If u were unsatisfied with SWGB/CC (or simply want another SW RTS) click here

[Crazy_dog no.3]

Click here to see what the fuss is all about.

 

Click here to go to the official thread

 

Click here to listen to an idea (although personally I don't support it)

 

Click here to discuss EU civs and other possible EU content.

 

Click here to discuss about how snipers should be implimented.

 

 

I hope we are right about SWGB2!

[Paragon_Leon]

I'd say the general idea sounds good, although i would simply die for a Battlefield 1942-type Star Wars game.

Think about it; running around first person with all the big weaponry around you... a lot more intense than the hand-to-hand combat in JK2.

[Rogue15]

I want my Force Commander 2

[Crazy_dog no.3]

U know, that's what I was thinking about a few days ago! If only there were mod tools of BF1942.

[Tie Guy]

Honestly, i could care less about another GB game if it uses the same or similar engine. I abhor the resource collection process and the whole worker thing (which is why i think C&C generals may be a step backwards in terms of gameplay).

 

However, if a game was to be built on a different engine, perhaps a new one with a different resource collection process more similar to RA2, then i think it'd be great.

 

I had high hopes for GB but it really dissapointed me. So if GB II had a few of the problems i thought it had fixed, i'd definately be for it.

[Sherack Nhar]

Shouldn't that go in Galactic Discussion?

 

And I agree with Tie Guy. Maybe they should consider using the C&C Generals engine... but I don't think Westwood is ready to license their engines. Maybe they could try to mimic it... although Lucasarts isn't very good at making engines anymore

[Crazy_dog no.3]

Originally posted by Rogue15

I want my Force Commander 2

 

U liked that game?

 

Anyway, this is the engine to use!!!!

[JEDI_MASTA]

tie... im starting to debate weather ur the stupidest person in these forums (does not seek flame war)

 

 

if u want to take workers out what kind of rescource collection process do you prefer.

 

 

I seem to be the only one of you who thot that SWGB was one of the best RTS games at the time of its release and still remains the reigning DM champ... SWGB2 sounds great, starwars RTS with a 3d engine possibly similar to the AoM one without the GPS

i dont wanna see godpowers but i still firmly believe that GB was not a "clone" ... there is no better way to do a 2d engine... thats why they opted to use the AoK2 engine... and the fact that Starwars games simply dont usually stand up to the other games simply because there arent as many Starwars fans as there are people who would go out there and play games based on some stupid bule hedgehog or a plummer. It baffles me 2, but Gaber and the GB guys were searching for a way to bring outside people to starwars, and from what i have seen they have SUCCEEDED.

 

I never see you guys on the zone or an ip game going up with the guys on MSN, it just dosent make sense to me how you can viciously come out here and attack a game we spent so much time in this forum talking about and not even play it online.

 

even if the zone does suck... its better than sitting here and crying about the game... if u think there are noobs... become unnoobish where u dont hafta put up with them... or u can just beat them down. I have never had anything but good times on the zone especially playing SWGB where the DMers formed a close knit group of xpert players and you start to learn about these peoples lives and what they do, the true beauty of the net.

 

Tie, no disrespect, you have put alot into this forum (spammed)

but you serriously need to open your eyes. Some of us are here for love of starwars, strategy, and just plain comerodery with starwars fans. You sit here and talk about how things are broken but give no idea how to fix them.

 

 

SWGB2 is just like a dream game for me... I would like to see something different than AoM in the population department but still use the tri based counter system (none of this double counter hero myth crap because lets face it, there are not myth units in starwars) I'd also like to see a far more extensive range of units butmaybe cut down on the extra "fluff" as i call it (war centers/research centers and fancy pop systems)

 

Im not sayint the techs shouldnt be a major part of the game, because afterall it is a major part of warfare. but honestly the RM should be sped up and simplified for the beauty of the players having a better/faster game that allows people to focus on other things beside the stupid all economy, but the economy should still be an important part of the game, because in a civilization it is.

 

 

I guess im asking for an impossible game, but i gaurantee you that with this community providing suggestions and a LA team that is willing to cooperate with the hardcore fans could create the best RTS game possible and remain true to the starwars universe.

[JEDI_MASTA]

Ok c dog... you have officially lost your mind.

first off... huge RTS games like this lalways fail because they are too large... and translate starwars into allt hese ages. all we know is time period after the formation of the republic (as opposed to some verry verry faint descriptions of life before)

 

Simplifying and speeding up early game in RTS games seems to be the way to go... not complicating things to the point where u only get hardcores.

