilians homeless and kill there families, is that god punishing them? I don't think all those innocent people could've done something bad enough to warrent that.

 

And there is nothing wrong with homosexuality. Why shouldn't they be allowed to get married? Is it hurting someone? Nope.

 

Why do y'all Christians believe in that silly bible book? How do you know it's all real? Thousands of years ago, some dicknoses could've written this entire book of stuff they made up and called it the bible. It could all be bullsh*t.

 

Let the flaming commence. My email address is jrwjams@astound.net and my AIM screen name is EHrevltcoranier

[tFighterPilot]

Originally posted by Revlt Coranier

I didn't read all the pages, because it's late and I'm tired. But let me just input my two cents. F*ck god. Religion should have nothing to do with government. And Curious George does look like a chimp . I am ashamed to be an American. When I went on vacation to Switzerland and Italy, I wanted to stay there and never come back to the garbage heap that is the USA.

 

 

So when we bomb Iraq and make all those innocent Iraqi civilians homeless and kill there families, is that god punishing them? I don't think all those innocent people could've done something bad enough to warrent that.

 

And there is nothing wrong with homosexuality. Why shouldn't they be allowed to get married? Is it hurting someone? Nope.

 

Why do y'all Christians believe in that silly bible book? How do you know it's all real? Thousands of years ago, some dicknoses could've written this entire book of stuff they made up and called it the bible. It could all be bullsh*t.

 

Let the flaming commence. My email address is jrwjams@astound.net and my AIM screen name is EHrevltcoranier

Don't expect to be flamed, most people here agrees with you...

[yaebginn]

Originally posted by Revlt Coranier

I didn't read all the pages, because it's late and I'm tired. But let me just input my two cents. F*ck god. Religion should have nothing to do with government. And Curious George does look like a chimp . I am ashamed to be an American. When I went on vacation to Switzerland and Italy, I wanted to stay there and never come back to the garbage heap that is the USA.

 

 

 

Good, then get the heck out of my country. And, no, I am not gonna start flaming, as you obviously want so dearly. And the governemnt was built on this religion. You dont like it? Then go to Italy, with the hairy girls. Go on, have a good time.

[tFighterPilot]

Originally posted by yaebginn

Good, then get the heck out of my country. And, no, I am not gonna start flaming, as you obviously want so dearly. And the governemnt was built on this religion. You dont like it? Then go to Italy, with the hairy girls. Go on, have a good time.

Funny thing you mention italy, as it's probably the most christian state is there, with the vatican and stuff.

[ET Warrior]

Originally posted by yaebginn

Good, then get the heck out of my country.

 

YOUR country? At what point did you claim ownership? And at what point do you reserve the right to tell people where they can and cannot stay?

[Revlt Coranier]

I'm 14 ¬_¬ I can't leave by my self. Of course, when I am a grown up, I will leave the USA right away.

It just kinda disgusts me how Americans can be so gross. The people not liking homosexuals and not wanting them to get married, I (since I am not religious) don't see it as religoius. I just see it as being mean. To put it bluntly. It's mean and disgusting. They are humans, they are American citizerns, they have the right to get married. I live in California, and my neighbors are gay, and they got married on Valentine's Day of this year. You can't imagine how happy I was for them. It's almost as bad as racial discrimination. Same idea.

 

And the governemnt was built on this religion.

And right now, the government ain't workin too well, is it? I've heard some people say they like Georgie because he is a "good Christian boy". Tsk tsk.

 

How did George W. get into college? Was he smart? Hell no. He's dumber than a pencil. So how did he get in you ask? Well.... He had the magical key: A DAD WITH MONEY

He stopped the recount because he was afraid of losing and he has daddy's friends on the ole supreme court.

[DieStarWarsGeek]

Originally posted by Revlt Coranier

He had the magical key: A DAD WITH MONEY

He stopped the recount because he was afraid of losing and he has daddy's friends on the ole supreme court.

 

 

Don't forget a dad with reaches into the government, and the school. and W. didn't stop it, the 5 conservative judges in the court did.

[Revlt Coranier]

and W. didn't stop it, the 5 conservative judges in the court did.

Thanks, that's what I meant, his dad has friends in the court who stopped it so he wouldn't lose.

[yaebginn]

so because they are conservatives, they are automatically in cahoots with george? hm. and good, if you are happy for them, good. glad you were happy. and it is all of our country. I am a patriotic person, I love my country, and here is this kid who hates America. He's spoiled. And that sickens me. And about the schoole, there is a program with many of the large schools that if your parents went there or something, you get to get in if you are within a certain limit to carry on a tradition. All you liberals are all abou tconspiracies, Bush won fair and square.

[DieStarWarsGeek]

They weren't in cahoots. There was no conspiracy.

