TSL Vs. KOTOR

[Emperor Devon]

1. I love games with incomprehensible banter.

 

How exactly is the banter "incomprehensible"? If you mean the dialogue is much deeper and isn't spoon-fed to you, then yes.

 

Seems to be fairly common with games or books that have deep stories... Half the fans will be enraptured by them, and the rest will dismiss it as too boring or complicated.

 

2. You can sell me a buggy game any old day, and I will nievely buy into your advertising.

 

I'm sorry, but the whole bug argument is just plain ridiculous. If anyone can remember back to those days, KotOR when it was unpatched had at least as many bugs as TSL did, if not more in my case.

 

3. Its okay to make flawed games. As long as you have my money, you can count on me to be a whipping boy.

 

Paying for a game means you're willing to buy low quality ones? For Pete's sake, if the game is worthless buying it would seem like the last thing someone would do.

 

4. The story was very well written, and I like boring, dull, and anoying characters.

 

Completely untrue. How on earth can you say that Malak, our completely characterless Vader rip-off who laughs insanely when his schemes come into fruition is superior to Kreia? He has absolutely no character development or backstory. He falls to the dark side and then kills his best friend. His goal is crush everyone beneath his heel and rule the galaxy. Where is the character in that? It's completely bland, unoriginal, 2-d, and totally black and white. Thank goodness for fan theories and fiction or he'd be one of the worst villains Star Wars has ever had. [/rant]

 

KotOR's characters are okay but I can't think of any truly outstanding ones. Kreia, on the other hand... WTF was boring or dull about her??

 

When it comes to Obsidian: One cannot dismiss NWN2.

 

Mmm, debatable. Apart from the ending I found the game to be immensly the enjoyable, and for all its ubgs, I found the NWN2 toolset to be vastly superior to NWN1's.

 

The ending might not be as bad as I thought though, since Obsidian has said they intend to make an expansion pack for the game taking place right after the battle with the KoS. We'll see how they finish that.

[Jediphile]

If I were to except 'KotOR II' as the better of the two, I would be telling Lucas Arts that:

 

1. I love games with incomprehensible banter.

2. You can sell me a buggy game any old day, and I will nievely buy into your advertising.

3. Its okay to make flawed games. As long as you have my money, you can count on me to be a whipping boy.

4. The story was very well written, and I like boring, dull, and anoying characters.

 

The problem with these statements is that you proceed to make them on the basis that your reasons are factual. Which they are not. You may THINK that TSL has "incomprehensible banter" and boring, dull and annoying characters, but many of us would disagree. As ED points out, Kreia is an infinitely better character than Mr. Cheesy (Malak) could ever hope to be... Or at least so I think. In short, you base your conclusion on facts that are still in dispute and then you proceed as if they are established as facts. People can and probably will take issue with that.

 

I can't even agree that the game was bugged, since I've completed it several times and never patched it once. Same with KotOR, There are bugs, yes, but there are in all games. Are there more in TSL than in KotOR. I'm not sure. maybe there are, but quickloading when you run into one has solved my problem in most cases in both games, so it's difficult to say. The game suffered from cut content, yes, but what was in there actually worked for me.

 

When it comes to Obsidian: One cannot dismiss NWN2. Even though there are interesting things going on in the game, I can still see the same mistakes being made. They just don't listen to fans. Period.

 

While I haven't played NWN2 (and am not about to, either), this seems to be at least debateable as well.

[Pavlos]

They just don't listen to fans. Period.

 

Odd... I think they do .

 

If you would care to click here I think you'll find that the developer-community communication is excellent. I think every week the community director sets up a new thread about how the classes can be improved, or better implemented. If you check Obsidian's blog you'll find that after the (entirely warranted) whining of the community about not having a model export tool, Obsidian have started up a Granny beta. There are numerous other examples if you would care to search around.

 

As to NWN2's plot... I'm a fan, what can I say? The ending was... rubbishy but we now know that there was a reason behind that - admittedly, they could have voiced it a little better but the point still stands.

[Jae Onasi]

They could have at least showed you escaping from the rubble of the building and showed the sun coming out for a LS ending in NWN2. I think a lot of us would have been happier with that. And maybe for a DS ending you pushing aside some rubble and the darkness increasing. At least there would have been some resolution there.

 

I like both Kotor and TSL. I like both for very different reasons, however. If Malachor wasn't so devoid of life and the chance to have some witty conversation with party members, and you'd had the chance to see that you rescued your party for the LS ending and subjugated Malachor and the galaxy for a DS ending, I think it would have been much better. As it is, I play either depending of the particular mood I'm in at that moment, and enjoy the aspects unique to each.