 

Whoever said that LA has lost it completely... they can still make a powerful engine that can compete with the big boys... one more suited for starwars... i suggest that we stop talking about engines and start talking about ways to make engines that would be better suited to the series we all know and love... starwars.

 

 

Sorry for the double post but it was necessary cuz im a lazy bumb..... and sherack... keep it here guyus... no noob attack from gb discussion... no noob attack pleeeaaassee!!!!!

[Tie Guy]

Masta, are you talking to me? Because you obviously didn't read my post.

 

You also obviously haven't played C&C - RA2 either. I don't want workers, i want NO workers. I can't make myself any clearer. Whats the alternative? NOT including workers. In RA2 you just have harvesters that mine precious ores used for contruction. There is no worker to collect food and wood and gold or what not, there just aren't any workers period. Buildings are made at a contruction yard and placed on the battle field within a certain range of the contrcution center or other allied buildings.

 

Here's how i would fix it, do exactly what GB did with AOK, except with RA2/Generals. Then, of course, add a few changes, like making aircraft capable of attacking others as well as ground targets, expanding the tech tree a little, etc.

 

Maybe the economy is important in civilization, but its funny, because i can't remember when civilizations all fought each other. No, we're talking about WAR, two ARMIES against each other. I mean, since when do an army go into an area, send out civilians to harvest food, build a city, and then start making an army. Of course, they don't mine ores either, but at least that system downplays that unrealistic aspect.

 

I own GB, but the reason i don't play it is because i don't like it. I did play on the zone, and i didn't like it, so why would continue to play it? How can you say we can't attack the game because we don't play it when if we played it and liked it we wouldn't be attacking it!

 

 

BTW, and insult with a disclaimer is still an insult. I happened to like RA2 better than AOK or GB, don't insult me or call me stupid because you happen to hold a different opinion. I offered a solution, changing the engine, so please read next time before you post, especially if you are going in criticize me or my opinion.

[Crazy_dog no.3]

Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA

Ok c dog... you have officially lost your mind.

first off... huge RTS games like this lalways fail because they are too large... and translate starwars into allt hese ages. all we know is time period after the formation of the republic (as opposed to some verry verry faint descriptions of life before)

 

Simplifying and speeding up early game in RTS games seems to be the way to go... not complicating things to the point where u only get hardcores.

 

 

Whoa, I didn't mean translate SW into 8 ages. I just meant this should be the BASIC engine to use. Maybe like 5 tech levels (not ages) and the rest is sacrificed to make additional civ art.

Oh and stop flaming Tie.

 

Tie- I think the first thing Rebels would do on Hoth is to try and find food and other raw materials to build thier base. I don't have the time to go into why I think workers/resources should be kept in so I'll post later.

[Tie Guy]

Originally posted by Crazy_dog no.3

Tie- I think the first thing Rebels would do on Hoth is to try and find food and other raw materials to build thier base. I don't have the time to go into why I think workers/resources should be kept in so I'll post later.

 

 

Sorry, but i disagree. The rebels did not send out civilians to find food and cut down wood on the wastelands on Hoth, i can assure you of that. They may have carved the base out of the ice, but they brought all the supplies and materials for it themselves, they must have, because they certainly couldn't find any on Hoth, or Yavin IV for that matter.

 

And you don't see that happening today either. If the US needs supplies in a foreign county it calls for them and they are shipped in, they dont send out little peons to hunt for them.

[JEDI_MASTA]

civilizations fight in wars dude... if you dont have enough food to feed an army because you dont have civilization... u simply dont have an army ... thats it. if your a fan of RA and RA2 and the future C&C generals... thats fine with me, but many people apparently didnt think so... because RA2 never had any kind of popularity that iv ever heard of and AoK reigned over the RTS world until AoM was released.... buildings dont just appear out of anywhere without villagers... allthough it could be done in engine... it dosent look very much like starwars because when you really get down to starwars it isnt about war or military might... it is a massive political struggle about which type of government is best (democracy or a dictatorship) and it shows the downfalls of each,

 

villagers have never been a problem to anybody else... harvesters simply decreases the strategy in the whole thing... iv never played RA so i can only speculate but, therez only so much room around a rescource in which to put a harvester, (possibly only one per rescource i dont know)... the age way of controlling your rescource generation to suit your economy and total civ is what peoples have been doing throughout history... its also been about people working their butts off... and you see PEOPLE working in starwars (moisture farmers) you dont see big unmanned machines working in starwars... they allways have something overseeing them... especially in the early ages of any civilization... a move to automization is made later... not first.

