Do we die to live or do we live to die?

[Emperor Devon]

I believe there is no such thing as reincarnation. When we die, we are gone forever, and cease to exist. There is no afterlife. That is why you should live life to the fullest - eighty or so years is all you'll ever get, so you might as well enjoy it.

[Darth333]

Jedigoku: stop posting irrelevant comments in this thread. We all heard that you don't like religion and it's ok but there is no point in trying to have this thread closed by posting irrelevant comments just because you don't like it. Respect the other members in their beliefs.

 

I erased most of your posts. However if you continue, there could be some disciplinary measures... If you have nothing to discuss, pass your turn.

 

If you have something to say concerning this warning, PM me instead of posting your comments here.

 

To everyone: Please do not discuss this post. Keep the discussion civilized and on topic. The discussion has been respectful until now, keep it that way.

[T7nowhere]

I believe Religion is an invention of Humans(PC) and speaks volumes of our nature.

 

But first let me say, Stop the flames and the off topic posts if you want this thread to continue(which 90% of this thread has been:rolleyes: )! The topic of the post is a question regarding death.

 

I believe death is a cycle of life, without death how could we have life. There is always a beginning and an end to all things. A balance in the Universe that is probably for the most part equal.

 

I don't know what comes after death and frankly I'm not concerned about it since its something I can't control. Though I do take effort to not die I am alive now and thats what matters.

 

The topic question is an odd one, But like I said in my third paragraph ,you can't have one without the other.

[Bastila]

I'm not really reglious, but i do hope there is somekind of afterlife, if not then having this life and living it the best and saying things like ''your the best parents'' or ''your the love of my life'' will mean nothing if you are born again, so i hope there is somekind of afterlife.

[Aristotélēsticus]

Muslem faith believes that god CANNOT "die" right? Such as the death of Jesus.

 

Yes, god is above all of the nature laws, he is above time and place, and for this he is not limited by place for "he is everywhere" and he is not limited by time for

"he has no beginning nor end"

 

 

and for the record I DON'T BELIEVE IN RELIGON because there have been to many wars about religous beliefs

 

the reason beyond this wars are human nature not religions, coz all religions order us to love eachothers, but humans are evil and they use religion to effect their fellows and lead them to wars that feed their desires and lust for power.

 

 

May I ask another? In the Muslem faith are there different "sects" that radically differ in belief as there are present in christianity?

 

Offcourse, there are two basic sects(sonnies, and Shiites) and these sects are divided into lower sects, and this what I meant by the corruption of the human mind, because we see that the followers of one book are measured in hundreds of sects and fought eachothers for many years.

[Aristotélēsticus]

The whole Christian belief in the crucifixion is that Christ is God in human flesh, who came to earth so that He could die and be the one final perfect sacrifice that can cleanse all sin (previously, forgiveness required the sacrifice of an animal)

 

Well this is from your point of view, i believe that pureness cannot be achieved by death of someone, you became clean if you try hard to be kind, love the others and respect life, only then you will understand the truth that lies within the holy words. well from my point of view, if I had a son I wont let him die this horrible way and I think that god also wont let him die like this. after all no one can understand the words of god fully.

(I believe that this subject must have its own thread)

[Aristotélēsticus]

I believe there is no such thing as reincarnation. When we die, we are gone forever, and cease to exist. There is no afterlife. That is why you should live life to the fullest - eighty or so years is all you'll ever get, so you might as well enjoy it.

 

That means that we are living for nothing, there is no meaning for a life like the one you have mentioned.

 

 

I'm not really reglious, but i do hope there is somekind of afterlife, if not then having this life and living it the best and saying things like ''your the best parents'' or ''your the love of my life'' will mean nothing if you are born again, so i hope there is somekind of afterlife.

 

Exactly, sometimes when we fall in love with someone from the first look we feel that we have seen him before but we don’t know where.

[REDJOHNNYMIKE]

"I don't know what comes after death and frankly I'm not concerned about it since its something I can't control."

 

I'm curious as to why you believe that?