 

You obviously know nothing about the election of 2000, except what your parents told you. There are 9 supreme court justices. 5 of them were openly republican before they were judges(which when you recieve that status you are supposed to be non-partisan). But they have all consistenly voted conservatively in matters like civil liberties and civil rights. Each one who voted to stop the recount had some agenda(relatives who worked for Bush, wanted a republican president to pick their replacements when they retired, personal grudges with democrats and al gore) why they wanted a republican to be the next president. There is a real good book on it I'll give it to you if you want.

 

Not to mention all of the voters who had their votes scrubbed.

 

You should really know about something before you say what it is and isn't.

[Revlt Coranier]

Originally posted by yaebginn

He's spoiled. And that sickens me.

Um, are you talking about me? What does disliking the state of our country have to do with being spoiled? I'm not spoiled.

 

Originally posted by yaebginn

And about the schoole, there is a program with many of the large schools that if your parents went there or something, you get to get in if you are within a certain limit to carry on a tradition.

And that's total bullsh*t. That is one of the stupidest programs I've heard of. Just because one of your parents was smart (and I'm not saying the first bush was smart) doesn't mean you'll be smart. Schools are for education and learning. Not tradition.

 

 

Originally posted by yaebginn

All you liberals are all abou tconspiracies, Bush won fair and square.

Hehe, there was nothing fair about the 2000 election. And when I think of George W. I think of a circle more than a square.

[yaebginn]

yes you are. spoiled that is. You dont realise how good you have it in America.

 

and there cant be a democrat every year, just quit complaining about it and slap a Kerry/Edwards bumper sticker on your bicycle to get Bush out of office, otherwise, I'm gonna get another four years of you democrats whinng.

[reelguy227]

Originally posted by Revlt Coranier

 

 

 

Hehe, there was nothing fair about the 2000 election. And when I think of George W. I think of a circle more than a square.

 

yu talk about votes not being counted ,what about all the absentee ballots that were supposed to be counted from our men and women who voted while serving our country overseas ?

[SkinWalker]

Originally posted by yaebginn

Good, then get the heck out of my country. [...] You dont like it? Then go to Italy, with the hairy girls. Go on, have a good time.

 

That would be un-American. The American thing to do is dissent in order to change the government and nation you disagree with. The American thing to do is speak out. Those that just shut up and take whatever crap their leaders tell them deserve not be American.

 

 

Originally posted by yaebginn

And the governemnt was built on this religion.

 

The government was built on the principle that the people shall govern, regardless of religious ideology. Indeed, freedom from religion is why many people migrated to this nation. So your statement is merely wishful thinking on the part of someone who wants this country to be based on his/her religion.

[yaebginn]

not at all, they came here to worship God however they wanted and it was built on the principals and rules of the Christian religion.

[tFighterPilot]

Originally posted by yaebginn

not at all, they came here to worship God however they wanted and it was built on the principals and rules of the Christian religion.

:/

 

I think your history book is broken

[Mike Windu]

not at all, they came here to worship God however they wanted and it was built on the principals and rules of the Christian religion.

 

Christianity might have been there, but America was really founded on the idealism of freedom. Hence, allowing people to practice religion however the hell they want, even if that means they don't worship God.

 

Here, I'll say this again:

But the odd thing is that Jesus did not turn the disciples into storm troopers, burn down the Temple at Jerusalem, and fix the blame on the Pontius Pilate. On the contrary, he made it clear that the business of the philosopher was to make ideas AVAILABLE, and NOT to impose them on people.

 

I'm gonna say that every single time you bring up religion.

[tFighterPilot]

And as I said before, Jesus didn't want to create a new religion. Jesus was just a normal person.

[yaebginn]

I dont get it, how was what I said incorrect? the pilgrims were christian, in case you didnt know.

[tFighterPilot]

Originally posted by yaebginn

I dont get it, how was what I said incorrect? the pilgrims were christian, in case you didnt know.

The pilgrims were chrstian, but are you saying that everyone that came to the USA was a pilgrim?

[yaebginn]

no, but the ones who founded it and made it what it is today were. there were some indians, and some conquestadors and some frechys, but the pilgrims founded it and made it what it is.

[SkinWalker]

To suggest that "christians" fled religious persecution in other lands, came to North America, and created the United States based upon "christian principles," is non sequitur. That is to say, it doesn't follow that those who founded the nation were doing so with ideals that were the sole province and domain of christianity.

 

That the European ancestors who invaded conquered the North American continent were largely christian is actually a testiment to the vanity and evil nature of christianity of the time rather than the nobility of it. Millions of inhabitants already occupied the continent's 300 - 700 nations. The invaders who came, did so initially to support the economy of foriegn lands (England, Spain, Portugal, France). They raped, pilaged, burned villages, stole land, and commited wholesale genocide on a level that makes Hitler's Germany look docile. Blankets were given to natives that were intentionally infected with smallpox. Apaches, Zuni, and Navajo were enslaved in the West. Eastern nations fled, died or were killed and African slaves were imported to work the lands instead.

 

Are these the christian principles with which you speak?