 

 

tie... next time you look at history and warfare and try to take somebody on in the subject... please make sure ur not against me... because i WILL beat u down... if u want me to elaborate... please... let me know.

[JEDI_MASTA]

lol C dog... i wasnt flaming tie... i argue my ideas strongly... thats what i do

[Young David]

Originally posted by Sherack Nhar

Shouldn't that go in Galactic Discussion?

 

No ...

 

For the simple reason that most of us don't come there anymore. GT and OT became two very different forums. Let it be this one thread about SWGB. Most of us don't care about the other SWGB discussions.

 

First. SWGB has not been confirmed. GG only hinted at another game he was making, So I'd call it GGG (Gary Gaber's Game). What GGG will be ... I don't know, maybe FC2 or Rebellion2 ... I wouldn't care, Just as long it's a good game.

 

However, when people refer to SWGB2 they always shout it should use this or that engine ... Why would it need another engine?

 

I liked SWGB because I'm a fan of the Ensemble games (I play them since AoK when RoR wasn't released yet) ánd I'm a SW fan. So it seems logical that those 2 combinations would make a great game because 1 + 1 is 2 right?

 

Well ... In this case it was more like 1 + 1 = 1. SWGB never topped AoK. Yes, it had some gameplay changes but in all it was just a big AoK mod ... even the interface was just a skin. The intro's to the campaigns were less attracting than those of AoK.

 

If somebody asked me advice on getting AoK or SWGB, I'd say AoK. It's the original game that feels more middle ages than SWGB does feel SW. SWGB just didn't feel SW enough ...

 

So I'm not a big fan of using another engine. If they do, they should take AoM's ... why?

 

AoM is the next step from AoK, in essence it's the same gameplay. A sequel should have the same gameplay as the game before it I think so AoM fits best.

 

But ...

 

If they'd use AoM engine they should completely alter it and start from scratch. It should be built from the view of what a SW game needs, not from what AoM made great. So it would lose the Godpowers, the myth units, maybe even the heroes. The resourses should be reconsidered and the variations in gameplay between the norse/greek/eggys schould be very different than the SW races.

 

SWGB shouldn't be about quantity either. I don't want 20 different SW races if they'd all were more or less the same. I'd even be happy with Rebels Vs Emp if the game was good enough. Altough I think that 3 races should be a minimum for a RTS nowadays.

 

With SWGB I want quality and I want something new. It has to feel new and play good.

[darthfergie]

Originally posted by Paragon_Leon

I'd say the general idea sounds good, although i would simply die for a Battlefield 1942-type Star Wars game.

Think about it; running around first person with all the big weaponry around you... a lot more intense than the hand-to-hand combat in JK2.

 

dang...the mental picture I got was really frigging awesome:eek:

 

BTW, For GB2 I say we screw ground units and go to space! HOMEWORLD STYLE! With a little bit of RPG and stuff thrown in. (I love SW Trilogy space combat and I really want to use a stardestroyer...not just a stinkin fighter)

[Tie Guy]

Masta, you're right, Civilizations fight wars, but i never said they didn't. Of course a civilization has to support the army with food and resources, they simply don't do it on the battlefield. The armies do the fighting, there are no civilians directly involved, i can assure you of that. For instance, how many civilians went over to Kuwait to help in desert storm? How many trees did they cut down or how many buildings did they build? None.

 

Oh, and often times buildings do just "pop out of nowhere", its called prefab shelters. They are aleady built and the troops just set them up. That, or they take over existing buildings. What they don't do is hire a contruction company to come over to the battlefield and build their buildings, much less recruit local "villagers" to build them, if you think that they do then that just sad.

 

Oh, and you show very clearly that you haven't played RA2. Harvesters are mobile, they have to go out and bring the resources back to a refinery. You can have as many as you like, but they are expensive. One important strategy is finding the right balance of harvesters. Another is attacking and defending harvestors, because they are your economy, which means your ability to build units. Without them you've already lost, so it is vital to protect them and destroy your opponents. while this doens't invlove a great deal of strategy, its not supposed to. the emphasis is rightly on the warfare, which is just the way i like it. I feel like AoK is more Sim City with a little action thrown in at the end. I like Sim City, but not in my RTS.

 

Oh, and since when does the Alliance move from vastly different tech levels over the course of the movies or books. Sure, they move from the Y-wing to the B-wing, thats great, RA2 accomodates that, but they don't jump from manned machines to automation. They always had automation. What do you think droids are? And they've been around for millenia. Or look at the droid factory on Genonosis, thats autmated, and its before the Alliance's time.