[Jediphile]

Malachor V was, dramatically, pretty disappointment in TSL.

 

"Oooh, storm beasts! How scary!!"

 

I mean, it's supposed to be a dead world, right? So what are those beasts doing there? Except serving as opposition to test my lightsaber against...

 

The poisonous areas were much better, since they were scary. There should have been no monsters on the surface of Malachor V. Instead it should have been a far more hostile place with explosions going off randomly, rocks falling on you, etc. All to give the appearance that the planet itself is evil and trying to kill you. Oh, and maybe hazy, dreamlike images of exile and/or companions trying to kill him. It should have been more like the tomb on Korriban taken to the tenth power.

 

The Trayus Academy was okay, but fairly unexciting dramatically until you reach Sion and Traya. Just stuffed full of Sith for you to slaughter - booooorrrrriiiinnnnnnggggg!!!

 

There was very little sense of uneasy or forboding there. It should have been a place, where you feel the very walls bleed with forbidden and ancient lore. Instead it's just a big hackfest

[mjpb3]

While some people believe that KotOR II: TSL had a weak plot and sub-par writing, I would have to say I really disagree. I’m sorry, but I really think they just weren't intelligent enough to understand the games subdued, yet morally complex plot which concluded in a duel with the woman who is almost solely responsible for your own salvation.

I am probably going to get flamed for this, but...

 

@ The Architect:

I find your sig highly offensive. I realize that this is your opinion and you are more than entitled to it, but to just assume that people who didn't like the plot of K2 are too stupid to grasp the plot of K2 is very offensive--if to no one else, then just to me.

 

I found the plot and writing in K2 to be bad, and that is my opinion--and no, you won't change my opinion by rehashing everything that has been stated in this thread. I made up my mind about K2 long ago while I was still playing K2 on the XBox, and there's nothing anyone could say to change my opinion. I found the game to be sub-par to KotOR 1. That's my opinion.

 

No matter what was intended for K2, the fact remains that the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1.

 

Everyone can say that K1 was too much like the movies to enjoy, or whatever else it is that has been stated ad nauseam in this thread, but no one seems to grasp the fact that K1 was supposed to be reminiscent to the movies. That was the whole point of KotOR 1.

 

Those of us who did not like K2 are perfectly entitiled to our opinion, and frankly, statements about our intelligence are downright insulting.

 

I am perfectly aware what the plot of K2 was about. It still doesn't mean that I have to like the game. I don't. I don't hate it, but in comparison to K1, in my opinion, K2 falls short of what I wanted and expected a sequel to K1 to be.

 

This whole thread has turned into one giant debate where it's the K2 fans against the K1 fans, and it seems to me that since the K2 fans can't sway the opinions of the K1 fans then they've decided to attack the "intelligence" of the K1 fans for not liking the different aspects of K2...

 

 

Anyway, that's my two cents, and now, I shall bow out because I have stated my opinion...

[Jediphile]

I am probably going to get flamed for this, but...

 

@ The Architect:

I find your sig highly offensive. I realize that this is your opinion and you are more than entitled to it, but to just assume that people who didn't like the plot of K2 are too stupid to grasp the plot of K2 is very offensive--if to no one else, then just to me.

 

As The Architect has already stated previously in this very thread, that is a quote from someone else and not his words

http://www.lucasforums.com/showpost.php?p=2302514&postcount=170

 

I found the plot and writing in K2 to be bad, and that is my opinion--and no, you won't change my opinion by rehashing everything that has been stated in this thread. I made up my mind about K2 long ago while I was still playing K2 on the XBox, and there's nothing anyone could say to change my opinion. I found the game to be sub-par to KotOR 1. That's my opinion.

 

No matter what was intended for K2, the fact remains that the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1.

 

Wrong. You were right the first time. That's your opinion. It is not, however, a fact.

[mjpb3]

As The Architect has already stated previously in this very thread, that is a quote from someone else and not his words

http://www.lucasforums.com/showpost.php?p=2302514&postcount=170

And if he is using a paraphrased version of that quote as his sig, then I don't think I am being too remiss in assuming that his sig reflects his opinion. I could very well be wrong, but that is neither here nor there. The point is that I still find his sig quote to be offensive.

 

Wrong. You were right the first time. That's your opinion. It is not, however, a fact.

And that is your opinion, as well. We could go round and round with this...