 

"I'm not really reglious, but i do hope there is somekind of afterlife, if not then having this life and living it the best and saying things like ''your the best parents'' or ''your the love of my life'' will mean nothing if you are born again, so i hope there is somekind of afterlife."

 

Do you mean born again in the "Christian" or "reincarnation" sense?

 

"Yes, god is above all of the nature laws, he is above time and place, and for this he is not limited by place for "he is everywhere" and he is not limited by time for

"he has no beginning nor end"

 

But that is the whole point of coming in human form.

 

" the reason beyond this wars are human nature not religions, coz all religions order us to love eachothers, but humans are evil and they use religion to effect their fellows and lead them to wars that feed their desires and lust for power."

 

HEY, we do agree om something:D

 

"(sonnies, and Shiites)"

 

I thought there were three, while the news was heavily covering the post sadaam conflicts, and rebuilding (before Michael Jackson:p)

I thought I heard them say something about another main sect that was playing a role in the religion and politics over there as well?

 

" Well this is from your point of view, i believe that pureness cannot be achieved by death of someone, you became clean if you try hard to be kind, love the others and respect life,"

 

That's not really my point of view, those topics you mentioned are stated simply in several places, "For I AM the way, the truth and the life, no man comes to the father but by me" referring to accepting his sacrifice, so maybe we just believe different things, because you read the koran (speling?) as well, and the two seperate books are different,

no offense, but I don't see it as an opinion any more than I see "low overpass, clearence 16 feet" as an opinion:)

I'm just saying, that unless you do go by several books, some things like that don't have much room for interpretation:)

 

"I believe there is no such thing as reincarnation. When we die, we are gone forever, and cease to exist. There is no afterlife. That is why you should live life to the fullest - eighty or so years is all you'll ever get, so you might as well enjoy it."

 

Then it would be wise to throw away your computer, and since there are no after death consequences for your actions, go out and have as much sex as possible, blow up anything you want, steal whatever you feel like just to make yourself happy, and do pretty much whatever you feel like doing,

That's one reason I don't believe death is like that:)

[RevanA4]

First let me apologize for my early behavior ^_^

 

and as I said before I do think that reincarnation exsits because there are to many things that only It can explain for example

 

1. you have a close friend or reliative that dies and there is always this same (insert animal or person) that seems to be every where you are or go like it is watching over you and yes this works for close pets also

 

2. cell memory which can make you relive someone elses tragity over and over in a reincuring nightmare

 

3. there are things that you can remember with cell memory that you cannot explain like say you've never had any previous knowlege (insert subjet) on say physics but when asked about it you come up with a correct answer having never taken a class or read a book on it EVER.

[Aristotélēsticus]

But that is the whole point of coming in human form.

 

thats right, i have already said that he came in human form to comfort us, and this is some kind of reincarnation.

 

I thought I heard them say something about another main sect that was playing a role in the religion and politics over there as well?

 

if you mean Kords so you are mistaken, coz they are nationality and there are islam and christian Kords, so they are not.

 

That's not really my point of view, those topics you mentioned are stated simply in several places, "For I AM the way, the truth and the life, no man comes to the father but by me"

 

yes, he is the gate to god, and no one can reach god but by him, for he is a prophet and a saviour, but not nessicerly for his sacrifice.

 

because you read the koran (speling?) as well, and the two seperate books are different,

 

i have read the Koran, Bible and Torah, so believe me i know alot about them.

 

 

anyway i wish that we may remain in the subject of the thread which is the reincarnation and i may start another thread about religions later

[REDJOHNNYMIKE]

I don't think it wa the kurds, I think it was another one that started in S like the other twp:confused:

 

"i have read the Koran, Bible and Torah, so believe me i know alot about them."

 

I meant that if you only read one, or some, or all, your view depends, on which ones you read and believed because they are different:)

 

I personally believe that the Bible is the only Divinely inspired Word of God, and the koran isn't,

So I guess we just agree to disagree then:D

[Aristotélēsticus]

I personally believe that the Bible is the only Divinely inspired Word of God, and the koran isn't,

 

as a muslem, i believe in the Bible and the Torah as well as i believe in the Quoran and the deference you talk about comes from our understanding the words of god not because of these words are deferent.

