Human robot relations

[Totenkopf]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21271545/wid/11915829

 

Discuss, both in terms of article and in general (other aspects of human-robotic relationships as well).

[John Galt]

That's... unusual, to say the least.

 

If they want to have sex with something, that's their business. As to whether robotic partners would qualify for marraige(sentience, ability to hold citizenship, etc)? That's another debate entirely, and I think this issue is just part of a huge ethical dillema regarding the use of artificial intelligences, specifically whether they can truly have free will and become sentient on the same plane as human beings.

 

pardon the rambling, it's another 0100 post.

[Rev7]

I am sorry, but I have to say that that is stupid. Sex with robots, what has the world come to?

[Fish.Stapler]

Hey man whatever works O.O

 

However, what's that hypothesis or theory called that says something like the closer to humanoid in appearance robots get the more they will be shunned? I've seen something like that before but I can't remember what it's called.

[Lance Monance]

... this issue is just part of a huge ethical dillema regarding the use of artificial intelligences ...

 

You're absolutely right, it comes down to that.

 

Personally I can't yet believe that robots will have fully independent minds anytime soon. And till that happens (hopefully never..) robots have no "rights" whatsoever imo. If people like to use them as sex toys that's ok. But marriage and citizenship? No.

[Jae Onasi]

All I can think is that quote by Carth when you meet with Elise: "Wow, she must really love her droid....."

[Web Rider]

Hey man whatever works O.O

 

However, what's that hypothesis or theory called that says something like the closer to humanoid in appearance robots get the more they will be shunned? I've seen something like that before but I can't remember what it's called.

 

I've only seen it in relation to movies right now. But yes, there is something related to that, probly a feeling like they're replacing us, which to a degree, is true.

 

On the topic, of somebody wants to have sex with a robot, I don't really care. It's not anymore than attracting a body to some already existing sex toys.

 

However, I don't like how he approaches relationships between humans a robots. If we're talking a mechanical doll that does what you tell it when you tell it, well, then you don't have AI. And if you do have AI, then programming it would be like brainwashing, which is unethical on humans.

 

The whole point of romance is that somebody chooses to love you. If somebody was programmed or "told" to love you, that's no different than arranged marriages. And that's not really a love.

 

If a machine truly has a sentient mind, and like me, it can work a 9-5 job, pay taxes, buy it's own car and home, then I'm all for making it an equal member of society.

[SilentScope001]

Levy argues that psychologists have identified roughly a dozen basic reasons why people fall in love, "and almost all of them could apply to human-robot relationships. For instance, one thing that prompts people to fall in love are similarities in personality and knowledge, and all of this is programmable. ..."

 

THIS IS EXACTLY THE REASON WHY IT MAY BE IMMORAL.

 

You get to control whatever a robot does. This isn't AI (artifical intelligence) at all, this is "alright, let's mind control some droid and get her to preform well in bed." This isn't the 'true love' that you expect in a human-human relation, thanks to this ability/belief of 'free will'.

 

For a robot, all you do is tell them 'have love with me', and they will have love with you.

 

Now, I can see people stating, "This is great", and I also think this is great. But we must admit that what we are doing here is slavery. We are enslaving robots, and we are okay with robots, because we get to control what they think, so the robots can enjoy their slavery. Masters have made love with their slaves in the past...just with humans instead of robots, and they were at least somewhat ashamed of it. And at least the slaves have the ability to think what they want to think, as long as they don't announce it others. The robots cannot even control what they think.

 

Don't believe me? Look around you, look at how robots became a major part of the economy. Even the creators of the word "Robot" knows its hidden meaning: Robot is Czechzolvkian for Slave.

 

Maybe slavery is okay for robots because they enjoy it...or maybe it's immoral because we are taking advantage of the stupidty of a race and manlipuating it to our desires. I don't really care. But we must make a choice right now.

[adamqd]

All I can think is that quote by Carth when you meet with Elise: "Wow, she must really love her droid....."

