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Originally posted by Jan Gaarni

It's probably EU. Like the Ewok series for instance.

 

 

The Holocron wasn't created to say what book, novel, game, film etc. is G-Level or C-level or whatever level they use, but each and every single reference within said book, film, game, etc....

 

A good point to remember. Parts of the Star Wars Holiday Special for example, might be G-Level canon, while a larger portion of it has become N-Level canon (supposedly).

 

The term "EU" is really not that useful when it comes to this, because it stands for "Expanded Universe" and quite literally means all the storys in Star Wars other than the movies themselves. With the C-Level (Continuity) and G-Level (George Lucas) Canon, you at least have the heirarchy of "authority" as to what is "real" in the series.

 

The point is to determine where the story goes from here. The trouble is that Lucas himself can do whatever he wants, including contradict old sources and rewrite them (as he's done with his constant revisions to the OT for example). The rest of the franchise just has to play catch up. Oh well, it's been this way for almost a decade now!

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Originally posted by Kurgan

 

The term "EU" is really not that useful when it comes to this, because it stands for "Expanded Universe" and quite literally means all the storys in Star Wars other than the movies themselves.

If that's true then they must have changed the policy in recent years and bumped down the script, movie novels and radio drama's into what we in the past would have considered to be EU.

 

On the other hand, that would mean everything is canon (except for fan fiction etc...), divided into 2 catagories (G and C levels). I have no trouble with this, it means that if it's G-level or C-level it's part of Star Wars and cannot be disregarded no matter what anyone personally think. But it does make it harder to argue what is correct and what is not. The star destroyer dome issue for instance comes to mind. :)

 

Personally though, I've stopped caring as passionatly anymore.

 

Whatever they decide what is what I'll wait and see and then relearn Star Wars from scratch. ;)

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  • 3 weeks later...
Originally posted by Jan Gaarni

If that's true then they must have changed the policy in recent years and bumped down the script, movie novels and radio drama's into what we in the past would have considered to be EU.

 

On the other hand, that would mean everything is canon (except for fan fiction etc...), divided into 2 catagories (G and C levels). I have no trouble with this, it means that if it's G-level or C-level it's part of Star Wars and cannot be disregarded no matter what anyone personally think. But it does make it harder to argue what is correct and what is not. The star destroyer dome issue for instance comes to mind. :)

 

Personally though, I've stopped caring as passionatly anymore.

 

Whatever they decide what is what I'll wait and see and then relearn Star Wars from scratch. ;)

 

What is the point of "canon" in a fictional franchise anyway? Theoretically if you were going to do some kind of "Vs." debate it would make sense, but in a practical sense it's for continuity-sake.

 

That is, when a new official book, game, or cartoon comes out, the writers are supposed to go "Oh, we can't do X and Y, because it's previously been established that... etc" Or "we have to make sure we mention A and B, in our new source, because they are part of the story already established..."

 

The trouble is that Lucas basically changes things whenever it suites him (modifying old movies, releasing new ones, although he's done once ROTS hits DVD, at least in terms of brand new films) and the liscensed authors just have to retcon things as best they can.

 

Yes, everything official (ie: liscensed... so fan fiction/films are excluded) is "canon" EXCEPT for stuff like Infinities and the first 20 issues of "Star Wars Tales."

 

And the levels of canon are for determining what source "wins" if there is a contradiction. This isn't always perfect though since if there are contradictions on the same level (like say in the movies) then you just have to leave it to the Holocron to figure it out.

 

 

I wouldn't say that the Radio Dramas, Screenplays and Novelisations of the films are now "EU." Only the parts of them that depict events that aren't in the films (like the new history of the Sith) would be "expanded material" logically. But as a whole that source would still be higher level of "authority" than say, some comic book in C-Level.

 

On the other hand it's been pointed out that you don't de-canonize entire sources because of one contradiction, only the part that contradicts. But without an official retcon, it's anyone's guess how it's resolved.

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  • 1 month later...

as a member of the 501st we are told cannon is anything that is in the movies, tv series etc.

 

 

Unfornately Anakin when he became vader before the mask we just can't quite agree on for some weird reason *shrug*

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Originally posted by ^Invader

Unfornately Anakin when he became vader before the mask we just can't quite agree on for some weird reason *shrug*

 

Anakin doesnt need the suit to be Darth Vader. He became a Dark Lord of the Sith when Darth Sidious declared him as his apprentice. Just because we first got to know him in the suit doesnt make that an ummutable point. I would think the 501st crowd were fanboyish enough to realise that :p

 

mtfbwya

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Originally posted by Astrotoy7

Anakin doesnt need the suit to be Darth Vader. He became a Dark Lord of the Sith when Darth Sidious declared him as his apprentice. Just because we first got to know him in the suit doesnt make that an ummutable point. I would think the 501st crowd were fanboyish enough to realise that :p

Werdz.

 

Story-wise Anakin/Darth Vader was never intended to end up in a lifesupport suit. Of course, that was an undesirable turn of events because it ment that Vader ended up being much less powerful than he would have been had he not been injured. That was the whole reason why Palpatine later sought to replace him with Luke. Luke was in essense the young, undamaged version of Vader, and had the potential that Vader never fulfilled.

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Originally posted by ^Invader

hehe tell legion command and the other 2999 members LOL

 

or tell a couple of LF mods and LFs 90, 000 members :p

 

anyways, any subsequent discussion *must* be back on topic...

 

 

mtfbwya

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Originally posted by Frankencow

Woops, mods ignore that other post. I hit the wrong button...