[RevanA4]

I thought is was about reincarnation not about what religion uses what books:confused: *

 

@Darth333 yes my lord *grovels at feet* :worship: I'll be good now:ang2:

 

in regards to reincarnation nobody is ever gonna prove weither it exists or doesn't It is just a matter of beliefs:)

 

but i like things to make sence and most things like this don't so i guess you can believe what you want to believe

 

 

 

 

Agreed! Keep the discussion on topic guys! (and Jedigoku...drop the "mame" :eyes3: ) - d333

[T7nowhere]

Originally posted by T7nowhere I don't know what comes after death and frankly I'm not concerned about it since its something I can't control.

 

Originally posted by REDJOHNNYMIKE

I'm curious as to why you believe that?

 

Why do I believe I can't control what happends after death? Simple reason I can't, that is fact. People can believe what they want but it doesn't make it true.

 

Personally I would not want to live for eternity in afterlife,it sounds incredibly boring, But I have no actuall facts of what happends after death. So my senses tell me reincarnation is very probably, but that could simply be an illision I have chosen to accept.

 

I don't believe in reincarnation they way jedigoku has stated, to me that sounds like delusionary devices used to help deal with the loss of a loved one. ( no offense intended jedigoku )

 

Now again I'm gonna say lets keep this on topic or the thread will be closed.

[RevanA4]

but...but...it happens like they are watching over you:) and since this isn't the matrix there is no other explaination and all the other stuff i said really happens so how do you explain that:cool:

 

*invocks prime's picture* lets stay on topic plz

 

@Darth333 see see me behaving:D

[Darth333]

I do not believe in reincarnation in the sense that once you die, your soul finds another body...For me every human being is unique and when your time in this life is over, then it's over (though what happens with your body afterwards is something else ).

 

Do I believe in afterlife? I have no idea whatsoever of what happens after death...Maybe there is something or maybe there is nothing and it's there to give some hope and a purpose to existence. The only thing I know is that I am not in a hurry to find out (assuming we can find out...)

 

That being said, I don't consider myself atheist, at least not completely. I had a Christian Catholic education but I am not practising as I believe in it more or less and I disagree with the way religion is interpreted. The problem is not religion in itself but human stupidity and interpretation IMHO. I believe that it's your actions and thoughts that make you better, not the number of prayers you recite, the way you dress or what you eat...those are just traditions, customs developped by humans to make them feel closer to the "divine" IMHO. I find it particularly ridiculous when I see people praying and at the same time exploiting, killing people and/or making other people's lifes miserable - sometimes even in the name of god...I think the essential message in the main religions is to help each other and encourage peace and that all the rest is mostly blabla written long ago by men who took inspiration in their environment and culture to illustrate things and make them comprehensible (no offense to anyone, that's just what I believe).

[Emperor Devon]

Originally posted by Korfredonn

That means that we are living for nothing, there is no meaning for a life like the one you have mentioned.

 

Did you read all my post? I said that since we only have a limited amount of time to exist, we should make the most of it. It's bad enough that life is so limited, but to waste it!?! That would be madness.

 

Originally posted by REDJOHNNYMIKE

Then it would be wise to throw away your computer,

 

I like my computer.

 

Originally posted by REDJOHNNYMIKE

and since there are no after death consequences for your actions, go out and have as much sex as possible,

 

Disgusting!

 

Originally posted by REDJOHNNYMIKE

blow up anything you want, steal whatever you feel like just to make yourself happy, and do pretty much whatever you feel like doing,

 

Pretty much. However, if you steal too much and blow stuff up, you could go to jail... And therefore waste some of the time you have such a limited amount of!

[Bastila]

Originally posted by jedigoku

and since this isn't the matrix there is no other explaination

 

 

That made me laugh :rofl:

If only i was, it would be pretty cool.

[Aristotélēsticus]

I do not believe in reincarnation in the sense that once you die, your soul finds another body...For me every human being is unique and when your time in this life is over, then it's over (though what happens with your body afterwards is something else).