 

QFE, lol

[tk102]

You get to control whatever a robot does. But we must admit that what we are doing here is slavery.

I have so many slaves already, what's one more? My coffee grinder obeys me without question. My thermostat keeps me comfortable. My car goes wherever I make it go -- it doesn't get to decide, I do! Ha ha ha.

 

Simply put, a robot is a tool. If you can program it, it has no sentience. I do not believe true artificial intelligence is possible with digital robots.

 

Analog robots however...(link #1) do not require programming to function.

[Jeff]

I agree tk, maybe they'll be made to act like humans and make decisions based on different things but thats no different than a program.

[Rogue Nine]

Until they make a robot that looks and functions this good, I'm not sold on it.

[SykoRevan]

I have to give Totenkopf mad props for finding the absolute weirdest discussion topic I've seen here. Now time for some idiotic one-liners from me:

 

*latest advertisement from local sex shop* "Forget inflatable girlfriends, get one of these!"

 

*Robot being hit on at a nightclub* "Hey jerk, 0100 means 0100!" (horrible binary code joke)

 

Okay, I'm done.

 

I have so many slaves already, what's one more? My coffee grinder obeys me without question. My thermostat keeps me comfortable. My car goes wherever I make it go -- it doesn't get to decide, I do! Ha ha ha.

 

Slave driver!

I just hope you meant that in a purely non-sexual way

[Pho3nix]

Until they make a robot that looks and functions this good, I'm not sold on it.

Indeed. Quoted for the 'effin truth.

[Ray Jones]

You get to control whatever a robot does. This isn't AI (artifical intelligence) at all, this is "alright, let's mind control some droid and get her to preform well in bed."

Her? Hm. Why not him?

 

Even the creators of the word "Robot" knows its hidden meaning: Robot is Czechzolvkian for Slave.

The word comes from the Slavic word "robota" what just means "work". And like so many things in science "robot" originated in science fiction literature, and was first used by Josef Karel Čapek, two Czech writers, not for robots though, but more what we now call androids.

 

Maybe slavery is okay for robots because they enjoy it...or maybe it's immoral because we are taking advantage of the stupidty of a race and manlipuating it to our desires.

Like cars or computers, robots are machines, not slaves.

[tk102]

For a further reading about analog robots I highly recommend this interview with Mark Tilden, the pioneer in that field.

Q: Would you say that these robots have some type of creativity?

 

A: As yet, we have not seen that. What we have seen are devices which we call the queens, which are one of our nervous net controllers, embedded into another form of nervous net controller. And what that allows us to do is make devices that are, in fact, capable of learning, that are subject to moods. And it's really quite fascinating. You have a device that, when you power it on, and you treat it carefully, it will actually realize, "Oh,human equals good." And it'll follow you around. Power it off, power it on, treat it like a grad student - beat it around, push it away, and it will quickly learn, "human equals bad." And it will run away into the dark. And as you chase it, it will run away. It's actually learned from its own experience. It might take it some time. Is that creative? No, it's nothing more than a sample survival response at a higher-order level.

[Rev7]

All I can think is that quote by Carth when you meet with Elise: "Wow, she must really love her droid....."

LOL!! This is a really "interesting" topic...

[Eiganjo]

If at some point in time robots actually are able to think, feel, show emotions, etc...can you really say it's only a machine, so it shouldn't have any rights? At what point can we consider something to be alife?

If the only diffrence between a human and a robot will be, that one was made in a factory and the other was made, well...in bed, I don't think that there would be too big of a problem with considering something as absurd as this.

[Rev7]

At what point can we consider something to be alife?

If it has blood running through it's viens.

[Jvstice]

Interesting article, but you act like this will be a new thing in the future.

 

Machines don't even have to be very humanlike or sentient for people to be attracted to them.

 

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article21242.ece

 

MECHANIC Chris Donald loves his work ? he has sex with

 

CARS.

 

And he admitted last night: “Some men like boobs and bums, but I much prefer curvy bodywork.”

 

Chris, 38, has a recognised psychological condition that makes him physically attracted to motors.