[Jediphile]

And that is your opinion, as well. We could go round and round with this...

 

Correct, but there is an important difference - I have not said that one game being better than the other is a fact, as you indeed have:

 

No matter what was intended for K2, the fact remains that the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1.

 

That's an opinion, but you're actually saying it's a fact. You may not have meant to, but you still did.

 

And in closing, I have actually not said that I thought TSL was better than KotOR. Take a look at the post you're respond to here - I actually avoided saying either way, because it's a close call for me. But I have said in the past that while I find TSL to have better plot and characters, I find KotOR to be the better gaming experience due to its more completed status, since TSL suffers horribly from cut content. Therefore I would rate KotOR ever so slightly above TSL in the final analysis. But it's just an opinion, albeit not the one you seem to think I have.

[Jae Onasi]

I'm addressing the sig issue. Please stay on topic. Make sure to stay nice to each other.

 

@JP below--that was a general statement, not one directed at you in particular.

[Jediphile]

If people say that it's a fact that TSL is a bad game or even just worse than KotOR, then I'll reserve the right to point that out as incorrect.

 

If people say, "No matter what was intended for K2, the fact remains that I think the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1," then no problem.

 

Heck, I wouldn't even object if someone said, "No matter what was intended for K2, the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1," because that's still just an opinion.

 

But if they say, "No matter what was intended for K2, the fact remains that the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1," as was done here, then I will object, because it is an untrue statement, yet is claimed to be factual.

 

There is an important difference between these, since the first two are statements of an opinion while the third is a statement of facts, which are not established. You do see that, right?

[The Source]

If people say that it's a fact that TSL is a bad game or even just worse than KotOR, then I'll reserve the right to point that out as incorrect.

 

If people say, "No matter what was intended for K2, the fact remains that I think the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1," then no problem.

 

Heck, I wouldn't even object if someone said, "No matter what was intended for K2, the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1," because that's still just an opinion.

 

But if they say, "No matter what was intended for K2, the fact remains that the game that was released was abysmal in comparison to KotOR 1," as was done here, then I will object, because it is an untrue statement, yet is claimed to be factual.

 

There is an important difference between these, since the first two are statements of an opinion while the third is a statement of facts, which are not established. You do see that, right?

When it comes to what is 'fact' and what is 'not fact', each of our oppinions are factual to how we believe. I know what you are going, and I had a friend with the same type of mannerism. Since you could't discredit anything, you are looking for language loop holds to make arguements.

 

Each person has an opinion, which is based upon a set of facts. If I remember corretly, 90% (my own estimate) of all the TSL magazines and online reviews was positive. As someone who worked for a magazine and newspaper, (graphic design department), I can honestly tell you that their reviews were based upon a biased opinion. Nothing in magazines or newspapers are 100% factual in nature.

 

When it comes to game reviews for popular franchises, such as Star Wars and Star Trek, I think that some reveiwers want to be the first with praise. They work blindly to be the first to say, "This game is cool." Now, do they represent the majority? I cannot answer that question. What I do know for a factor is that magazine and online reviews are biased towards a specific direction. If the reviewer is getting paid by Star Wars for advertising space, you can only guess what the answer is to that question. -or- The reveiwers expects to have an interview with the game developer. If they wrote a bad review, they could end up loosing the oportunity to talk to their favorite franchise.

 

Some people online are so desperate to keep an audience that they kiss behind to make a buck. That takes away from the intergrity of the website. I actually got into an argument with the owner of Game Banshee (over a KotOR II review and patch release). He was so worry about his reputation that he had to enter someone else's forums to argue his case. If he was not desperate to keep visitors, my comments should not have bothered him. I call that a sign of weakness.

 

As for the KotOR I vrs. KotOR II conversation, I think everyone has contributed something interesting to the topic. Just because certain people like the game, I am not going to tell them that they have it all wrong. When I called the story incomprehensible, I was refering to storyarchs similar to Go-To's. They are so illogical that it seemed very infintile. The problem is that there were several illogical moments in KotOR, and they took away from the intellegence of the game.

 

Now, I do know what KotOR II is about. I wouldn't be making my statements nievely. I give mjpb3 a thumbs up for sharing an opinion, and I look forward to reading more from this forumite.

[Jae Onasi]

Alright, we've established that opinion does not necessarily equate with fact. Let's move on before anyone takes offense over semantics.

[The Source]

Alright, we've established that opinion does not necessarily equate with fact. Let's move on before anyone takes offense over semantics.