 

Or are you referring to democracy, republican rule, freedom, liberty and religious choice? Those principles were born in the Greek world. But it is true that xianity has adopted and stolen much of its core religion from that of other, albeit polytheistic, religions. The popular image of fictional creatures like angels are taken directly from the Athenian Nike motif, for instance.

 

That this nation is founded on "christian ideals" is pure hogwash and xian propaganda. The idea is to keep people from thinking out of the box. Christianity cannot afford to have its followers use too much common sense or critical thinking, otherwise people will start to get ideas and see the truth. Instead, religions like xianity and islam wrap their doctrine in their self-described "truths" and create circular evidence. They use crap like "faith" to get people to abandon critical thinking and cease the search for evidence. After all, H. sapiens are a superstitious animal, as evidenced by the archaeological and epigraphical records.

 

This nation, the United States of America, was stolen from its rightful people. But in so doing, a true nation was created with hope, opportunity and inalienable rights for all. It was intended to be one nation -indivisible- with liberty and justice available for all who reside here.

 

Spirituality has its place. I commend anyone who can find peace and harmony, regardless of what religion they utilize if any. But to suggest that one religion should have dominance over all is bullsh*t. That assumption is distinctly un-American. There are many, many christians who are worthy of respect and admiration. But there are many christian nut-jobs (who, in all actuality, are really pseudo-christians) that want to inject their superstitions into the way the nation is governed.

 

Adding "under god" to the pledge of allegiance and "in god we trust" to coinage are clear examples. Superstitious nut-jobs fighting over idols that depict the 10-commandments (which no so-called christians follow) in public buildings are as well.

 

Many of the founding fathers of this nation questioned the validity of christianity and the christian doctrines of their time. In that age, when heresy was something that people still murdered each other over, it says a lot about their critical thinking.

 

A new religion is needed for the modern age. One that embraces spirituality and the kindness of the Jesus myth without side-lining and disenfranchising groups of people based on differences. One that accepts the tenents of science and acknowledges the age of the Earth and the validity of evolution without making up mythology to explain the complex or superstition to scare followers into believing.

 

Then, perhaps, a god will be found. That god will be life and existance itself, not the anthropomorphic expectation of immortality provided by an omniscent, omnipresent deity.

 

We'll call this new religion Humanity, and its hiearchy will be simple: you must be human to join, and respect Humanity to remain. No priests. No nuns. No televangelists.

[yaebginn]

and the pilgrims didnt build the country, they started it. the building to what it is today came later, with the revolutionary war.

[SkinWalker]

Originally posted by yaebginn

and the pilgrims didnt build the country, they started it.

 

Assumption and mythology. The pilgrims who fled from England and Northern Europe to ride the Mayflower to the North American continent landed in what is now considered New England. They were a minority of settlers in the New World, compared to the settlements elsewhere. They simply made for a good story. Many or most of them perished and moved on, replaced by more settlers at later periods.

 

The real beginnings of nation-building began with prologue to the Revolutionary War, when English colonists, who by this time had a generation or so of "American" born colonists but were still arriving from England, had had enough of the economic policy of the Motherland. England wanted all the profits and heavily taxed her subjects in the New World. Had she backed up her colonies with a real military presence, England might still be the rule of the land.

 

Colonists, however, noted that the military was as phyisically taxed as they were fiscally taxed. They were also not willing to allow tyrannical rule to govern them from afar, whilst their work and profit went to the royal coffers. "No taxation without representation," was a key focus for colonial businessmen. Our nation was built on capitalism, not christianity.

 

But there are those that will invoke quotes from famous Americans and Founding Fathers.

"The highest glory of the American Revolution was this: it connected in one indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity."

--President John Quincy Adams

 

"Nothing is more dreaded than the national government meddling with religion."-- John Adams

 

"Can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the gift of God? -- Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia, 1782.

 

But they will fail to offer other quotes by the same patriots that show that they were willing to question the role of christianity and religious dominance in nation-building.

 

"I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved--the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!"--John Adams in a letter to Thomas Jefferson

 

"But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legaends, hae been blended with both Jewish and Chiistian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed.--John Adams in a letter to F.A. Van der Kamp, Dec. 27, 1816

 

"The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity. Nowhere in the Gospels do we find a precept for Creeds, Confessions, Oaths, Doctrines, and whole carloads of other foolish trumpery that we find in Christianity." --John Adams

 

Or

"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between church and State."--Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptist Association on Jan. 1, 1802

 

"The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."--Thomas Jefferson, Notes on Virginia, Jefferson the President: First Term 1801-1805

 

After actually studying history and not simply accepting the dogma of one side of an issue, it would be foolish for one to state that the nation was "built upon christianity," not to mention arrogant and exclusionist.

 

Not bothering to study the nation's history and continuing to cite that the nation is built upon christianity is likewise as foolish.

 

Please take note that I used the same context of foolishness that Jed did in another post of another thread. He was accused of "flaming" then, but I'd like to point out that this is not an ad hominem remark, but rather one of logic.

[Mike Windu]

*bows down to Skin*