 

He has had sex with more than 30 different models in 20 years ? plus two motorboats and a pal’s JETSKI.

 

Chris, who DOES have a girlfriend, confessed: “A nice car for me is a feast for the senses. It’s about smells, feelings and tastes. If I see a gorgeous Mercedes I know I’d love to jump into bed with it.”

 

His weird obsession mirrors that of electrician Karl Watkins, who The Sun revealed was jailed for having sex with pavements in Redditch, Worcs, in 1993.

 

There will be different issues if there is an issue of machine intelligence brought into the picture, because the question becomes one of whether the machines have the legal right to say no, like everybody else.

 

I'd say that if it can pass an intelligence test, and can pass the Turing Test, then it should be considered to be more than a machine or a second class citizen in the eyes of the law. If it can ask for a right to live without being programmed to do so, it should be granted one.

[Eiganjo]

If it has blood running through it's viens.

 

So you consider bacteria, plants, etc to be dead?

[Rev7]

So you consider bacteria, plants, etc to be dead?

Yes and no. You can't see bacteria with the naked eye, as you already know, but it is considered "alive" generally because of microscopes. Plants are alive because they have glucose "running through their viens", and that COULD BE considered "blood". Contraversial though. I guess you could say that the phrase "blood running through it's veins" is somewhat of a metaphor. Great point though Eiganjo! I actually didn't think about that before I posted. Thanks

[Serpentine Cougar]

One thing that I think will always seperate humans from robots is the fact that we have souls. We can create arms and legs and robotic bodies that move and react to their environment, but we can't create a soul. Will robots ever be able to feel emotion, reason, or philosophize? I don't think robots will ever achieve sentiency.

 

As Obi-Wan Kenobi says, "Well, if droids could think, there'd be none of us here, would there?"

 

If it can ask for a right to live without being programmed to do so, it should be granted one.

 

I agree, though I don't think this will ever happen.

 

 

The robots in the article seems to be more like simulations than actually sentient beings. Aren't there already dating sim programs out there? So sex toys are getting more sophisticated; what's new? It's just another, more hi-tech way of simulating a false reality (kinda like video games...). But people shouldn't give up reality for that simulation. We weren't created for sex with robots, we were created for sex with humans.

[Ray Jones]

At what point can we consider something to be alife?

Life or the state of being alive can be defined through a handful of criteria (of which all have to be fulfilled). Being lazy, I'll shamelessly quote Wikipedia:

 

1. Homeostasis: Regulation of the internal environment to maintain a constant state; for example, sweating to reduce temperature.

 

2. Organization: Being composed of one or more cells, which are the basic units of life.

 

3. Metabolism: Consumption of energy by converting nonliving material into cellular components (anabolism) and decomposing organic matter (catabolism). Living things require energy to maintain internal organization (homeostasis) and to produce the other phenomena associated with life.

 

4. Growth: Maintenance of a higher rate of synthesis than catalysis. A growing organism increases in size in all of its parts, rather than simply accumulating matter. The particular species begins to multiply and expand as the evolution continues to flourish.

 

5. Adaptation: The ability to change over a period of time in response to the environment. This ability is fundamental to the process of evolution and is determined by the organism's heredity as well as the composition of metabolized substances, and external factors present.

 

6. Response to stimuli: A response can take many forms, from the contraction of a unicellular organism when touched to complex reactions involving all the senses of higher animals. A response is often expressed by motion, for example, the leaves of a plant turning toward the sun or an animal chasing its prey.

 

7. Reproduction: The ability to produce new organisms. Reproduction can be the division of one cell to form two new cells. Usually the term is applied to the production of a new individual (either asexually, from a single parent organism, or sexually, from at least two differing parent organisms), although strictly speaking it also describes the production of new cells in the process of growth.

[Eiganjo]

Thank you for the definition Ray Jones. Now i would like a defnition for what a robot is. Is it a requirement for a robot to be made out of metal, or could a robot be produced out of organic material too?