 

About the farmers and such on Tatooine, of course there are farmers and wokers in the SW universe! They simply don't work for the alliance on the battlefield! I mean, how many moisture farmers did you see on Yavin, or Hoth, or Endor? None! The farmers and civilians have their place in war, but it is NOT on the battlefield.

 

SW is about the political struggle, but its also about the WAR that is at the heart of the matter. The Alliance's war with the Empire is the foundation of the story (along with Luke's struggle against Vader and the Emperor). Sure, political sides are involved, but the war in the part of the story shown. Even so, though, that doens't mean that farmers or villagers or whatever have any place on the battlefield, because in no way do the movies show that or anything similar to it.

 

 

I'm not sure what history you're looking at, because I'd sure like to see the one that places American civilians growing crops beside the command center in Germany, or Korea, or Kuwait to help the war effort.

 

 

BTW, arguing strongly is fine, in fact its great, i do it too. But insulting people isn't arguing, its the opposite. When you insult people it makes them even less likely to be willing to listen to what you say. So you doom your entire argument right from the beginning, basically what you just did. Threats don't help either.

[Redwing]

Originally posted by darthfergie

 

dang...the mental picture I got was really frigging awesome:eek:

 

*definitely agrees* WOW. Leon, that would be awesome. But the closest anyone's ever gotten to that is AT-STs walking around in the Jedi Knight series...

[Admiral Odin]

Civilian units have their place, if it fits the game setting. An RTS set in the medieval ages should have civilians running around. Especially since in those games you at some point would have to lay siege to a stronghold.

 

An RTS set in modern times/future should not have civilians. It just doesn't fit the setting. As Tie Guy said you would not see twenty civilians running around setting up a base. You would see combat engineers doing that job. Setting up prefab buildings ect. and supply trucks ect. (One thing I like about C&C Generals is getting rid of harvesters for a more realistic supply line)

 

This brings us to any future SW RTS. Supplies should be collected through frieghters. (For Ground based, have a nuetral spaceport were supplies can be collected. A frieghter flys there lands, and after a period of time flys back with resources. For a space based RTS, then the same idea except replace the spaceports with planets). Then have engineer units to construct buildings. These combat engineers should be able to do other tasks, like laying down mine fields, and creating safe routes in enemy mine fields.

 

This would make the RTS have in my opinion a more SW like feel to it.

[JEDI_MASTA]

mobile harvesters... darn... sounds a whole fricken lot like villies to me.

 

I apoligize for my complete ignorance about the RA series because i have not played it and therefore could have no possible idea how it works.

 

Strategy is done the way that it is done for many reasons...

 

villagers on the battlefield involve the move of your people to conquered lands and producing places to faster generate military units. unfortunately in real life military units must be born... something that cannot be recreated in the game world.

[Treacherous Mercenary]

Originally posted by Paragon_Leon

I'd say the general idea sounds good, although i would simply die for a Battlefield 1942-type Star Wars game.

Think about it; running around first person with all the big weaponry around you... a lot more intense than the hand-to-hand combat in JK2.

 

Hey, I love the close quarter combat in JKII and if you use the ranged weapons correctly, those can work too . I do however like the more intense realistic battles however which as awesome with games like America's Army, etc.. Yeah, I would like something of that sort though.....

[Crazy_dog no.3]

OK I'm back, and I think I know why I favour these sort of games more (although this probably won't change ur POV).

 

I like to think I'm fighting a WAR and not just a battle. Battle feels more limiting to me. There can be plenty of battles in a war, and one slip in the economy can equal disaster in battles.

[JEDI_MASTA]

not necessarily in the terms of RTS games c dog... once ur stuff is built a slip in ur econ cant kill it... buto vertime it will cause you to lose the "war"

[Surfnshannon]

all I know is...I liked SWGB for about a month.Then realised that it was too easy to win. My bf kicked my butt constantly. It got boring. It needed something more. The air units needed not to suck. I like RA 2 very much. It was a lot of fun. I liked the idea of a star wars RTS but the problem was...was that it lost its fun fast. I don't know about new engines etc. If they dont make the game challenging enough - or work with improving what they already had going. What good is it to have a game that LOOKS good but doesn't play good. Waste of my time.

[Rogue15]

I love Force Commander. It was truer to star wars than gb was.

 

well i don't feel like explaining why i like it cause nobody understands me. *goes off to work with a sore throat*