Since most of his comments were geared towards my statements, I thought I would respond to his posts. I can see the wisdom in your post.

 

Now back to our regularly schedulled program:

 

KotOR I vrs. KotOR II

[Nikkolas]

Okay, need to clear a few things up.

 

Who Could Stop Nihilus-

 

Anyone in The Force and with no defense is doomed.This includes Revan, Kun, Bane... The only people with a possible defense are Palpatine, who was said to know all Ancient Sith techniques and then some, who himself can drain millions of people and then Luke who, as of Legacy of The Force, can do something and remove himself from The Force.

 

Droids? Nihilus lifted a fleet of ships from a gravity well...goodbye droids.

 

Vong? A battered and tortured Tahiri Veila was capable of nearly killing 2 Vong Shapers. The Vong themselves may not exist in The Force but AIR does. So you manipulate said air, create a vacuum around their head and...dead Vong.

 

There’s also Luke’s Emerald Lightning which seems to be nothing more than light-side Force lightning. And it was killing multiple Vong instantly.

 

Finally, when the Exile finally beat Nihilus, he was in a bad way. Starving to death basically. And yet he still could have killed her...he only decided to try and drain her and thus screwed himself.

 

And why does he need a fleet if he’s so powerful? Palpatine is described as the most powerful Sith in history. He can summon a Force Storm (a technique by Palpatine that destroys space-time, creates wormholes and annihilates whole starfleets) yet he still wants a Galaxy Gun, two Eclipse-class Super Star Destroyers, a Sun Crusher, two Death Stars, an Eye of Palpatine, World Devastators....

 

I think a book about Nihilus’ origins be awesome. Learn about what or who he is, his and Sion’s tuotolage under Traya and what he did after he beat the crap out of her by just shoving her into a wall.

[The Architect]

Look, you're just ticked off that someone has a different opinion about KotOR II than you do.

 

Is my bias that obvious?

 

I would hate it if I had the same opinion as the majority. If we were all the same, our world would be similar to the one in "Fahrenheit 451". Personally, I take great pride in my opinion, and I respect your thoughts about KotOR II.

 

When it comes to voicing my opinion, I don't have a responsibility to up hold. These forums were built upon opinions, and I will not hold back on my thoughts. If I believe something is pathetically horrible, I am going to voice my opinion about the matter. As long as I don't break the forum rules, I can continue to exercise my freedoms. Period.

 

Of course. I don't disagree, so why exactly are you telling me this?

 

PC/NPC Involvement - Side Quests are almost non-existant.

When I talk about side-quests, I was refering to the PC/NPC stand alone quests. In KotOR I, every single NPC/PC had a small personal quest. Carth, Bastila, Mission, etc... In KotOR II, the only personal side quest that made it into game was Mandalore's. Plus, he side-quest was to gather forces, but they didn't reveal anything personal about him. Otherwords, we were not in search to find anything to help him out personally. Within KotOR I, Mission's brother, Bastila's family, Carth's son, etc...

 

I think it was a bit too convenient how the personal quests for Carth, Mission, Canderous, Jolee, Bastila and Juhani all just happened to be on the planets that you travel to in search of the Star Maps. I guess the Force works in mysterious ways.

 

It would’ve been pretty dodgy in TSL if once again, the companions of the Exile, in possession of the same ship Revan had in his/her adventure (the Ebon Hawk) just happened to have had personal quests on the planets that you just happen to be travelling to in your main quest.

 

Don’t forget, Obsidian may have intended to give all of the Exile’s companion’s personal quests like in KotOR, but they had what, just over a year or something, compared to BioWare, who had approximately three years to develop the game, so time wasn’t on their side.

 

PC/NPCs that slightly interact with the PC durring the course of the quests. / PC/NPCs that interact with each other mostly on the Ebon Hawke.

When I talked about interaction in this statement, I was refering to the PC/NPCs interupting you on your journey. Most of the dialogue in KotOR II happens on the Hawke. In KotOR I, Mission, Bastila, Carth, and the others interupt your exploration. Otherwords, you can stand on Dantooine, and Mission will give you a saddened look. The game will pause and say, "Mission looks like she has something to say, try talking to her to find out what is on her mind." In KotOR II, the interaction only happens when you hit an encounter. Otherwords, triggers at certain locations trip off, but your dialogue with the PC/NPC is soley about that specific location. The PC/NPCs don't talk about their own lives, and the game doesn't pause and say, "Kreia looks upset with you, maybe you should talk to her."