 

You don’t seem to understand the purpose of Reincarnation (no offence) Reincarnation is a path of salvation, according to Neo-Platonism:

" all persons at first were stars in the world of light but fell from the firmament through disobedience and sins. The material world is a place of danger, enemies and impurity (Gnosticism). The essential evil of this present existence can be escaped by the help of the divine creator. Every man has within his soul a bit of the light of the divine creator, which can be accessed and lead him on the right path and salvation. men must be transformed or reborn for a certain number times before returning to take a place among the stars, where god is the ruler ,If blameworthy, they are sometimes reborn as another bodies and suffer as mush as they deserve for their sins until they became clean or choose the dark path and became dark souls that flow in the world of hate"

 

so finding another body depend on your deeds in your past life, so sometimes people took a lot of lifes to be clean while other may have only a few and maybe 1 or 2.

 

 

That being said, I don't consider myself atheist…..comprehensible (no offense to anyone, that's just what I believe).

 

Please get back to the topic (just kidding, but I got you)

[Aristotélēsticus]

Did you read all my post? I said that since we only have a limited amount of time to exist, we should make the most of it. It's bad enough that life is so limited, but to waste it!?! That would be madness.

 

 

You seem to get me wrong, I didn’t meant to tell you that you are wasting your time….etc, I meant that if there is nothing after life and you just cease to exist after you die so this life is realy a waste of time.

 

 

and since this isn't the matrix there is no other explaination

 

its like the matrix where your real self (your soul) belong to another world, while your body lives in the world of matter.

[Darth333]

Originally posted by Korfredonn

You don’t seem to understand the purpose of Reincarnation (no offence) Reincarnation is a path of salvation, according to Neo-Platonism:

" all persons at first were stars in the world of light but fell from the firmament through disobedience and sins. The material world is a place of danger, enemies and impurity (Gnosticism). The essential evil of this present existence can be escaped by the help of the divine creator. Every man has within his soul a bit of the light of the divine creator, which can be accessed and lead him on the right path and salvation. men must be transformed or reborn for a certain number times before returning to take a place among the stars, where god is the ruler ,If blameworthy, they are sometimes reborn as another bodies and suffer as mush as they deserve for their sins until they became clean or choose the dark path and became dark souls that flow in the world of hate"

 

so finding another body depend on your deeds in your past life, so sometimes people took a lot of lifes to be clean while other may have only a few and maybe 1 or 2.

I do understand it but I don't believe in it

[MdKnightR]

This is a very long and drawn out thread, but I will put my 2 cents in anyway. I apologize if the points I make have already been made, but I don't feel like reading every last post just to find out.

 

I don't necessarily believe or disbelieve in reincarnation. I don't see where a belief in it is harmful. I have fantasized about it being real, but somehow I don't believe it is. I consider myself a Deist if only because I feel the need to have a reason to justify existence. If I didn't need that reason, I would likely be an atheist.

 

For those of you who are going "huh?" about Deism, here is the best way I can explain it in everyday lay terms. It is the belief that God built the "clock" (the mechanisms of the universe, so to speak) and then went on a long vacation without his cell phone and his beeper. Every thing we see around us evolved from the original cause without the helping hand of this original clockmaker. Perhaps the clockmaker comes back once in a while to wind it up again, but for the most part he doesn't get involved.

 

That's all I have to say.

 

MdK

[Aristotélēsticus]

well, you can know more about reincarnation and its evidence and the Objections to, by entering this link:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reincarnation

 

also you can find the relationship between reincarnation and Bible in this link:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible_and_Reincarnation

[Darth InSidious]

Erm, just to clarify, Reincarnation and ressurection should not be confused

 

Ressurection is the bringing back to life of the dead by divine means,

 

Reincarnation is the rebirth of the person in another body, which is not necessarily human.

 

EDIT: Also, I think the second article comes from a misinterpretation of translations of the texts.....

[Aristotélēsticus]

Originally posted by Darth InSidious

Erm, just to clarify, Reincarnation and ressurection should not be confused

 

Ressurection is the bringing back to life of the dead by divine means,

 

Reincarnation is the rebirth of the person in another body, which is not necessarily human.

 

that's right, thanks for clarifying things, for more information click the links in my previous post.