 

ahem

 

So does he officially die or live and get away? I've been mixed up by playing Shadows too much.

 

Frankecow, this thread is solely for the purpose of discussion the definitions and limitation of canonical classification.

 

Your question about Dash belongs in that Dash Rendar thread(which I have replied to)..

 

It is possible to delete posts by pressing the "edit" button. You will notice a "delete post" check box - cjeck it and sumbit, and thats it !

 

mtfbwya

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  • 4 months later...
  • 3 weeks later...

I agree i feel SS is full of it, personally his involvement in anything. IF he worked with LFL or whatnot he would be under a NDA, and from what i see on his site he more likes to talk folx down and very willing to talk about it. Most guys in the 501st thinks he's full of it, and im one of them.

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I agree i feel SS is full of it, personally his involvement in anything. IF he worked with LFL or whatnot he would be under a NDA, and from what i see on his site he more likes to talk folx down and very willing to talk about it. Most guys in the 501st thinks he's full of it, and im one of them.

 

lolz... I dont think even SS's mother is that fond of him :p what's there to be proud of ??

 

*but before this thread degenerates into a SS hate-fest, I request we steer the topic of discussion back onto canon...

 

mtfbwya

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I am new to these forums, originally I was only part of the Empire At War forums, but for reasons I do not know or care I was asked to re-register for the Empire At War.net forums and now have access to these forums as well. Seeing as how it seams these forums and the individuals who grace them appear to be more understanding then most I have a question about what is "cannon".

 

Ever since reading the NJO and discovering this new Jedi Philosophy, can't exactly remember what it was called or even if it had a name. But is it considered "cannon"? Me personally being a big fan of the original three ever since I was a child, always considered the force to have two sides the Light and Dark, and have direct consequences for using anger to fuel ones power in the force. So where does this new Jedi Philosophy fit in? If it fits in at all?

 

Thank You for taking your time to read and reply to my question.

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Hello splintercell, welcome to the EU forums :D

 

This question is equally applicable in the Dark Nest Trilogy thread, but also applies in this discussion. The first page of this thread outlines Lucasfilm Licensing's current canon classification standard.

 

The novels, books, comics, even the Clone Wars series fall into a secondary category called C-level. Thi "highest" level is G-level basically anything that appears in the movies or screenplays, and was written by George Lucas himself. Therefore, even the movie novelisations(except ANH) can be considered C level canon.

 

Hence, the NJO and the Dark Nest books are definitely canon.

 

As for the revised force philosophy, this isnt really held by all the jedi. If you read the Dark Nest Trilogy, you will learn about the clashes this is causing in the jedi order. There is more discussion about this in the Dark Nest thread(see main page). Personally, I find the new philosophy refreshing, but it doesnt seem like its going to be adhered to by most of the jedi, in particular the Masters Council.

 

mtfbwya

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As for the revised force philosophy, this isnt really held by all the jedi. If you read the Dark Nest Trilogy, you will learn about the clashes this is causing in the jedi order. There is more discussion about this in the Dark Nest thread(see main page). Personally, I find the new philosophy refreshing, but it doesnt seem like its going to be adhered to by most of the jedi, in particular the Masters Council.

 

mtfbwya

 

Maybe a NJO civil war is just around the corner?

 

perhaps - I havent read Book 2 or 3 yet :(

 

mtfbwya

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Just a sidenote: Splintercell, you have always had access to these forums. :)

 

When you registered for the Empire at War.Net forums, you essentially registered at LucasForums.com, and not Empire at War.net forums alone.

 

So you have access to the Jedi Knight.net forums, Xwing Alliance.net forums, Dark Forces forums, etc etc ......

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Just a sidenote: Splintercell, you have always had access to these forums. :)

 

When you registered for the Empire at War.Net forums, you essentially registered at LucasForums.com, and not Empire at War.net forums alone.

 

So you have access to the Jedi Knight.net forums, Xwing Alliance.net forums, Dark Forces forums, etc etc ......

 

 

werdz. what may have happened is that he had gone into a new area and couldnt get on because he wasnt logged in. Thats happened to me. Maybe someone should delete his extraneous account, lest he gets accidentally banned for it !

 

mtfbwya

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  • 6 months later...

Well, DOn't revive old thread... then again this is a Sticky.

 

I am kinda used to people warped sense of Canon, like the ones who would ignore G-canon(yes I say G-canon not C-canon, as they think they are better than GL on what is correct) and believe in his own sense of so-called "canonized existance"

 

These SS-oids are not as uncommon as we would hope unfortunately.

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  • 5 months later...

I know this is an old thread, but as people have said, "This is a sticky."

 

After thinking about what the Expanded Universe is about, I drew one simple conclusion to all this canon talk. The Star Wars Movies are the sole source of main canon. Everything that is called "Expanded Universe' is secondary canon, and only hold weight to their appropriate series or genera.

 

What got me ticked about the 'New Jedi Order' is that it pulled all of EU together. I personally hate the idea of unifying EU. Why? What I like about EU (before NJO) was that I could find my own series to hide in, and there were multiple-creative perspectives of Star Wars. Now, every writter has to stay consistant. Grrr... If I want to keep Chewbacca alive, I could easily follow a particular writter. Because of what was descided by the powers-that-be, that is to unify EU, I am beginning to be turned away from Star Wars novels. I no longer have my own EU-canon version to follow. Instead, I have cheap writting, cheap grammar, and cheap storylines to follow. Gr... At the current moment, there is no escape from 'NJO' cannon. Very sad...

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