 

So what? Umm...the way I see it, this speaks in favour of TSL. How silly is it that in the middle of an important quest, one of your companions all of a sudden wants to tell you about their personal lives? A bit random don’t you think?

 

I’d much prefer that they tell me something specific about the location I’m in, or something relevant to the quest or the plot, like in TSL. Personal life talk crap belongs on the Ebon Hawk, where you have more time to talk to your companions.

 

One Major Villan.

When I talk about 'one major villan', I am refering to Kreia soley. Out of all the characters in the game, Kreia was the puppet master - the manipulator. All other villans were her lap dogs. This is not a game failure.

 

I beg to differ. I think the villains in TSL are far better than the pathetic villains in KotOR. I’ve already explained why in post 165# of this thread. I believe that the gameplay, not the writing, was the problem with Nihilus, Sion, and Atris.

 

PC/NPCs do not create personal connections with PC.

KotoR II does not have any characters that make a personal connection to the PC. Most of the PC/NPCs fall short in their romance stories. What I believe people enjoyed of 'KotOR I' was the interpersonal connections they made with Carth, Bastila, and Juhanne. What drove me personally to 'KotOR II' was the possibility for more interaction with the PC/NPCs. I was looking for that romantic element that made 'KotOR I' interesting to be in 'KotOR II'. I didn't feel for Mira when I had to go save her. When you play 'KotOR I', you build a relationship with Bastila. As she is being turtored, you feel saddened or angry about her situation. I was driven to save her life. When Mira is caught by Visquis, I only saved her so I can use her as an PC/NPC. Nothing emotional about it.

 

You speak as if your feelings equate to everyone else’s. They don’t.

 

I couldn’t stand Carth, Bastila and Juhani. All they did was whine or bicker, and talk about their clichéd pasts. And I think that the romance story with Bastila/Carth was pretty cheesy.

 

We’ve already seen romances in Star Wars plenty of times before. We’ve seen it in the PT, the OT, KotOR, and I think even in the comics or whatever (the stuff that takes place after RotJ, when Luke Skywalker is a Jedi Master and all that).

 

This is what Chris Avellone had to say about the romances in TSL:

http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=25810&view=findpost&p=203685

 

And in my opinion, implied romances are far more intriguing than gushing, blatantly obvious romances. Although I will admit, I thought the romances were so subdued in TSL to the point that it was completely forgettable.

 

However, I don’t believe romances are essential to role-playing games (fun, but not essential) and as I’ve said, gushing, blatantly obvious romances have been done before in Star Wars. Why must the same clichés be used over and over again?

 

As I said, I found Bastila to be an obnoxious, annoying, insular, uninteresting cow. Being forced to save her was a pain in the neck. But then no one deserves to be tortured by the cheesiest villain in all of Star Wars…well, Jar-Jar is an exception.

 

Jedi / Sith Training on the Road.

Another thing that I found successful about 'KotOR I' was the ability to learn in a Sith or Jedi temple. It would have been nice to goto 'Yavin IV' and find a Sith enclave. While you are there, you could have found some teachings or something. In KotOR II, Dantooine was a very big disapointment for me. It would have been nice to search the library and find some cool archives. Maybe we could have learned something new about the Sith or Jedi. We didn't.

 

Meh. It all just comes down to personal taste I guess. I thought Dantooine was quite interesting in TSL, and suited the general feel of the game. I wouldn’t want to see it again in KotOR III though.

 

You can not kill your PC/NPC. Unless you are Kreia

When I talk about killing the PC/NPCs, I refer to how you can kill Bastila, Mission, Juhanne, and Jolee in KotOR I. What KotOR II lack was the ability to kill your PC/NPCS. This would have been a cool move.

 

P.S. - I don't care about what was cut from the game. What I played is what I played. Period. Cut content means sqwat if it is not implimented.

 

This I agree with. You can’t blame Obsidian for this though. How did they know that LA was going to cut two months from an already unreasonable and tough time schedule? They didn’t. They HAD to cut interesting and important things from the game. WHAT other choice did they have? They aren’t super humans. Yes I know, you don’t care about whose fault it is. Bah!

 

Dialogue Ending (Boring and Anti-Climatic Ending.)

After meeting Kreia for the first time, you know she is the main villan. Her appearance mirrors the Emporer to the 'T'. There was no question about who I would face at the end of the game. In KotOR I, the revelations were unpredicatable. Yes, you knew Malek was your engame opponent, but you didn't see Bastila's turn coming from a mile away. Only after her turture cutscene played, you can predict what would happen next. But, not from the beginning of the game.

 

What is this garbage I hear about how the Kreia plot twist was oh so predictable? Finding out that Kreia is Darth Traya and is the villain you’re supposed to stop wasn’t surprising in the slightest, as it was never meant to be a plot twist in the first place. Some people seemed to have missed the point there. Obsidian made no effort to hide it, nor did Kreia. Even the player was allowed to distrust her from the beginning.

 

The point with Kreia was to discover why she chose to tag along with the Exile in the first place, or in other words, what her motivations were for following you (the Exile). Her intentions only become clear towards the end. So her betrayal wasn't expected to be unexpected, the point was to find out why she would betray you and why she followed you, which in my opinion, wasn’t exactly clear until the latter stages of the game.

 

Anyhow, yeah, for you they were, but not necessarily everyone else. You DO NOT speak for everyone else. Whether you believe me or not, I saw the Revan plot twist and Bastila’s fall coming a mile away.

 

I went over some of the many clues of the Revan plot twist in post #62 of this thread. That was BioWare’s problem. It was an interesting idea, but they sugar coated the twist with so many clues it wasn’t funny. I found their attempt at subtlety to be appalling.

 

I found the Bastila twist to be obvious too. You kept getting reminded what would happen if Bastila fell to the dark side, Bastila’s attitude had DS written all over it and her “the dark side is so dangerous, what if I fell to the DS, I can’t imagine myself falling to the DS” talks plus the fact she wielded a yellow lightsaber (symbolism for her fall if you ask me) for me, made the twist at least for me pretty bloody unsurprising.

 

Now, I’m not saying those who didn’t figure out the plot twists are idiots. I mean while he may deny it, I consider Jediphile to be a lore master of well…pretty much everything (forgot to insert giggle smilie here). I have a lot of respect for him. And he said he didn’t figure out the Revan plot twist in KotOR.

 

I won’t go into the “why”, all I’m saying is that not everyone didn’t see the plot twists in KotOR coming.

 

Game was not drentched with Sith and Jedi History.

Oh yes. I believe KotOR II needed some knee deep Sith and Jedi history. Obsidian didn't bother to tell us anything new about their history. When you play through 'KotOR I', I learned something new from beginning to end. 'KotOR II' lacked quizitive information, which may shead light on stuff that could have happened even further back in history.

 

To quote Jediphile:

 

KotOR1: 17. Mandalorian history told only from biased source (Canderous).

KotOR2: 16. Mandalore's take on history questioned by Bao-Dur. Vast expansion on Mandalorian Wars and Revan's goals and motives in it.

 

Personally, I found the conversations with Atris, Kreia and the Handmaiden to be far more interesting than anything KotOR had to offer.

 

Oh, and I changed my signature. I don’t mind if people like KotOR more than TSL, because everyone is entitled to their own opinions. Duh, that’s a given. It’s just that I don’t like:

 

“TSL was full of meaningless and emotionless banter.”

 

I’d prefer:

 

“TSL was full of meaningless and emotionless banter. For example, just look at how…”

 

I have nothing against MacCorp’s argument as to why he thinks KotOR is better than TSL. I disagree with him of course, but oh well, we can't all have the same opinions, or we could, but we just don't.

[SilentScope001]

Frankly, they are both good games for different people. People who love traidtional Star Wars play KOTOR. People who love ethical relativism play TSL. TSL and KOTOR are both two different games made for two different groups. Just because I love TSL does not make KOTOR a bad game. It tells more about my personality than about the game itself...

 

I quote this again, because I am getting somewhat tired of this debate.

 

You know...if we're going to have this sort of argument over a game that people like just because they like it...I can't begin to think what would happen when K3 comes along and becomes a total flop.

[Christos K]

I love both games so much. KOTOR has super cool characters and a good plot. TSL has super cool characters, an extremely dark but good plot, and better gameplay. But KOTOR had a few more better characters: Jolee, Canderous, HK-47, even Zaalbar was kind of cool (Only because he was big, furry, and strong.) I admit Darth Malak was to much like Vader but I like the plot still, At least they didnt have another Sith Lord instead of Bandon that was very simmilar to Sidious. But look in TSL Kreia is a complete female version of Obi-Won and Palpatine. Atton is more elike Han Solo then Carth. I also like TSL for how many more powerful force powers there were, I liked how they increased weapon damage and defense, I think they exagerated way too much on Darth Sion and Darth Nihilus. I mean that is just far too powerful, I liked where the level cap was, I do like that they made all of the bosses much stronger though.